calling on NSMA and other mech/auto inclined astute

[dweller]

i hope this is the right group* to shout out in, am replacing driveshafts in a Geo Metro, 95. No problems with the driveshaft work.
But...i drained the transaxle fluid using a 3/8" socket wrench to loosen the plug, drained it. Put it back, yanked the driveshafts off, replaced, and
now going onto refilling the trans fluid.
sigh...

the plug to fill is the same type as the plug to drain, but set up on the side. And it appears the last joker who checked/filled the fluid either put
the plug in with a torque hammer... :shrug: and the plug has been wallowed/buggered out so that a 3/8" socket just slips...the hole the wrench
should fit in should be square, it's not ...almost 5 points in there now.
I've already tried a cold chisel and hammer to tap it around, no giving, plus no room to swing the 3#hammer and it's just mucking up the plug
more.
I haven't tried heat yet, since i'm under the engine etc. And now it's dark and i'm beat.

Does anyone know of a specific tool for this application that could be purchased to work out this *&^%$!! plug?

I realize that the sucker could be stripped in there, and is going to call for a major dismantling to remove it. But anything that might get me a
leg up on conquering this freakin' $4 plug would be mucho appreciated.

i guess i'll get back on it in the morning.
many thanks for any advice.
dp

edit: *crossposting from the DIY group....

[dweller]

1. okay

:kick:

i guess i'll cross post over in the physics and rocket scientist's group too......

dp

[havocmom]

2. Haven't seen NSMA around lately. Is she vacationing?

I will refrain from offering suggestions. So much plumbing trouble at our house, I think I am under some sort of curse. Ms Fixit is not having a fun day!

[dweller]

3. thanks, Ms Fixit!

at least i know i'm not on universal ignore :)

and while i'd gladly take your on plumbing problems in exchange for my plug problem anyday, somehow i think the mods would lock this in the confusion.

but thanks for the word on NSMA, i bet she knows the remedy... she knows everything about . . . stuff! lol

dp

[jonnyblitz]

9. yes, she has company and they are travelling..

:hi:

[Misunderestimator]

15. Mwaahaaa... I have her held hostage...

:evilgrin:

Though I will go tell her that this thread is here. :)

[steely]

4. Last time I worked under a car, I squarshed my thumbnail

but good with a breaker bar against the bell housing. It came off later (not the bell housing).

After that - well, I just paid.

Me no like fire, fire baaaaddd.

It's just 3/8ths - it's gotta come off.

couldja go the vise grip route?

[dweller]

5. i'd sacrifice the whole thumb almost

at this point.

the 3/8" is the size of the square hole in the end of the stud/plug that a standard 3/8" ratchet wrench fits (just like it would fit a socket you would use to remove a bolt of various size). In this case, you don't need the socket, just the wrench since it fits in the plug just like it would in the socket. . . and it's wallowed out and since the plug fits flush in the trans case, there's nothing to grab with vice grips... :cry: :mad:


i'm gonna get that sucker out one way or another...just looking for the best way...

thanks, hey i guess you got a new nail anyways? :)
dp

[steely]

10. damn dude, thought you went to bed.

yeah, I got a new nail :-)
I know the type of plug.
guess there's no room to use an easy out (or get a drill in there)?

looks like drilling it out and re-tapping? fock - I feel your pain.

I know you said it was flush, but is there any hint of thread showing?

how about, and this could destroy what meat is left, so you might have to line up a local garage guy to assist/bail you out....

drill a 1/8 hole in the side if the plug and cotter pin it to provide more grip with another tool (pliers/something).

any other way to get oil in the thing at all, even the drain plug (mess)? Is it 90 wt? that moves kinda slow.

best of luck.

[Schema Thing]

6. Is it an inny, or an outy?

I can't tell from your description, though it sounds more like an "inny". In which case I'd recommend trying the appropriate size of these tools:


If it is a square stud that you can put an adjustable wrench on, but is just rounded over... you can file two opposing surfaces flat, and then likely get a good grip with your wrench. The extractors would work with either type bolt though, as well.

[Schema Thing]

7. btw,

the tool seen above is called a screw extactor. You drill a hole into your bolt, then then turn this into that hole (righthandedly, wedging it in) and then it trys to hold as you turn it left.

[dweller]

8. an inny, flush in the case, no head

those are easy outs, right?

the hole for removal is sized to accept a 3/8" socket wrench, so it would take a fairly large one since it's a plug threaded for about 30 footpounds torque (and may have been over torqued by some bubba in the past).

Thanks for the advice, on the upside i get to buy some new tool! :)

dp

[Schema Thing]

12. Yeah, I think "easy out" is one way to refer to them

They make them quite large.

Also, just getting a big enough drill up in that square, it might wedge and then reverse the plug out, worth a try.

You could also (you may end up having to) just drill it out and tap an oversize thread. Might give you an excuse to buy that tap and die set ;-)

[steely]

11. last minute advice from a sleepy head.

not to condescend, but watch out drilling into the sucker too deep for the easy out, lest you go too far and spill metal into the transaxle.

I thought they sold some sort of liquid, the opposite of loctite, to help break the grip.

[dweller]

13. from bad to worse...

got an easy out from the auto shop, and a new plug. Told the guy i had a plug just like the one he was selling me stuck in the case.
He recommended a 7/16" easy out...so i drilled a hole through the plug, tapped that sucker in, and put a wrench on it to back it out.

the easy out snapped in half, leaving half of itself in the hole, in the plug...

not a happy camper here...
so i decided to just pull the transaxle: either get it out where i could maybe work at the plug better, or send it off to a shop...after taking off all necessary wires, parts, connections...jacking up under the transaxle to take the weight, went after the 4 14mm bolts that hold trans/engine together...and sure enough, that last one down by the exhaust manifold ...is not coming off, and is just starting to round the points on the bolthead...


sigh...all over a $1.33 plug.

dp

[jmowreader]

14. Okay, now that the transmission's out, here's whatcha do (spam enclosed)

This job requires a trip to Home Depot on Saturday morning (yes, I know you guys hate the idea of shopping there, but suck it up because we're the only ones open in the next couple of days that sell one of the things you'll need) and a stop off at the auto parts store.

At Home Depot you need to buy a tube of Sikabond-1 Anchoring Epoxy (this is the stuff you can't get anywhere else; accept no substitutes--ESPECIALLY not Sikabond-3 Anchoring Adhesive, which is displayed right next to the Sikabond-1) and a 3/8" extension for your ratchet wrench. At the auto parts store you'll buy a can of brake cleaner. (Not brake fluid, brake cleaner. There's a difference.) If you don't have a caulking gun, get one of those too--we have them for two bucks.

Once home, start by cleaning your transaxle and the old shitty 3/8" extension you have now with the brake cleaner. Let it dry good, then use the Sikabond to glue the old extension into the plug--making DAMN SURE NONE GETS ONTO THE TRANSMISSION CASE ITSELF because you will be there forever trying to get the plug out if you slop the epoxy across the seam between the plug and the case.

Let this cure until Sunday, then put your 3/8" ratchet on the extension and turn the plug right out. At this point you can pitch your old shitty extension because you'll never get this glue off of it.

How tough is Sikabond-1? The company that makes it did a test where they glued ten bolts into concrete with Sikabond-1 then pulled on them with a hydraulic press until something gave out. The results were zero adhesive failures, seven concrete failures and three snapped bolts. This shit WILL solve your problem.

On edit: In the future, take the fill plug out first.

[Misunderestimator]

16. This is really NSMA not MU...and I believe this is the only

alternative left...sorry I wasb't there for you buddy..I was making black eyed peas :D

[dweller]

17. yuuummm.....blackeyedpeas...

that's okay, i'm plugging along. lol.

the only problem is the trannie is not out yet...one bolt yet to give up the grip. Going to look for a better socket first.

i guess i can try the advice from our home depot rep above, thanks for that jm. i may be able to leave in the trans and try at it.
or get the trans out, and then go at it...
either way, i'll get it. i'm a Dem...i never give up!

fun stuff...a one day job stretched into 3...or better yet, from one year into the next!

happy new year all. :toast:
grubby greasy cranky dp

[jmowreader]

20. It should work fine with the transmission still in

Anchoring Epoxy is very thick, so no problems there. I would just squirt a nice blob on the end of the extension, shove it in the hole (once again, making sure none gets on the transmission case), then prop up the extension so it sticks straight out of the transmission. Let it cure and unscrew the plug.

[dweller]

18. thanks!

and for the instructions, etc.

as long as HD is open tomorrow, i'll try that. Nothing to lose at this point!

:toast:

dp

edit: what is the caulking gun for? i have everything but the sikabond 1... :shrug:

[Schema Thing]

19. Damn, I like that!

I wanna hear if it works. I love better-living-thru-chemistry stories!