A message for/request to gay DUers.

[liberalhistorian]

If you have met a woman who doesn't know you're gay, PLEASE DO NOT DO THE FOLLOWING:

1. Because she's a paralegal, get her to help a "friend" of yours (said friend really being your lover, but neither of you bother to confide that petty little detail) with an extremely serious legal matter
2. Spend a lot of time with her both in person and over the phone, acting like you enjoy talking to/being around her.
3. Act like you're enjoying the friendship and want to develop it further.
4. Allow the two of you to grow closer and closer as she spends many, many hours of her own time, uncompensated, trying to help your "friend"
5. Even though you sense she's falling hard for you, keep totally quiet about the fact that you're gay and your "friend" in trouble is really your lover, taking advantage of her feelings and her naivete to get her to continue helping your "friend" with his legal matter for free;
6. Give her hope that there may be more than just a friendship developing and give indications that you are returning her feelings;
7. Give lingering hugs at the end of each meeting, and give indications that there will be more physical contact forthcoming;
8. Take her to a nice restaurant for her milestone birthday and give her a nice romantic gift and card.
9. Continue to call her and see her frequently, flirting with and complitmenting her, with indications of something real and wonderfully romantic beginning.
10. When she finally confides in the "friend" that she can't keep her strong, true feelings inside anymore and that she's anxious to get to the next level of the relationship, and the "friend" has known of her feelings for some time because she confided them previously and he never bothered to "enlighten" her at that time, and the "friend" finally comes out and "straightens" her out as to the true situation and that nothing will ever happen, DO NOT SAY, FIRST THING, "so, does that mean you won't help "__________" anymore?" thereby giving away the game that you two had just been using and taking advantage of her all along;
11. Finally, please do not insult her intelligence by continuing to try to contact her, claiming that you just feel so terrible about things, that you're oh so sorry, that you just had no idea of her true feelings and would have said something if you did, that you never meant for any of this to happen this way and that it kills you that she's hurting so, etc., etc., etc., etc., blahblahblahblahblah. She already feels like enough of an idiotic naive fool, she doesn't need to to rub salt in a very open, raw wound.

Do not do things like this. It's not fair at all to her, and it's not even really fair to you and your "friend", however much an ego boost you may get from it. And it causes people to be very resentful toward gays, however unfair that may be. Just an FYI.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

1. What If The Person Was Bisexual?

[liberalhistorian]

6. What if he wasn't and never

had any intention of having any kind of relationship at all with women?

[Lex]

2. A gay guy might respond and say

.
"Don't over-interpret interactions with me. And (with respect to #5) how can you know WHAT I "sense"--are you now reading my mind?"

And also, "I might may want to keep my relationship with my 'friend' personal and not general information."

[liberalhistorian]

8. Kinda hard to

"overinterpret" certain very heterosexual comments, and kinda hard to "overinterpret" being given flowers and beautiful jewelry for your birthday.

[Fenris]

3. Straight people also have the ability to use others.

Amazing thing, that.

[liberalhistorian]

7. Yeah, but that doesn't change

the fact that when you're gay you shouldn't lead women on who don't know you're gay because you don't bother to tell them.

[jpgray]

64. In those romantic transactions of life, there can be a karmic consistency

:)

[nini]

4. uh... someone doesn't have to be gay to lead another on

this guy just happened to be.

He could have been married and you didn't know it.

In a long term relationship and you didn't know it etc..


All kinds of people can fool us.

Learn from it and move on.

[liberalhistorian]

12. Thank you very much for that insightful,

heartfelt advice, I feel ever so much better now.

[nini]

21. not being insightful, being realistic

you worded this thread in a way that is insulting to the gay people on this board. You generalized something that should not have been that pointed. There are creeps in every sexual preference and you happened to run into one of them who happened to be gay. To lecture the gay DUers wasn't right. If you didn't mean your post to come off like that then ok, but that's how it did come across.

[liberalhistorian]

29. No, actually I didn't mean it to come

off that way at all, and I see now how it must seem. I just hate being told, though, to "move on" by people who have no idea how I'm feeling and how dismissive that sounds. I hate hearing other people being told that, too, which is why I try not to say it.

[sundog]

5. Door swings both ways...

roaches & cons exist in all groups

[Bluebear]

9. So you think gay men at DU need this kind of detailed lecture?

Because, after all, leading a straight woman on is such an "ego boost"?

[liberalhistorian]

14. Actually, yeah, according to his

"friend", that's exactly what it was to him.

[Bluebear]

16. Well his "friend" isn't indicative of all gay men

In other words he might be a sociopath, really I am sorry this happened to you, I didn't realize at first that it was first-person experience but really, we're not all jerks.

[libnnc]

10. Straight women

should learn not to assume that everyone is heterosexual.

And they should learn that it is rude to flirt with lesbians too. If I had a nickel for every time a straight gal tried flirting with me because she thought she was being cute...

it's a two-way street you know

heteros can be really selfish too

[liberalhistorian]

13. Pretty goddamned hard

to assume someone isn't heterosexual when you're being given nice jewelry and flirted constantly with. But then again, maybe that's just me. The point is, you need to be HONEST and NOT LEAD PEOPLE ON.

[libnnc]

17. Well it sucks being used don't it?

As a lesbian, I've had LOTS of straight women friends who have treated me like I was their new found love only to find out they just "wanted to be friends"...that 2 hour necking session on their couch was just "getting to know you time"....whatever

That said, your experience is no excuse to go medieval on all gay men.

Learn not to be suckered in, grow up and move on.

Shit happens.

[liberalhistorian]

40. I'm sorry you've encountered

straight women like that. I know how often that happens, and I saw that kind of deceitful shit back in my college dormitory and couldn't believe someone would do that and play around with feelings like that. What was worse was that the straight women would then think it was funny and would be laughing among themselves over it.

[libnnc]

47. Thanks, I didn't mean to come off as cold and uncaring

We're all a bit sensitive these days with fundies breathing down our necks and wishing us death and dismemberment on a daily basis. I have known some pretty bitchy, nasty, pissy gay men in my life too. But the common denomiator among them was greed and selfishness, not their being gay.

My feelings towards hetero women these days is--it is best not to take them too seriously (especially after they've sucked down half of a pitcher of margaritas).

Bill the bastard. Time is money.

[Radical Activist]

11. I hate it when that happens!

Ok, so that has never happened to me, but I'm sorry to hear about a that experience.

[Bouncy Ball]

15. OhmyGOD gay men are like, ALWAYS doing that to me!

Wait, no they aren't. Nevermind.

[Dookus]

49. LOL

good 'un

[Nikia]

18. Some people carry friendship further without sexual intentions

Especially if they are in a relationship (gay or straight) or have other reasons like not wanting to pursue a sexual or partnered relationship at the time. They may even take you on what some people consider dates or give you presents. As part of their friendship though, especially if you are single and have not expressed disinterest in a physical, partnered relationship, they should be willing to share that part of their life with you (that they are gay, married, studying for the priesthood, not wanting to get involved until after graduate school, ect.). It sounds from your story though that he wasn't just being overly friendly and leaving out part of his life, but being openly deceitful. That wasn't nice of him. People should not play with other people's feelings like that.

[HeyManThatsCool]

19. Don't judge the gay community by that idiot

But DO go ahead & egg his house.

This is something a married or committed man could have done as well.
The problem isn't the sexuality........ IT"S THE MAN.


Gay, Straight, Bi..... some men are just dicks



Sorry about your bad experience. There is no excuse for that & I know you must feel retched- & your probably reviewing everything that ever happened wondering if you should have known sooner. In the long run, you just have to let it go and move on. You deserve better


& anyone who wrote you back on this thread being an asshole is probably just..... well....... a man

[Bluebear]

22. I was an asshole

I didn't realize at first that it was a first-person narrative. I guess I am already sensitive on here for being blamed for losing the whole election :) Sorry, but I thought the original tone was a bit insulting to gay DUers but I can appreciate that people lash out when hurt.

[HeyManThatsCool]

23. It's not your fault we lost the election!!

It's Karl Roves fault. :evilfrown:

[Bluebear]

24. I know but right after Nov. 2 there was a lot of...

"we need to stop pushing for gay rights" talk and "moral values" and ...well, stuff.

[HeyManThatsCool]

31. I think that people who think beating on gays is Moral are SICK

They don't have any moral values what-so-ever in my opinion.
I'm a proud hetero woman- but I see no difference between the way I love a man & the way gay people love eachother. I think people who spend so much of their lives focusing on homosexuality, abortion, and mandatory prayer have problems they cant deal with so they go ahead and butt their noses into everyone elses business.

We need to KEEP on pushing for gay rights. I think it is a god damn disgrace what passes for gay rights.... including dont ask, dont tell.

[Bluebear]

33. Thanks for that

It's why I continue to fight for a woman's right to choose, something that will never affect me. We're all in this boat together. :toast:

[HeyManThatsCool]

42. Exactly. Why dont more people see that?

Is it something they put in the water or??????

[liberalhistorian]

34. Yeah, well, that pissed me off, too,

and I still can't believe people actually said things like that; I'm sure Rove was proud of his handiwork.

[jonnyblitz]

27. it was insulting to all gay DUers and you owe nobody

an apology.

[HeyManThatsCool]

28. way to make it about you

Obviously the girls a bit emotional. Let's make sure to bash the crap out of her now so she feels even worse.

Hope that makes your day a happy one

[Bluebear]

37. Come on guys and gals

We'll get past this one. Wanna bet the original villain in the story is a "Log Cabin Republican"?

[HeyManThatsCool]

38. ROFLMAO

well... this guy does sound like a big dick!

[liberalhistorian]

44. LOL! I could make a joke about

not ever being able to find that out for sure, but, well..........:evilgrin:

[johnnie]

41. LOL

You just might be right about that.

[Duncan Grant]

46. You got that right.

"And it causes people to be very resentful toward gays, however unfair that may be. Just an FYI."

I understand she's hurt but to patronize all gay DUers - :shrug:

[liberalhistorian]

48. You're right, and, again,

I apologize. That wasn't my intention at all.

[Duncan Grant]

54. Apology accepted.

I loathe opportunists like your 'friend' as much as you do.

Hope a few generous and loving people cross your path in the near future to help soothe this bad experience.

[Rowdyboy]

20. I'm sorry......His behavior was cheap and trashy

Gay men are just as likely to be insensitive jerks as straight men. The first gay guy I dated after coming out took me for $50; within a year, another guy took me for close to $1000. There are plenty of users in the gay community, just as there are in all large groups of people. You just met a very talented one. Sorry... :hug:

[liberalhistorian]

26. I'm sorry, I probably shouldn't have

even started this stupid thread, I should have waited until I cooled down and felt at least a little better (I feel so miserable now, though, that God knows when I'll be feeling better). I see now how insulting it must seem to gay men. Certainly didn't mean to paint all of them with the same brush, and I see that that's how it must sound. Should probably just delete the whole damn thing.

Intense hurt and bitterness will do that to a person, I guess.

[Rowdyboy]

55. You don't owe anyone any apologies...You've been hurt quite cruelly

and deliberately. Its okay to be defensive and pissed and hurt and even lash out a little. I understand that you meant no offense because I've been reading your thoughts for a long time now. You don't have it in you to be mean.

I'm really sorry the creep hurt you. The sad thing is, you probably would have given about the same amount of help to him if he'd been honest.

[Frogtutor]

25. I'm so sorry you've been hurt...

Gay or not, this guy's just an asshole. Unfortunately, the world is full of assholes, and they come in all colors, sexes, and sexual orientations. I'm sure you know this, but you are just really hurt and angry right now.

My personal wish for you is for you to very soon meet a nice guy who wouldn't dream of using you, and fall in mutual love...

:hug:

[johnnie]

30. I'm sorry to hear that this happened

I agree with you that this was wrong from the get go. Sure, not only "gay" people do it, but in your case the person was gay. This person lied to you and obviously knew he was gay and wasn't up front with you about it. Yeah, he could have been married and straight, but he wasn't. It's funny that some people on here are more worried about being "PC" than to look at the situation as you described it. If you would have posted "A message for/request to married DUers." and went on to explain that all this happened with a married man, some people would have torn into the "married" man and what a pig he was.
I'm sorry this happened and please don't get too down on people. There are a lot of assholes out there and we all run into them sooner or later. This person was deceitful and knew what he was doing from the start (according to your post). I would bill him and his friend for your time.
:hug:

[Frogtutor]

35. Ooooo...billing him is a GREAT idea!

Then, if he doesn't pay you, you can file a lien on his personal property, or something!

Sweet revenge...

[Bluebear]

36. I LOVE that idea!

hehehehe

[HeyManThatsCool]

39. Bill him till you can bill him no more

f'er

[liberalhistorian]

43. LOL!

Hey, great idea actually! I've put in over 50 hours of work so far, so if I charge the normal independent paralegal rate of between $20-30 an hour, that'd be a pretty neat chunk of change! :evilgrin:

[Frogtutor]

45. Go for it, girlfriend!! n/t

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

32. There are loads of assholes in the world who use people

Sorry you crossed paths with one of them...and he didn't do it because he is gay...he did it because he is an asshole, a schemer and a user.

[JimmyJazz]

57. I could not possibly agree with you more!

:toast:

[Bok_Tukalo]

50. What an interesting conversation

BTW, my opinion is the guy was rude.

[tjdee]

51. I fell for a gay guy in college...

and I knew he was gay. He was very friendly, gave me a necklace for my birthday, picked me flowers (off the tree at our school, but whatever!), gave me long hugs (YUM)...at first I kind of wondered if he wasn't bi.

But I learned that it was just that he was a caring, warm person who appreciated his friends. I've met a few more gay men like that, actually. I'm lucky to know them.

Obviously, though, you didn't know, and that was unfair of this guy. He probably does feel badly (though, his initial reaction sucked). I'm sorry this happened. It was bad enough when I *knew* the guy was gay (and his very hot boyfriend).

Maybe there are straight men somewhere like that?
:hug:

[liberalhistorian]

53. Oh, undoubtedly, there are tons and tons

of straight men and women like that, too, I never, ever meant to paint all gays with the same brush. He was, indeed, using me and taking advantage of my feelings in order to get me to continue to help his friend for free. It's a really, bitter blow and I let my emotions run wild before reason when I posted this stupid thread. I've asked the mods to just delete the whole thing, hopefully, they'll do that soon.

[intrepid_wanderer]

58. if only... only if...

I wish there were "straight men" like that as well!!

'cause it seems all the 'straight men' I end up dating turn up to be a$$hole$ much like the one (two?) that were the impetus for this thread...

... so nice to have a dream (thinking one day it may be life, makes it better)

[Bouncy Ball]

52. He was probably a Clark supporter.

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I'm SO JUST KIDDING!!!!!!!!!

[sbj405]

56. LH, sorry you got hurt

Though I agree with the above posters that this jerk would have done this regardless of his sexual orientation. Jerks come in all shapes, sizes, orientations. Again, sorry that you were hurt and wasted your time on said jerk. :hug:

[Rowdyboy]

59. If you feel like a laugh, check out "Gay Boyfriend"

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mcneal/mirror/gb_medium.html

You should laugh your ass off if you've never seen it.

[NightTrain]

60. Aww, Lisa. I'm so sorry!

Sounds like you've had your version of the experience I had with that woman I met late last fall, who didn't bother for several weeks to mention that she has a fiance. God, some people...! :cry:

[Name removed]

61. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bluebear]

62. "A great homosexual victory over our straight oppressors?"

Whaa?????????

[jonnyblitz]

65. so you agree that if one gay person is an ass to your friend

the whole bunch of us deseve a lecture on why no wonder people don't like us?

give me a fucking break. :puke:

[libnnc]

66. self delete

[libnnc]

67. take it down a notch, sparky

you need to read the whole thread--every post--before you start calling names.

[JimmyJazz]

70. And you need to have been here longer than a few weeks to

understand the nature of Night Train's protection of liberalhistorian. You don't know what you are talking about, "sparky" - he's defending a friend is all.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

69. She saw her mistake and corrected it

She's cool...

[Lydia Leftcoast]

63. Yeah, I've been there, only without the paralegal work

:hug:

I may be disappointed, but I do appreciate it when men mention their wives or partners early in the conversation.

[foreigncorrespondent]

68. I don't understand the request at all!

Obviously this has happened to you, and I do feel for this happening. But lumbering an entire community into this, because this has happened is the exact same sensless cruelity you were put through. And by making this "request" to all gay DUers is lumbering us all into the same boat these jerks that used you are in.

Not everyone in the gay community likes using people to get what they want. If that was the case, then I should have just married some lame duck American bloke years ago, just to get a green card, so I could be with Sapph.

Just like in the heterosexual world, not everyone in the gay community have morals, but please remember that the majority of us do.

I am sorry for this outburst, but I am tired of everytime something negative happens, which happens to involve a gay person, it always happens that we are ALL blamed!

[Moderator]

71. Locking

Locking at original poster's request.