Survivor: Race War Starts Tonight

[philosophie_en_rose]

It's surprisingly not as terrible as I expected. To the contrary, I'm so excited to see so many Asian faces on television that I'm actually kind of interested in the show now. (Finally some Filipinos!) Though I can see the flamebait aspect of the show.

[crim son]

1. Me too. That is, I liked it and see the potential for

trouble. I did find myself rooting for anybody other than the whites! so the format is already working to get me more involved. Survivor... I don't get tired of it and I don't know anybody else who even likes it!

[philosophie_en_rose]

7. It's not the white team. It's the chicken *****er.

The only issue between the tribes arose when that white guy stole the Asian team's chicken. The African American team lost the immunity contest, so had to both vote someone out their tribe and choose someone from the other teams to be isolated on "exile island." (I don't know what that means, because I haven't watched the show in a few seasons). They chose the chicken thief, because he stood out. It's interesting to hear the exiled guy's complaints. (The black guy voted me into exile, because I stole the Asian guy's chicken. How could that be? Reverse discrimination!).

[crim son]

10. I don't see reverse discrimination there.

The black guy had to pick someone from another race. Why not choose the one man everybody knew had done something mildly out-of-order? I would have picked chickenman too. Excuses, excuses. And I was referring to my own personal reaction to the various teams. I don't have a favorite race! But for the heck of it, I'm rooting for anybody who doesn't look like me. That's what I meant by the format having it's effect. A personal effect.

[deucemagnet]

12. Basically, he was the only one that did something to make...

...himself stand out from the crowd. Even if his pinching the chicken was inadvertent in the two-minute rush to forage from the ship, he was a marked man the second Probst pointed it out.

[philosophie_en_rose]

15. There was no reverse discrimination.

I forgot the sarcasm smiley. Basically, I was making fun of the chicken stealer's assumption that he was booted because of some sort of conspiracy between the African American and Asian teams. When it was really that he was the only person to stand out.

[xmas74]

18. I didn't really take it as a complaint.

I took it more as him joking.

A few did joke about the racial/ethnic divides on the first episode. I just took his comment on how far the theme had gone.

What I find more interesting is that the tribes themselves are dividing themselves and, in some cases, getting rid of those whom they feel don't "add up" to what they think. A few players need to hope for a tribal change quickly or they will be early evictees.

[LostinVA]

28. Which is exactly what always happens on Survivor!

Which proves people are the same....

TAR starts Sunday, remember!!!!!!!

[xmas74]

39. I remember!

And I learned something about our team project. Turns out we'd have to lie and say we're dating to be on TAR. To be in a friendship on the show you have to PROVE you've been friends for over four years.

Dr Will and Boogie let that little rule out on the feeds a few weeks ago when they were convincing others that they would take them on TAR w/ them. They knew about the rule and were laughing about it.

[LostinVA]

41. Well, I HAVE been corrupting straight women, remember...

[xmas74]

47. I know

but it still might be hard to lie about.

"Long distance relationship" How long distance? So long that we've never met but will pretend to be girlfriends for TAR!

Man, this really sucks.

[LynneSin]

17. I watched for 5 minutes and found myself not rooting for the white folks

and I'm white.

:shrug:

I was channel flipping during commericial break for Countdown and I checked it out - actually watched them do the immunity challenge. Overall the show bored me. I was hoping that the white team would come in last because let's face it - we've done enough world dominating fuck-ups for our lifetime.

[crim son]

21. My thought exactly, irrational though it may be when applied

to a reality show!

[mvd]

2. I lost interest after the first season

This season is a new low IMO. It's too much like segregation. Pitting people against each other. I would never root for or against a race. I'd just like diverse tribes where they work together.

[philosophie_en_rose]

5. To be honest, race is much less an issue now.

Race isn't the issue on the tribes, because everyone is the same race. Therefore, other dynamics are shown - such as the different nationalities on the Asian team or the dynamics between the men and the women on the African American team.

[mvd]

6. Yeah, but I still don't like the separation

It's a cheap ploy for ratings IMO. They MADE race an issue. Also, people don't view Survivor for cultural education.

[philosophie_en_rose]

8. Some people are watching survivor to see a cultural reflection.

Perhaps the idea in isolation is repulsive (it certainly repulsed me), but the execution is rather good. And I think the producers did a great job with casting.

As I said, race isn't the issue. I haven't watched a survivor for a while, but the integrated tribes were a million times more disturbingly racist than this season.

[mvd]

9. Well, we'll agree to disagree

I just find the idea wrong. It is segregation and is an issue for me.

[philosophie_en_rose]

13. I'll tell everyone at the Fil-Am.

As an Asian, I know how it feels to be part of a close community. It's not segregation, it's culture. It's family. It's just wrong to assume that any group of people of the same race is automatically segregated in the same sense of Jim Crow.

I certainly agree to disagree about the show, but seeing the show makes the difference. If someone described a Dave Chappelle skit to me, I might think it was really offensive. But only because I hadn't seen the show.

[mvd]

14. Well, I'll watch the show next time

But if I think it's segregation, that's just how I feel. It's personal. I will give it one chance, though.

I would like to see the same people they have now in tribes together.

[LostinVA]

29. Part of why I love it IS being of the social experiment/education aspect

People ALWAYS ACT THE SAME on this show, regardless of ANY "characteristic" they may or may not have. Certain people always, always act a certain way... and can't see themselves doing it. They can only play to the cameras for about the first 12-36 hours...

[deucemagnet]

3. I'll admit that I watched it, and rather enjoyed it..

This has been such a toxic subject in the lounge that I'm reluctant to even post my opinion, but I didn't think it was all that bad. The Asian tribe definitely got out of the gate as the most interesting. With only 5 people per tribe, I don't think the racial divisions are going to last long, though.

[mvd]

4. I hope they don't

I think there will be a quick merge this time. They will attempt to appease people like me while having their experiment.

[crim son]

11. Oh, you can voice it to me.

Racists might be stirred up by the show. The rest of us can just sit back and enjoy.

[Demit]

16. Notice how quickly things started to break down into old/young, male/fem,

etc? It made me smile to see how, no matter the cultural group, there's always going to be some kind of natural aligning (before the politicking starts in). The younger Asian guys making cracks about the older Asian guy; the Afro-American women deferring to the Afro-American men; the slim Latinos criticizing the overweight guy's looks. I hope that's the revelation that viewers come away with: how remarkably alike we all are in what we do, no matter what our race is.

This Survivor ploy didn't bother me when I first heard about it and what I saw last night confirms what I expected—it's showing how alike we all are after all.

[xmas74]

20. I just read that on another board.

They've all stated the same thing: since race no longer applies it will go back to the classic standby-old vs young, man vs woman. The minority gender for each race will be the first gone and out of that it will be the oldest of the minority gender. (Perfect example last night-the older black male is the first vote out.)

IMO, the two standout women will be from the black tribe-Rebecca and Sundra. They have bonded, they both have the Cirie mental game but both are a bit more athletic than she was. Best thing for those two women is to be divided into separate tribes and allow them to work the other tribes until the merge.

Males: I'm seeing it as Cao Boi will get the wise but flaky elder edit (think Scout, Bruce, etc for the proper edit), Jonathan will get the angry Everyman edit, and Nathan will get the angry young man edit.

From what I saw last night I have a big suspicion for at least one of the F4.

[Demit]

23. Trouble is, they've kind of alienated the older black woman.

Who might then join forces with the one remaining male if she's feeling po'd enough. See, this is why I like Survivor. The shifting alliances and how well people can keep all their balls in the air. It's so much fun to see somebody get what's coming to them when they're not good enough at it. But it is early days. And the one flaw that has developed over the years is how easily the most deserving people get voted out early when they're identified as a threat. I'll bet the producers are trying to devise ways to keep this from happening & will be juggling folks around a lot this season hoping to prevent it. I still remember people who got voted out because they were strong & how bummed I was that they wouldn't be on anymore.

[xmas74]

24. On Sucks Stephannie(the odd woman out)

is being revered as a goddess right now. They're loving her-which usually means someone has spilled the beans and she is going far.

As to strength-they just have to appear to be strong. The best players (the manipulators) are almost never caught until the very end. It's always the athletic players gone early.

[LostinVA]

30. I knew that would happen as soon as I read about "the twist"

Race means very, very little. It's ALWAYS a female/man or old/young thing.

[Katina]

19. past shows have already exposed

"closet" racism IMVHO. It always struck me that anyone who was strongly ethnic was always one of the first to be voted out by what always seemed to be a white majority. I think this was a good idea because it evened the number of people from different ethnic/racial groups and yet it still demonstrates that even within these groups, there will still be divisions along age/gender/background lines..it's the nature of people. I don't believe it's overt, I just think that it's part of human nature to want to "tribe up" with those whom you have the most things in common.

[xmas74]

25. Not necessarily.

Just look at last season. Bruce would have gone farther if he hadn't been medivac'd out (Courtney was going to be voted out that night.) And Cirie made F4. Why didn't they take her to the end? Because she would have won against anyone in the game.

[Katina]

31. Bruce wouldn't have gone much further

He irritated too many people. Cirie made F4 through gamesmanship AND because she was the "fat women" who was no threat. How many other black survivors made it as far as she did? NONE, she was the first. The problem was that she was liked better than others so she couldn't be brought to the final two.
All that being said, I still maintain that in the early going, there is some closet racism involved and people will vote out anyone who does not fit into their familiarity scheme. That's just part of human nature. It's not good or bad, it just is.

[haele]

34. Everyone forgets Vecepia, winner of Survivor Marqueses...

Pretty, once in the Air Force, capable enough to be an asset but not enough to be threatening, she flew under the radar and managed to keep people from realizing the size of the knife she was using on whatever alliance she belonged to at the moment.

Poor Vecepia. Part of her problem is that Marquesas became so boring at the end; I found that the final six were too much of a similar personality to care one way or the other about who won.

You are right about the familiarity/unfamiliarity. Early on, most contestants tended to use "prejudice" (familiar trait likes and dislikes) or even more rare, a perceived threat level - when deciding who to vote out, rather than actual consideration of the team dynamic and strategy.
It takes more than even two or three weeks to figure out who is actually an asset for how long and who needs to leave ASAP.

Haele

[xmas74]

36. I forgot Vee for a second too!

Damn. She was forgettable for the most part.

Sandra is a good example too. UTR yet wasn't afraid to mouth and she won the whole game.

[LostinVA]

43. V made me sick -- acting all religious, swearing upon Jesus

Then lying to someone... THEN saying it was okay, because all she had to do was ask forgiveness. Ugh. It doesn't work that way. That season so sucked, anyway.

I liked Sandra, and was very glad she won.

I agree with your premise: that's why older people and women often get voted out first... or "weirdos."

[LostinVA]

42. Cirie wasn't voted out of the Final Two -- she lost the fire building

thing.

[LostinVA]

32. Cirie would have WON if she had made the Final Two

She came THIS close! Only the fire making thing got her. I wanted her to win soooo badly!

She was kept over Alpha Males, very athletic males and females (though she was a strong bugger!), and people "craftier" than her. She and Danni are two of the best players I have ever seen.... Cirie almost won by chillin' and being herself, and Danni won by TELLING THE TRUTH. Scary....

[xmas74]

37. Cirie would have won that game

and Terry and Aras knew it. I think they both made comments about how they both could have easily have accepted her win over someone else's and that they didn't mind the idea of her winning against them.

I miss my freakin' CirieownageOwl this season. It sucks w/o it.

[rug]

22. Prussian Blue is doing the soundtrack.

[LostinVA]

33. Which shows you didn't watch it nor understand the show

[WHAT]

26. Anyway, it's not a race war...

it has to do with organization vs. an external threat...

My first eye-popping experience had to do with the subtle but profound decision of priority, cohesion over consensus (consensus as it relates to following leadership); consensus (teamwork) is primary (go, Stephanie).

I learned that a bad leader is worse than no leader at all. (well, duh, 6 years with bush, what were those fools thinking?)

Cohesion is most important in the beginning aaaaaaaaaaaa(go, Stephanie, go Pragmatism. Later, individuation/differentiation might have room to express itself. Cohesion first.

Then, the smart ones can do the puzzles, the strong ones can do the races, and the smart and strong ones should cover their asses.

I like the initial aspects of this game because it highlights the initial aspects of organization and I think it will ultimately pit myth against pragmatism.

First, there was the standing wave, loaded in the front with assumptions that gain social muscle and become expectations. Then, there is the bell-curve, that the standing-wave attempts to co-op and obtain...then there is a catharsis which is usually an unexpected result that the standing-wave seeks to claim or deny (depending on efficacy).

I just wonder why the focus of science is on the standing-wave, with so much "muscle" put into explanation. Does the muscle relay information, contract and expand the heart, or does the heart really command its devotees?

Well, science and society may initially prove at logger-heads on this episode...but, I hedge my bet with unexpected results, surprising outcomes.

I'm anticipating further episodes...

[LostinVA]

27. Mark Burnett is a frigging GENIUS

What happened is what I knew would happen: NOTHING. Same old Survivor: Alpha males throwing weight around and being sexist, little female cliques starting, gay guys trying to act straight, ceratin "unusual" tribe members annoying people ASAP, fratty and sorority White guys and girls getting all snuggly on Night One, etc. The ONLY unusual thing was the women actually sticking together in the vote.

Which proves what MB said he was trying to show: race means very, very little. People are people. Dynamics are dynamics.

And the rating were mondo.

Interesting stuff was: the Asian time getting shirty about Asian stereotypes, while the other teams threw theirs around.

[mark414]

35. i don't think anyone who thinks reality shows are a good idea

can qualify as a genius

[LostinVA]

44. Your opinion -- I disagree

He is a marketing genius: Eco Challenge, Survivor, Apprentice, Rockstar.

I also don't see anything inherently wrong with reality shows. I find alot of the comments against them -- on this board and in real life -- as quite elitist.

[xmas74]

38. Wasn't sure how it would go at first

but what happened is exactly how you said it.


The only difference so far this season is that there are no white men providing me w/ my eye candy. A girl's gotta look at JP and Yul for that this season.

(Fuck! Doesn't Yul look like Jin from freakin' Lost?)

[LostinVA]

45. Jin is better looking, but yes

And, there are several pieces of eye candy for ME... yum.

[xmas74]

46. I bet there are!

And Jin is better looking but we get the basic jist of the situation.

JP, OTOH, just needs to run naked every episode and I'll be a happy girl.

[Irreverend IX]

40. Race War?

Why couldn't they go all the way and make it a Racial Holy War?