'Spiritual' DUers, tell me why I should believe in anything.

[JaySherman]

Seriously, please give me a reason. I was raised Catholic, went from Catholic, to pagan, to now I don't know what. Maybe borderline aetheist. I want to believe, I really do. My whole life I've considered myself at least a spiritual person. But seeing all the cruelty, horror, and suffering going on out there right now, it's getting harder and harder to believe in anything. This is not a "What kind of god would allow this?" type of post. It's not like I'm looking for the Christian concept of a deity. I just want some sign, anything, to tell me we're not alone. I've tried meditating, praying, and outright begging but it's gotten me zero response. Nothing. Not even a jolt of comfort or reassurance. Sorry, I don't want to hear from aetheists right now. Someone wiser than me please offer some words. I'm feeling lost and alone right now, and I don't like it.

[cyberpj]

1. Because God doesn't intervene in man's creations.

It's up to mankind to be helping mankind.

And we NEVER NEVER NEVER seem to learn because ego creates greed and selfishness and corruption and "power" and lies and war and everything negative in this world.

Right now, it would appear ego is winning.

It will take a true "spirited" uprising.

[Heidi]

2. If you want to believe, that's reason enough.

I've seen enough goodness in my life to believe that it exists; I like how goodness feels when I experience it, and that's enough for to inspire me to try to live as a good person. Rationally, I know that life is cyclical; it's a circle, not a line. Good things happen to "bad" people, and "bad" things happen to good people.

I'm a far cry from wise, but I do know that you're not alone, JaySherman. Take good care of _you_ just now, OK?

[KittyWampus]

3. God isn't a person or being- It's the Creative Spirit.Creation=Destruction

you chop down a tree to build a house.

and the suffering is our way of feeling pain and finding out where we need to change course.

our best lessons come from our mistakes.

[intheflow]

10. Thanks, cryingshame.

"Creation = Destruction" is a very helpful equation for me. I'm a minister, this concept will "preach", as we say. It's akin to the concept that nothing comes from nothing--everything has its beginning in something else.

[sniffa]

4. how can ace be both 1 and 11?

what kind of god wouLd aLLow that?

[cally]

5. What I decided is that my belief

helps me and many others. I know God/goddess is too powerful to know or understand completely. I decided to not question and just have faith. I know it sounds simplistic and it is but that's what I did when I had a spiritual crisis.

[supernova]

6. Has nothing to do with reason

How do you like and love the people that you do in your life? Often it has nothing to do with reason. You are either:

1) Related to them. We don't get to choose our relatives.

2) Attacted to them. Is there a reason for being attracted to the people that we are? Sometimes there is. You like the way they laugh; or the things they talk about, or you like the same things. But just as often, you're left wondering :wtf: even if it is wonderful.

3) You just know. You just know The Eternal is there, you can feel the presence. It has nothing to do with doctrine or sets of beliefs. That's all just surface coating, anyway. It's really about wanting to get to know a benevolent presence in your life.

[Taverner]

7. Don't

Do what feels right - you can't force yourself to feel something you don't

And on edit: I'm a Deist, and I don't think God gives a rats ass. He gave us the tools, its up to us. My personal belief is that Christ's message was "You're on your own - whether you live or die is up to you."

[Lerkfish]

8. first, let me give you a virtual hug...

:hug:

If I were there in person, I'd give you a good one. I'm a good hugger.
:)

I can't implant belief in you, nor would I want to try. Right now, you seem upset and distraught (as are we all) at the gravity of many situations.

The only thing I can tell you is that the rain falls on the just and the unjust. By that I mean, things HAPPEN, they are happening all the time. I don't think it should be interpreted as punishment from God when bad things happen nor rewarding when good things happen.

Its at our worst moments that we want something to come together, to make sense in that way, but I honestly think that in this life we are all subject to the random vagaries of what might happen. No one is immune to things happening beyond our control.

There may be no guarantees of what befalls us, but we do have control of how we respond to those things.
New Orleans is an example...due to choices people make, this COULD be an overwhelming outpouring of support and help from common people, or it COULD be a horrendous abandonment of needy people. We can choose.

:hug:

[cyberpj]

9. More -

re: "I've tried meditating, praying, and outright begging but it's gotten me zero response."

Been there too. What finally made a difference was doing something. Anything. And I don't mean sending money. I mean some sort of volunteer work that appeals to you. Big Bros/Sisters, Reading to the blind, Helping immigrants learn English, Hospital aide. Find something YOU can DO for someone in need and you will feel your spirit healing.

And I second that virtual hug.

"When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love has always won. There have been tyrants and murderers and for a time they seem invincible but in the end, they always fall - think of it, ALWAYS." - Gandhi

[elshiva]

11. You don't have to believe, God loves everyone regardless,

BUT since you want to believe, believe. God's free will is so radical that it applies to all of nature, not just human beings. None of God's creation are puppets. A lot of factors are present in natural diasters. God does NOT punish people by storms, people suffer by their own actions and by others acting on them. Nature definitely has a will of its own, for good and ill.
Please be persistent in prayer, if it is what you want, but often people experience God through others. Ever have a loving relationship with a friend or family member? God is love, so God is there.

[kick-ass-bob]

12. There is always despair in the world.

Just because it is close to us, doesn't mean it's any different (overall, to us, obviously it is).
We are all interconnected beings, and your true spirit lies within you (and everyone), not outside of you. So you have to look within and do what feels right for you to do - what you can do, whatever that may be.

To be "asking" someone else for guidance is misled, the answer comes from within.

[elshiva]

13. Guidance comes from within, but people also need the

support of others to spark their minds.

[wildhorses]

14. I am not wiser

and I too, often have trouble believing and communicating what I believe. Language is so constricting/confining when trying to describe the awesomeness and vastness of a supreme creator. To me it is a paradox: because there is unbelief therefore it must be belief. In order to know joy one must experience sadness.
Time is the problem cos everyone wants it to happen in their time frame. The "God" I know can accept ALL and fears NONE. In "time" all will be different. Energy is energy, only the form changes.
I am making a mess of this, as usual. Just know that in "time" YOU will understand just as now you do not understand...there is that paradox thing again. May the angels shine especially on you this day. May all your needs for this one day be met, needs NOT wants. May you find trust that tomorrow will be today and your needs will again be met. Learn to see the signs in simple things...and I pray you find some comfort in these words. Go in peace so that peace will come to you. Good luck and best wishes as you face the tough times, trials and tribulations ahead of you. Know that there is a strength in you that will allow you to meet the challenges that have been placed before you.

[stellanoir]

15. a few "half baked theories". . .

Since I was quite young, I sensed that things would deteriorate before they improved globally but I never thought they'd digress to this extreme or so quickly.

Some spiritualists believe that we're in the midst of sort of a "spiritual winter" wherein certain negative forces are making their last stand. That's not unrelated to why fundamentalist factions of the various faiths have so much power and influence right now. These spiritualists also believe that the planet's vibration will be elevated by 2012, but things will be fairly crazy through about 2008-9.

Watching this country make all the blunders of every Imperial power throughout recorded history has been absolutely torturous
but there is a higher sense that superpowers are perhaps, no longer appropriate for this still new millennium.

I feel an all inclusive tolerant spirituality coupled with basic human kindness is the only thing that can create a lasting peace and improve life globally.

The whole of creation can really be reduced to love and fear. The fear mongers know on one level they will ultimately fall from power so they're behaving as though they have no concern for the future because fundamentall, they don't. You can also consider that there are those who are on paths where they are creating karma and those who are redeeming their karma. At least that rings true for me.

As for gaining no comfort from prayer, meditation, or "begging", bare in mind that different techniques work for different individuals. Prayers of gratitude are said to be the most powerful of all. There are also "active meditators" who clear their minds through physical activity or when surrounded by nature. Some of my greatest revelations have come both actively and passively, or even when I driving my car.

There are those who say "to say that you know nothing is one of the final stages moving towards elightenment."

You may be further along than you know.

[JaySherman]

16. Thanks for the help all.

I'm taking all your words to heart. Just did the only thing I could think of. Called the people closest to me and told them I love them. Now I'm going to try get some sleep. Thanks again and goodnight.

[AnarchoFreeThinker]

17. start with a belief in more than meets the eye

it's a small start, but opens lots of doors