Just saw HOTEL RWANDA and I'm sick to my stomach.

[NightTrain]

In 1994, while the U.S. news media obsessed over the O.J. Simpson murder trial, the Hutu army in Rwanda was busy committing genocide against one million of its fellow citizens, the Tutsis. As if I didn't already hate the mainstream media...! :grr:

What, exactly, is the difference between Hutus and Tutsis? Seems the Hutus have the darker skin and wider noses, while the Tutsis have the lighter skin and narrower noses. You can thank the Belgians for that artificial distinction, which led directly to the 1994 Tutsi holocaust (and I use that word deliberately).

HOTEL RWANDA is based on the true story of Paul Rusesabagina (Don Cheadle), the Hutu house manager of a four-star hotel who took in 1,628 Tutsi refugees at great personal risk. I hope this film affords Mr. Rusesabagina the respect that SCHINDLER'S LIST gave the late Oskar Schindler, but I wouldn't count on it. After all, who cares about a bunch of niggers? Right??? :puke:

This is a film that raises far more questions than it answers. Unfortunately, the questions it raises are ones that I've asked at least a thousand times in my relatively short life: Why don't people learn from past mistakes? Why didn't I hear about all that horror while it was occurring? Why don't the lives of non-whites matter more to the world community? Why do people allow artificially created differences to fill them with hatred for their fellow human beings?

Sitting in the row ahead of me was a black man who attended HOTEL RWANDA by himself. Throughout the film, I heard periodic sobs and sniffles emanating from that man. I wondered if he was Rwandan, or if he knew people who were murdered there in 1994. I wanted to ask him, but couldn't bring myself to do so.

Sorry if I'm rambling, but I'm still pretty shaken up over the horrors depicted in HOTEL RWANDA. It is an excellent film that I wish everybody would see, government leaders in particular. I would not, however, recommend it to folks who are susceptible to the cinematic equivalent of Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to drown my sorrows in a pint of Dove's Irresistibly Raspberry ice cream, after which I plan to crawl into bed with my roommate's dog for an hour or two. If that doesn't help me to feel better, I'll move into a fucking cave! :cry:

[Guy Fawkes]

1. Wait.. you didn't know that?

Do you know what happened in Sierra Leon?

[amazona]

4. a lot of people don't know about it

As for Sierra Leone, some of the stuff going on there is so horrific that it becomes impossible for the mind to comprehend. How are you going to put stuff like gangs of machete-wielding freaks chopping off people's limbs and facial features in the news? No one wants to look at it. Past a certain point of horror, people shut down. Not sure what to do about it.

The conservation movement is a breeding ground of communists
and other subversives. We intend to clean them out,
even if it means rounding up every birdwatcher in the country.
--John Mitchell, US Attorney General 1969-72

[NightTrain]

5. It happened during the worst year of my life.

In January 1994, my then-girlfriend broke my heart. Two weeks later, my mother died suddenly. Consequently, I spent much of 1994 as an emotional cripple, too absorbed in my own personal hell to pay much attention to the world beyond my own little piece of it. However, I still tuned in to the TV news a couple of times a week, and I can't for the life of me recall having heard Rwanda mentioned back then.

[Garbo 2004]

20. I do recall that it was reported on the TV news. I still recall seeing,

among other scenes and reports, a river filled with what appeared to be at least hundreds of dead bodies. The story was reported at the time.

[Zuni]

48. I remember seeing the news with huge mass graves

It was definetly reported

[DrWeird]

23. It was widely reported. Papers, radio, TV...

images of corpses floating down rivers and over waterfalls, corpses lying in churchyards, screaming children with freshly amputated stumps...

Nobody cared.

I remember people laughing at the names "hutus" and "tutsies."

[AngryAmish]

39. Nodody cared? Nobody cares now

I made a post yesterday that "never again" has become a pious joke.
I really mean it.

As Americans we don't care. We really don't. 2 million Congolese die in the last few years - did I do one thing? No, and that is my moral failing.

Darfur has been going on for a long time, and other than tsk-tsking at the problem I have done nothing.

People pontificate about the UN and their moral authority. They can do nothing. And the reports of rapist UN peacekeepers do not help things.

The US cares when it is in our interest to care. Clinton said he had no idea about the extent of the horror. Liar. I was sitting my fat ass on the couch and I knew.

Bottom line: we are savage beasts and will remain so.

[barb162]

45. I remember it being on the national news a lot, newspapers,

the weekly news mags, etc.

[flamingyouth]

2. Now you'll have to read this book:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0312243359/qid=1105921236/sr=2-1/ref=pd_ka_b_2_1/104-6176300-1395139

"We Wish to Inform You That Tomorrow We Will Be Killed Along With Our Families: Stories From Rwanda." It made me cry so hard it took me about two weeks to finish it - I could only read three or four pages at a time.

I would like to see this film at some point, but I might have to see it on DVD in the privacy of my own home so I don't freak out in public. :cry:

[Sufi Marmot]

21. Or this one....

A Sunday at the Pool in Kigali by Gil Courtemanche, which is autobiography presented as fiction.

-SM

[Garbo 2004]

27. Excellent book. I recommend it also. & there is PBS' Frontline documentary

"Ghosts of Rwanda." Info on the program, some video and transcripts are available at PBS' site: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/ghosts/ The program also is available on DVD.

[AngryAmish]

40. One of the best things I have ever seen on tv

Really showed what we are all about as a people.

[TrustingDog]

38. or Shake Hands with the Devil

The Failure of Humanity in Rwanda
by Romeo A. Dallaire

Editorial Reviews
From Publishers Weekly
As former head of the late 1993 U.N. peacekeeping mission in Rwanda, Canadian general Dallaire's initial proposal called for 5,000 soldiers to permit orderly elections and the return of the refugees. Nothing like this number was supplied, and the result was an outright attempt at genocide against the Tutsis that nearly succeeded, with 800,000 dead over three months. The failure of the U.N.'s wealthier members to act as the tragedy unfolded obliged the author to leave military service to recover from PTSD (as well as the near breakdown of his family).

While much of the account is a thickly described I-went-here, I went-there, I-met-X, I-said-this, one learns much more about the author's emotional states when making decisions than in a conventional military history, making this an important document of service—one that has been awarded Canada's Governor General's Award. And his descriptions of Rwanda's unraveling are disturbing, to say the least ("I then noticed large piles of blue-black bodies heaped on the creek banks"). Dallaire's argument that Rwanda-like situations are fires that can be put out with a small force if caught early enough will certainly draw debate, but the book documents in horrifying detail what happens when no serious effort is made.

[jonnyblitz]

44. I just "ordered " this book via intra-library loan online because

of your post. my local library (Norwich, CT) doesn't carry it but, according to online records, it is checked in at whatever CT public library DOES carry it and should be enroute the first business day. this is why I like DU. I didn't know about this book until I read your post. :hi:

[Zuni]

47. That book is incredible

I couldn't put it down

[rockymountaindem]

3. Hutus and Tutsis are the same.

Hutus, however, are a branch of the society which farmed, while the Tutsis raised cattle. The Belgians emphasized the distinction in order to divide the population so that they could more easily rule the area. There is no difference between Hutus and Tutsis other than this, however the Tutsis were used by the Belgians to oppress the Hutus. When the Hutus finally got the chance for revenge in 1994, they took full advantage of it.

[The Backlash Cometh]

8. If we're expecting whites to appreciate the minority experience,

and do something about inequities, it's a strategy that will only waste time. Write your own histories, teach your own children, and build pride and collective cooperation.

[rockymountaindem]

16. Did I say something wrong?

[The Backlash Cometh]

18. No. Of course not! Just hit on my pet peeve. We keep talking

to anglos about these experiences as if they can empathize with any of it, but they can't. And even if they could, we wouldn't get enough of them to care to change policy.

Probably just lamenting our situation. Didn't mean to come across so hard edged.

[DrWeird]

6. Clinton's only real fuck-up.

Going on now in the Sudan, not that Bush cares, of course.

[NightTrain]

7. To his credit, Clinton now regrets not having done more in Rwanda.

Not that his regret does those one million dead Tutsis any good....

[DrWeird]

11. Yeah, he says he does. I have my doubts.

I think he knew exactly what he was doing, or didn't do, when he was doing it.

[Schema Thing]

24. Well, the movie gives him a good bitch slapping, if you watch closely

They made sure to prop a scene in the hotel so that a Time magazine with Clintons face and name on the cover, is VERY readable and noticeable in one scene.

[Garbo 2004]

29. The Clinton Administration didn't want to know about things it didn't

want to know about. They studiously avoided the use of the term "genocide" since that would require action. The massacres weren't spur of the moment events, it had been planned in advance and there were reports about the situation well before the killing started.

Reportedly the US also blocked action at the UN (Albright was the Ambassador to the UN) which might have prevented or at least mitigated the situation. By the time the administration roused itself to acknowledge the situation required some sort of attention it was too late.

[amazona]

37. well hindsight is 20/20

...and the Africans I've spoken to, for what it's worth, certainly don't hate Clinton. I'm not so outgoing and the only ones I've spoken to have been in the tourist industry where Clinton is far from unpopular. So take it FWIW.

There are atrocities going on all over the continent, and to this day. "Bill Clinton dunnit" goes only so far.

At that time we were all very upset at U.S. military intervention in Latin America. Our intervention in Central/South America over the pre-Clinton decades had killed more than it saved. A lot more. So when the call came out for intervention in Africa, people were hesitant and didn't know who to believe.

At the time I for one assumed that U.S. intervention could not be a positive thing for Rwanda. I think a lot of Americans, and not just conservatives, thought the same.

The conservation movement is a breeding ground of communists
and other subversives. We intend to clean them out,
even if it means rounding up every birdwatcher in the country.
--John Mitchell, US Attorney General 1969-72

[Garbo 2004]

43. Military intervention was not the only option and again, the US wasn't

unaware of what was going to go down in Rwanda. Preemptive nonmilitary gestures would have risked little yet even those weren't made. The US had no direct interest to be served and so simply let it go.

The US, however, did not need to discourage action at the UN and yet it did.

The reasons the Clinton administration didn't try even the most feeble of actions prior and during the event had nothing to do with Central America. And again, "action" does not necessarily mean "military intervention." Different situations altogether. But the assumption that military intervention was the only option available and the US had no information prior to the massacres allow the administration officials to justify why they did nothing.

[AngryAmish]

42. He knew and he lies about it now

I remember. I saw it on TV. It was covered by all the networks. I saw the bodies going over the waterfall. If he said he did not know he is lying.

Watch the Frontline documentary and see the complete contortions that Albrieght did at the UN not to call it genocide. Genocide has a clear, statutory meaning in the US. It was ignored because he was still smarting from the Battle of Mogadishu.

[Bok_Tukalo]

50. Close to a million dead is more than a "fuck-up"

It is a profound failure of character on the part of the leader of the free world.

[GOPFighter]

9. My co-worker saw it last week...

...and said it's the most powerful movie he's ever seen. He, too, was shaken up by the movie. I think it's going to get a lot of attention and raise some awareness.

[Rick Myers]

10. It's a sad, sad thing that this could happen in a civilized world!!!

:cry:

[Grace]

12. Where were the United Nations?

Why didn't they intervene to stop the butchery? This was on the magnitude of the Holoacaust, yet nothing was done. To put things in perspective, the genocide dwarfs the toll from the tsunami. Too bad we are over 10 years after the fact...

[NightTrain]

13. There were U.N. peacekeepers in Rwanda in 1994.

However, the "force" consisted of only 300 soldiers for the entire country. And they were forbidden to use their guns!

[Garbo 2004]

30. The commander asked for more troops to prevent the massacre before

it began. The UN (Kofi Annan if I recall correctly) refused to provide additional support. I think the commander said a force of perhaps about 2,000 would have been sufficient to prevent the massacre which was a preplanned event.

[DrWeird]

33. You mean the Secretary-General?

Boutros-Boutros Ghali.

[Garbo 2004]

35. No, not Secretary Gen. Annan was in charge of UN peacekeepers then. n/t

[Grace]

49. Well, then I guess the UN (and the world)

is in good hands with Kofi huh? LoL!

Stopping a genocide for the UN would be like a one-legged man winning an ass kicking contest. Would a Secretary-General Clinton be more effective?

Or the UN could just fall like its predecessor, the League of Nations.

[DrWeird]

17. Where was the US?

nt

[Garbo 2004]

31. Not interested and avoiding the word "genocide" since it would require

some action be taken.

Again, despite what the Clinton officials now say, this event didn't just happen on the spur of the moment. It was foreseen and preplanned. The Administration had other priorities and made sure it sat on the sidelines and clucked "oh isn't it awful" when it happened.

What's worse, they also apparently discouraged the UN from taking effective action when it could have made a difference.

[Kire]

14. Your "who cares about the ___" comment reminds me:

of when Nick Nolte's UN officer, who was no villain, said to Paul that "You're not even a n*gger. You're an African." He was explaining how he was viewed by the UN and all of the foreign nationals (i.e. whites) in Rwanda who were being evacuated, while the Tutsis weren't.

I read some review somewhere, the tagline should be: "Nolte uses the N word around Cheadle, and survives."

But, it really shocked me to show how much overt, colonial-era racist violence still has such very intense consequences in my lifetime.

[ThorsHammer]

15. I hope we do something about Darfur while we can

From what I've heard, it's pretty bad there too. Powell himself called it genocide, although I don't know if we've taken any steps yet.

[Kire]

32. Powell took steps last week. Backward ones.

Powell Sidesteps Question About Sudan Genocide

By Glenn Kessler
Washington Post Staff Writer
Sunday, January 9, 2005; Page A16

NAIROBI, Jan. 8 -- Secretary of State Colin L. Powell declined to say Saturday whether Sudan was still committing genocide through a campaign of killings, rapes and other abuses by government-sponsored Arab militias that have left 1.2 million black Africans homeless in the country's western region of Darfur.

Four months ago, in a dramatic statement, Powell said the government in Khartoum had committed genocide and "genocide may still be occurring."

On Friday, in a 16-page report to the U.N. Security Council, Secretary General Kofi Annan said the situation in Darfur was deteriorating. It charges that the Sudanese government has consistently violated U.N. Security Council resolutions demanding the disarmament, arrest and prosecution of the Arab Janjaweed militia, responsible for carrying out some of the worst atrocities in the region. "On the contrary, they have returned to the practice of including the militia in joint military operations," Annan wrote.

More: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A58717-2005Jan8.html

[Orangepeel]

19. Hadn't "Blackhawk Down" happened recently?

It was a very powerful movie. And, an absolute tragedy that never should have occurred (and I sobbed and sniffled through the movie and I'm not Rwandan).

There is no question that the UN should have done more (than virtually nothing) and that the Clinton administration should have done more. But, for what little it's worth, hadn't the United States just had that tragedy in Somalia? It's no excuse, but it sheds some light on why Clinton (who was still a fairly "young" president) was politically hesitant to intervene.

Because the movie is about this particular incident at this point in time, it casts the Hutu as "the bad guys." That's not a criticism because that was the story, but my limited understanding of the situation and what I looked up after seeing the movie, leads me to think that it is more complicated than that. Again, no excuse for slaughter, but if the movie had taken place at another time or in a neighboring country, the Tutsi may have been slaughtering the Hutu.

The most blame for the events is placed on the world community -- the Belgians for exacerbating the hatred between Hutus and Tutsi while they were a colonial power (again, not quite as simple as the movie indicated but the Belgians did make them carry ID cards to indicate who was who and only let the Tutsi get educated and hold positions of authority), France for arming the Hutus, and Britain and the US for doing nothing.

Nick Nolte plays a cynical UN peacekeeper who is trying his best with no help from the UN itself. There is a tragic scene fairly early in the movie where UN soldiers come to evacuate people from the hotel, but will only take foreigners and leave the Rwandans there to fend for themselves.

[DrWeird]

22. It was both an incredibly complex and obscene simple situation.

a minimal force could have saved thousands.

I haven't seen the movie yet, hasn't been released here.

There was an incredible documentary on PBS several months ago. Should be required viewing.

[warrens]

25. I just got back from seeing it with the kid

Very moving, very accurate, very well done. It's a crime that most of the murderers snuck over the Congo border, where they are still creating mayhem, although not to the same satanic level.

I can't remember the name right now, but Elmore Leonard wrote a very good book based on the genocide.

You have to wonder if had not the Rethugs been in full assassination mode in 94, with their contract on america and screeching Vince Foster and Whitewater nonstop if Clinton would have had the courage to send in our troops.

[tjdee]

26. What about the Sudan and the Congo NOW??

Thousands of refugees just fled the Democratic Republic of the Congo to Uganda.
Darfur has been a crazyhouse for months.

People talk about the Middle East's instability, but they act like Africa doesn't exist. Until Africans bomb us one day.

And I worry that they will.

[gottaB]

41. The Rhinos are getting airlifted to safety

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4179027.stm

[Skittles]

28. I would have asked that guy

my curiosity always gets the best of me; usually it works out well because I'm truly interested, not just being nosy

[Lindsey]

34. I'm seeing it tomorrow and also didn't know that this

went on. You're right. OJ was MUCH more important than 1,000,000 people being slaughtered. I know the movie is going to get me but I know it one I need to see. I hope you feel better - I'm sorry :-(

[imenja]

36. racial and ethnic difference are culturally constructed

Hutus and Tutsis see a difference between themselves, and there has been a long history of political conflict.
Who we think about race and ethnicity is a product of our culture. We see all Africans alike in the US, because of the kind of racial ideas that surround us. It's not about actual genetic difference.
PBS had an excellent series on the Rwanda genocide called "A Problem from Hell." It's worth trying to get a hold of.

[Minstrel Boy]

46. Romeo Dallaire, the Canadian commander of UN peacekeepers,

kept asking for more troops - just a few thousand would have stopped the genocide, he believes. The UN refused. He, in turn, refused orders to leave. And Rwanda left him with awful Post Traumatic Stress, which finished his military career and almost killed him.

From the CBC:

After Rwanda, Dallaire blamed himself for everything. He sank deep into despair. He attempted suicide. Three years ago he sat on a park bench in Ottawa and drank from a bottle of alcohol. He's forbidden to drink because of the drugs he takes for depression. The mixture almost put him into a coma. Police had to take him to hospital.

...

So, who does he blame?

"I blame the American leadership, which includes the Pentagon, in projecting itself as the world policeman one day and a recluse the next," Dallaire says.

...

As the death toll mounted, General Dallaire submitted a detailed plan for a Rapid Reaction Force. He needed 5,000 soldiers to dismantle the killing machine of the genocidaire and to stop the Hutu power movement. The UN Security Council rejected the plan. The United States even refused to acknowledge the genocide to avoid any legal obligations to help.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/dallaire/

[solinvictus]

51. It was reported...

I remember seeing the falls from Lake Victoria red with blood and feet, arms, and heads popping out of the water.