On Tolerance and Being Offended

[SOteric]

(Reprinted as thread topic by special request)

In the middle of the last century, progressive people stood up for the oppressed and were an important factor in elevating the cause of civil rights in this country.

When we hear someone use the 'N' word, or behave in abusive ways to a person of African descent only because of the colour of their skin, we're not merely offended, correct thinking individuals find that situation intolerable.

In gender discrimination the line gets clouded by sexuality, but it's really not different. I'm no prude. I have laughed at a number of randy jokes and know the meaning of terms which make polite people blush. I have an apron with a bunch of penguins boinking in orgy in a subtle pattern. This would be free expression of sexualised topics. We can laugh at the jokes in Playboy, we can indulge in erotica, we can accept people for their open marriages or variant sexual predilections. Where it becomes intolerable is the point that it demeans any individual simply because of their gender, or predilection, or orientation, or ad infinitum.

Certainly there are people in every segment of society who use any excuse to find offense. I really don't see that as being the majority of what goes on here at these message boards. It's a careful line we have to walk balancing our tolerance and the need to stand up and speak to that which is wrong.

I admire a great many men and women on these boards who speak out against that which they feel is intolerable. I think if you'll read with an open mind, you'll find most of them make a very reasonable case for their beliefs and are not merely speaking from emotion or a need to be dramatic.

It's not offensive to use joking, abusive terms about the gay and lesbian community; it's intolerable. It's not offensive to poke fun of women in demeaning and objectifying ways; it's intolerable. It's not offensive to mock people of colour or ethnic variation; it's intolerable. Yes, we're a tolerant bunch but we will not be the oppressors. We stand against the evil we do not accept it.

We're just fucking better than that.

[Misunderestimator]

1. Rock on! Thanks for reposting this. Nominated!

:yourock:

[motely36]

2. Great Post!

:toast:

[DS1]

3. Hooray!

:yourock:

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

4. I really want to thank you for taking my sentiments

and so succinctly stating them...

Kudos

[GOPisEvil]

5. That's the point I was trying to make.

You said so much better than I. :)

[ulysses]

6. MOST excellent.

Thank you. :thumbsup:

[redqueen]

7. I'm just piling on...

:applause:

:loveya:

[progmom]

8. thank you, esso

Passionate and brilliant as always. :applause:

[Fly by night]

9. What stimulated this thread?

I spend most of my DU time on the 2004 ERD forum, though I also enjoy reading the "Greatest" threads for the cross-fertilization they provide. So I'm unaware what brought this thread into being? Is there an offensive thread you can refer me to to see what stimulated your concern and response? Thanks.

[SOteric]

10. Sure.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=3731937&mesg_id=3731937

There's been a minor kerfluffle in the Lounge of late. The thread above is where my original post was made.

[Pithlet]

11. Nominated again!

:applause:

[VelmaD]

12. You are still the most wonderful-est person...

it has been my good fortune to know. I'm still sad I didn't get to meet you in person in Seattle and hug your nack. :)

[bliss_eternal]

13. Right ON!

:woohoo:

[Bunny]

14. Thanks SOteric!

:yourock:

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NMMNG]

29. Yes, but...

Queer has long been used as a perjorative term against gay people. However many years ago gays took ownership of the word and began using it as a symbol of pride. So even though homophobes still use the word to belittle gays, many gays will joyfully refer to themselves as "Queer". It takes the stigma out of it, and sends a "F-U" message back to the bigots at the same time.

[NMMNG]

30. BTW, welcome to DU!

:hi:

[wickerwoman]

32. I took a class in Grad School on "Queer Theory" in Literature.

I think it has been largely reclaimed, at least in academic circles.

:shrug:

[sundog]

16. nice post so

thanks :)

[blondeatlast]

17. EXCELLENT! "We will not be the oppressors." Could anything be simpler

to understand?

Thank you for a brilliant post.

I nominate this for a DU Hall of fame!

[hickman1937]

18. Why only women?

It's not offensive to use joking, abusive terms about the gay and lesbian community; it's intolerable. It's not offensive to poke fun of women in demeaning and objectifying ways; it's intolerable. It's not offensive to mock people of colour or ethnic variation; it's intolerable. Yes, we're a tolerant bunch but we will not be the oppressors. We stand against the evil we do not accept it.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

19. Great post!

Thank you....

:yourock:

[freeplessinseattle]

20. Great post! Thank you so much, that needed to be said

and you said it very well.

[skygazer]

21. Great post!

Well worth repeating! :applause:

[smirkymonkey]

22. Hear, hear!

:toast: :applause:

[Cyndee_Lou_Who]

23. Again....

impressed as always.

[Tsiyu]

24. Great post

There has been so much stumbling and slipping by some trying to find a foothold on this whole situation, can't we just all agree that disallowing an advertiser to utilize DU is not part of some sinister agenda to censor everybody?

I had no idea so many DUers were feeling disgruntled about this "agenda" they perceive.

It's rather stunning, actually. The depth of outrage felt by these members amazes me. And I still can't figure out why they keep saying, 'I'm fine with getting rid of the advertiser; I'm disgusted by their products, too, but...WaaaWaaaWaaaa my feelings are hurt because I have to watch everything I say" or some such. I still don't understand how they agree with what has transpired yet they still feel insulted and put out by the "atmosphere." Is it cognitive dissonance or just what? I really want to understand!

Anyhoo, the right choices were made by the right people. :thumbsup:

[jonnyblitz]

25. excellent post!

:thumbsup: :hi:

[bloom]

26. thanks for that...

It's a hell of a philosophy that some seem to have - that people should be able to be as mean and cruel as they can be - and we are supposed to "tolerate" it.

[JimmyJazz]

27. Awesome post.

:yourock:

[fleabert]

28. so glad you reposted.

nominated! (and thanks for the heads-up on it, Misunderestimator!)

[Wetzelbill]

31. I wish I still lived in Seattle because....

I think I just fell in love. What words. What power. That was awesome. Truly. :wow:

[Wetzelbill]

33. Kick

:kick:

[ScreamingMeemie]

34. Thank you!!! Thank you!!! I just printed this out.

I'd say more but I have to go iron my husband's shirts! :P

:hug: :loveya:

[progmom]

35. wise words, don't you agree?

:bounce:

[DS1]

36. I do

Regardless of inherent bias :-)

[progmom]

37. only a little bit of bias there

:)