I just figured out my problem with the Beatles.

[Pale Blue Dot]

It has always puzzled me why I am not a bigger fan of the Beatles. After all, my namesake, Neil Finn, has often been called "Beatlesque". The Neil Finn message boards (yes, these exist) often erupt into Dean vs. Clark type flamefests over whether he sounds more like Paul or John. So why have I never been crazy about the Beatles music?

Oddly enough, the answer came to me as I was listening to a Neil Finn remake of the Beatles song "Two of Us". I realized that the Beatles lyrics fail to connect to me on a personal level. Unlike Finn, who writes intensely personal songs about the inner life of the soul, the Beatles mainly wrote much broader songs about the outer life. When they did get personal, they obscured the meaning so much ("I Am the Walrus", anyone?) they it is impossible for me to relate. This would explain why I like very late John Lennon as well.

In short, the Beatles can engage me on an intellectual level, but not an emotional one.

Thoughts? Flames?

[mac56]

1. If it doesn't work for you, it doesn't work.

No need to apologize. May I point out, however, that Neil Finn had the Beatles to listen to and jump off from. The Beatles didn't.

[Pale Blue Dot]

4. Absolutely, Mac56

No argument here. I'm not really questioning their place in history, just their place in my record collection! :-)

[BelleCarolinaPeridot]

2. Nah no flames

I don't like the Beatles either . I don't understand why Paul ( I refuse to call him " Sir " )McCartney has became so important after he was knighted . Its not like if England burned , the Queen would call him as her knight to rescue the roses . Heck she would'nt even call on her own son Charles .

Although I do love " Hard Days Night " movie .

[ugarte]

3. It's just pop music

Very little pop music is personal. I can't think of any massive selling pop artists who engage me emotionally.

[commander bunnypants]

5. No flames

The Beatles are ok, some music even rocks, some sucks. To each their own

DDQM

[ProfessorGAC]

6. Flames for What?

You didn't say a single bad thing about them. No way you should be flamed for actually given the consideration you gave this topic. You seem to appreciate their importance, the music just doesn't resonate for you personally. Pretty mature perspective, i would say.

Now, all that being said, since you don't worship at the altar of The Beatles, i have to hate you. Sorry, i don't make the rules, i just enforce the rules.

Kidding, of course.
The Professor

[Droopy]

7. My thoughts are:

Musical tastes are very personal. Everybody likes what they like often for very different reasons. Some people may like the Beatles for the very reason that you dislike them. That their music is more extroverted. I like the Beatles, at least what I've heard of them (I've never bought a Beatles record). I can't really tell you why.

[number six]

8. The Beatles lyrics were universal

which is one of the reasons for their huge success. The lyrics ring with many people, but will never have the same emotional connection of more specific lyrics such as Finn's, Nick Drake's or Lennon's later lyrics, like the Plastic Ono Band Album.

[Loonman]

9. You have not listened to nearly enough

If your example is "Walrus".


You have much to learn, grasshopper, much to learn.

[ArkDem]

10. What he said...

.

[blessedleader]

11. listened to the White Album lately?

yeah, seriously. . . walrus??

try julia or while my guitar gently sleeps or yer blues or who knows. . .

[Gato Moteado]

27. weeps, not sleeps

the guitar, that is

[Palacsinta]

12. As a 12 year old girl........

Man, did they EVER engage me on an emotional level!!!!! John, I LOVE YOU!!! John, 4-ever!!!

Oh........I like their songs, too.

[jus_the_facts]

13. to each his own.....

....personally as you know I like heavy metal and get emotionally and intellectually engaged by it yet others such as yourself never were into it on the same level or at all...so it's all relative....like the universe and everything in it...ooooh ain't I just the philosophical one today or what! :evilgrin:

[Loonman]

14. Actually

"For No One" could easily be a Neil Finn song, and Finn's use of melody and song structure is Beatle-esque, if you will.


I have been a Split Enz fan since 1980, up through Crowded house and the solo albums so I know what I'm talking about.

One Nil(One All, domestically) is very Beatle-esque in nature and sound, mostly because Wendy and Lisa are heavily influenced by the Beatles.

[RandomKoolzip]

15. Try "Plastic Ono Band"...If you can't relate to "Working Class Hero...."

Frankly, I find the melodies the Beatles came up with so firmly engrained in my brain that I can't imagine NOT relating to them on a personal level. John was always my favorite (my family had more solo John Lennon albums than Beatles albums as a little kid, so I knew every word on "Plastic Ono Band" when I was four years old, even though there's some dirty words on there and I was just a widdle kid), and one of my earliest memories is my father telling me he'd benn killed (I was in Kindergarten at the time). So on a personal level, the Beatles are like instinctual......

[XNASA]

16. Let's sort this out a bit....

The Lennon songs from his "gibberish" period such as, I am the Walrus, Come Together, Lucy in the Sky and Mr. Kite were written as a deliberate attempt by Lennon to poke fun at popular culture.

Amazed after reading a glowing review of Mr. Kite, Lennon decided to push the envelope a bit and see how much he could get away with. I am the Walrus was just a joke, Lennon would admit.

But to say that a majority of his songs weren't personal, or introspective I think, is missing the point completely.

[SiouxJ]

17. Good point Patrick

I sort of feel the same way but I still love them. I don't have their albums on CD but I enjoy hearing a Beatles song on the radio. I'm a sucker for emotion both in lyric and in voice so I can totally understand what you're saying. I was discussing this with a friend a while back - I was trying to figure out why I love some Dylan songs better when done by other artists. I finally figured out it's that I lean more towards emotional singers. If it has that emotion, AND the singer actually wrote the song, well, then that really gets my attention. It just means more I guess. I've found that my favorite artists are ones who write their own, deeply personal lyrics and sing with some degree of emotion.

[Pale Blue Dot]

21. You're right, the singing does make a huge difference.

I was listening to a song called "Show Me Heaven" by Maria McKee. She always sings with such passion and conviction, and she makes it a really sexy song. However, the Musak at work plays a different version, by some country singer (Jessica Andrews?), who just sucks all the passion and life right out of it.

Oh, BTW, hi Sue! :hi:

[SiouxJ]

22. Yes!

McKee has amazing passion.

:hi: Patrick ;-)

[grannylib]

18. From one who notices the same stuff!!!

I think that the Beatle references are largely because
1) yes, Neil does sound rather like a combo of John and Paul - coincidence, surely, but he does (and that's OK!)
2) Melodically, there are reminiscences of Beatle-esque tunings and all

I agree that Neil's lyrics are far more personal and engaging than most of the Beatle's stuff, although there are exceptions to everything...

"And She Goes On" makes me just weep...he could have written that for my daughter, but for the reference to Sinatra *lol*
His lyrics are one of the main reasons I am so smitten with him as an artist. It is a VERY challenging thing to write music that is not trite, rhyming couplets for the sake of rhyme alone, yet is still melodic and listenable. Neil is a master (much like Sting - very different styles but similar talents for melody and lyrics that SAY something - intelligibly - )

[Pale Blue Dot]

20. "She Goes On" is a great example

A song that grabs you by the head and by the heart. Neil also does a lot of father/son songs, and they really get to me.

[supernova]

19. Well, if they don't work for you

I won't flame you. But here are some Beatles songs worth considering for their personal, emotional appeal:

"While My Guitar Gently Weeps"

"And I Love Her"

"Blackbird"

"Yesterday"

"Eleanor Rigby"

"Fixing a Hole"

"Do You Want to Know a Secret?"

"If I Fell"

"A Day in the Life"

"She's Leaving Home"

"Here Comes the Sun"

"We Can Work It Out"

"You've Got to Hide Your Love Away"


Whew! I didn't mean to write so much. These are just some of the ones that have meant the most to me over the years.

[RaulGroom]

23. One of the very few songs that always gets to me

Particularly when I hear it in context, is "Golden Slumbers." The heartache in Paul's voice sometimes move me to tears. It's not the lyrics, really, the Beatles weren't primarily poets, like I'd say Paul Simon is. It's the music.

24. plus

Yer Blues

I'm a Loser

Help

Something

I think pop music appreciation might have something to do also with the time you heard it. Hearing the Beatles at the time they were releasing stuff (that is within the context of what music sounded like at the time) is much different than hearing it as it becomes a historical artifact.

[emulatorloo]

25. and more you might like

The Beatles really were an album band, especially starting w Rubber Soul. The albums have a dramatic and emotional arc that you may not get from just listening to a hit single or a song here and there.

That being said these songs in addition to what supernova, 56kid and RaulGroom listed, to me, have very heart felt lyrics and performances. I'm crying just thinking about them.

Don't Let Me Down (B-Side Single)

The Long and Winding Road (Let It Be, see "de-Spectorized versions on" Anthology 3 version too and upcoming Let It Be- Naked release - very simple and heart felt)

Let It Be (Let It Be)

I've Got A Feeling (Let It Be)

Oh! Darling (Abbey Road)

You never give me your money (Abbey Road)

Hey Jude (Single - forget that you have heard it a thousand times)

Hear There and Everywhere (Revolver)

You Won't See Me (Rubber Soul)

Nowhere Man (Rubber Soul)

I'm Looking Through You (Rubber Soul)

Girl (Rubber Soul)

Getting Better (Sgt Pepper)

Good Morning, Good Morning (Sgt Pepper)

Dear Prudence (White Album)

I Will (White Album)

Best Regards,

Greg

On Edit:edited for clarity

[bicentennial_baby]

26. You forgot one

"For No One" fr. Revolver

[emulatorloo]

29. And we both forgot "In My Life" (Rubber Soul) n/t

[Gato Moteado]

28. as a huge beatles freak....

..all i can say is that i'm sorry they don't speak to you like they do to me. listening to rubber soul, revolver, abbey road, sgt pepper's or the white album can change your mood for a whole day.