Women - why can't my best friend get a steady date?

[HEyHEY]

Seriously... Okay my best friend is a very handsome guy, and a gentleman. As well, he's got a good sense of humour, intelligent and is the president of a million dollar company (family business, but he works VERY hard at it and deserves what he has).
Anyway, he often goes out on dates and it never seems to go anywhere...the latest bit was with a mutual friend's sister..he went out a few times (And she's a great girl by the way) so I called him tonight and asked how it was going. He said it was floundering and he's called her a few times after their third date... but she never called back so he just forgot about it.

NOW, I told him by date number three you gotta make a physical move and he was all "careful" about it. I really think that may be his problem.

Ladies - what say you?

[Syrinx]

1. you may be on the right track

Some girls think that if you are too "gentlemanly" you're not interested. And from what I've observed, it seems like a lot of the ladies go for the biggest jerks -- the best way to "seduce" them is to be the biggest asshole in the world to them. I don't understand it, but it IS a real phenomenon.

[Wapsie B]

6. Yes it is very real.

That's why so many guys hate to be called a nice guy. It's like the kiss of death in dating. My only suggestion would be to try to get out and meet more women and maybe something will just click with him. Practice makes perfect.

[artificial flavor]

9. My thoughts on this.

With a unsettling frequency the asshole guys I know get laid a few times and never see the girl again. The nice guys I know usually have long term relationships with the girls they meet. They just don't score five times per week.

I have never had any luck picking up girls. All of my relationships have blossomed from long time friendships and co-workers. And all of them have lasted for a long time.

Perhaps using words like blossomed doesn't project the bad boy image.

[serryjw]

2. More info, please

How old? Any kids?(was he already married?) Is he GAY? You can continue to do the same thing again and again and get the same results. Is he just choosing the wrong gals?

[HEyHEY]

7. He's 25 no kids - never been married

[serryjw]

8. That explains it all

There has been a shift in young woman. They are not interested in getting serious until their late 20's when they have a few years with career. IF he is serious about finding Mrs RIGHT try Eharmony or Perfectmatch. I think all on both are looking for marriage.

[the Princess]

15. Why isn't he just dating for fun at his age??

Your 20's are the time to do all the stupid stuff you won't be able to do later on. LOL

Date as many women as possible and just have fun.

Jeez I didn't even want to get married till I was over 30. And I got married at 32.

25? Too damn young to be thinking about stuff like this.

[Miami Liberal]

3. How old is your friend?

[the Princess]

4. It has been my experience

that a lot of women don't like *nice guys*. I include myself in that - until I wised up. Bad boys get the dates and the women calling them. Nice guys go through what your friend is going through. It's a real shame and it makes me crazy. I married a *nice guy* and I have never been happier - BUT - bad boys STILL turn my head.

Maybe it has something to do with self-esteem. Until you think you deserve to be treated well you are gonna pick men who treat you like crap.

I wish I had some advice - I don't.

[tcfrogs]

5. Speaking for the other "nice guys"

THEN, what the fuck do I do? Treat women that I just meet like shit? I just don't get it.

Maybe, we need a tutorial here...

[JohnKleeb]

10. I know man, why the fuck

I don't like acting like an asshole, I hate it, I like being myself which is nice and friendly, sigh, goddamnit.

[tcfrogs]

13. Just a mystery, Kleeb

I've been married, and had lots of relationships over the years, but have never understood the love/hate/treat-me-like-shit stuff.

If someone can convince me treating women like dirt will get me more sex, I'd love to hear it.

[JohnKleeb]

29. I know

[the Princess]

11. I wish I had an answer

The reason I fell in love with CO Liberal was because he was my best friend first. But see we were also older when we met and being friends first was a priority for me and him. I was 31 he was 39 when we met.

I would suggest looking for women who don't *need* you. This to me would mean a woman who is secure - and would be more apt to appreciate being treated like a lady. Don't look to date women who you want to "take care of" or "help fix" - it's a dead end.

I didn't need CO Liberal when we met and I ceratinly didn't want to get into another relationship as I had just ended a very bad one.

You know everyone is different and what happened for me may not happen for you.

Hell I don't know - maybe it's all just chance anyway.

[artificial flavor]

19. After thinking about it.

I don't know if it the nice factor. I don't think we are taking rugged into account. I know my sister loves the handyman, covered in dirt look. I had a job where I was constantly covered in oil from fixing machines all day and I was always scruffy. During that time I had the most girls going after me. When I cleaned up to work a desk job the attraction dropped off.

[Miami Liberal]

12. I like the nice guys

but I can't seem to find any. :shrug:

[SOteric]

21. Really, that very much depends on how you define 'nice.'

"Nice guys are easy to find. They're the ones you're complaining to about how the guy you're screwing is such a prick."

This is a familiar expression frequently uttered with no small amount of bitterness.

As near as I can tell almost everyone, regardless of gender, has found themselves hunched over some wobbly sidewalk café table, drinking strong espresso and listening to a friend bemoan the fact that their boyfriend/girlfriend/husband/wife/ is about as sensitive as a lead wrench. This in itself isn’t all that bad. It’s when they commence to declare that all the “nice” guys/girls are nowhere to be found, that you glance around and realize that you’re doing your best imitation of chopped liver.

I think it may be safe to say that MOST of us consider ourselves to be “nice” categorically speaking. Unfortunately, what we think we are, isn’t always the way other people see us. I mean, when you think about it, when you’re asking a third person about someone else, what’s your first response when that third person hesitates and then says, “Well…he/she is nice.?” Far from being a resounding acclaim of sterling character, that double-edged compliment usually evokes images of anything from a Gomer Pyle look-a-like to someone who writes the days of the week on their underwear.*

Frankly, I never really claimed to be looking for a Nice Guy. I just want a guy who isn’t an ass and who doesn’t have to gain 50 IQ points just to be considered an idiot. I know that for some people that statement is somewhat confusing. If a guy isn’t nice, then isn’t he automatically an ass? Perhaps it will clear things up if I give my definition of a “nice guy:”**

A “nice guy” is the guy who calls you back after the first date………and every hour afterwards, on the hour for a number of variable reasons that range from the commonplace (“I just wanted to see how you were doing,”) to the more specific (“I can’t stop thinking about your smile,”), to the downright frightening (“I hope our kids don’t take after my great uncle Eustice.”) A “nice guy” is the guy who becomes immediately alarmed if you quit smiling for even a second, and god help you if you aren’t in a talkative mood. As soon as a “nice guy” detects any drop in the level of conversation, he will immediately launch his “Are-you-all-right?” counter-offensive, which consists of repeating the phrase “Are you all right?” every two minutes until you go stark raving mad and beat him to death with whatever you can find in your purse. Have you ever seen a man beaten to death with a box of Altoids? It’s not a pretty sight I can tell you.

A “nice guy,” more often than not, will fail to understand why he was not invited to your “girl’s night out.” He thinks that when you talk about having “time for yourself”, that you are speaking of the watch you’d like to buy. A “nice guy” will show up at your office with a romantic lunch packed and will become extremely put out when you explain to him that it’s the middle of January and not even the bears are picnicking in this weather. A “nice guy” refuses to take the hint when you say that you aren’t really interested in a relationship. If you tell him you’re not ready, he tells you that he’ll wait. You tell him that you are interested in women. He tells you that he’s persistent. You tell him that you are dating a biker named Chopper. He tells you that he has a moped. You tell him that you’d rather be dry shaven by a troop of drunk chipmunks than date him. He tells you that you’re not the first woman to tell him that. He wears a T-shirt with your face printed on it.

The problem with people being “nice” sometimes is that they don’t really think about what they’re doing. Hey, it’s great that you gave me this $600 dog, but I live in a one-bedroom apartment and I can’t afford to keep it. Hey, it’s great that you want to spend time with me but “women only” usually means that you can’t have a penis. Yes, I appreciate that you send me such beautiful flowers but I’m running out of vases and my house smells like a funeral home.

Face it, in this day and age, “nice” is a highly questionable adjective. Frankly, to me, someone with strength of character is perfectly capable of being a nice person without turning into an annoying whiney tumor that has somehow attached itself to your left buttock. Being nice doesn’t mean you have to be stupid, or weak, or a pushover. So the next time you’re wondering if you’re a “nice” person or not, check to see what picture is on the front of your shirt.








*Not that I have anything against Underwear Organization. Underwear Chaos is more fun, but organization is good too.

**This is a definition based on MY EXPERIENCE ONLY. The use of quotation marks around the word “nice” is to emphasize this.

GENERAL DISCLAIMER: This post is drawn from my experience and in no way represents the thoughts or beliefs of the creators of DU, my readers, my cat, my family or my college roommate. If you have been referred to as a “nice” person before, then please accept my apologies. I’m sure that my post in no way represents you.

[EC]

26. You're right....

The one thing I really, really hate is the guy that tells me he loves me on the first date...this isn't a nice guy...he's a stalker...

[NuttyFluffers]

14. the best way to attract interest is show interest... or better expressed..

no risky, no frisky.

there's a reason badboys turn heads and get attention. it's because they want attention and they give attention to prospective dates/victims. there's no messin' around, no coy lil' guessin' games, just straight on chase. probably has to do with the leftover vestiges of gender roles -- women liked to be chased, not to do the chasing. it's only when they are caught that they can end up clinging to someone like a shadow.

attracting sex has to do with accepting gritty realities with confidence, and strict following of etiquette codes timidly isn't very gritty and confident is it? ;)

[Wapsie B]

16. That's fine but

don't come running to a nice guy after Mr. badboy breaks your heart.

[the Princess]

20. I don't know if I agree with that

CO Liberal was my freind and my shoulder because I had just ended an abusive relationship and the asshole I broke up with would not leave me alone. So CO Liberal was there for me through it all and I realized I loved him somwhere along the way.

[Wapsie B]

22. I see your point.

It's good that you had someone to help you through that.

[NuttyFluffers]

27. even a nice guy can break hearts...

you just need to know when to be more than 'nice.'

like sunshine. a bright sunny day is nice. it's reliable, it's safe, it's pleasant... and completely unmemorable and devoid of excitement in and of itself. a blazing sunset, a brilliant sunrise, a mysterious twilight, a schizophrenic partly cloudy, an overbearing searing heatwave, etc. *that* is memorable, that brings passion, that evokes more than 'just nice.' ... but it still is the same sun, right? ;)

why? because it does more than bask you with warmth from a distance. it comes up to you, it grabs you, it teases you, it taunts you, it is dynamic change that says, you, you, you are my interest, and i *will* be yours. (*gasp* is it getting hot in here? ... so take off all your clothes!)

heh, find me a 'nice' man who can't get a date and i'll show you passion suppressed into a bland neutral (which can bring out other 'clingy' problems). but give a nice man a chance to burst out and i'll show you one sexy beast who'll have to beat them off with a stick. needs to harness his inner changeability, his inner 'weather control,' and learn to shine full bore on the object of his affection... then he'll be truly alive, and more than just 'nice.'
:evilgrin:

[the Princess]

17. Good post

You are so right. Every bad boy I have ever been with (and there were way too many) made it perfectly clear he wanted me. And I liked that. And they were very aggressive in their pursuit of me. I liked that too.

I like being chased. I'm being honest here.

[yvr girl]

18. I want a nice guy, but I also want a guy with a bit of edge

I don't want to be treated badly, in fact, I won't put up with that, but too nice is boring. Guys like the chase, girls like a challenge. Anything worth having is worth working for, it stands to reason you only value a SO that you need to work for a bit.

Confidence is really sexy too. You want a good guy who is good because he has integrity and he chooses to be good, not because he's afraid to be bad.

Just my two cents worth.

[Miami Liberal]

23. good post n/t

[shraby]

25. Ask the girl he was going out with

why.

[EC]

24. I don't usually accept a third date if

there is absolutely no common interests, nothing to talk about. Is he interested in anything other than work? Does he have any hobbies or anything in which the girl can relate to? Does he show any interest in what she has to say or what she is interested in? Nothing more boring than a guy that talks about himself all night and interupts anything I may have to say. Some of my more interesting dates ended up talking non-stop all night, and laughing. The comfort level has to be addressed first, then the "moves" will come naturally.

[NuttyFluffers]

28. yes, the art of conversation has really taken a hit in these modern times.

some yammer on endlessly about themselves, some offer nothing to the conversation except a flat sounding board, and some people are seemingly devoid of multiple dimension. all problems like that kill conversation quick, which is bad because the most powerful sex organ is the brain. engage and tantalize that and you are more than halfway there.

quick question to author of this topic: is this guy a bore? do you have great, engaging conversations and would actively seek his company?

[Guaranteed]

30. More booze is the answer,

on both sides.

Sounds like it's too late, though.

[Tony_Illinois]

31. I'm not sure how, but it's Bill Clinton's fault.

[T Town Jake]

32. Oldest story still current, actually...

...while Ashley Wilkes gets all the talking points, Rhett Butler is the one who actually scores... :evilgrin:

[Gardeaux08]

34. And why is that?

Because Rhett visited Scarlett and brought her pretty things. he pursued her...the man told her he wanted her to someday say "I love you" to him while she was in mourning for Charles Hamilton!! Rhett was minding the store! Actually, I could never understand what Scarlett saw in Ashley Wilkes. What a drip! Even Leslie Howard hated that character.

Seriously, I can only tell you what attracts me to a man. I look for a good sense of humor and the ability to carry on a good conversation. I like a man to be confident because there is NOTHING sexier than confidence. And when a man pursues me it shows me he is a little bit of a risk taker because he is willing to be in a position of vulnerability.

[artificial flavor]

33. Yeah, Jesus saves! Gretzky scores!

[Lexingtonian]

35. As Bette Davis said...

It's not the man in your life, it's the life in your man that counts.

Bad boys hurt the women in their lives. But they give them a feeling that they're really alive, that Life is for the having, the taking, the giving, the here and now. (Shallow or bad as the reality of what takes place may be, the elan and sense of power is what counts.) I should also note that 'passion' is a term derived from the Latin word for 'suffering'....

I'd guess that your friend doesn't have that bit of edge/wildness and that hidden dimension/continuum of wisdom-insight-imagination that is what people really look for, that is the thing that charms and promises the ineffable things. It's hard for an average person who is 25 to have much of it, but it comes from really living,

One measure of a relationship is whether both sides truly believe that they have more of Life when together than with other people of the usual kinds. Romantic relationships definitely have to meet some minimum in that respect.

[Maine-ah]

36. I think

women like the "bad boy" image. Just the image. A nice guy, but in a black leather motor cycle jacket, ect... No woman I know wants a man thats an asshole. My guess is at 25 and he's president of a million dollar company, he might be a little intimidating for some women. Maybe instead of wining and dining, try a less expensive kind of date, you know, a walk on the beach, dinner at home, a simple movie. Keep it simple. I've known my husband since junior high school, he's always had the "bad boy" image, but he's a "nice guy".