I've been contemplating living in the UK. Am I crazy???

[SmileyBoy]

Lately, I've seriously been thinking about moving to the UK (namely London) after I finish graduate school. London is a city I've been DYING to visit in the past several years, and I've done a little research on the city, and I've come to the conclusion that it would actually be a great city for me to live in.

I think my future career could accomodate it. I'm planning on becoming a stadium architect, and I know for a fact that HOK (based out of Kansas City) is the most world-renowned firm for designing stadiums and arenas, and they have a huge branch office in London. I'm thinking once I get my master's, I could apply for work there. I'm thinking I'd have a good chance to immigrate to the UK, because I would have money, lots of education, and a high-paying job lined up for me.

I was originally thinking of moving to Canada once I got my bachelor's (going to grad school in Winnipeg and then staying there), but now I'm seriously thinking of the UK. My father would hate me for this, because he absolutely HATES the British for some reason.

Any UK DU'ers out there care to tell me a little more on how things are in the UK (politically, culturally and economically)?? Thanks.

[Orsino]

1. Fascism seems to have less of a hold on Britain...

...than it does over here. I'm headed for Canada, myself.

Good luck.

[billyskank]

2. You're not crazy

although I would come here to visit before you commit to anything. You know, check it out, see how it fits you.

Politically it's quite different to the States. There is something of the neoconservative about Tony Blair, especially in terms of foreign policy, but the populace isn't behind him in the way that all those people in America seem to be behind Bush. Blair does well in the polls but IMHO that's mostly about the extremely low regard the Conservative party is held in these days.

PS. The weather sucks in a kind of middle-of-the road way. It's hardly ever extreme.

[Taxloss]

5. The weather is similar to the Pacific Northwest

minus the volcanoes. Damp, but mild.

[Skittles]

3. I grew up there as an American

I'd go back, although on recent visits I have been terribly disappointed how Americanized it is getting - Texacos, McDonalds, f*** that.

[Taxloss]

4. I live in London. And I love it. Best city on Earth.

Politically, we'll still stuck with Bliar. That's the bad news. The good news is that he will certainly be out within two-three years and his replacement will be careful not to repeat his mistakes. The other good news is that Labour should and will win the next election, and Iraq aside their agenda is progressive.

Culturally, the UK has just been through a very creative patch that is now on the wane a bit, but still it's a great place for fine plays and modern architecture. Despite some reports of anti-Americanism, I live in an area with a large transient American population and see little evidence of it - but it's unwise to praise Bush loudly in a pub. Not that you're planning to do that...

Economically, the recent slowdown affected the UK least of all EU countries, and inflation is very low, although the cost of living - especially housing - is high in London.

I recommend it.

[SmileyBoy]

7. I heard that one British Pound is worth almost 2 Dollars American.

The most deflated currency in the world, if I'm not mistaken.

[Taxloss]

9. Yes, it's close to USD2.

I believe it's more to do with the dollar's weakness than the pound's strength.

[SheilaT]

6. You're not crazy,

although you do need to find out how hard it would be to get based in HOK's London office once you're employed by them. But London would be an excellent place to live, in my opinion, having visited several times.

You might want to try to find out why your father hates the British so much. You probably won't be able to change his mind, but you might want to present your moving to the UK (if it happens) as purely job-related, rather than your desiring to live there.

Good Luck.

[SmileyBoy]

14. He hates the British because he's a Turkish immigrant...

Born and raised in Turkey, and was taught from a young age that the British were trying to overtake and enslave Turkey and turn it into a colony after the Ottoman Empire collapsed (which is actually true, but he holds a grudge for something that happened before he was born). Also, he has this notion that all British people hate Turkish people.

[KurtNYC]

8. I've been to London twice

Couldn't live there. Some of the least friendly people I have ever met. Not nasty, just unfriendly and ocassionally snobby. Way too in love with the past for my taste in an insecure / fallen empire sort of way.

Bars close at 11PM, the trains stop at Midnight, terrible food. Expensive as hell (and I live in NYC).

My friend lived there for 3 months and said ' why is it that any Brit with a high school education assumes that they are smarter than
any Yank on the planet?'

On the plus side they have a wicked sense of humor.

[SmileyBoy]

11. I don't care about the bars closing. I don't drink.

But I am a little concerned about people saying it's very expensive there.

[tjwmason]

16. I disagree

We're not unfriendly, we more cautious in getting to know people. Once a friendship is established it is very firm though. Also I think the snobbery is more usually in the eye of the beholder.

Many bars close far later than 11, and the current proposal is to move to 24hour legal drinking, which would allow each bar to set its own openning hours.

The terrible food thing is a passe joke. I've heard far worse comments about American food from people going over to you.

Yes it is very expensive.

My friend lived there for 3 months and said ' why is it that any Brit with a high school education assumes that they are smarter than
any Yank on the planet?'

Because we are. Only joking. Sorry to tar you all with the same brush, but really George Dubya...

[Taxloss]

27. Seconded.

As for the "we're cleverer than you" thing, the most prominent thing most Brits see about the US is that the president is a moron and has been "elected by the people" twice. They don't see the subtleties of hanging chads and touch-screen voting and stolen elections, just the "results". So while it's wrong for Brits to get huffity in that respect, since our leader is apparently happy to follow that moron around like a groupie and that is the national embarrassment, cut us a bit of slack?

[GreenPartyVoter]

10. It's Ireland you want. No offense to the Brits, but between the Iraq

war support and the crack down on religious satire, I think living there is only marginally better than here.
--------------------------------------

Would Jesus love a liberal? You bet!
http://timeforachange.bluelemur.com/

[SmileyBoy]

12. But isn't Ireland really poor???

I thought I heard something like that.

[GreenPartyVoter]

13. Not any more. Growing by leaps and bounds these days.

--------------------------------------
Would Jesus love a liberal? You bet!
http://timeforachange.bluelemur.com/

[tjwmason]

17. Ireland

Is now more wealthy than the U.K. according to some sources.

But they don't play cricket in Ireland.

[JohnKleeb]

24. no, not at all

[WritersBlock]

15. Have you thought about Scotland, or does it have to be London?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=191&topic_id=1413&mesg_id=1413

[MsAnthropy]

18. Oh I can't believe you're thinking of giving up Fargo!

Seriously, if an opportunity to live abroad comes up, GRAB IT! Who cares how much it costs? You can always pay the bills later. An experience like that doesn't come up every day.

[Merrick]

19. I've contemplated the same thing

My cousin lives in London (a fact which I've taken advantage of twice for cheap visits) and makes a good living as an English-Lit teacher at a private school. I'd love living there as well, but unfortunately I've determined it to be financially infeasible. The jobs, at least in my field (non-Phd science professional) pay about the equivalent as here (I live in Long Beach, CA) yet the cost of living is about double. basically I'd have to live out in the sticks, thus negating the appeal of moving. Pretty much if you can't afford san francisco or NY, you cant afford London.

[Mass_Liberal]

20. Not at all

I have duel citizenship, American and British.. I personally think that London is a fantastic city.


BIG ITEM: People who say that British food is bad are full of shit. It is so damn good. On top of the fact that the regional food is good, England is also home to really good Indian and Chinese food. I've been to India, and frankly British Indian food is better than Indian Indian food, so far as my experience goes.

What else can I say, the people are really nice, grade A book stores, the pubs are great, and the football (soccer) is the best in the world. So catch some premiership games if you can. Politically England is for the most part your dream social democracy. Blair is obviously conservative on foreign policy, but isn't bad on domestic issues, and anyhow he'll be gone in a few years. I suggest you go. I certainly want to spend a year there when I get out of college.

[KurtNYC]

21. What I ate in London

A nasty sandwich with fatty ham and cucumbers (6 quid)
Soggy fish and cold chips with no salt
Cheddar cheese and ketchup on a bagel (they insisted this was pizza)
Beer with lemonade poured into it
A fried egg, white toast, and milk camouflaging itself onto a white plate

at which point I was indeed, full of shit.

[Arugula Latte]

22. Oooh. Lager 'n' lime?

That's the only kind of beer I actually like -- beer w/ citrus to take away the crappy taste of the beer ... ;-)

[Taxloss]

28. That is hardly representative of what is available

in one of the most diverse culinary cities on Earth.

http://www.washingtonian.com/dining/london.html

[Mass_Liberal]

31. Listen

I live in NYC and I am sure from your username that you do too. Now, I know that the food here kicks ass. However, I am sure that it is easy for a tourist to get a coupla bad meals here and decide that the food sucks. There is bad food in NYC, its just hard to find.


Now, in terms of English food lemme tell you that I have lived in London for two months, and every year visit relatives in Birmingham and go out to eat all the time. Let me tell you, I have not had a meal there ever that was not delicious. And why is that? Because I was lucky when alone and because my relatives know where to go.

Having lived in both places, it is my opinion, that both London and NYC have food that is fantastic the vast majority of the time . However in both places there is some crap food. You just have to go out w/ people who know the good places to eat to get the real representative stuff.

[mr blur]

33. Well, I ate worse in Florida!

It's a myth about the British and bad food. Really. London is a fabulous city - I lived there for 23 years. If you follow the tourist routes you'll get scalped, as in every other major city on the planet. After living there a little while you get to know where to eat, where to go just as if you're in, say, NYC.
Coming fom the US it will seem pricey I guess, but think of the advantages. Health care, no freepers, the right wing lunatics get laughed at and not obeyed; you can say, read, write what you like and you won't get stoned (unless, of course, you want to get stoned, in which case...) The newspapers will tell you what's happening in the world! BBC TV with no advertising! Great theatres, great music, trees everywhere, the royal family to laugh at!
In no time at all you'd be crossing the street to avoid the families of loud American tourists tring to find the nearest McDonalds to get "real food".
And you'd be welcome.

[no name no slogan]

23. I lived in the UK after college

In fact, you may be able to go on the program I went on, if you're a student. It was basically a six-month student/working visa that allowed you to work for up to six months. It was about the easiest way to legally stay in the UK without having to study there.

I spent almost seven months there from July 1991 to February 1992. I worked in a very cool pub in London and learned all about British Ale in the process. I was trained in the art of cellermanship and even went through a vocational training program through the City & Guilds of London Institute. I still have the certificate from there hanging on the wall in my home office.

I'd check with the international studies office of your university to see what they offer-- even though you're a grad student, they may be able to help out.

AFAIK it's very hard to emigrate there (as a permanent resident), unless you are a political refugee or have some highly specialized skill that they can't find anywhere else in Europe. It's much easier to get into Canada these days, IMHO.

[SmileyBoy]

26. I'm not a grad student.

I still have a few years until I get my bachelor's.

I still want to go to grad school in Winnipeg, but I've been contemplating moving to the UK after that.

[no name no slogan]

32. Even better then

The program I went through was sponsored by BUNAC. I did it immediately after I got my undergrad degree. IIRC you don't have to be enrolled to participate in it-- you're eligible to go if you've been away from college for 6 months or less.

You may want to take a year off between college and grad school and do something like this. It will give you a good taste of another part of the world, plus it will look better on a grad school application, too. Depending on your graduate field of study, most places like it if you take some time between undergrad and grad school, anyway.

Good luck!

[Lex]

25. I don't think it's all that easy to get permanent status to live there.

Maybe you can get a temporary visa to stay for a while, but I wouldn't assume that getting to live there full time is just yours for the taking.

[billyskank]

29. I wasn't aware that it was difficult

I would have thought someone with an American passport would have no trouble getting permanent residency here.

[Lex]

30. No, in order to get permanent residency status . . .

.
well, as it was stated up in the thread in post #23:

"AFAIK it's very hard to emigrate there (as a permanent resident), unless you are a political refugee or have some highly specialized skill that they can't find anywhere else in Europe. It's much easier to get into Canada these days, IMHO."

That's my understanding too, from a cousin who lived and worked in the UK briefly. She looked into permanant status but it wasn't going to happen.