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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-21-05 11:47 PM
Original message
What the judge told the "Shoe Bomber" -- Your comments???
Have you seen this? I received it without attribution in an e-mail from a friend. I didn't have much chance to check its veracity, but assume it is all true. It's a little long, but interesting...

---
WHAT THE JUDGE TOLD THE SHOE BOMBER

Remember the guy who got on a plane with a bomb built into his shoe and tried to light it?

Did you know his trial is over?
Did you know he was sentenced?
Did you see/hear any of the judge's comments on TV/Radio?
Didn't think so.

Everyone should hear what the judge had to say.
Ruling by Judge William Young, US District Court.

Prior to sentencing, the Judge asked the defendant if he had anything to say.

His response: After admitting his guilt to the court for the record, Reid also admitted his "allegiance to Osama bin Laden, to Islam, and to the religion of Allah," defiantly stated "I think I will not apologize for my actions, "and told the court "I am at war with your country."

Judge Young then delivered the statement quoted below:

January 30, 2003, United States vs. Rid. Judge Young:

"Mr. Richard C. Reid, hearken now to the sentence the Court imposes upon you.

On counts 1, 5 and 6 the Court sentences you to life in prison in the custody of the United States Attorney General. On counts 2, 3, 4 and 7, the Court sentences you to 20 years in prison on each count, the sentence on each count to run consecutive with the other. That's 80 years. On count 8 the Court sentences you to the mandatory 30 years consecutive to the 80 years just imposed. The Court imposes upon you each of the eight counts a fine of $250,000 for the aggregate fine of $2 million. The Court accepts the government's recommendation with respect to restitution and orders restitution in the amount of $298.17 to Andre Bouquet and $5,784 to American Airlines. The Court imposes upon you the $800 special assessment. The Court imposes upon you five years supervised release simply because the law requires it. But the life sentences are real life sentences so I need go no further. This is the sentence that is provided for by our statutes. It is a fair and just sentence. It is a righteous sentence.

Let me explain this to you. We are not afraid of you or any of your terrorist coconspirators, Mr. Reid. We are Americans. We have been through the fire before. There is all too much war talk here and I say hat to everyone with the utmost respect. Here in this court, we deal with individuals as individuals and care for individuals as individuals. As human beings, we reach out for justice. You are not an enemy combatant. You are a terrorist. You are not a soldier in any war. You are a terrorist. To give you that reference, to call you a soldier, gives you far too much stature. Whether it is the officers of government who do it or your attorney who does it, or if you think you are a soldier. You are not ----- you are a terrorist And we do not negotiate with terrorists. We do not meet with terrorists. We do not sign documents with terrorists. We hunt them down one by one and bring them to justice. So war talk is way out of line in this court. You are a big fellow. But you are not that big You're no warrior. I've know warriors. You are a terrorist. A species of criminal that is guilty of multiple attempted murders. In a very real sense, State Trooper Santiago had it right when you first were taken off that plane and into custody and you wondered where the press and where the TV crews were, and he said: "You're no big deal."

You are no big deal.

What your able counsel and what the equally able United States attorneys have grappled with and what I have as honestly as I know how tried to grapple with, is why you did something so horrific. What was it that led you here to this courtroom today? I have listened respectfully to what you have to say. And I ask you to search your heart and ask yourself what sort of unfathomable hate led you to do what you are guilty and admit you are guilty of doing. And I have an answer for you. It may not satisfy you, but as I search this entire record, it comes as close to understanding as I know.

It seems to me you hate the one thing that to us is most precious. You hate our freedom. Our individual freedom. Our individual freedom to live as we choose, to come and go as we choose, to believe or not believe as we individually choose. Here, in this society, the very wind carries freedom. It carries it everywhere from sea to shining sea. It is because we prize individual freedom so much that you are here in this beautiful courtroom. So that everyone can see, truly see, that justice is administered fairly, individually, and discretely. It is for freedom's sake that your lawyers are striving so vigorously on your behalf and have filed appeals, will go on in their representation of you before other judges. We Americans are all about freedom. Because we all know that the way we treat you, Mr. Reid, is the measure of our own liberties. Make no mistake though. It is yet true that we will bear any burden; pay any price, to preserve our freedoms. Look around this courtroom. Mark it well. The world is not going to long remember what you or I say here. Day after tomorrow, it will be forgotten, but this, however, will long endure. Here in this courtroom and courtrooms all across America, the American people will gather to see that justice, individual justice, justice, not war, individual justice is in fact being done. The very President of the United States through his officers will have to come into courtrooms and lay out evidence on which specific matters can be judged and juries of citizens will gather to sit and judge that evidence democratically, to mold and shape and refine our sense of justice. See that flag, Mr. Reid? That's the flag of the United States of America. That flag will fly there long after this is all forgotten. That flag stands for freedom. And it always will.

Mr. Custody Officer. Stand him down.

So, how much of this Judge's comments did we hear on our TV sets? We need more judges like Judge Young, but that's another subject. Pass this around. Everyone should and needs to hear what this fine judge had to say. Powerful words that strike home.

God bless America.



Every American should have a chance to read this. Canadians should read it, too.
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nickgutierrez Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jul-21-05 11:52 PM
Response to Original message
1. This is, apparently, true
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Thanks for "snoping" it -- how DID that web site get its name??
Good job!
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Spider Jerusalem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. Maybe the person who started it really liked William Faulkner's novels?
Edited on Fri Jul-22-05 12:25 AM by Spider Jerusalem
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:41 AM
Response to Reply #9
20. I found your reference in Faulkner's biography on-line --
"While in New York in the fall of 1938, Faulkner began writing a short story, "Barn Burning," which would be published in Harper's the following year. But Faulkner was not finished with the story. He had in mind a trilogy about the Snopes family, a lower-class rural laboring white family who, unlike the Compsons and Sartorises of other Faulkner novels, had little regard for southern tradition, heritage, or lineage. The Snopes, often regarded as Faulkner's metaphor for the rising "redneck" middle class in the South, more interested in avaricious commercial gain than honor or pride, were to be led in the trilogy by the enterprising Flem Snopes, who in the original story "Barn Burning" had appeared only briefly as the eldest son of Ab Snopes."

It's still just a little obtuse -- maybe I'll speak with my aunt who actually lectures on William Faulkner and has read everything he has written. Obviously, I haven't.

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SoDesuKa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:12 AM
Response to Original message
2. Grandstanding
The judge became the darling of a certain type of patriotic sentimentalists, that's all. The American flag is not a symbol of freedom. What a load of shit. For the record, we are in a war. We should have avoided that war, and if we'd been as committed to justice as Judge Bluster thinks we are, we would have avoided it.
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CanuckAmok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:18 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Ironic.
For someone who apparently wanted to downplay the significance of Reid, he sure chose his words carefully and jingoistically.

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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. Certainly can follow that reasoning. What is this judge's background?
Edited on Fri Jul-22-05 12:20 AM by Radio_Lady
Anyone care to look it up?

Did right-wing websites pick this up?

What is a "patriotic sentimentalist"?

What kind of a symbol is our flag?

I agree completely with your last statement.

Thanks for your post.
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frylock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:18 AM
Response to Original message
4. with all due respect..
this is the type of jingoistic bullkrap I would expect to receive in an email from one of my barstool patriot friends. I wish we had a whacking-off smiley, because that's how I feel about this judge's statement.
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. Interesting response. I'm still puzzled by what you would define
as patriotic. Were the American Revolutionaries patriotic? I'm sure the British didn't think so. It's just getting bandied around so much that I find the defining of it difficult.

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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:22 AM
Response to Original message
8. Canadians would laugh at the bravado in that
And think it was cheesy
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:26 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. So a Canadian judge would have "cut the cheese" so to speak???
Edited on Fri Jul-22-05 12:27 AM by Radio_Lady
Canadians judges show "no bravado", as a class, when speaking to a defendant who is guilty? Or are we speaking about an individual here? And your flag -- it is considered a symbol of freedom and of patriotism?
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:27 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. They wouldn't go off on a patriotic tangent
ANd I'm speaking as someone who covers court
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. Appreciate your reply. BTW, we're headed to Victoria, BC, Canada --
next month for a ten-day visit. We love being in Canada (and I do love cold weather). We might even choose to live there if we could figure out the conundrums of medical care (we're both over 65, finally on Medicare and have a pretty good alternate health plan).

I wish there was more Canadian news coverage in the U.S. It's pretty paltry -- and so was my education about your country where I grew up in Miami, Florida. I know more about the Spanish who settled Florida, and many other Latin cultures, than I do about our neighbor to the north. It's disappointing...

Thanks again.
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:33 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. This dink below me lives in "Da vix"
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CanuckAmok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #15
19. You'll be interestd to know...
The Spanish who settled in California also settled parts of Vancouver Island, as did many Californians who headed North for the various goldrushes.

Drop in when you're in Victoria... I'll take you on the nickel tour.
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #19
29. Well, I'd have to know how to contact you, Canuck...
Edited on Fri Jul-22-05 08:40 PM by Radio_Lady
PM me if you're serious and give me some information on how to get in touch. Are you in business or do you live in the downtown area? We're going to be staying at one of the Traveler's Inns - City Center, 1961 Douglas Street.
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CanuckAmok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. A Canadian judge would probably deliver a written judgement.
And with less florid writing.

We do things differently here.

Not necessarily better, just differently.
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:29 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. BETTER YOU TREACHOROUS SWINE!
Go back to Quebec!
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CanuckAmok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:31 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. LOL!
You're a pip!
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:36 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Break it up, gentlepeople! Let's have a more lucid and kind evening!
I'm going to bed -- glad to meet you both. I can speak a little French, love the language, and the people. I sometimes feel quite badly that your country still has so much anguish over the language and population difference in Quebec.



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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:36 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. They started it
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. Yeah, I hear that all the time -- from my grandchildren, ages 7 and 4!
P. S. I like your plushy Canadian bear, HEyHEY... I have a children's room that I'm planning to decorate in patriotic colors (red, white, and blue). He'd fit right in!

Have a great weekend!
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
22. I don't have any problem with this.
This terrorist showed no remorse whatsoever, and thought of himself as some sort of hero. I don't think it's grandstanding to confront someone for that.
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Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
23. If the judge meant what he said he would have
Read the sentence, and then followed it by "You're no big deal. Stand this man down."

And thats it...
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
24. i heard it aLL when it happened
just because ditto-heads don't keep up with the news....
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RPM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
25. he made a big deal about no big deal...
he seems a bit confused to me. if someone is no big deal you don't make a long diatribe :eyes:
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dean_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
26. He had me until that last paragraph.
I mean, it was a good point to make, that this country he despises so much still respected his rights enough to give him a trial, as opposed to just beheading him. That "from sea to shining sea" crap was just pointless though.
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Radio_Lady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. Reading it again today, I also agree the pronouncement could
use a little editing. I still know nothing about this judge -- hard to analyze it from here.
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Squatch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
27. Good stuff. Very well said.
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Tyrone Slothrop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
28. I have a hard time appreciating that
Edited on Fri Jul-22-05 01:06 PM by Tyrone Slothrop
Considering that I was randomly searched on my way to work this morning -- no warrant, no anything -- and will potentially be searched anytime I wish to go anywhere in NYC. My work, my brother's apartment, a movie, etc.

I am now subject to random searches. I walk past soldiers armed with rifles and machine guns on a daily basis.

Is this freedom?

It looks more and more like a police state everyday.
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CanuckAmok Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-22-05 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. Check out this newspoll:
We're no more appreciative of our disappearing freedoms up here, it seems...

http://www.cfax1070.com/polls/index.php?poll=20050722093817
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