Are you applying to College? If so, listen up:

[ursacorwin]

i'm pretty cheesed right now. i work for a selective major university as an admissions officer, and i speak with families as a part of the admissions process. we give interviews to students as a part of the overall application process, and use what we learn in the evaluation of a student.

so this nice young man, for whom we are a 'reach' school, came in to inteview with me. he did well, and i was inclined to speak in his favor in my report. because we are very selective, we expect qualified applicants to have strong grades and scores in both the sciences and the humanities. this young man didn't exactly love the sciences, but his grades were pretty much ok.

so after the interview, i went with him to speak with his father about the school, and his son. in the middle of the conversation, the father says, "well, he's a smart kid with english, but he really doesn't do so well in math," and proceeds to detail all the little failures his son has had over the years in math classes.

Oh My God! is this father even thinking? i mean, how much do you have to hate your own son to tank his application interview? this is the worst possible thing a parent can do in a college visit. i now have no choice but to carefully review this young man's math record, because while I might have been able to overlook a few Bs, I can't not try to understand what the father described to me.

Parents: please, if you love your children: KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT!!! let the professionals (teachers) speak about your child's work habits, that's what letters of recommendation are for. We know you're proud of your child, but there are things that you can say, even when you think you're helping your child, that really HURT their chances for admission. By all means, visit a school and talk to the admissions staff, but don't give them any more information than they ask you for.

Students: try to remind your parents that your college choice is YOUR choice. you are the one who has to live your life, and even if they are paying your tuition the decisions you make will affect YOU and YOUR CAREER, and therefore you should remain in control. Stand up to your folks if you have to, but don't let them put words in your mouth or speak for you.

I am a professional, and I pride myself on knowing the things I should to make the best decisions for applicants and the school. But I see this so often, I just had to rant- parents ruin their children's chances ALL THE TIME. don't let this happen to your family.

[mmm]

1. why don't YOU speak up and ask the parent not to comment?

If anything, this is YOUR fault!

[DS1]

2. yeah! cut his mike!

seriously, if you think this dad did it because he hates his kid, why give the information any weight?

[judge_smales]

3. ????

How is it her fault?

[morstyranni]

6. I got plenty of B's and C's in math in High School

And although my english SAT's were extremely good, my math were nothing great.

But I went on to get all A's in college calculus because the stakes were higher and I actually cared.

It didn't keep me out of a really good school either (it's initials are HC and it is in Massachusetts) and I'm a straight middle class white male.

What school do you work for if a couple of B's in math might keep a kid out?? Sounds very selective.

It is crazy how much kids with the right attitude turn it around in college - I'm living proof.

[ursacorwin]

9. i agree

and i tell a similar story, now i'm a phd student. high school performance is not the only thing to consider.

but here, it's the most important thing. which is why i felt so bad. the dad bascially gave me the information i needed to question my initial impression, and dig deeper. i have to be honest in my work, and fair. that means looking at good as well as the bad, and correctly contextualizing what i see. this is why sometimes, too much information is a bad thing.

[rogerashton]

4. No, it is NOT her job to tell the parent to shut up --

but I'm not so sure, either, that the father was wrong to say what he did. The kid might very well be better off at State or at St. Roseydawn where the competition will not be intense.

Speaking as a person who turned down the U of PA for Louisiana State, mostly over money, I have never regretted that decision. I don't think I would have survived Pennsy at that time in my life -- I don't mean the term "survived" as a figure of speech: I am not so sure I would be alive -- and having turned down Pennsy gives me SUCH chops now that I am across the street!

[ursacorwin]

7. what is sad though is that the young man

wants to be an academic, and even though it would be hard on him, if he worked hard he could probably handle it here. i believe that all good students deserve a chance, and more than that, before we reject them. that's what was so awful about the dad- i cannot ignore information about a student's work habits. the kid had me conviced that he was ready & willing to take the plunge, but if the dad believes it important for me to hear about quizzes and Bs on tests, i *have* to take notice.

college admissions is not a science. i'm sorry to say that, but it's true. on any given day, all of my applicants could potentially get in, and do well here. it a matter of support, luck and determination.
what they deserve is my full attention, my open mind, and a chance to prove themselves. what they *don't* need is someone else interjecting their opinion into one of the most important inteviews of their lives.

[Wickerman]

8. I say let him in

Get him away from his nutcase father.

[Racenut20]

5. That would be a nervous father.

Trying to talk his son's way past a few flaws that he thinks you are going to find later and downgrade his son because they did not reveal the information to you.

Wouldn't carry any weight at all in my evaluation.

[lolly]

10. Alternate Explanation?

Maybe Dad, for whatever reason, doesn't really want his kid going to this school?

I have to ask, though, why you keep saying this FORCED you to look more critically at the kid's application. What if, say, his best friend from high school had been there and said the same thing? Would that have forced you to reconsider? I would hope not; friend might have all kinds of ulterior motives, or just might not know his buddy as well as he thinks he does. Well, same thing with Dad. I thought my daughter was blowing off her AP exam because I didn't see her studying--I thought she was playing on the computer all the time. Turns out she found a study group on-line. She got a 5 on it (highest score).

Parents don't know everything. What you've got is what the kid does (his actual grades and scores) and the impression the kid has left with you. Non-professionals (including parents) shouldn't make any difference.

[ursacorwin]

11. unfortunately,

dad was rather specific. parent input does count, not the way you may think it does, but as "information." a "fair" evaluation includes all relevant data pertaining to admissions, so when you percieve something, you're compelled to investigate it.

think of it as a job interview. you'd want to know anything that would tell you about a person, and if you should hire them, right? therefore, anything that "slips" out is fair game. at least, this is how our society of drug testing and background checks operates.