Where do animal's souls go when they die?

[Sequoia]

I'm serious. No christian answers please because they think animals have no souls, which is wrong.

[stopthegop]

1. question...

how do you know Christians are wrong..ie: how do you know animals have souls?

[Az]

2. Um we ain't got souls either

But then that is just my opinion. Life... its a process... when it stops so do you.

[Brucey]

24. Cool.

I don't want to go on.

[Az]

25. Hang around for a while

Even if now sucks I can practically guarantee that some day you will be happy you stuck around. Sure its a limited gig but its worth the price of admission.

[RebelOne]

28. Yep, I second that. Unfortunately, doggie souls go the same

place as we do -- Nowhere.

[papau]

3. Where did Jesus say that animals have no souls?

And I mean Jesus - not Paul or any of the others around Jesus.

I honestly can not find such a comment.

[Wwagsthedog]

Help me out. I can't seem to find the book of Jesus in the Bible.

n/t

[hlthe2b]

15. thank you... my point exactly

I am so sick of quotes from "Christian" interpreters who turn his words any way they wish.

[Speck Tater]

4. If it's a dog soul...

they get together in heaven and 8 or ten of them merge to become a single cat soul which is then reborn as a cat. After a few succesful incarnations as a cat 8 or 10 cat souls merge a get reborn as a pig. A few more rounds and 8 or 10 pig souls merge to get reborn as a human (Republican). Another dozen incarnations as a Republican and theses souls have aquired enough wisdom to be reborn as Democrats.

;)

[Az]

7. Serious order issues

It should be repuke ---> pig ---> cat ---> dog ---> dem

[Speck Tater]

10. Ah, of course. I stand corrected.

n/t

[mmm]

12. that is a GREAT post! Thanks

[hlthe2b]

16. there's no way on earth any dog's soul could ever

.......revert to a REPUBLICAN! REUGS have no soul... that's the point.

[DBoon]

29. But

my dog is already a Democrat!

[elfwitch]

5. Christians are...

I would never belong to a religion that believed that animals don't have souls. I have met animals that have more soul in a tiny body that do most of the people I have ever met.

I think that your animals wait for you, and when you die you all get to be together again. I full expect to be with all my kitties again someday.

[slappypan]

6. group soul

I once read that some pantheistic (pagan) belief systems teach that each type of animal partakes in a "group soul" that does not ever die, unless, I suppose the species became extinct.

[Speck Tater]

8. Each soul is reincarnated

forward, backward, and sideways in time. Eventually, you are reborn as everyone who has ever existed and who ever will exist. So in effect, there is only one soul. We just flit around through time creating all these alternate selves so that we will have somebody to play with.

[mmm]

17. I hope that is not true

If those who are kind and decent come back at a higher plain
that would be alright. I certainly do not wish to endure the
life of every person who ever lived. 75% of those lives seem
pretty nasty to me.

[Speck Tater]

37. Ah, but the ones that seem nasty to you...

... seem that way because you've already finished living those lives. The hard stuff is already behind you. It's all gravy from here on.

[Skittles]

9. they go to the Rainbow Bridge

http://www.rainbowbridge.com/

I dare you to read some testimonials and not start blubbering. *sniff*

[Bozita]

59. If you've ever loved a dog or cat, this is a special place

Very special

[mermaid]

62. Thank You...sniff

I have been looking EVERYWHERE for this!!

I started crying as soon as it loaded up...

[OneBlueSky]

11. they go here . . .

http://www.petloss.com/poems/maingrp/rainbowb.htm

[hlthe2b]

13. I'm Christian and I KNOW in my heart that animals have souls...

please don't take the extremes of 'Christian' perversion as fact. The fundies claim to be Christian but defy the teachings in every way. Since Christ is not immediately available to counter their exploitive ilck. then I think it is up to his followers to figure the truth out themselves.

I know that if there is a heaven, it must be intermixed with that paradise for animals. There would be no heaven in my mind without my own long departed dear ones, both human and non-human.

[mmm]

18. Your logic is simply indisputable!

good post

[hlthe2b]

32. Ahh,

Faith is just that, faith.

While I work in Science and Medicine and am about as "left-brained" as they come, I do recognize that some things we may never know. The tiny bit of myself that allows me to believe what can not be proven comes from inside me-- instinct-- or from some force I can not identify. WHile I relate to the need to prove all that we come to believe, that is not always possible and I think a bit of tolerance may be in order for all of us. After all, we can not prove there is NO God or heaven, or that animals have no souls.

People who hold religious beliefs (0r none at all) should be equally respected and not demeaned IMO and I'd like to think we wouldn't always judge religious belief based on sterotypes (e.g., RW fundies).

[DBoon]

30. Catholics said they have souls

Or at least that was what I was taught way back. Unfortunately, we were taught they did not have immortal souls, so your dear doggie will not be beside you in the eternal hereafter.

[Richardo]

49. To which I can only respond as my avatar....

"If there are no dogs in heaven then when I die I want to go where they went." - Will Rogers

[theHandpuppet]

63. I'm with you!

Besides, we're talking about the same church which a mere 150 years ago was still debating whether or not women had souls.

[Piperay]

50. I believe that too...

I have no doubt. Heaven would never be heaven without my beloved animals, it would be hell.

[E_Zapata]

14. they go deeper into our own hearts

**weeping**

[jumptheshadow]

19. Sequoia...

I spent quite a bit of time thinking about that when I put my dear Jessica to sleep last summer.

Mom put Jessie's son to sleep two weeks ago and it was the first question out of her mouth. (When she could talk again.)

I really hope and pray that we see them again.

[arwalden]

20. Sorry About Your Cat...

... their "soul" lives on in your heart and in the stories and memories you share with and laugh about with others.

-- Allen

[Blue_Chill]

21. No christian answers please? Too bad your getting one anyway!

They go....I have no idea being that I don't know what exactly happens after death.

There was that so damn bad??!!

[Az]

22. Oh the pain

Exscruciating.... arrrggggg.... er .... hey that wasn't so bad.....

[JVS]

23. Doggie Hell

[qwertyMike]

26. Limbo?

Don't they go to Limbo?
Ooops that's a religious (RC) answer.

[LuLu550]

68. I always thought it was called "limbo"

because you would spend eternity trying to "limbo" under an impossibley low limbo pole.....Torture!

[GoddessOfGuinness]

27. Dear Sequoia...

I'm sorry for the loss of your dear pet. I don't know "where" their souls go, or if they go anywhere at all. Maybe they just linger in our midst until their next reincarnation.

I do know that if you'll take a little time to meditate...perhaps in some spot that was a favorite of your kitty's...you can commune with his soul in spirit, and take comfort in his presence in your heart.

I've found this to be true with humans and animals...with the deceased, and with those who are simply far away or whom I've lost contact with.

:hug:

[Aristus]

31. No Christian answers, huh?

You been talking to the wrong type of Christians, my friend. I can't imagine that God would forbid pets in Heaven. Anything living that we invest so much love in, care for so much and cherish would be welcome in Heaven, as far as I'm concerned. I know fundy Christians who insist that since animals don't have souls, they can't go to Heaven. What would they say if we were to tell them that there's no MONEY in Heaven? They'd probably blanch, then tentatively pick up that Infernal Regions travel brochure.

Someone once said to me, if animals are not born with souls, then they acquire them from the people who love them. That was good enough for me. I know only God can bestow a soul upon something, but work with me here, willya? God loves us. I don't think he'd want us to be in Heaven without our pets.

[hlthe2b]

33. that's a nice thought, Aristus

(If animals are not born with souls, then they acquire them from the people who love them).....

[Kamika]

34. They go to animal heaven ofcourse

silly question

[Robb]

35. Chukchi legend (sled dogs)

The deal was however you treated your dogs would rank highest on whether you got into heaven. Treat them well, and in you'd go... the dogs that had died before you would wait curled up by the gates, waking up when you arrived to pull your sled across.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

38. That reminds me of the kitty story

in which a thief picked up a malnourished stray cat with bloody paws and nursed him back to health. He felt he could relate to the animal, because it reminded him of his own life of continual poverty and neglect. The animal eventually died, and years later the thief did as well.

It surprised the thief, when his time came, to find himself at Heaven's gate. He even told the gatekeeper there'd been some mistake, because he'd never done a decent thing in his life. Then he heard a "meow" and looked down to see the cat he'd nursed back to health purring and rubbing against him.

The gatekeeper said, "That may be true; but for this one soul, Heaven could not exist without your presence."

[geniph]

40. That made me cry

thanks a whole hell of a lot, Goddess!

No, I'm not being sarcastic, I really do mean thanks for that story. It's beautiful.

[Bertha Venation]

44. damn your eyes

Goddess, for making me snif at work.

And your story reminds me of a children's book I loved as a child and can't read as an adult. The Cat Who Went To Heaven.

My answer to the thread's question:

Directly to heaven.

[Sequoia]

46. What a lovely story

and nothing against Christians as I was raised that way. But animals not having souls was a belief we were told (southern babtist of course). This shortly after some kittens of our had been killed by our pet dog and I was saying they'd be in heaven and adults (not parents) telling me otherwise. I was about 7 at that time. Then I had to put my 17 year old cat down on Saturday, so yeah, I'm feeling a little upset. But some of you know that already, so thank you.

[GoddessOfGuinness]

53. !!!

I don't think I'd say that to a grieving child even if I thought it was true...

I'm glad that their heartlessness didn't rub off on you!

[Mikimouse]

55. Whereever they go, that's where I want to go

and it doesn't really matter where that happens to be.

[LuLu550]

70. oh, that me me cry, too!

I had a brain damaged little dog that I tried so hard to help. She had terrible fear agression and everyone told me to put her down. It took me almost two years and I did everything I could to help her. Then I got the feeling that life was just too scarey for her and she really wanted to be released from her pain. In April,I put her down with a heavy heart, but knowing I gave her the longest and best life she could have had given the terrible problems she had since birth. I have sinced wondered if she was god, testing me to see how I would treat one so needy and hard to love. :cry:

[Myra]

36. Sequoia

In my secular opinion all that's left when
someone is gone is dust. That, and the love and
memories left in the hearts and minds of those
who have to live on without that very special
individual.

I think that's where your beloved cat went.
Into your heart and mind. And I think your
kitty will remain there as long as you walk
the earth.

My condolences...

[geniph]

39. They go back to the cosmic energy pool

where all consciousnesses come from, and someday, may inhabit another creature. If they were a good doggie/kitty/ferret/whatever, then maybe they get a species with a bit more control of its environment, a little higher on the food chain. If they were a selfish critter, then they go down the food chain.

That's what I want to believe, anyway - what do I actually believe? I don't really know, I just know that any afterlife without my beloved pets in it, I AIN'T A-GOIN'. I like the way the afterlife was in Richard Matheson's What Dreams May Come (an excellent book, whatever you may think of the movie - personally, I liked the movie a lot, but the book IS better). You create your own afterlife, and if you need your beloved pets with you, they will be there.

I need to believe that my beloved Yankee and Jigger and all the others will be on the other side of the Bridge with me...

[hunter]

41. Souls without a personality get recycled.

Souls that develop some sort of personality are admitted into the heavenly archive.

I've known many dogs who have a generic dog personality, and cats who have a generic cat personality, and cows that have a generic cow personality. I figure God doesn't clutter up Heaven with the generic personalities of any species until that generic species actually becomes extinct.

There are probably a few interesting Tyrannosaurus Rex dinosaur souls running around in heaven, plus the one generic Tyrannosaurus Rex soul that was recycled across all those boring Tyrannosaurus Rex dinosaurs who never bothered to develop any sort of personality.

In the end, there will be all sorts of humans in the heavenly archive, alongside their dogs and cats and cows who developed personalities, plus one each of the singular generic personality version of every species.

As a good liberal Christian, I am forbidden from entertaining the possibility that there may be any sort of generic human soul that could be recycled. I must never imagine that I will find in Heaven some generic human soul that has been recycled through a few billion incarnations. In God's image I must suppose that each human soul is unique.

But I find nothing in my religion that prevents me from imagining many dogs and cats and cows in heaven, but only one each of every generic species of mosquito, flea, tapeworm, or malaria protozoa, to be hosted by the non-generic soul who very most deserves it.

So I figure I'll be carrying the generic tick soul on my scrotum for all eternity, just because I wrote this.

Fortunately in heaven, one's private parts never itch.

[Myra]

51. "Fortunately in heaven, one's private parts never itch."

That's the most beautiful thing I've ever heard.

:)

[roguevalley]

42. straight to God.

Where else would something so wonderful go? :)

[supernova]

43. LOL!

Can't believe you think all of us believe this: "they think animals have no souls...'

I've never believed that for a minute. And I'm a life-long presbyterian to boot.

Whereever we are when we die, there are our animals also, both companion and wild. Couldn't imagine it otherwise.

[Nikia]

45. My friends' cat became a ghost

It was out one day and it started to rain. The cat hated rain so as usual it attempted to run home. Unfortunately, it got ran over by a car. The cat did get home though. For the next few months, the entire family felt the cat rubbing up against them on separate occaisions. The dog cornered him against the wall and barked at him just as usual. Eventually, the cat went away. I am not sure about the after life for humans or animals, but for this family their cat had a soul and he continued to exist on Earth for a while after his body died.

[Beaker]

47. the same place our souls go- into the ether.

all living things have "souls"- they just aren't eternal.

[brook]

48. They wait on the other side.

My grandad, on the day he died, told at rather great length just what he was seeing and hearing. He said there were green hills and trees, beautiful sunlight and music - and that his LaddieBoy was sitting under one of the trees waiting for him. My grandad never lied to me. I know he and LaddieBoy will be there to greet me, too.

[mlawson]

52. That's very nice.

Thanks for the story; I believe it. Being a Buddhist, I can fit that in easily.

[progressiverealist]

61. that means I get to se Beans the cat again????

[LuLu550]

54. see

www.petloss.com for the "Rainbow Bridge" story.
That's where my pups Scruffy and Sadies are, I'm sure.

[AlienGirl]

56. Reincarnation, baby!

I believe it works for animals as well as humans. Hey, why not?

Tucker

[HornBuckler]

57. Better Be A Damn Big Place

Hmmm, All The Bacteria, Protozoa, Inch Worms, Plankton Etc - For Billions Of Years - Doesn't Add Up

LISTEN REAL CLOSE next time you take a shower and ask the millions of animals you just killed where they are going

[LuLu550]

67. we won't take up that much space...

we will be pure spirit!

[corarose]

58. To the same place that our souls go to

Christians will tell you that they don't go to heaven and that's a bunch of BS.

[Dr Satan]

60. if all animals go to heaven

then why dont all humans?
Christianity is based on a SAVIOR. Which implies punishment/reward system and none of these so called christians can rationalize that away.

[MissMillie]

64. My cat's soul

resides in my kitchen.

He always used to hang around my feet while I was cooking, waiting for me to drop something tasty on the floor. I think his soul is still there... and hoping to get some of tonight's tuna steaks.

[undergroundpanther]

65. Animal Spirits

Animals do have spirits. If these apparitions ARE spirits,that is..I have seen them.
I have seen spirits around roadkills and places where animals died.The spirit looks like the animal,but it isn't.It fades as you get closer to it. What I am seeing I don't know what it is I am seeing,really or why I see it.
Frankly,I don't know where animal spirits go any more than I know where I will go after I die.

I haven't a clue what will happen to anything after it dies.That is why death is a great mystery. Because death looks unpleasent,and life is hard and unjust people have been guessing about what happens after death ever since they became aware they will die.Religion guesses about the afterlife and existance like science guesses about it.There are plenty of gueses out there and each one has it's reasons and systems,but it doesen't say much about what the afterlife is,really when faith in a particular guess is doubted. We are left time and again with this mystery.We are great at making believe,and saying we KNOW the truth or have the answer,and we seek comfort,in these things we tell ourselves especially when it's something that hurts the heart as much as life and death does.Uncertainty is a painful place to be,until you let go of the desire for certainty.


If one assumes that death is final,and there is no after life one could take life two ways.

Either you cling rabidly to your life and make your survival the highest law or you can become so nilhilistic and futile,you can get suicidal,because life seems like a cruel joke,(or you can have a mix of the two positions I guess).
When it comes to which perspectivs you take about life without hope for an afterlife has a lot to do with your own life experinces,what kinds of traumas you have faced,what kind of emotional makeup you have,and what your outlook on your life is and is shaped by.Everyone wants a better, happier,secure more fufilled life without deprivation, struggle strife and suffering.Yet few of us ever get there.Childhood for some is the closest we ever get.It's uncanny how heaven is almost like a never-ending childhood.

But in this sick ,sad world we got unpredictability,uncertainty,and no control over circumstances that come your way.We grow up we are alone with our thoughts,and words suck at communicating experinces,we are struggling and society is a reflection of everyman's sickness of survival.We are an ugly culture reflecting the ugliness our reality impresses upon our hearts..

We as far as I know, don't pick where we are born ,we don't choose which parents,or what body..and we don't decide when we get to die.
These circumstances of birth are crucial to how your life will be lived.We can't plot out our life and the lives of those we love to avoid all the hurts life brings to us.Why? I dunno.Life lives off of death and the desire to continue on and,the fear of death spurs more births to die.There is something very ,very sick about this way life feeds off the death of the living.There is something very sad about ending up in a life ,society, mind or a body you cannot stand living in.Some People want to die because life is that painful for them.
If this world was created by a creator,the fact that evolution,suicide,abuse or war exists shows the creator is one sick monster.

If the world exists because of random chance events coinciding,just so,than we have to look at what can we do to remove the excess suffering and strife we face and not upset the balance. Science isn't so good at this,nor are governments,tribes, companies or ISM systems.Life causes alot of strife and suffering,and it's sucess is limited. If you believe the world is by chance this way,than supporting "leaders" causing wars and using up precious resources than becomes suicide for all of us who aren't in the leader's nespot club'.So rebellion and elitism become two dynamics that are vital to survival.Communal life VS autocrats,both looking to preseve themselves.

There are people who say you chose all the adversities you face in life before you are born into this life.Almost like your in a "morality" school here on Earth.But to me that veiw boils down to an almost authoritarian veiw of'fate'(that you pre picked and can do nothing about NOW) and it recycles 'original sin' where humans are flawed and must work to be unflawed so spirituality consists of learning to accept your lot in life,with a smile because you chose it.It's like the fundie who says it's gods will when tragedy strikes.
I do however observe there is phenomena concerning spirits or something,(I guess it's a spirit)that can't be explained.I'm not the only one who sees this stuff either.


Is it proof of an afterlife? If so,what is the afterlife and how do we know it's better? Is it because there is no body hoding us down?

I don't know where the spirits of pets go any more than I know where I will go..I do know no one deserves the pain of this life..here.Where our kitties die and we get sick and our emotions are abused and our spiritual yearnings are crushed into societies molds by time we reach adolescence.
Sure life here has love,beauty ect.Y ou can create art or whatever,you can have freinds,and rewarding relationships,the sunset is still beautiful.Some people say these things are reflections of what the spirit realms are. I dunno what is in store after death for any living thing.

For all I know,I might end up right here again ,like the groundhog day movie doing the eternal recurrance thing,or maybe I'll be crammed into living another life I can't remember choosing, in another time,or live in another species.Maybe I can never leave this problem of life feeding on death here,I'm trapped.Maybe this is hell..I don't know,maybe there are techiques to escape the cycles of life here like what's written in the Tibetian the book of the dead or in the Egyptian book of the dead ,like words you say to judging gods who give your life a grade,by the weight of a feather,to guard your heart from Ammit,maybe there is nothing after life but silence,peace.Maybe you can feel your body rot.. I hope for an afterlife where freinds,sunsets,kitties,creativity and joy is not so fleeting and temporary.

But I just don't know what happens,it's a mystery.

[mmonk]

66. Whatever happened to the light bulb theory?

When you're out, you're out.

[Clete]

69. Well, call me a nuts, but this really happens to me.

It could be in my mind or....

Everytime a pet of mine has died, I have a dream about them sometime later and they are usually in a very nice place. One lives in a mansion and another lives in a garden-like forest. Each one of them has woken me up to the dream in the way they woke me up in life to feed them. They never come back after that one time though. I like to think they came in a dream to tell me they are fine.

Even if it's only in my mind, I do feel better.

[AlienGirl]

71. This has happened to me as well

Check out this dream: http://www.twisk.com/droom.asp?droom_id=184643431

Tucker

[mermaid]

72. It's Not Nuts...

Same sort of thing happened to me after my dog Barney died.
He came back to see me, in my dream. And I knew he was okay. He no longer had the horrible arthritis in his back legs, he was able to run and jump and play...and before he left in the morning, I knew he was okay.

Interestingly...Barney had been an abused dog before we got him, and we brought him back, emotionally...but he would NEVER, EVER lick anyone...not even us! Yet, in the dream, he did.

His healing was finally complete. And I knew that his goodbye face-lick was to tell me he was okay, and he would see me again...

[jsw_81]

73. Soul?

Is there any credible evidence to support the existence of the soul? Any at all?

Hate to rain on your parade, but souls don't exist. Life is really nothing more than a chemical process, and when a creature dies it's over. Forever.

I have lost many beloved pets and would LOVE to imagine that they're in paradise somewhere waiting for me, but unless we have evidence to support it such a belief is nothing more than wishful thinking.

[commander bunnypants]

74. But what holds the chemical process together my friend

1. The life force, that some call the soul.


DDQM

[Az]

75. Um, holds the chemical process to gether?

So you mean that the soul is just close nuclear ties?

No, the soul if anything is simply the common associations we make with each other as living entities. Its a convieniant explanation for that which is difficult for most to understand. We are born not knowing we are seperate from the universe and our brain has to learn to differentiate itself from the universe around us. It takes a lifetime again for some to learn that we really are not seperate from the universe.