Ritalin is a Schedule II drug (same as OxyCon.)and we give it to our kids?

[LynneSin]

I've been doing some reading on controlled substances and I found something that was VERY disturbing.

As you know, controlled substances (those drugs deemed by the FDA as addictive) have a 'Schedule' rating. Schedule 1 drugs are those drugs which serve no medical purpose and you cannot get by prescription (which yes, includes Marijuana :crazy: ). But what really really freaked me out is Schedule II drugs - which is considered the most addictive Control Substance that can be prescribed. OxyContin (Rush's drug of choice) is Schedule II, but what really bugs me is Ritalin, a drug we give our chilrden who have Attention Deficit Disorder, is also Schedule II.

That's just freaking wrong. We are giving our kids a drug that is considered as highly addictive as OxyContin???!!!! And doctors prescribe this stuff like it's freaking candy. Geez, they thought about putting one of my nephews on it (and turns out they misdiagnosed him and he actually had a real condition - Epilepsy)

Am I the only one bothered by this???!!!!

http://www.anxietyinfo.com/content.asp?ID=4&SID=3

[soleft]

1. It's speed

I'll never understand why it has a sedating affect on hyper kids. Though I took speed once in college and fell asleep immediately, no one ever accused me of being hyper.

I also took ritalin for a while to counterbalance the sedating affect of another drug I was taking. I don't think it's addictive, but you do build up a tolerance and need to take a higher dose the longer you're on it.

[fishnfla]

10. Thats known as a paradoxical effect

its an upper for adults and a downer for kids. Not sure why.

[ender]

31. thats been debunked...

ritalin has the same properties in both - its a stimulant, and aids concentration.

ritalin is a pretty crappy stimulant, actually, it feels like you drank 4 too many cups of coffee. its very similar to methamphetamine except with a 5 carbon ring instead of a 6 carbon ring at its center. human body doesnt metabolize 5 carbon rings particularly well. For example, corn, the outer shell is a 5 carbon ring sugar. you know, it comes out when you sh1t.

[arissa]

2. ADD/ADHD are made up "diseases"

The drug companies invented them to sell drugs. Drugs only make the problem worse, or at best, suppresses the symptoms without attacking the actual problem.

A healthy, whole food (unprocessed) diet, less video games/tv, more outdoor activities and this "disease" would disappear. But that's not as easy as dumping drugs down kids' throats.

[meegbear]

4. I agree with you ...

they had a South Park episode about that. Chef showed a video of a "time tested method to stop hyperactive kids, without drugs". The guy in the video smacks a kid on the side of the head and he yells "SHUT UP AND STUDY!". The kid immediately stops and starts doing his work.

While I don't agree about the smack part, I think that what these kids need is a more disciplined regiment.

[TrogL]

15. You get your medical information from South Park?

I get mine from medical journals.

[TrogL]

5. Glad you think so

ADD/ADHD has been around a long time and was simply not diagnosed. I remember plenty of kids I went through school with who were classic cases of ADHD and could have benefited from medication.

Proper, scientific, research has shown the ADHD is NOT caused by diet, video games or a lack of outdoor activities. It's caused by a chemical inbalance in the brain. Ritalin (and other stimulants) restore this balance.

While I agree ADD/ADHD is over-diagnosed, it's often by family doctors or school board officials unqualified to make this diagnosis.

It's really quite simple. Give an ordinary person Ritalin and they go manic. Given an ADD/ADHD person Ritalin and they slow down and get organized.

[HuckleB]

8. Thanks TrogL.

Your post was definitely needed. What we are learning about the brain is incredible.

I hope that others recognize that the brain is just as prone to having something not work quite right as the rest of the body. In some cases, medication can be a valuable tool for those dealing with biological processes that are off balance, including for the brain. It's just one tool. But it is a valid tool.

[Guaranteed]

18. I think my opposition to the "diagnosis"

is that there's seemingly no room for personality anymore in this world. If there's anything mildly eccentric about you, it's a problem. Everyone must have the name neurochemical make-up.
Other people see a hyper kid and say "There's something wrong with him. He needs to be fixed."
I see a hyper kid and say, "Man, that's a lucky kid, with an interesting personality. I never had that much energy. Hopefully someone will show him a way to put it to good use."

[TrogL]

30. ADHD kids are not "mildly" eccentric

They literally cannot sit still. It interferes with their school work to the point where they flunk out in later grades.

[LynneSin]

6. It's odd that ADD was not common back in my parent's generation

Think about it

If you or family members that are from the 50's or earlier, there was AD&D but it was a rarely diagnosed condition.

I guess it's easier to prescribe the drug that to treat the child and find the root of the problem (which you've given plenty of reasons for what is causing it).

I've seen perfectly behaved children turn into monsters almost 15-20 minutes after consuming junk food and other processed foods. Why aren't we questioning this first instead of just doping our kids.

I'm not saying that Ritalin is a bad drug OR that ADD is a made up disease. I just think that it's overprescribed for a condition that barely existed a few decades ago.

[TrogL]

13. "Rarely diagnosed" does not mean it didn't exist

I was in school "a few decades ago" and there were plenty of ADHD kids. I can think of three in my classroom alone.

I've seen perfectly behaved kids turn into monsters - mine. Junk food contains sugar. They go manic on sugar rush. As soon as the sugar runs out, they're back to normal. Non-junk food tends to be lower in sugar or use sucrose instead of fructose.

[Guaranteed]

19. But if it's so common,

in CHILDREN, mind you, how can it be considered a problem? Isn't this part of humanity? Aren't almost all kids weird in one way or another?

[TrogL]

25. Diabetes is common too

we treat that. Up until the time of injectible insulin, there was nothing we could do about it.

I watched a highly intelligent kid drop out in grade 10 because of ADD/ADHD. Why would you not want him treated?

[arissa]

26. Diabetes, especially in children, is also a symptom of culture

Bad diet, laziness, lack of physical activity, obesity, chemical contamination of the food supply - these are what causes Type II diabetes in children (which until recently was referred to as ADULT ONSET diabetes, but due to the rapid increase of children getting Type II, is no longer referred to that).

Proper diet, proper diet, proper diet, physical activity, physical activity, physical activity. It simply cannot be repeated enough. These two things alone could solve most of our culture's problems that we like to blame on diseases and genetics (when, strangely, other cultures don't experience them, yet we still live in denial).

[TrogL]

32. So what else are you going to blame on "our culture"

and try to fix with the panacae of "proper diet (repeat ad nauseum), physical activity (repeat ad nauseum)?

[arissa]

35. Anything that is caused by poor diet and lack of exercise

See, I prefer to seek the truth, rather than hiding behind bogus diagnoses and prescription drugs to solve all our problems.

And I happen to be very personally experienced in this matter, so you can save your righteous indignation, it's tired and boring.

[NuckinFutz]

37. who knows??

cancer? AIDS? respiratory illness? tooth decay? Myopia?

I know!! The common cold!

I guess treating the symptoms for anything is just a lame excuse for not finding and fixing the real cause. Why bother to ease the suffering in the interim?... it's better than nothing.

[LynneSin]

39. I would never recommend to NOT treat someone with ADD/ADHD

I just see some kids being diagnosed too quickly and put on this drug that is considered "highly addictive" according to the FDA. I'm reading folks who talk about how teachers will make the claim of ADD/ADHD and BOOM the kids is taking Ritalin. And I also know from what they did to my nephew - who really didn't have ADD/ADHD but Epilepsy.

I believe that we need better standardize testing for these diseases and also provide options for parents to try before they go the Ritalin route.

[NuckinFutz]

45. testing for ADHD is problematic

There's no definite test that will identify it, like you get with a PAP smear or a strep culture. It takes serious, experienced evaluation. Until further discoveries and technologies evolve to deal with diagnosing brain malfunction, we're stuck with these subjective methods. And it's very much trial and error with what works and what doesn't before proper treatments are found to work. It's not the greatest, but it's all we've got right now.

The same sort of problem existed, and may still exist, with diagnosing Alzheimer's (I've not followed the subject for some time). When my dad was diagnosed with the early onset of it back in the late 70's, it took several months to come to that conclusion. He was in his 50's at the time. The doctors were doing their level best to eliminate other diagnoses. This is pretty much the same path that should be followed, and usually is, for diagnosing ADHD.

Not having a definitive set of tests that will prove an illness without fail is definitely the ideal, but it is no reason to treat symptoms and suffering of someone along the way.

[TrogL]

55. On that we agree

ADHD can only be diagnosed by a child psychologist over several appointments. ADHD can easily be mis-diagnosed for something else for which Ritalin (or whatever) is contra-indicated.

[RobinA]

50. I Was in School

in the '60's. I can remember no ADHD kids in any class in elementary school. I can't figure out where they all came from. I blame TV.

[TrogL]

54. I remember one in particular

This is 1967. He would sit in his chair in the back of the room just bouncin' and bouncin' his foot and tapping and rockin'. He would blurt out answers and if asked to do something on the board would run pell-mell to the front and heaven help anybody who got in his way. His desk was always a disaster area and his assignments a wreck.

He eventually dropped out because he just couldn't get his act together.

When I student taught I had another one. The kid just could not stay in his seat no matter how much discipline or whatever was applied. Once you actually got him on task, he'd get so totally involved in it you could blow up a bomb next to him and not get his attention.

[arissa]

24. Exactly

People these days are conditioned to think that everything is just a "disease" and you just need to take a drug. You're a victim. Poor you. Take this drug, you'll feel better. I should know, that's what they told me for years before I finally woke up.

The drug companies and their defenders would have us believe that diagnoses have just gotten more accurate. What a load of crap. They don't even diagnose anymore - kid has problems? Take ritalin!

The fact is that kids have more problems nowadays than they used to. It's not because some evil "disease" is taking over our young population, it's because we've created an unhealthy situation for the kids, and parents are either unwilling or unable to face the facts.

Processed junk foods and too much tv/video games are the cause of an incredibly vast majority of the so-called ADD/ADHD being "diagnosed" nowadays. Lazy, or admittedly just over-worked in single-parent homes, parents don't have the time to actually raise their kids so they just shove drugs down their throats and park them in front of the tv with a frozen pizza in the oven, as they run out to their second job, or in the case of laziness, sit and watch tv with them.

It's pathological. Kids didn't have these problems decades ago because there was less junk food and no tv. They actually had to engage with other human beings in a meaningful way to have fun. It's that simple. Not to mention, a prescription of healthy whole foods, less sugar, less saturated fat, and more outdoor activities will also do wonders to prevent allergies, auto-immune disease, and diabetes becoming more and more common in children raised in this culture.

[TrogL]

29. kids did so have these problems decades ago

Used to be they flunked out or spent useless hours in detention because nobody knew what the problem was or tried to solve it (as recommended by another poster) by physical violence.

Please cite the scientific studies to back up your allegations.

[arissa]

33. Ahh, I see

Everyone who ever had problems just needed ritalin. Christ, are you getting your talking points directly off the Novartis website??

And don't give the BS lines about quoting "scientific studies" - any study can be designed to prove any result. That's not what you're after, you're just not comfortable with what I'm saying, it challenges the easy way out. I don't need a "scientific study" to prove common sense. Does anyone still remember what that is??

Here's a place for you to start with your research about the actual problems with ritalin and ADD/ADHD, but I'm not holding my breath that you're actually trying to learn, rather to try and shout-down anyone who challenges the mold.

http://www.attention-deficit-disorder.org/news/lawyers-allege-group-created-disease.htm
http://www.breggin.com/ritalin.html
http://www.ritalindeath.com/

[TrogL]

40. Now isn't that an interesting coincidence

I was about to accuse you of exactly the same thing, except you saved me some searching by linking to the websites you're quoting.

"everyone who ever had problems"?

Not what I said. You're engaging in "straw man".

I am not interested in the easy way out. I want something that works.

If you don't believe in science there's no point in discussing the matter further.

[arissa]

42. Cop out n/t

[TrogL]

44. Since you appear to be unable to use the tools of logic and science

...how do you suggest we proceed?

I quote personal experience and well-known science, both of which you discount.

I attempt to use rational discourse and you resort to name calling and logical fallacy.

Congratulations. You're the first person I've put on ignore.

[arissa]

46. You never tried to do anything other than shout me down

You were never interested in discussion, and when it got too hot, you resorted to cop outs and straw men. Even in this latest post, you're continuing your projection onto me.

I hope you did put me on ignore, I would consider it a compliment that you were unable to shout me down or scare me off and thus had to protect yourself from a differing point of view. :)

[Ilsa]

38. I still object to your original assertion,

that ADHD is all made up, and you haven't backed down on that. I agree that too many kids suffer from crappy diets, bad parenting, inattention, poor socialization, etc. But you basically lumped all ADHD situations into one, and condemned the whole lot.

I wish you would reconsider making such sweeping judgements about the benefits of such drugs as strattera, ritalin, and adderall when clearly the diagnoses and benefits do exist for many families. Many here have walked this walk. Are you the one who is supposed to sort out who is doing it right and lump the others into the bin of condemnation?

[arissa]

41. Thank you for the civil post

I appreciate it, as opposed to others who are intent on shouting down with sarcasm and "righteous anger."

"I still object to your original assertion, that ADHD is all made up, and you haven't backed down on that. I agree that too many kids suffer from crappy diets, bad parenting, inattention, poor socialization, etc. But you basically lumped all ADHD situations into one, and condemned the whole lot."

ADHD, as it is commonly diagnosed and perceived in our culture, is nearly entirely made-up. I stand by that statement. There are exceptions to every rule, but the exception reinforces the rule rather than disproving it. And focusing on the rare exceptions, people who actually have a genetic, as opposed to environmental, disorder, to justify drugging millions of children is insane, to say the least. The vast, vast, vast majority are not these rare exceptions.

"Many here have walked this walk."

You assume that I haven't.

"Are you the one who is supposed to sort out who is doing it right and lump the others into the bin of condemnation?"

That's a stretch. I speak the truth, not to condemn those who aren't following the proper path, but to try and help educate people. I talk to people nearly EVERY DAY in my job that have cured their kids ADD/ADHD with better diet and less tv. On the other hand, I know dozens of parents who shove countless drugs down their kids throats and their kids are in HORRIBLE shape.

If you feel like I'm condemning you, then you're being too defensive, which indicates you may have some subconscious doubts/guilt associated with your position.

[Ilsa]

47. Guilt?

At first I heavily resisted giving my child drugs. I know what drugs do. I'm a nurse. But I've also seen that his medication has given him his life back, after trying alternatives (homeopathy, diet, etc) for the last three years. He has hope for a future and diet and homeopathy couldn't give him that.

If I'm defensive, maybe it's because people like you have threatened to have us arrested because our child was having a screaming fit in public and couldn't speak to tell anyone what was wrong. They jsut assumed we beat him. If I'm defensive,, it's because people like you have assumed I was a bad parent and come over to my table in a restaurant and tried to "enlighten" me about what's really wrong with my child. Yeah, I get defensive about people assuming they know what's best for me and my family!

I still have seen nothing but "everyone else is wrong, I am 100% right" in your attitude here, even in your response. I'm happy for you if diet and beh. mod. worked for your child, but don't condemn us who have children with real health problems by claiming "it's all made up."

[arissa]

48. Now who's lumping who into a bin of condemnation

:eyes:

[Ilsa]

49. I don't pretend to

tell you how to manage your child's (or whoever's) ADD/ADHD problems.

You blasted everyone who had to resort to meds, regardless of the circumstances.

[Colin Ex]

43. I don't know about that...

"If you or family members that are from the 50's or earlier, there was AD&D but it was a rarely diagnosed condition."

Advanced Dungeons and Dragons didn't come around until the late 80s, I believe.

Now, attention deficit disorder... :-)

-Colin

[Ilsa]

12. I disagree. In a big way.

I placed my adhd autistic son on a completely natural, preservative free, artificial color/flavor diet for over a year and it made no difference. I also did the gluten-free, casein-free diet for several months, but no effect there either. If you were successful in this, great, but understand that it doesn't work for everyone, and you shouldn't be so critical (implied in your message) of families trying to have a functional life and their son having a functional learning experience in school.

My son is on three medications to help him overcome his hyperactivity and aggression and agitation, none of which, thankfully, is ritalin or adderall, but his meds cost about $600 a month before ordering them through mail Rx. Believe me, we wouldn't have gone this route if it weren't absolutely necessary. I am a nurse and am very familiar with the long term dangers of med use and abuse. I THANK GOD every day for Strattera.

If anyone has any concerns that we weren't parenting him right, they should have tried to walk in our shoes for a week or two before we placed him on meds. Many families in our situation end up divorced; some people place their children in remote group homes. But our child's loving nature has beamed through since starting his meds. He is happier than I've ever seen him, and he is accomplishing much in school, for which he is very proud. He is even learning to read, and he wouldn't have been able to accomplish that without his meds.

[NuckinFutz]

16. Amen to that

And by the way, my husband was diagnosed back in the early '60's, before it was called ADD/ADHD. Then it was MBD, minimal brain dysfunction.

Since both he and our two sons have been on meds, the chaos has been quite reduced, though these drugs aren't the only solution, and most folks need some therapy to augment the meds. In a lot of cases, the therapy doesn't do squat until the meds start working.

[Ilsa]

23. Hadn't heard "MBD" in a long time.

Glad your lives are coming together better now.

Our life is very regimented to adapt to our oldest son's need for routine and predictability. My son's day is usually very organized and he thrives in this structured environment. Lots of outdoor play, healthy diet, and an abundance of love and loving discipline (teaching, not "smacking").

Since he has been doing so well, my attitude is much better and I am infinitely less depressed over what will be a struggle for us for the rest of our lives. I suspect the last thing on my mind before I die will be of hm and whether he is getting the assistence he needs in this cold Republican world.

[NuckinFutz]

27. I know what you mean

What a long, strange trip it's been. Still is.

We'll be dealing with this pretty much forever.

There's also the ultimate frustration from dealing with folks who just don't think it even exists. But when you've tried that route, and removed the junk food and the video games and too much TV, and you've got them out exercising and you're feeding them right, what other explanation is there? That's not bad parenting anymore, does that mena the kid's just 'bad'? I don't think so. People who blow this off obviously have never had to live with it for any length of time.

[RobinA]

51. I Don't Think This Thread

is addressing kids with complex problems like autism.

It's more about the thousands of kids with environmental problems, family problems, and who are just plain strange who get Ritaln as a panacea rather than getting some real attention to the problem.

I work with disadvantaged children. At the first sign of a behavior problem they get Ritalin (or something similar) thrown at them. At the second sign of a behavior problem they are on anti-psychotics. No one is saying no kid needs this stuff, I think what the people here are saying is that the kids who need these drugs are a fraction of those who actually get them.

[Ilsa]

53. This isn't about kids with autism,

it's about kids who need help, and parents who seek whatever help they can get for their child's problem and for the family's survival.

The problem is that it is the parents and the doctors who need to address it, not teachers or caregivers or someone who patently declares the drug companies have made it all up. It isn't for me or a teacher or another DU'er to decide which kids need the medication and which don't, and I don't think it is fair for that DU'er to imply that people who go that route are somehow less caring, attentive, or knowledgeable in their parenting. The implication was that we are not raising our children right. It doesn't matter that my child has autism along with ADHD. It was inappropriate to assume I needed "enlightening", IMO.

[Guaranteed]

14. Yes, exactly.

Like Social Anxiety Disorder. Talk about playing off of people's anxieties.

[TrogL]

22. There is such a thing as Social Anxiety Disorder

It goes way beyond mere shyness. It is successfully treated with some anti-depressants.

[Lindacooks]

52. No, they aren't 'made up'

My 44 year old husband has it. He was extensively tested, with questionnaires and computer programs, after his diagnosed nephews told him what it's like before and after treatment and he said 'but that's the way I've always been! (before treatment).

With ADHD, less blood gets to your brain, which is what Ritalin, Adderal, et al fixes.

On Edit: And he was told he was lazy and stupid and not trying hard enough all the way through high school, just like most kids with learning disabilities and ADHD. He says the difference in ability to concentrate and finish a task since he started with Adderal is incredible.

[MuseRider]

3. I have narcolepsy

and have been on Ritalin for over 20 years. It is not addictive, at least not physically addictive. I still take the same amount as I have always taken, occasionally take more occasionally take less, depends. I do not think that it is a bad drug to use for children, it works, but the diagnosis is misused. I believe it is a schedule II because it can be used to get high and it keeps the likelihood of abuse down.

[streakr]

7. Ritalin is a stimulant

ADD/ADHD disorders are treatable using a variety of stimulants including amphetamines. Ritalin is much milder and does have significant therapeutic effect on truly ADD/ADHD. I and two sons can attest to that! In normal individuals it is a stimulant and therefore classified as Schedule II.

Streakr

[NuckinFutz]

9. Do some more research

I know a lot of people get misdiagnosed with ADHD, but many more are properly diagnosed and treated. Learn more about what ADHD actually is, a neurological disorder, before you panic about how it is treated. Not only is Ritalin a schedule II drug, but it is a stimulant, as are all but one ADHD medication (Stratera), and it works to calm ADHD people. That a stimulant can calm a hyperactive, easily distracted ADHD person is evidence that some crossfiring in the brain is involved, and enough for me to believe it's for real. These drugs have the opposite effect for people without ADHD...creating hyperactivity and distractability, rather than qwelling them.

The important thing to remember with these kinds of drugs is that, for the most part, the addiction will occur when they are misused, not when properly used. In all cases where serious and possibly addictive medication is the suggested option, it's best to get a second opinion, and I'm glad the real problem was found for your nephew. His parents did the right thing.

My spouse and both my children have ADHD, and have been successfully taking ADHD medications for three years. They are not addicted.

[tsakshaug]

11. I have ADD

I am in my mid 40's and have recently been diagnosed with ADD. I am on Adderol for this. I exercise, eat right and don't play video games. I could tell you how difficult it was getting through school with ADD, I managed to get two master's degrees before it was diagnosed. The past year, on meds have been the most productive work year I have ever had. I can sit and write for more than 10 min, I can read what I need to read to do the job. It is amazing. ADD is real, and correct diagnosis is important. I have one child with it, one without. The one on adderol is now doing well in school and is able to do what is expected. A smack upside the head does not work, my parents tried.

[alwynsw]

17. Ritalin: the drug du jour...

...for the diagnosis du jour. ADD/ADHD is the current darling of the pshrink set. If a child's mind wanders, if that child has discipline issues, or if that child is just generally obnoxious, ADD/ADHD is the diagnosis of choice. Let's ignore the fact that there is no qualified objective test to either prove or disprove the condition unless there is an organic cause or injury present.

Most often, the "diagnosis" is made by school staff (read teacher) who notifies the parents and administration that "Little Johnny" has a problem with discipline/concentration. Usually, that teacher has had no more psych training then the required elementary classes required for an education degree. Mom and maybe Pop generally see this as a revelation from above that explains why "Little Johnny" is a double handful. Personal observation has shown me that most often, the pshrink marches in lock-step with the teacher's "diagnosis" because the teacher has far more contact with, therefore time to observe "Little Johnny's" behavior.

Don't get me wrong. I greatly admire and respect most teachers. I'm married to a retired wrangler of 8th graders. Fortunately, my bride knows the limits of her knowledge in this area. Usually, the teachers who "diagnose" ADD/ADHD in their charges do not. Most I have met (some are friends) appear to be either "on a mission" to help the children whether they need it or not or are simply willing to use any tool available to reduce disruption in the classroom to the bare minimum. Regardless of the motivation, teachers, counselors, and social workers overstep when they add a diagnosis to a request that a child seek professional evaluation.

I'm just a layman. Here's an example of just onne "but": the 14 year old child of a dear friend has been diagnosed with ADHD because of poor performance in school, yet this same child cand recite, nearly verbatim, the enitre dialog of his favorite movies and handily dispatch all opponents I have seen on any of the numerous video and PC games he owns. He can recite Redskins ststistics for days. He can quote the Pop Warner football rulebook aith few errors. Math intersts him - he get A's and B's. Geography bore him - he gets D's and F's.

Before you go about thinking I'm harsh and heartless, ther indeed are children who benefit from this drug for all the right reasons. ADD/ADHD is real. I just cannot believe that it is as widespread as some would have us believe. For many, drug therapy is an easy way out. Rather than making the effort to increase "Lillte Johnny's" interest in schoolwork or improve his behavior, many turn to psych-aid. Ritalin works to turn "Little Johnny" into a more docile, malleable child without the parents and teachers doing more than ensuring that the pills are taken on schedule. That's the "miracle" of ritalin for many educators and parents.

Don't ask me for the phramacogenics of how "speed" slows a kid down. I read all about it and came away more confused than when I began.

[NuckinFutz]

20. In our case

The teachers didn't diagnose it, nor did the make assumptions as to how to treat it. All they did was provide some information to help the doctor. The doctor took data from teachers and parents, and looked at all aspects of the kids' lives, not just school/teacher issues. Not to mention that they were evaluated through several visits to the doctor before meds were prescribed.

However, I agree that ADD/ADHD is used as an excuse in some cases, and that is why I originally stated that second opinions are a necessity. The drugs definitely are not the 'be all and end all' to this disorder. But in most cases they enable the person to concentrate well enough to learn some compensating and that can help when the drugs wear off.

[TrogL]

36. Ritalin cannot turn a non-ADD kid into a "docile, malleable child"

and the actually recommendation for dealing with ADD/ADHD is a medication (which doesn't necessarily have to be Ritalin - there's lot of other choices) and councelling in organizational skills and behaviour. The pills are not enough.

Answer me this. Suppose my kid is bouncing off the walls in the classroom, his desk looks like a tornado hit it and he can't get through a declarative sentence without two or more digressions. He's flunking school as a result. A medication has been found that will help him.

The reason for not giving him this medication is....?

[ArkDem]

57. You are fighting a losing battle here. I admire the attempt.

Maybe the arguement would go better for you if you quoted from a popular tv program.:evilgrin:

[qb]

21. Dr. Dean Edell said ADHD symptoms are similar to sleep deprivation.

Make sure the kids are getting enough sleep, and the misdiagnoses will go way down. I'm not knocking responsible diagnoses and people who are helped by mediations. It's an important call to look at all possible causes for the behavior before prescribing drugs.

edit- I noticed an interesting parallel to the contrasting effects of stimulants on adults and ADHD children. When I'm sleep deprived, I drag through the day - can't wait to lie down. When my 3-year-old is sleep deprived (misses his nap), he's bouncing off the walls.

[Ilsa]

28. We always put our son to bed early,

but he couldn't sleep. He was hardwired to sleep less and awaken easily, which contributed to his hyperactivity. The first step in his med regimen was to tackle his sleep problems, then see how much hyperactivity and aggression remained.

I also believe a lot of kids called ADHD without a professional evaluation, might need more sleep. Once again, this is not a diagnosis for a teacher, but for trained doctors to make.

[geniph]

34. One of my brothers was unquestionably hyperactive

He was born in 1956. In those days, they didn't call it ADD and treat it with drugs; they called him a troublemaker and beat the living shit out of him, which did not help. Greg was never still, never shut up. He might as well have had Tourette's - you couldn't keep him quiet and you couldn't stop him saying whatever he pleased. My dad used a belt to try to quiet him and my mother used a backhand, and neither had the slightest success. Our elder siblings also tried to pummel him into behaving with no more luck than our parents. So did numerous teachers, vice principals, etc.

He was very physically active and outdoors all the time - no one wanted him in the house! But he couldn't sleep more than about five hours a night from the time he was about two. We didn't even have a TV, and we were always kept busy with shoveling cowshit, digging in the garden, chores like that, so it was certainly no lack of physical activity or interaction with others causing Greg's hyperactivity. Our diet was, by necessity, plain and simple; we couldn't afford a lot of processed foods or sweets. We grew a lot of what we ate.

Some kids are hyperactive at birth, no matter what environment they're in, no matter their level of physical activity or what you feed them. My brother would have had a much easier life had there been Ritalin in those days; he'd have done better in school, gotten beaten a lot less, been less unpopular with others (he had a MOUTH on him) - he'd have been treated less as a problem and more as a child. I mourn for what Greg might have been had he been properly diagnosed and treated. (He pretty much self-treats these days with pot.)

Big pharma wants to make profits. Doctors want to get you out of their office as quickly as possible. Both factors lead to the "syndrome de jour" being overdiagnosed and the popular drugs of the day being overprescribed. But that does not mean that the drugs still aren't a godsend for those who truly have the disorder. Not all prescriptions of Ritalin to children are equivalent to having them smoke crack. In some cases, you may be saving those children from severe physical abuse by calming them.

[Nikia]

56. My parents give my little brother ginko baloba

He wasn't officially disagnosed as ADD, but he did get in trouble his first couple years in school because he was easily distracted and disliked sitting in class the entire time. My cousin, who is a few years older than my brother, has learning disabilities and his parents found that ginko baloba helped him concentrate so he could do well in mainstream classes (the district had a lousy special education program) despite his disabilities. My parents tried it on my little brother. Of course, they also gave him an allowance tied to obeying rules and staying in control as well as banning him from watching a couple shows if he could not settle down after watching them. Now, at 12, he is in the gifted program and is on the honor roll. I really haven't studied it much myself, but perhaps there are herbal remedies like this that work.