Question: Soy-based infant formula:

[Earth_First]

My father sent this to me in regards to our lifestyle choices, and was curious to see what Democratic Underground had to say in regards to debunking any (or all) or it:

THANKS, DU!

...diets filled with soy and the hormones in conventional dairy products might be largely to blame for early puberty...

The most serious problem with soy formula is the presence of phytoestrogens or isoflavones. While many claims have been made about the health benefits of these estrogen-like compounds, animal studies indicate that they are powerful endocrine disrupters that alter growth patterns and cause sterility. Toxicologists estimate that an infant exclusively fed soy formula receives the estrogenic equivalent of at least five birth control pills per day. By contrast, almost no phytoestrogens have been detected in dairy-based infant formula or in human milk, even when the mother consumes soy products. A recent study found that babies fed soy-based formula had 13,000 to 22,0000 times more isoflavones in their blood than babies fed milk-based formula.

As for girls, an alarming number are entering puberty much earlier than normal, according to a recent study reported in the journal Pediatrics. Investigators found that one percent of all girls now show signs of puberty, such as breast development or pubic hair, before the age of three; by age eight, 14.7 percent of white girls and a whopping 48.3 percent of African-American girls had one or both of these characteristics. New data indicate that environmental estrogens such as PCBs and DDE (a breakdown product of DDT) may cause early sexual development in girls and a study in Puerto Rico implicated soy feeding as a cause of early menarche. The use of soy formula in the WIC program, which supplies free formula to welfare mothers, may explain the astronomical rates of early menarche in African American girls.

http://www.westonaprice.org/soy/infant.html

[purr]

1. I have my 6 mo old son and my 2 yr old daughter was on Soy.

That was the only formula they could tolerate. My daughter had HORRIBLE colic and as soon as I switched her to soy she was fine. My son I was breastfeeding until I had to get on really nasty drug and I had to stop and put him on formula. My daughter is almost 3 and hasnt shown any of those side effects.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

2. Used Soy formula

With all of my girls. The oldest is now 8 with no signs of early development. The had soy formula (after I did the breast feeding) from about 3 months until they were about 8 months. Used the Carnation one.

So far, they are just fine.:hi:

[LeftyMom]

3. 1. The source is craaaaaaaaaazy

2. Dairy is also associated with early puberty in girls and gynomastica in boys, so neither formula option is a good idea when there's an alternative (also breastfed kids are healthier, smarter and less smelly.)

3. Higher forumla use rates are associated with poverty and impoverished kids tend to have lousy diets and higher toxin exposure rates, so it's hard to know just what can be pinned on formula feeding and what's the result of other factors.

4. Some differences in onset of menarche may be racial rather than enviornmental. The link sort of implies that because AA girls had pubic hair before white girls that this means something's wrong. It may just mean that AA girls get pubic hair earlier. The description of WIC as a program for welfare mothers (it also serves working class families) to associate it with the AA group is both nasty racial politics and ill-informed.

5. The default with WIC is dairy formula. Switching to soy or a specialized formula usually requires a request from the infant's care provider.

[LostinVA]

4. This has been debunked

I don't have a source, but one of my students researched this very thing for a paper. I proofed it for her.

[hippiechick]

5. HippieKid, who is 'African Americans', was a soy baby ...

... she had her first period just before her 12th birthday, which I believe is fairly common among this generation. My generation was 13-14 for the onset.

I'm not sure what's causing it seemingly earlier and earlier with each generation, but I suspect growth hormones in Milk and all the chemicals in fast food have alot more to do with it than soy products.

:shrug:

[LeftyMom]

6. I was 11 and was exclusively breastfed for the first year of my life

I think diet in childhood and at puberty is more of a factor than infant feeding, as well. I'm of european extraction, if it matters.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

29. You were breastfed until you were 11?!?!?!

:crazy:

[ghostsofgiants]

21. 8-12 years old is the general age range for the onset of puberty...

Menarche usually occurs at around 12 or 13. Body fat levels can be an issue. The lower the body fat, usually the later it occurs. So diet in general is a major factor I would assume. More junk food --> More body fat --> Earlier menarche.

[MissMillie]

7. ya know.... If there's really something DANGEROUS about formula

let's have it.

If not, let's not try to make women feel guilty for making a choice that may suit their lives and their parenting plans better than breastfeeding does.

People need to do what is comfortable for themselves.

[purr]

11. Kudos!

Well said!

[miss_american_pie]

8. I'd be more concerned with allergies

Soy is one of the eight most common foods people are allergic to.

That said, soy is what they switch babies to when the have dairy allergies.

Personally I'm more concerned about the hormones in non-organic dairy products.

[Momgonepostal]

14. True, but milk is also one of the big 8 allergens

I don't think a milk based formula is any less allergenic.

I'm not a fan of any formula, really, but I understand that its use is sometimes necessary.

[miss_american_pie]

15. Oh I hear you

My first kid is allergic to dairy, egg whites, peanuts, and tree nuts.

Feeding him is such a joy. :eyes:

[Momgonepostal]

18. We have a bit of that going on here, too

My second child is also allergic to egg whites and peanuts, plus citrus, soy and wheat.

Do you cook much? I'd love to hear your egg substitute ideas for cakes. Feel free to PM me!

[LeftyMom]

20. Momgonepostal, have you tried ener-g egg replacer?

I don't know how I'd bake without it. You can get it at pretty much any health food store or online here: http://www.veganstore.com/index-store.html?deptid=17122&parentid=42&stocknumber=231&page=1&itemsperpage=12

Also, all the recipies at http://vegweb.com/ are egg-free, since it's for vegans. Most of my baked goods recipes come from there- I've had really good luck with the recipes on that site.

Hope that helps.

[Momgonepostal]

22. Thank you

I use egg replacer and like it for many things, but it's not perfect. I'm always looking for new ideas, too.

I'll book mark the vegan site to check out later, thank you!

[jmowreader]

23. What do you feed this child

Considering that he/she is allergic to basically every food item ever made by the Hand of Man, I think you're down to throwing chunks of raw venison at him/her.

[Momgonepostal]

32. We've got a system down now

It was tough at first, but we've managed to find things she likes. We have best luck with whole foods, since they don't have hidden allergens. So a piece of chicken that we prepare ourselves will work as opposed to chicken nuggets that have wheat or sometimes egg. She can have any meat, most fruits other that citrus, most vegetables, although she's picky about that, dairy, potatoes, and for breads we have some recipes and a few speciality items that work. I have a pizza dough recipe made from rice and tapioca flours that she likes. Trader Joes sells a type of brown rice bread she likes, too. There are some good corn based pastas on the market. It was definitely a bit of a lifestyle change starting out, though.

[miss_american_pie]

28. Sure

Give me a bit to get some recipes together and I'll pm you.

[Momgonepostal]

33. I appreciate that! Thank you! nt

[xmas74]

9. My mother used soy on me since I was allergic to

dairy. Breast development began for me at the age of nine and my first period was right after my eleventh birthday-the same as my mother who had been nursed.

I call BS on this one. A friend's daughter was given soy and she did not begin to develop breasts until the age of twelve-onset of menses was at the age of fourteen.

I have another friend who is an OB/Gyn nurse. We've talked about puberty before and she says that the biggest factor for when a girl begins to develop is family history. If mother is an early or late developer chances are the daughter will be similar (but not always. There could be other factors involved).

[seemunkee]

10. Used it for our two kids

My daughter was late hitting puberty.

[mzteris]

12. Not those QUACKS!

Westonprice.org (and Sally Fallon) are nuts.

"Dr. Price" was a DENTIST who tried to turn anthropologist or something back earlier last century (ok - 20th century, but still . . .) and developed some "theories" about diet based on teeth.

His followers have created this whole "organization" that touts drinking RAW milk, eating lots and lots of MEAT and maintaining that soy is "evil". Their sources for saying such are grossly flawed. No reputable researcher has found what their poorly designed "studies" have. They tend to self-referential circular "references". They cite their own - or a friends study to bolster their "studies".

As far as "entering puberty early" - I'd think the GROWTH HORMONES fed to ANIMALS consumed by humans is far the more likely culprit!

[JuniperLea]

13. Used it for three kids

All are adults now... smart as hell and healthy as can be. Middle kid is a Chemical Engineer... sure didn't hurt him!

[Not_Giving_Up]

16. My son was on a soy formula because he couldn't keep the normal stuff down

When he was six weeks old, he started projectile vomiting. He did fine on the soy, he's 12 now, and hasn't hit puberty yet...but we know it's coming.

[u4ic]

17. Petrochemicals are endocrine disruptors

can we say (soft)plastics and pesticides?!!?

[AirmensMom]

36. And don't forget the fragrance chemicals.

:hi: u4ic! :hug:

[u4ic]

41. Hey AirmensMom!!!

:bounce: :loveya: :hug:

You're absolutely right!! Silly me...

How are you holding up? Have you got your house sold yet?

[AirmensMom]

42. I PMed you.

:hug: :loveya:

[u4ic]

43. Got it, hon!

:D

[Critters2]

19. I honestly don't know what to make of this

I was fed soy formula. I began menses at 12, which isn't particularly early, I don't think. But I also have both endometriosis and a fibroid, which I've read may be connected to the phytoestrogens in soy formula. But I don't know that that issue has been settled.

Of course, I've also heard these things blamed on the hormones they give milk cows.

So, damned if ya do, damned if ya don't.

[RagingInMiami]

24. Soy increases estrogen levels

So I would be careful giving soy-based products to boys.

[mzteris]

26. What are you basing this statement on?

Links to legitimate research, please . . .

[sendero]

25. I would not feed soy..

... to a male, at any age. A little tofu here and there, but soy is not a food that should be a staple of the diet. Anything that is a sex-hormone analog it not to be messed with.

[mzteris]

27. Real men should eat soy

Eat your soy, boys
Sally Squires, The Washington Post
Jun 15, 2004

". . . Real men should eat soy," said Kenneth Setchell, professor of pediatrics at the Cincinnati Children's Medical Center, who has studied soy for 30 years. "Generally, men are put off by soy. It tends to be sort of a woman's thing. That's a great pity, because the evidence that soy protects against prostate cancer is quite strong."

While there have been worries that men who consume large quantities of low-carb soy bread, soy cereal or other soy-filled foods may get a little too in touch with their feminine sides, research findings have generally not borne out those fears.

-snip -

Most concerns about soy have centered around the fact that it is a rich source of isoflavones, substances that mimic the effects of the female hormone estrogen. To determine what these plant-based chemicals might do, Steven Zeisel and his colleagues at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill fed megadoses of soy to men as part of a recent National Cancer Institute study.

Nipple discharge, breast enlargement and slight decreases in testosterone occurred with the megadoses. But "we still couldn't find anything that was serious, and we went up to doses that are probably 30 times what you could get from normal foods," Zeisel said.

And if you stick with foods rich in soy as opposed to supplements, researchers say, there's no evidence of harm, unless you happen to be among the one in every 1,000 people who are allergic to soy. . ."

-more-


http://www.postgazette.com/pg/04167/331753.stm

[pitohui]

31. who funded these men's studies? bet it was monsanto!

you can't put any more reliance in most studies of the health benefits of soy than you can in wine council funded studies of the benefits of wine

soy is a cheap animal feed that is being pushed onto the american public with unhappy results for those who develop the resulting allergies

[eyesroll]

Soy is a staple of many Asian diets, and has been for centuries.

Tofu and soy milk have been used for 2,000 years -- well before Monsanto or its equivalent.

[pitohui]

35. round-up ready soy, which is what baby's getting, around for 2000 yrs?

wow i did not know that

(do i really have to use the :sarcasm: smiley?)

there was no doubt a natural soy plant around many thousands of years ago, the soy that is destroying north and south american landscapes today ain't it


but you will pry the soy from the cold dead hands of the apologists so it's all a bit hopeless for the natural world

[eyesroll]

37. So what's left?

Let's assume a baby can't breastfeed. What do you feed him or her?

Dairy formula's hardly a panacea either -- you are aware of what they feed commercial dairy cows these days, right?

[eyesroll]

34. dupe

[mzteris]

38. National Cancer Institute isn't

Monsanto.

I'll put the soy research up against the anti-soy "research" any day.

[pitohui]

30. hadn't heard that but i hear it's the cause of peanut allergy

a severe peanut allergy means lifelong limitations and hassles for your child so i would sure as hell stay well away from the soy until the kiddo's immune system is fully formed, say around age 19 or so, ha ha!

the soy lobby (monsanto) is very powerful and unfortunately many people do not realize how harmful soy is until too late, my mom actually developed a soy allergy in her late 30s or so as a result of the fad diet that included soy lecithin

round-up ready soy is also killing our native wildflowers and butterflies but as i'm tired of being shouted down by the vegans who have never left a city cafe and don't give a damn abt our countryside i won't go into that argument again

but i certainly would not consider offering a formula that included soy

[LeftyMom]

40. 1. most of us vegans avoid GMO soy

2. no vegans that I know of (and I moderate a vegan message board so that's a fair unumber of people) advocate the feeding of soy formula. Why? Breastmilk is ideal nutrition for babies be they vegan or not and there is no vegan infant forumla sold in the US, because they all have vitamin D derived from lanolin

3. there are non-GMO organic soy formulas available now, just as there didn't used to be organic dairy formula but now there is

4. there are plenty of vegans who live in the sticks, so please lay off the stereotypes

[nini]

39. My son was a soy formula baby

He developed just fine - 6'4" and about 280lbs (football player build)


If he didn't have this alternative formula I don't know what we would have done as he was allergic to regular formulas and I had an infection after a c-section and could not nurse him.

This sounds like crazy BS.

[NMMNG]

44. Girls are indeed experiencing puberty earlier than before

But soy is not to blame. A mere 25% of infants are given soy-based formula so that can't be the reason for the widespread phenomenon. However the phenomenal use of hormones and other chemicals in the meat and dairy industry, and the vast amounts of such compounds children consume as a result of their heavily meat and dairy based diets can.

As populations of people have gradually changed their diets from plant-based to animal-based, (rich in meats, dairy products, and refined foods) the onset of sexual maturity has decreased at a rate of about 2 to 6 months per decade. For example, the age of onset of the first menses, a time known as menarche, has decreased steadily from age 17.2 years in Norway in 1830 to age 13.2 years in 1950 (WHO Monograph 62:500, 1976). Similar changes have been seen in other western European countries over the past 160 years. In Britain, over the past 150 years the average age of menarche has fallen from 16.5 years to 12.8 years (Lancet 342:1375, 1993).

snip

The gradual shift from a plant-based diet to a diet of animal-based, high-fat, highly-processed foods has resulted in every society in a decrease in the age of onset of maturity of the boys and girls. Many investigations have come to this "diet-menarche connection" by looking at different aspects of the eating. For example, protein-rich foods, especially beef and pork, and low-fiber diets, which, of course, mean diets high in meats, dairy products, and processed plant foods, have been found associated with earlier menarche (Am J Clin Nutr 54:805, 1991; Hum Biol 28:393, 1956; Int J Cancer 28:685, 1981). Vegetarians have also been observed to have a later onset of menarche, compared to nonvegetarians (Nutr Res 7:471, 1987). Vigorous exercise has also been shown to delay the onset of menarche (Br J Cancer 55:681, 1987; Am J Epidemiol 138:217, 1993). A common pathway for the effects of diet and lifestyle (mostly exercise) on menarche is female sex hormones, primarily estrogen. Earlier and greater rises in hormone activity bring on earlier puberty. Estrogen promotes the development of secondary sex characteristics: causing uterine growth, thickening of the vaginal tissues, and development of the breasts; and along with other hormones, the final signal that a little girl is now a woman capable of childbearing, she starts to bleed (menstruation).

snip

The intake of high-fat foods--especially fish, meat, eggs, fats and oils, and dairy products--is the primary source of environmental chemicals in the American population. These chemicals are attracted to, and concentrated in fat--the fat in our foods and the fat in our bodies. Many of these chemicals (mostly pesticides), such as atrazine, DDT (its metabolite DDE), dieldrin, endosulfan, and toxaphene have an estrogenic effect. When studied singly these chemicals may have only a weak estrogenic effect. However, when the chemicals were tested in combination estrogenic activity shot up 160- to 1600-fold (Science 272:1489, 1996 & 272:1418, 1996). Americans used a record amount of pesticides, insecticides, and herbicides in 1995 despite claims by the chemical industry and farmers that they are cutting pesticide use (BMJ 312:1498, 1996).

Another interesting source is from dairy products. In modern dairy farming most dairy cows are pregnant; however, unlike women, they continue to lactate. Pregnancy causes high levels of circulating estrogen in the animals body. As a result he milk produced by these pregnant cows contains high levels of estrogen (estrone) (Lancet 341:1392, 1993).

http://www.drmcdougall.com/newsletter/nov_dec97.html


In 1998, the UK Department of Health’s Working Group on Diet and Cancer of the Committee on Medical Aspects of Food and Nutrition Policy made public their cohort study showing that higher consumption of produce and protein-rich plant foods such as beans and nuts is associated with a later menarche, and the higher consumption of protein-rich animal foods—meat and dairy—is associated with an earlier menarche and increased occurrence of adult breast cancer.

http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/cancer-75-ny-times-questions-diet-as-cancer-prevention.html

Agriculture typically uses artificial estrogen compounds to fatten up cattle and chicken quickly. Estrogen also stimulates the retention of water giving a heavier weight and tender meat. Some proponents say that the artificial estrogen compounds disappear from the urine in a matter of days and the animals are then free of artificial hormones. Other opponents say the artificial estrogens are stored in the fat and then eaten by consumers. The European Union has banned U.S. and Canadian beef from entering the E.U. for 12 years citing estrogen in the meat and the probable increase of breast cancer. Are they right? Or merely being protectionist as the U.S. claims.

In 1970's and 1980's, an epidemic of early puberty girls as young as a year old in Puerto Rico began menstruating after eating meat and dairy products with high amounts of estrogens. Some young boys developed breasts.

15% Girls aged 8 sprouting pubic hair and breast buds?

Women are now beginning to menstruate in the United States at age 10. The age of menarche used to be 16. Authorities have insisted that this is normal for a population with good nutrition. Is it? Herman-Giddons in a landmark study done in 1997 published in Pediatrics showed that out of 17,000 girls, 15% aged 8 years old began to show signs of puberty in the United States. See the Time Magazine article! The Time Magazine article points a finger at chemicals in our environment that mimic estrogen.

http://www.fibroid101.com/cause.htm




I began developing breasts at age nine, and started my period at 10. I was never given soy formula or any soy foods until I became an adult and consumed them of my own volition. Therefore it was not soy that caused my early puberty.