Pitfalls of Vegetarianism

[absyntheNsugar]

Been seeing a lot of posts regarding Vegetarianism here and wanted to throw out a quick reference on the dangers you face if you go veg. Going veg can be very healthy, but you have to watch your diet. So many people make the same mistakes and end up much unhealthier as a result. Who am i? I was a Personal Trainer and Nutritionist for 3 years in and after college.

The biggest pitfall vegetarians go through is they stop eating meat, replace that food with carbs and GET OBESE!!!! A carb heavy diet WILL KILL YOU!!!!! All those grains will turn to sugar and will make you diabetic. SO DO NOT INCREASE THE CARBS!!!!!!! Make sure you eat equal amounts of plant based protein. Or better yet, get your protein from eggs and milk. You can buy whey protein at many health food stores, but it's cheaper to eat lowfat cheeses, cottage cheeese, milk, and egg whites.

Soy is an excellent source, as is whey, milk, eggs. If you are going vegan you REALLY have to watch this.

[RebelOne]

1. Also I recommend to take a supplement of vitamin B-12 for protein.

At least I do. And I eat plenty of soy products and drink lots of skim milk. My only downfall is pasta. I love it in all forms -- macaroni and cheese, spaghetti, pasta salads (but I add lots of veggies to my salads), etc. I eat very little bread products.

[absyntheNsugar]

2. Try Kamut Pasta

The stuff has twice the fiber and twice the protein of whole wheat pasta. It also goes really well with marsala sauce.

The protein will help you keep those levels up, and the fiber will make you feel full.

[RebelOne]

5. Where do you buy this pasta?

I haven't seen it on my grocery stores' shelves. I'm in Georgia.

[absyntheNsugar]

7. I usually get it at Whole Foods or GNC

But in Georgia....are there any natural food stores out there?

I'm sure you could find it on the internet tho. The brand that's most common is Cleopatra Kamut Pasta. They make a rotini, spaghetti, penne, macaroni and the kind that looks like little grains (sorry forget what its called)

[RebelOne]

8. Yes, we have Whole Foods, but I haven't been there.

And I have a GNC almost around the corner from me. Last time I checked them out, I was just looking for vitamins and found their prices much higher than I would pay on the Internet. I buy all my vitamins at Puritan's Pride, which is much less expensive than retail stores and their shipping is cheap. And they always have specials, such as buy 1 get 2 free. Thanks, I will definitely pay GNC a visit.

[tinrobot]

33. Trader Joe's Soy Pasta

Not every state has Trader Joe's, but they have a nice soy-based pasta that has lots of protein and fiber. It's a little more dense than regular pasta, but it still tastes pretty good.

I just had some for lunch. Yum...

[populistmom]

6. Just a note

B-12 isn't a protein, but something that is only found in animal products and a necessity in our diets, so definately supplementations is important, especially for vegans. Without it, a person would quickly become anemic.

[no_arbusto]

9. Quinoa is good too.

Quinoa (pronounced Keen Wah) is considered to be one of the most nutritious grains and it is high in protein.

Here is a link to nutritional info on quinoa:
http://www.fatfree.com/foodweb/nutrition/nquinoa.html

Ancient Harvest makes a great corn/quinoa pasta. You can find it in many grocery stores or on their website:
http://www.quinoa.net

[absyntheNsugar]

17. Quinoa...ahh yes

Goes real well with a little olive oil, some oregano and garlic.

[bleedingheart]

3. I have to agree, you must be very careful to replace the proteins

...I had a very good friend who decided to become a vegetarian and she ended up getting a severe vitamin deficiency because she did not adjust her diet properly...for example she would eat a can of green beans and a baked potato for dinner commonly....and think that was enough...
She started getting really odd bruises even though she had not hurt herself... in the end she went to the doctor and he had to explain how her diet was killing her. He put her in contact with a nutritionist who helped her regulate her vegetarian diet so that she would be healthy...

[jpgray]

4. If you're losing animal products entirely

You also have to watch that you get all your amino acids needed for building muscle--animal meat has them all, but you may have to eat a variety of veggies and/or soy products etc. to get them all.

[curse10]

13. that's easy to do

it's not that hard to get the vitamins you need. And, if needed, a simple dietary supplement will usually suffice.

[absyntheNsugar]

16. Dietary supplements aren't always best

They often get passed right through your system - they need to be water soluable ones. And if not, you need to eat them with fat for them to metabolize. Especially ones like E.

Vegetarianism in itself is not a healthy lifestyle, but neither is carnivorism.

I'm just saying if you convert, you have to go out of your way at first to get protein.

[TreasonousBastard]

35. That's one of the most important...

things vegetarians often ignore.

We require complete proteins that we get from meat. If we eliminate meat, much of the vegetable protein is incomplete.

This can be dealt with by getting an appropriate variety of vegetable protein. For instance, missing amino acids in wheat can be found in corn. (working from ancient memory here-- any one interested should look this stuff up anyway, though)

A purely vegetarian diet, even without dairy, can certainly be healthy and nutritious, but is inefficient in in getting some nutrients. One must be careful to find the vitamins, iron, calcium, and amino acids necessary. They're there, but you've got to make sure you have them in the necessary quantities.

Supplements sometimes help, but that kind of negates the point of going veggie to begin with.

[prolesunited]

10. Although I agree somewhat

Look at the diet of the average American. Like THAT is healthy! Whether you eat meat or not, I think we can ALL benefit by making conscious and informed choices when it comes to food.

You can eat meat and still have vitamin and nutritional deficiencies. This post makes it sound that you only face such pitfalls from being a vegetarian.

[cliss]

11. I agree, Proles.

I'm a curiosity at my office. In the lunchroom, I come bouncing in with my whole wheat bread, avocado, tomato and sprout sandwiches and milk for lunch. Meanwhile, they're sitting there eating their Big Mac Supersized lunches. They glance over at me every once in a while, to see what new oddity I bring in to eat.

These very beautiful young women are obese. They are at least 100 pounds overweight. They eat A LOT of meat; they admit it. I'm a vegetarian, and I'm thin.

So -- I'm just a little hesitant to say that an American diet is the world's best, and if you stray from it you're in danger...

Look at the majority of the world: many live on simple diets; a little rice, occasional fish, lots of green vegetables, no meat, and these people are healthy. They have only a fraction of our problems of obesity and many other diseases like heart disease, stroke, hardening of the artieries, etc.

[absyntheNsugar]

14. Wasn't saying the *American* diet is healthy

In fact it is anything but.

However, Meat contains a lot of essential amino acids and nutrients that aren't always present in the vegetable alternative. B vitamins, for example. Can't find them in soy, can't find them in all beans. You need black beans in your diet to get them, and without them you will get sick, or die.

Also, I've known a lot of vegetarians who when the converted, just doubled up on what they had with their meat rather than finding protein subsitutes. Eating a whole wheat sandwich with lettuce, avacado and tomatoes is fine - as long as you have cheese with it or to the side, or nail a slab of tofu inbetween the two pieces of bread. Bread and veggies alone won't cut it. You may be thin, but how long can you keep an activity going before you get winded or tired? If you don't get tired, you must be getting protein from somewhere then.

[curse10]

12. Whoa there, a veg diet is a healthy lifestyle

it's like any other diet out there. You have to eat what's right for you. Some people can handle their carbs. I gained more weight while eating meat, but carbs don't seem to mess with me.

This doom and gloom about vegetarianism is not necessary and will likely turn many people off to a lifestyle that is safe and healthy.


It's not as hard as you make it out to be. Common sense goes a long way with any diet.

[Deja Q]

15. The soy folk take big advantage of their customers

12oz of soy crumbles from Morningstar Farms costs $3.94. 16oz of ground turkey costs $0.97 - $1.79 depending on brand (I stick with the $1.25 brand).

A different brand, selling 1 ounce of low carb chips (containing a small amount of soy yet whose logo is a gigantic red letter "A" for Atkins) costs a whopping $1.99.

Low carb bread isn't that much better than regular bread (though costs a lot more, go figure), but I'm miffed because whole wheat healthy bread costs TWICE as much the processed, bleached, nutritionally bankrupt white bread. ($2.69 for Healthy Choice and $1.39 for Taystee.)

Milk from cows that were pumped full of hormones can cost $5 for 2 gallons. 1 gallon of hormone-free milk is $3.69. 1/2 gallon of soy milk costs $3.69. OUCH!

And don't forget, the soy used in 99% of the companies that use it is genetically modified. In 2001, there was a scare on GM soy. Dunno if they fixed the problem and, with GM in general, we have no clue about long term effects...

Let's face it, whatever it destined for the toilet bowl had been screwed around with before they screwed us out of $.

Also, vegetarians will drink milk and eat eggs and cheese. Vegans won't use any aspect of any critter for consumption. No milk, no cheese, no eggs. One vegan couple also got into the news (and into the jail) because they wouldn't feed mother's own breastmilk to the baby and the baby became malnourished! Very tragic for ALL involved but is a prime example of what happens when one restricts their diet of important nutrients.

[curse10]

18. that couple was just retarded

and obviously didn't understand the tenets of veganism. It's about not eating animal products. Human babies are meant to drink human milk. If and when I have a baby I'll be breastfeeding them.

A couple of uneducated people do not represent vegans as a whole.

[absyntheNsugar]

19. I agree....

Most vegans I've known have been the smartest about nutrition - and I even knew a vegan in the bodybuilding circuit.

But that's it - every sucessful vegan I've known has had to be up on his or her nutrition. It's not that the proteins, nutrients and amino acids aren't in many foods, its that the American food industry doesn't cater to vegan diets very often.

[Deja Q]

22. Amusing, isn't it?

Most in the American food industry prefer cheaper, genetically modified, altered, processed, bleached, stuff sold at low cost. Whether it's truly healthy or not depends on the product in question.

The ones who do cater to vegan or specialized (or fad) diets go out of their way to exploit them with massively inflated costs. It's silly that processed bleached bread costs half as much as bread that actually IS healthy; the former containing enough bad simple carbohydrates to make a whole herd of cattle obese. Whereas the latter has complex carbs, which are beneficial...

The best thing to do is look at all food indivudually, regardless of what you will or will not eat. Study the federally mandated nutrition labels posted on every package.

[Deja Q]

20. I did not say all Vegans were like that

And I agree with you, that particular couple was dumb. It was a tragedy for all involved.

Or maybe they thought that, because humans are animals, that human fluids were off limits too. :eyes: Dunno.

Just beware, many in the Vegan/healthfood industry are scammers playing off your beliefs. (and vegan actors can more readily live off the diet than most folks because of co$t.)

[curse10]

21. I've not found difficulties with the price

tofu is readily available at very reasonable prices where I am at. In fact, it's far cheaper than meat. I've done price comparisons. Once I completely cut out animal products from my life I noticed a substantial decrease in my monthly grocery bill.

I do pay more for organic when I choose to buy it-- but I'm willing to make that sacrifice. I think vegans as a whole also tend to cut out unneccesary stuff from their diet-- like junk food. So that helps with the cost too. I used to down bags of doritos like there was no tomorrow. No doritos for me anymore. :-) And soda is something I cut out in an effort to be healthier and as a cost saving measure.

And, a lot of problem with the fake meat stuff is the supply and demand component. Unfortunately, there isn't much demand for it. So it is made in smaller batches, thus it costs more to make. You can get a burger for 99 cents because people buy it in droves. Not the same with soy products. Hopefully we'll see a change in the next decade, but I'm not keeping my fingers crossed.

[absyntheNsugar]

23. Two Angels in White for the Vegan Community

Trader Joes has organic black and pinto beans by the can - 89 cents each.

Trader Joes ALSO has a bread called "Ezekiel 2-somethingarather" bread. They found an obscure verse in Ezekiel that says you should take lentils, spelt and wheat and make bread of it. So they did. They make an egg free version. Delicious, made with sprouted wheat and the above ingredients - 10 grams of protein per slice! 10 grams of fiber too! Yum! Excellent with Avacados and whatever else.

In fact, good for meat eaters too! (I have a slice of turkey with my avacado, home grown tomatoes and red onions)

[prolesunited]

24. I SOOO totally disagree with this statement.

"Just beware, many in the Vegan/healthfood industry are scammers playing off your beliefs."

I think the laws of supply and demand come into play here. If there was more demand, the supply would increase and the cost would come down. If more people demanded better food and quit buying garbage, big business would change it's practices.

Also, you say "playing off your beliefs." This isn't like the psychic hotline. There is no belief involved, just sound research that vegetarian, when complete and balanced, can be a VERY healthy lifestyle choice.

If anyone is falling for "beliefs," it's those who continue to eat contaminated hormone-filled and antibiotic-laced meat and think that they are not going to have to pay for it in terms of their health down the line.

<stepping off my soapbox now>

[amazona]

30. soy is incredibly destructive to the environment

If people are switching from meat to soy out of a misguided hope of saving the environment, there is no hope.

Go out to where cattle are grazed. Yes, there are issues, but you at least have a partial ecosystem. I have seen wild plants, wild butterflies, wild birds...I have seen hawks and eagles raising their babies in ranges shared with cattle.

Go out to where soy is raised, and you will see death -- "agricultural desert" as it's called. No birds, no wild plants (they are "weeds"), no butterflies. It was bad enough when soy was a cheap animal feed. Now people are being scammed into paying big bucks to kill our wildlife.

It's extremely upsetting to drive past soy fields for hours and see nothing but death.

I would say the number one pitfall of a vegetarian diet is that it leads too many people to eat soy. Some people do develop soy allergies and that cuts down on some of the demand...but many others just eat more and more and even try to convince the rest of us that tofu tastes good. Sigh.

Progressives need to ask themselves if they want to support Monsanto because every time you buy soy that is what you are doing.

[Cleita]

31. Gee, I plant soy to improve the soil.

Soy, alfalfa and clover are all known as green manure. When I moved in here, my yard was a clay desert. I turn everything back into the ground and my soil is becoming rich with the compost. Crop rotation and other eco-friendly farming practices are needed to avoid what you speak of. Also, heavy animals like cows and horses harm the soil more because of the compaction they cause.

[absyntheNsugar]

32. Did not know that...

So soy is a 'predator plant' like Eucalyptus trees and Lily Pads (both plants suck up all resources to survive, and render the soil useless for years.)

There are alternatives to Monsanto's Frankensoy btw...

My take: Balance is the healthiest choice of all. Some meat, some soy, some nuts, some fish...shite if we really wanted to be environmentally conscious we would start eating insects. Yeah you got that right, bugs.

When I lived in Thailand, we would often eat water beetles, silkworm larvae and ant eggs. Sound disgusting? Nothing of the sort. Water beetles taste like almonds, ant eggs are like nothing you've ever had (and they are delicious), and silkworm larvae are like cashews.

Bugs are a healthy alternative to meat, they taste great and don't carry the diseases that mammals do, AND they are protein rich and virtually fat free.

[Pobeka]

34. For those who think healthy food costs too much

WARNING PET PEEVE ALERT. SMALL RANT FOLLOWS, DON'T TAKE IT PERSONALLY!

This drives me crazy.

I had a checker once ask if I really wanted "all those tomatoes", the price was really high that day and it was costing an extra 50 cents a pound, maybe I paid an extra dollar that day for tomatoes.

But I had no candy, chocolate etc. And you know what that stuff costs. And I am certain she would have scanned a 1.50 candy bar without blinking an eye.

So, take a look at what's in your cart. How much are you willing to spend on coca-cola, which is nothing but corn syrup versus a marginal amount more for an organic version of something that's actually good for you.

Out here in the northwest, I've watched the demand for organic milk go up, the space on the milk aisle increase and the price drop. We can now get it on sale for 2.50 per 1/2 gal. Usually it's 2.80 per 1/2 gal. And when you are raising children, it's a no brainer for us where to spend an extra couple of bucks.

Indulge in the junk food every now and then, but change the proportion of junk to healthy food and the price to eat will be similar. That's what we've done and we're very happy for it.

[Cleita]

25. I have been a vegetarian for over ten years now.

I get my protein from soy and eggs. I stay away from dairy, except a little cheese now and then, like in pizza or tacos. It is because of my asthma and dairy produces unneeded mucous. A bigger problem is getting B vitamins especially B12, which you need to get from animal sources. I find the eggs are a satisfactory source. Since I live in a rural area, I am able to buy fresh eggs from chicken ranchers, who treat their birds humanely.

[absyntheNsugar]

26. Do Black Beans or Kidney Beans contain B12

I thought they had at least some....but it's been a while since I had a look through my Nutrition Textbooks.

[Cleita]

27. Soy beans are the only ones with complete protein. No vitamin B12 though.

It is my understanding that B12 can only be obtained from animal sources. There is also miso or tempeh that has been fermented with Klebsiella bacteria and there is no guarantee that your store bought tempeh or miso has been processed this way. The vegetarian cookbook "Laurel's Kitchen" has a very complete rundown of plant based nutrition.

[cliss]

28. On vitamin B12: I'm reading from my cookbook

"Vegan Planet" by Robin Robertson which I gave myself as a Xmas present (I'm not a vegan, I'm a vegetarian).

On page 5 she writes:

"Nutritional yeast is an inactive yeast that is used as a food supplement and seasoning. It is extremely high in protein, B complex vitamins, and folic acid and very low in fat and sodium. Perhaps its greatest merit is that it provides vegans with a reliable, nonanimal source of vitamin B12. Nutritional yeast will keep indefinitely....etc.

Does anyone have an opinion on this? I've eaten this for a long time as a supplement, but I didn't know it was a complete source of vitamin B.

[Cleita]

29. I don't think it provides enough.

Or so says Laurel, who is kinda my diet guru. Not getting enough is as bad as not getting any because you still suffer from the deficiency.

[jimbo fett]

36. Pitfalls? Don't avoid the obvious.... flatulence. ;-)

[CShine]

37. You're wrong. Sugar does not cause diabetes.

This is a common misconception. The loss of insulin production is caused by other factors, and obesity does increase the risk of those things causing diabetes. So if you get fat from eating a lot of sugar it can increase your risk of becoming a diabetic. However, simply eating a lot sugar does not cause diabetes. Excessively eating sugar AFTER the onset of diabetes is what leads to really bad stuff happening to you. Sugar has the ability to worsen the harmful effects of the diabetes after its onset, but it is not the cause of the disease.