I had an epiphany regarding my furrbaby adoption....Help!

[serryjw]

You all know that Einstein crossed the Rainbow Bridge on 3/29. I have wanted to adopt two (kitty) furrbabies but have yet to find them. This w/e I realized I have been put on this earth to care for the furrbabies no one else wants......NOW, I have to decide to I adopt 2
FeLV or 2 SENIOR furrbables that no one will any longer want. I have to decide because I will do it this week...OPINIONS?

[smbolisnch]

1. I think that whichever you choose is wonderful.

Seriously. I think it is wonderful that you are going to do that!!! :yourock:

[benburch]

2. You are a kind soul.

Senior cats would be my preference because then you are free to take in other strays in the future.

What part of the country (or world) are you from?

I volunteer with a shelter here in the Western Chicago Suburbs where we have both FeLV and Senior cats who have been waiting for adoption for months!

[serryjw]

4. I live in 550 sq feet!

Unless I move out, 2 is probably all I can muster. I live in D/T Denver

[friesianrider]

3. I think you're my new favorite DUer :)

Adopting a senior or FIV positive kitty is one of the most compassionate things one can do - particularly if you go to a high-kill shelter.

There is a very high-kill pound near me, and I adopted a 12-year-old kitty who had FIV. He was to be PTS that evening. He's been absolutely wonderful! So often, particularly this time of year, shelters are overrun with kittens from the idiots who won't spay and neuter their cats. They are usually adopted, as peope whiz right by the adult kitties, and senior cats are especially hard to adopt out. I think your decision to adopt two older, FIV kitties is extremely compassionate and a wise choice. Adult rescue kitties make the best pets, IMHO!

:yourock: Let us know how it goes (and pictures too!) :)

[serryjw]

5. I'm going to cry!

I love them all and want to take all of them but can't right now. our KILL shelter has triplets that are gray tabbies,2 months old!...It would be great to have them but I KNOW they will be adopted very quickly and a beautiful 5 & 8 year old have been there a long time...I need to me their Mommy!

[LisaL]

6. Sounds like you already have these cats picked out.

So, just adopt them.

[serryjw]

7. Too many choices

b/t FeLV and senior furbabies. Still have not decided

[Carni]

8. I have three of the SOBs

Said with great affection of course... (SORT OF lol)

All three are males, all were ferals and two were very ill (bottle feeding every four hours was in order)

My opinion of them goes back and forth between "delightful" and "devil's spawn --what the hell was I thinking?"

One dumped a running fan on my head the other morning so there had better be a place reserved for my soul SOMEWHERE for taking these guys in!

But as to your question...old or young you're saving somebody!

[flvegan]

9. What would happen if...?

Your avatar...HHDL...

What would happen if you adopted all 4 cats? Is 4 too many? Can you afford 4 cats? Could you then try to adopt the 2 seniors out (the two FeLV wouldn't get adopted, obviously) maybe through a local Petfinder resource? 550 square feet isn't a ton of space, but is it enough? Could you keep them apart? Do you need to? Can you provide a better life for them, without subjecting yours, causing resentment?

[LisaL]

10. It's not a good idea to have four cats at 550 square feet.

Cats need space. You can not stuff them as sardines into bottle and expect they will behave. It's even worst idea to have two Felv positive and 2 Felv negative cats together.
Felv is highly infectious. Frankly, I don't know what your resources are, but you need to consider that if you are to adopt two Felv positive cats. They might need more vet care than two healthy five-eight year old cats.
"DO NOT EVER knowingly put an FeLV-Positive cat in with any cat who is not also Positive. Putting an FeLV-Positive cat in with one that is Negative, even though they have been vaccinated, puts them at risk for getting the disease. The constant exposure to the FeLV cat on a daily basis - using the same litterbox, drinking out of the same water bowl, and eating out of the same food bowl, is asking for trouble."

http://www.geocities.com/miller-roth/felv.html

[flvegan]

12. Heyyyy!

You missed the part where I asked if the poster could keep them apart. Maybe try to adopt out the seniors? Did you read my post? Didya? Hmmmmm...

Oh...pssst...it's an even worse idea to have them stuffed 2 at a time in small 18"x18" cattery cages. Nothing against a shelter, but that's how most of them are kept (that come in together, not 2 strange cats put in together).

[LisaL]

15. I think the goal of adopting the cats is so they have better life than

they did in a shelter. And yes, I read your post. How do you propose someone can keep 4 cats apart on 550 square feet?
Keep them in cages again? It is not fair to put healthy cats at risk by exposing them to highly contagious deadly disease.

[friesianrider]

20. The OP would have plenty of room, IMHO.

My old apartment was around that and I had 4 cats there, no problem. Like I said, one had felv and the others did not. Still to this day, all are negative except for the original cat.

If she wants to adopt all 4, I say good for her - she is a wonderful individual.

[serryjw]

13. Thanks for your candor

My funds are limited and I was concerned over possible future vet bills. My 5 & 8 year old are in a KILL shelter. I know they are not very old BUT their days are numbered and I'm concern they will not get adopted in time. I'm aware of the problems with adopting 2 FeLV and wouldn't bring a healthy cat into my home with them. I work all day and having more than 2 furrbabies home w/o be wouldn't be fair and I couldn't give them the love & attention I want to give.

[LisaL]

14. Sounds like you identified the cats already.

And with limited funds, it wouldn't be fair to adopt Felv positive cats knowing you might not be able to pay their vet bills.
Vet bills are a lot of money.

[friesianrider]

17. As far as I know...

Most times cats with Felv are just carriers and have no symptoms. Let me check on that.

On edit: checked with my Mom (she works with a rescue that specializes in felv cats) and said that felv is spread by saliva, but it is extremely rare to be spread by saliva just by licking the same food dish or whatever. It is usually only transmitted through bites that puncture the skin and saliva enters the bloodstream that way. As long as they aren't at each others throats it likely isn't a problem.

For the record, we have had an felv cat with non-felv cats for 12 years and all are still negative except for that original one.

[LisaL]

18. I think you are confusing Felv with Fiv.

Fiv is less infectious. Felv is highly infectious.
It's a deadly disease that kills a lot of cats. Cats with Fiv, on the other hand, can live a longer life.
"Feline leukemia virus (FeLV) is a contagious and often fatal virus that is widespread in the American cat population. Once a cat has been infected with FeLV, it has the virus and, at this time, there is no known way to eliminate it from the cat's system. The infected cat's immune system is suppressed and thereby the cat becomes more susceptible to secondary infections. No breed of cat is more susceptible than another, but kittens and older or debilitated cats are more susceptible than healthy cats."
"Signs of FeLV infection arise from the various diseases it causes. The affected cat may lose appetite and weight, its mucus membranes may become pale, it may be constipated or pass bloody stool, and have difficulty breathing, coughing or swallowing. Most kittens born to infected mothers develop what is termed "fading kitten syndrome". The kittens are lethargic, have stunted growth, and are susceptible to infection. A cat with FeLV may develop a number of diseases that are either directly or indirectly caused by the virus. Most common are various cancers, anemia, kidney disease,or secondary infections caused by a lowered immune response. With the weakening of the cat's immune system, otherwise non-threatening conditions may prove serious or fatal. FeLV cats recover slowly from such infections (upper respiratory infections, bite wounds, abcesses) and can easily become severely debilitated."
http://www.paws.org/cas/resources/fact_sheets_cats/flv.php

[friesianrider]

19. See my other post.

My mother has worked with a kitty rescue that specializes in re-homing felv cats for almost 8 years now.

[LisaL]

21. I saw your other post, and you clearly state in there

that it would be great to adopt a FIV positive cat.
The poster, however, stated he/she thinks of adopting Felv positive cats.
That's how I reached the conclusion you might have the two diseases confused.

[friesianrider]

23. Okay...

Yes, it was a typo.

But I did just check, and felv IS containable as long as you vaccinate and the cats are not fighting to the point of breaking skin.

On edit: vaccinate

[LisaL]

25. Fiv is containable as long as the cats aren't breaking skin.

Felv is transmitted trough contact.
All the info I could find regarding Felv states that.

[friesianrider]

29. Okay, once more...

Yes, it CAN be transmitted through contact, but is is VERY RARE. That's why you vaccinate the healthy cats with the felv vaccine. :shrug:

[LisaL]

45. The best way to protect against disease is to prevent exposure

to it. This person plans to adopt 2 cats and already stated it's not his/ hers intentions to adopt both Felv negative and positive cats together. If the cats are indoor, then there is no need to vaccinate them against Felv at all.

[smbolisnch]

47. From Cornell Veterinary College.

How is FeLV spread?


Cats persistently infected with FeLV serve as sources of infection. Virus is shed in very high quantities in saliva and nasal secretions, but also in urine, feces, and milk from infected cats. Cat-to-cat transfer of virus may occur from a bite wound, during mutual grooming, and (though rarely) through the shared use of litter boxes and feeding dishes

I think it is safe to assume that unless the cats were fighting, it would be safe.

[LisaL]

48. Mutual grooming is not fighting. So, no, it's not safe to assume

cats will be safe if they don't fight.

[friesianrider]

52. Oh for heaven's sake.

I friggin' give up. I guess you just will not let this go even though wrong.

[smbolisnch]

54. Well, might as well put them to sleep then.

ETA: :sarcasm: to the title.

The OP is a rare gem that is willing to consider 2 Felv kitties. That does not happen often. They may not get another chance. Since the likelyhood of transmission is rare, I see no harm in adopting them.

[LisaL]

58. If he/she adopts two Felv positive cats, then they are both

already infected. What risk of transmission?
He/she can adopt either Felv positive cat, or Felv negative cats. There is no need to mix them together.
As for putting them to sleep, a lot of shelters do put Felv and Fiv positive cats to sleep. And the old cats can also be put to sleep if nobody adopts them.
It's a fact of life.

[smbolisnch]

59. You just reiterated my point.

Thank you. :banghead:

[friesianrider]

50. Particularly if vaccinated.

Thanks for this link. Like I said, I haven't had a problem in 12 years with an felv positive cat living with others who are not - they are all still negative to this day.

I certainly would exercise caution and vaccinate, but I honestly don't see a problem or my cats would not be living together like they are.

[LisaL]

22. Again, Fiv is transmitted trough bites. Felv is transmitted trough

contact.

[friesianrider]

24. felv is ALSO transmitted through bites, rarely contact.

From the rescue's flyer:

How is the virus transmitted?

The main means of transmitting the virus is through cat fights. Puncture wounds associated with fighting result in injection of the virus into other cats. The virus can be spread through other less frequent routes of viral spread include sharing food and water bowls, cats grooming each other, and transmission from mother to kittens before birth, but these are extremely rare.

[LisaL]

27. That's not what every website on a subject says.

"FeLV TRANSMISSION:
Transmission of FeLV occurs through bodily secretions, such as saliva or urine. Mutual licking or grooming, sharing of food and water bowls, sharing litter boxes, and bites while fighting, can all spread FeLV. Transmission can also occur from an infected mother to her unborn fetus or to kittens via nursing.

FIV TRANSMISSION:
Transmission of FIV occurs predominantly from cat bites while fighting. Transmission from an infected mother to her kittens can also occur, but it is rare."
http://www.elliottbayah.com/articles/leukemia.html

[friesianrider]

28. I never said it was impossible through contact...

Only that transmission through contact alone is extremely rare, which it is.

[LisaL]

34. It's not extremely rare.

No info I can find says Felv transmission trough contact is extremely rare.

[friesianrider]

37. Sure is...I'm looking at one right now

A rescue made up of 4 vets - if I could scan it in I would.

[friesianrider]

30. Also, this is why you vaccinate the healthy cats.

The vaccine is highly effective.

[LisaL]

33. Not really.

Vaccine is definitely isn't 100 % effective. This person is on limited income and smallish apartment. He/she defiantly shouldn't adopt both Felv positive and negative cats. At 5 and 8 years old, the oldsters still have a lot of life ahead of them.

[friesianrider]

36. Why not really?

No vaccine is 100% effective, but show me where the felv vaccine is not effective enough to warrant vaccinating the healthy cats.

The person is perfectly capable of making the decision on what she can and cannot afford. But to give the impression that the felv is not highly effective is simply misleading. It is why our vet vaccinates ALL cats and kittens for felv - because it is highly effective.

Again, show me where you see the felv vaccine is NOT highly effective.

[LisaL]

38. Fine.

"There are presently a number of companies who make and sell vaccines against FeLV. Vaccines may be against FeLV only, or they may combine FeLV with other components. Many trials have been conducted to compare the effectiveness of the various vaccines, but unfortunately, the studies remain hard to interpret, largely due to inconsistencies in study designs. On average, FeLV vaccines are able to prevent infection in about 80 to 90% of cats. All the vaccines are recommended to be given as a two-dose regimen spaced 2-4 weeks apart, staring with kittens 8 to 9 weeks of age. Thereafter, annual boosters are recommended."
"The best protection against any infectious disease is eliminating possible exposure."


http://www.winnfelinehealth.org/health/FeLV.html
Why in the world should this person adopt both Felv positive and negative cats together? That's just complete nonsense. Either stick to adopting Felv negative or Felv positive cats, but not both. To on purpose risk infecting healthy animals-for what reason? It makes no sense whatsoever.

[friesianrider]

40. LOL, and how does that answer my challenge?

"On average, FeLV vaccines are able to prevent infection in about 80 to 90% of cats. All the vaccines are recommended to be given as a two-dose regimen spaced 2-4 weeks apart, staring with kittens 8 to 9 weeks of age. Thereafter, annual boosters are recommended."

Does 80-90% effective not qualify as "highly" effective to you? :eyes:

[LisaL]

41. No, it's not. If you are going to mix Felv positive and negative

cats on purpose, then you better have a 100 % effective vaccine.
There is no reason whatsoever for this person to mix negative and positive cats. And those are not his/hers intentions anyway.

[friesianrider]

42. WTF...80-90% effective does not qualify as highly effective??

Wow...:eyes:

There is no such thing as a vaccine that is 100% effective 100% of the time. So I guess no one should vaccinate against ANYTHING because no vaccine is 100% effective? You're just plain wrong on this, I'm sorry.

[LisaL]

43. And you are very wrong if you think recommending someone

on a limited budget and smallish apartment to adopt both Felv negative and positive cats in large numbers is a good idea.

[friesianrider]

44. Don't change the subject, please...

You were taking issue with the felv vaccine. Say what you want about space or budget - that is all debatable, but please DON'T spread blatantly false information.

[LisaL]

46. 80 % effective means 1 out of 5 cats will get the disease.

I suppose as far as vaccines go, it's considered effective.
But still not good enough to place Felv positive and negative cats together on purpose.

[friesianrider]

49. 80-90%, not 80%

And last I checked, 80-90% meant HIGHLY effective (not just "effective", something you for some reason disputed from the get-go.

Worst case scenario is that 1 in 5 cats gets the disease. Maybe to YOU it is not "good enough", but does that mean we should stop vaccinating cats? You never know when your cat (particularly if he goes outdoors) may be exposed to a felv positive cat. Should we just not bother vaccinating at all then?

No vaccine is 100% effective, in case you didn't know, even though I've noted this fact several times. 80-90% effective is EXTREMELY high.

[LisaL]

51. My cats are indoor. And I am not vaccinating them against Felv.

They are not at risk of contacting it.

[friesianrider]

53. What if they got out? Do they not get vaccin'd for anything then?

Happens all the time. What if they got loose while on a trip to the vet? What if they slipped out a door?

That's just irresponsible to not vaccinate for something like felv. But since 80-90% effectiveness isn't "good" enough for you, it is no wonder. Do you not vaccinate them for anything then since they're indoor?

[LisaL]

55. What if huge asteroid falls on my apartment?

I guess we all are going to be dead then.

[friesianrider]

56. Alright well, whatever. You're clearly wrong and know it.

Great argument, by the way. Shows you have nothing substantive to say.

:eyes:

[LisaL]

60. Wrong?

There is no need to vaccinate an indoor cat against Felv, if the cat isn't exposed to Felv positive cats.
Show me any info that contradicts that.

[smbolisnch]

57. Oh for shit's sakes.

This is getting stupid.

[friesianrider]

26. She could get a healthy cat and have huge vet bills.

Similarly, she could get a felv or FIV positive cat and have few vet bills - with pets no one knows, it's really silly to try and predict. I haven't had much luck at predicting them that's for sure (my felv kitty hasn't been sick EVER and my healthy kittens have each been to the vet three times in 2 years = $600 vet bills) ;)

[LisaL]

35. It's possible. That's why someone with limited funds should

think very carefully about adopting cats. But to adopt high risk cats on purpose on a limited budget is not a good idea.

[TimeChaser]

11. My one cat

had a little sign on her cage that read "Last Chance." She wasn't too old (only 5) and didn't have any major health problems (she'd had a 'fang' removed because of an abscess before, though). She may be a little psychotic, but we love her. :)

[City Lights]

16. I think it's wonderful that you want to adopt elderly or special-needs

cats. :hug: I think special-needs cats will be more challenging, and while it will be rewarding to open your home to them, it could be very heart-breaking for you. Some things to consider - Do they require medication? If so, how much will it cost you a month? Will taking care of them require more time than you have?

Adopting the seniors could be costly as well, but it's not a given. My Tigger never had any health problems other than pulling/cleaning teeth.

In the end, you are the only one who can make this decision. Whatever you decide to do, :yourock: for going this route.

You've found your mission in life. ;-) Good luck! Please keep us posted, and please include pictures!

[Samurai_Writer]

31. I adopted a senior cat in May

from the rescue that Lorien works for. He's a 10 year old silver Persian, and I got him to be a companion to my 14 year old longhaired domestic, who had recently lost his mother in March.

I can't say enough good things about my experience in adopting Sterling. I definitely will be adopting other senior animals in the future. Hopefully not too soon, though, as I want Smoke and Sterling with me for a long time!

Peace,
Bella

RIP, Nightmare, 3/31/05
RIP, Magic 6/25/05

[Samurai_Writer]

61. Here's Sterling's photo

thanks to Lorien for this one. She is a great kitty photographer!

[Rhiannon12866]

32. This is the very best thing that you could possibly do,

both for them and for yourself. These are the kind of animals that I adopt, as well. It all started with a cocker spaniel, my Barney, who was the "pet of the week" on the "Pet Connection" segment of my local news. He was such a beautiful dog, with a story that broke my heart. He was 10 or 11 years old, had never lived in a home with people and was not housebroken. I thought that I was up to the challenge, but that amazing dog, with a perfect temperament, was perfect from day one. He was the dog of my heart and I lost him after eight years, not nearly long enough for me.;(

But Barney inspired me and, of all the animals on my life, seven dogs and three cats, all but the puppy I had as a kid have been both rescue and older when I adopted them. After I lost my Barney, my neighbor suggested that if I ever got another dog, I should think of getting a puppy. And what I told her was that everyone wants a puppy, but who wants an eight-year-old dog with seizures? I've adopted two. They're the ones who need me. I had no idea when I first took them, but that's the way it turned out and I have no regrets. They needed somebody to care for them and they found me.
:grouphug:

It's tough, because you don't have as long together as you might with a younger animal. But kittens and puppies soon grow up, and the bond with an older pet can become just as strong. I sure have experienced it and, though my heart still breaks as easily as it always did, I wouldn't trade any of my guys for anything.
:loveya:

So, IMO, this is a brilliant idea. Let us know what you decide and how it turns out. And you know that if you ever need advice or support, short of your vet, you always have your fellow animal lovers on DU!:hi:

And just in case you need any additional inspiration, I'll post photos of two of my angels who have been closest to my heart:

Barney:

:loveya:

And Rhiannon:

:loveya:

[Samurai_Writer]

62. Rhiannon, it's so strange how our lost pets are so alike...

I adopted Magic, who was 4 at the time, and heartworm positive. The Humane Society usually puts down all heartworm positive dogs, but they said that Magic was so sweet, they had to give him a chance. I had 1 1/2 years with him, before he was taken by pancreatic cancer very unexpectedly. Also a cocker spaniel, he was the best dog I've ever had.

Nightmare was my 15 year old cat, who came to me at the age of 7 months old and pregnant. She just appeared at my door and refused to leave. Of course, I took her in, and kept one of her litter, Smoke, who is now 14. She died from complications of hyperthyroidism, after 2 years of having meds and treatment.

I have lost pets before, but these two have a very special place in my heart.

Magic



Nightmare

[Rhiannon12866]

63. I remember Magic well, my friend!

Both when he got sick and when you lost him. His story and his pic got to me, especially, because he reminded me of my Barney. He was also an exceptional dog and you gave him another chance and a wonderful life!
:loveya:

But your kitty! Yikes! From the color to the lovely tail, to that particular pose, so incredibly like my Rhiannon! Wow! That really is uncanny! What a beautiful cat and another sad story with a happy ending.O8)

Our lost angels are remarkably similar, and also the fact that they managed to find us, and a loving home, despite the odds! I have lost other pets, as well, too many, but Barney and Rhiannon were closest to my heart. Thanks so much for sharing their pix and their stories. We were fortunate to have them with us, even though the time was way too short...:pals:

[khashka]

39. Either is a good choice

and there's a special place in heaven for you for your compassion.

But if you want my advice, flawed as it is... FeLV. I don't know if they are sick or not. But, thinking of the possibilty of adoption, seems like the seniors stand a slightly better chance. Even if only slightly. And so maybe the FeLV babies need you more.

But then others might see it opposite.

Whatever choice you make, though, will be a good and right thing.

Khash.