"Hold your Wee for a Wii." DJ's fired

[kmla]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16660273/

Now if they will just prosecute the idiots...

[_testify_]

1. Station manager who approved it should be fired.

Along with the DJs, of course.

And there should be criminal proceedings, as well as civil.

[HEyHEY]

14. YEah, considering all contest ideas would go through

THe station manager and ad department.... it seems unfair to only fire the DJs

[kmla]

16. The article said that 10 people were fired....

...so hopefully that selection set include the station manager and the promotions people in charge.

[Left Is Write]

22. Yes - whoever green-lighted the contest should go too. From the top down.

The DJs didn't do this all by themselves.

[itsmesgd]

2. why didn't the idiot just take a piss?

If this radio contest killed her, she wasnt going to make it much longer in life anyway. Let's punish the funny for the acts of the stupid.

It was for a fucking nintendo game- stupo

[ChoralScholar]

3. I understood

that the problem wasn't that she didn't piss, it was that she had consumed too much water.

I'm not sure you could voluntarily hold urine in long enough to cause a problem.

[jpgray]

15. Tycho Brahe has taught us more than astronomical lessons

[Kutjara]

70. I'm glad someone else knows that story.

I thought I was the only one who carried that particular piece of trivia around in their head. :hi:

[_testify_]

4. So she didn't know two gallons of water in a short time could be fatal.

You're right, what a fucking moron. Especially for trying to win a prize she couldn't otherwise afford to buy for her kids.

Of course, drinking a lot of water in a short time is comedy gold!

I say the 'acts of the stupid' were performed by the radio station personnel.

[Goblinmonger]

35. So she isn't at fault because she didn't know

but somehow the radio DJs have biology degrees or something.

There was stupidity on both parts, but I don't see how this is criminal.

[Kerrytravelers]

60. Everyone involved with hosting the contest should have ran it past the legal department and a

medical doctor. Apparently, there were calls to the djs from health professionals while on the air, but they laughed it off. If I were in the place of the djs or one of the producers, I'd have taken the time to be sure everything was on the up-and-up before I participated.

[Goblinmonger]

76. My argument/reaction

is that so many people are blaming the DJs for the same reason they should be blaming the woman. It's obviously something that could cause death.

I think that their lack of checking was reckless. Having heard about their warnings (and, upon reading more about it, the fact that someone went into seizures during the contest--might have been the woman that died it was a little unclear--should also have been an indication of this not being right), I would also agree that there is a strong tort claim as well as criminal claim. There was a frat hazing case where the members making the pledge drink a lot of water were charged/convicted of manslaughter--and they had no clue it was dangerous nor were they warned.

[kmla]

5. Wow. The lack of empathy is stunning.

And reveling in, and celebrating the discomfort - and perhaps danger - of others is not funny. It's sadistic.

[Goblinmonger]

36. There is some argument to the fact

that if the DJs and the station manager are somehow supposed to hold the common knowledge that too much water can kill you, why isn't the person drinking the water held to the same standard. If it is so damn obvious that it is bad for you, that kind of cuts against the civil case that people here seem to want to file.

[Solon]

67. You did know that they were warned, by a nurse, about the dangers...

and even mentioned them on-air while the contest was taking place, right?

[Goblinmonger]

77. My main reaction to this

is about the "common knowledge" aspect. If that is the argument, then both the woman and the DJ should have had that common knowledge.

After reading more about it, it wasn't just the warnings that are scary. A person went into seizures during the contest and they didn't call it off.

[Kerrytravelers]

6. Well, count me in as stupid.

I didn't know this:
Drinking large quantities of water rapidly can throw off the body's balance of electrolytes, causing brain swelling and leading to seizures, coma or even death.

I knew that drinking too much water too fast can make you ill, even to the level of being under a doctor's care, but I didn't think it could do all that to your body, and as fast as it happened in her case.


This part just makes me sad.
Strange had showed fellow contestants photographs of her two sons and daughter, for whom she was hoping to win the Nintendo Wii. The game console sells for about $250.

Three little kids lost their mommy because she was trying to do something nice for them.


Calling her stupid just isn't nice.

[_testify_]

7. Only stupid people die accidentally.

Didn't you know that?

[Kerrytravelers]

9. Well, I did say to call me stupid.

:shrug:

[bleedingheart]

23. if she was one of those folks that is always well hydrated to begin with

the kind of person who drinks their 8 glasses of water a day...then she was already hydrated to begin with and she was more likely to intoxicate herself with water in this type of contest.

I have always known about this...happened in my family once a long time ago.

However just recently some british actor was admitted to a hospital for water intoxication because he kept drinking to stay hydrated and to help his voice...and nearly killed himself...

[Goblinmonger]

38. Blaming the DJs

for not knowing that seems not nice, too. Either it is common knowledge or it isn't. If it is, then the woman should have known. If it isn't, then nobody is to blame.

[Left Is Write]

44. Those who put on the contest bear the responsibility for vetting its terms.

You run the contest - you make sure it's legal and safe. If there are hazards inherent to participation in the contest, you warn the participants. The radio station doesn't get an excuse for "not knowing."

[hippywife]

49. Thanx, LIW!

I'll definitely back you on that explanation. :hi:

[Goblinmonger]

78. I can agree completely with your statement

Other statements were less compelling. Most of my reaction is to the "they should have know" argument and not from the legal standpoint you come from. Yes they should have run it through someone. Yes they should have listened to the person who called in and said it was dangerous. Yes they should have called it off when someone went into seizures during the contest.

They should probably be charged with manslaughter like the frat men that unknowingly killed a pledge with the same stunt.

But saying the DJs are stupid because they "just didn't know" is much different than the legal argument you make.

Hope I'm clear. Probably not since I haven't finished my cup of coffee this morning.

[Phillycat]

8. Wow.

:eyes:

[slj0101]

10. Too bad it wasn't a "Be a Dickhole for a Wii" contest.

You'd have won fair & square.

[itsmesgd]

12. have you ever been real thirsty and drank too much water?

The discomfort lets you know to stop doing that. It is not a pleasureable feeling and most people stop at that point. If someone encounters this first warning and continues to struggle on, they are making the decision to put their health in jeopardy.
This is along the same lines of runners stopping when the muscles in their legs burn and their lungs burn. That is your body's way of screaming "stop".
I am sorry that this woman was blinded with consumerism and felt that she had to take this extreme challenge in order to win a present for her kids, but I am really sorry that her lover for her children was conditional upon a gift. I'm sure that if given the choice most kids would rather have their parents instead of a gift that wil be forgotten.
I'm sorry that this woman felt the pressure that society puts on people to have more and more stuff in order to be a successful parent. I am sad for her children's loss. I wish that more people could be happy without "stuff".
So go ahead and call me a dickhole, that's fine.

[Susang]

24. Okay, you're a dickhole

Well, you said...

Here's a more informed doctor's opinion regarding the incident:
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2007/01/a_truly_pointless_way_to_die.php#more

[Little Wing]

41. Seconded

You're a dickhole

[crispini]

47. Thirded. You're a dickhole. nt

[UncleSepp]

53. Nevermind.

Flower's mom had it right. If you can't say something nice, don't say nuttin' at all.

[Kerrytravelers]

61. Then I'll just have to stay mum.

Get it... stay mum?






:rofl: God, I kill me sometimes. :rofl: I really need to get out of the house more.

[Guaranteed]

34. It wasn't a bladder issue. It's an electrolyte imbalance issue.

You ever heard of osmosis? Well, there are a lot of salts and sugars in your body, and there is a balance between them in their concentrations in your cells. Drinking gallons of water throws that off, and makes the cells expand.

Now, when your brain expands, it doesn't have very far to go. As it keeps expanding, your organs shut down. Pissing ain't gonna help that.

[LynneSin]

42. Definate Darwin award winner there

I would have worn a diaper just to fake not peeing

But I also know I would have quickly been a loser - my bladder is incredibly small

[Orsino]

11. Huh. I'd thought that this was a joke...

...when I read this comic yesterday: http://www.little-gamers.com/index.php?comicID=1519

[mark414]

13. prosecuted for what?

an accident?

sometimes bad things happen and there's no one to point the finger at - that's life and we all gotta live with it

it's sad what happened, sure, but it's not like they forced her to drink all that water

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

17. Agreed.

[bleedingheart]

21. because they ran a contest without properly investigating the hazards

it is well known within the medical community that you can die from water intoxication...hell my cousin nearly died from it almost 25 years ago during a very hot summer...he drank and drank water (like you are supposed too he thought)...and nearly died because of it.

Now if a lawyer at that radio station (and I am quite sure they have a lawyer on retainer)...had an assistant look over the contest before it was advertised and had that assistant do some research, the contest would never have occurred.

[Susang]

25. Because the contestants were not informed of the risks

Nobody forced the poor woman to drink all that water, but nobody told her that it could kill her, either. Most people don't know about dilutional hymponatremia. Did you know that a nurse called into the program and told the DJs that the contest could be dangerous? The organizers of the contest and the radio station were negligent for not researching the risks and informing their contestants.

On edit: Here's the link to that story http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/local/states/california/northern_california/16466704.htm

[mark414]

26. well if that's the case

that a nurse informed them there might be something there. my initial post mostly came from my aversion to the wave of people that start screaming lawsuit every time something bad happens...a tragedy regardless of how it turns out - poor kids

[Susang]

30. It's really sad

She was entered in that contest to win a $250 prize for her kids. You'd think that the radio station's legal department would have done at least a few minutes of research. Just google "risks of drinking too much water" and you'd get all the info you needed. http://www.google.com/search?q=risks+of+drinking+too+much+water&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&startIndex=&startPage=1

[Left Is Write]

32. Even without the nurse's call, the station would be liable.

They ran the contest. It was their responsibility to make sure their contest was both legal and safe, and to inform participants of any health risks involved.

[_testify_]

27. No shit about the nurse?

Getting awfully close to involuntary manslaughter...

[GoddessOfGuinness]

40. They should have ended the contest as soon as they received that warning.

Ignorance is forgiveable; refusing to listen is not.

[pinniped]

50. ....and the dumbass D.J.'s response was that it was ok because they signed....

waivers. The radio jerks knew and didn't give a $hit.

[Courtesy Flush]

18. I never touch the stuff, myself.

Water contains almost NO alcohol. Why would anyone drink it?

[Tyrone Slothrop]

28. Besides...

Fish fuck in it.

:evilgrin:

[bleedingheart]

19. I knew some poor soul would get killed in one of these dumb contests

a few years ago a Pittsburgh radio station was advertising a contest about eating an entire tube of toothpaste.

Well...turns out someone from poison control was listening and called the morons and told them that some brands of toothpaste come with an emetic that will make someone who eats an entire tube...throw up because it is actually a dangerous thing to eat an entire tube...don't remember the reasoning.

That contest ended before it started..

Many people don't realize that you can actually drink too much water...and this poor woman and those idiots at the radio station were some of those people. Now three children are going to grow up without their mother over a stupid toy...and that is just so sad.

[LynzM]

20. Usually the toothpaste issue is fluoride...

There's enough in a whole tube to poison you, same with a whole bottle of fluroidated (?) mouthwash. Some people (like me) are quite sensitive to it and can't use the higher level mouthwashes without stomach upset, even from the small bit ingested.

[Xithras]

29. Nothing to prosecute criminally, but the family will likely sue. The station KNEW!

There's a recording on the Sacramento Bee website from the contest, and one of the DJ's specifically mentioned water intoxication or water poisoning. There was also a caller who called in and WARNED them about the dangers of what they were doing, and the DJ's ignored and ridiculed her concern. The second DJ seemed genuinely ignorant of the hazards, but there was certainly enough warning for any decent lawyer to prove that there was knowledge of the danger. I predict that the family of this woman is about to become incredibly wealthy.

[Susang]

31. I'm pretty sure the station can be prosecute

For gross negligence, which can be tried criminally.

[Xithras]

37. Gross negligence would be tough to prove criminally.

Gross negligence means they acted in a way that ignored obvious dangers. The prosecutor would have to PROVE that drinking water is a danger that any common person would recognize, and this very thread proves that isn't the case. LOTS of people don't know that overconsumption of water can be dangerous. Because criminal charges have to be levied against individuals, the prosecutor would need to prove that each of them SHOULD have been aware of the danger, and with water, that would be tough to prove.

Civil law is another matter. You don't have to prove that the knowledge is common, but that it could have been obtained easily. A plaintiff simply has to prove that SOMEONE in the company was capable of looking up the danger, and that their failure to do so lead to a death.

[Susang]

45. You're missing a big part of the picture

Several listeners called in and informed the station of the danger and they were either ignored or mocked. The individuals who heard this and ignored it would have that common knowledge. They did not stop the contest.


These people are in prison because of this case: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/03/04/HAZING.TMP

On edit: A link that reports on the defendants' sentencing: http://www.nbc11.com/news/5200859/detail.html

[Guaranteed]

33. It's funny- I was listening to Bernie Ward, and he was against the firings

and a suit. Said that the lady voluntarily did it, so she was solely responsible.

It's odd how even liberals can get sucked into these rather bad libertarian ideas....seems like we need to reaffirm our tort liability principles with people. Too much South Park garbage in our heads.

[Xithras]

39. I'm torn on the issue.

If I tell you "Go jump off that bridge and I'll give you $1000", is it really my fault if you jump off the bridge and kill yourself? I don't think personal responsibility is a libertarian issue, and I don't think the abdication of personal responsibility is in any way a liberal value. I agree with Bernie in that we're all responsible for OUR OWN ACTIONS.

[Pithlet]

55. Are corporations not responsible for their actions?

Libertarians love to hype personal responsibility, but never mention the responsibility on the part of other entities, which is one of the glaring faults of big 'L' Libertarians. Did this radio station not have a responsibility to make sure the contests it holds are safe for the customers who are participating?

I'm not informed enough to have a concrete opinion, but from what I've read it certainly seems a reasonable conclusion that the radio station had some culpability, here.

[Guaranteed]

56. It was the radio station's idea. They planned the whole contest.

They supplied the water, the publicity for the event, the facilities, the "judges," and, yes, the Wii, which was the incentive used to get these people to drink as much water as they possibly could without going to the bathroom. Not only that, but the radio station was profiting off of the very show which was using these contestants to sell advertising time. Now, I believe that this is a comparative negligence issue, but to say flat-out that the radio station was not responsible- as if the station's actions were not a substantial cause of this woman's death- would be ignorant of the realities of this world.

How about a Russian Roulette contest? If a radio station had one of those, and someone "lost," do you think they shouldn't be responsible for that, either? Keep in mind that most people are, in fact, aware of the dangers of playing Russian Roulette.

[Solon]

65. Bad analogy, again...

Jumping off a bridge is something that will obviously result in either injury or death, drinking water, on the other hand, is NOT.

[judaspriestess]

43. the lady unfortunately had a bad reaction

"During the contest, participants were given two minutes to drink an 8-ounce bottle of water and then given another bottle to drink after a 10-minute break.

Strange may have drunk nearly two gallons, witnesses said. She appeared ill, one contestant said."

May have drank two gallons? Some people have a reaction taking aspirin or smoking marijuana or drinking alcohol. The radio station although completely stupid in having this contest did not know if someone was going to have a reaction to drinking water, regardless of the warnings from the nurse,
you just never know who is going to enter the contest and what the reaction is going to be.

Its an unfortunate thing.

[crispini]

79. It's not a bad reaction -- it could happen to ANYONE.

You sound as if she was allergic to water or something. The fact is that if ANYONE drinks so much water that it overloads their kidneys, they will DIE.

[mountainvue]

46. Good. Assholes. n/t

[flamingyouth]

48. Really - the worst contest idea ever.

A kid died from water intoxication a few years ago here. His friend dared him to drink something like three gallons of water, which he couldn't do, but he still died.

It's amazing to me how many people don't know that people can die from drinking too much water.

[pinniped]

51. These dumbass D.J.s probably got the water idea from one of those....

fraternity hazing incidents where someone got messed up.

Great ideas, Einstein.

[bigwillq]

52. They should've been fired

but I think lawsuits should be off limits. Just my opinion.

[Left Is Write]

63. I have to disagree. The station does have culpability.

At the very least, this woman's survivors ought to be able to bring a wrongful death suit.

If the station and its representatives don't feel a hit in the pocketbook, they won't learn their lesson (so to speak).

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

54. Two words:

Personal. Responsibility.

[zingaro]

62. Two more.

Hear hear!

[Solon]

66. Here are some words for you...

THEY KNEW ABOUT THE DANGER, AND DIDN'T TELL HER ABOUT IT! Who's responsible again?

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

68. I do believe she signed a waiver.

I'm in the martial arts. I *routinely* sign my life away. I know that accidents happen and people die. It's up to the participants to educate themselves and decide if the risks are worth it.

[Solon]

69. You know waivers don't mean shit when negligence is involved, right?

Besides, you are comparing apples and oranges, she wasn't participating in a dangerous activity, at least, she wasn't aware she was. The station had an obligation, being the organizers of this contest, to make sure the activity itself was safe.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

71. Chugging mass amounts of water is a fairly well-known dangerous activity.

I wouldn't sign away my life without knowing what I was getting into. Anyone that does is just fucking stupid.

[Solon]

72. I'm sorry that most of us don't live up to your standards of medical knowledge!

:puke:

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

73. It's okay. I accept your apology.

:D

:hi:

[youthere]

83. I thought I read that the contestants were present when the nurse called in the warning.

But I could be wrong.

[KitchenWitch]

57. I just heard on the LA local news that the Sheriff is looking into

pressing murder charges. Apparently a nurse had called into the show trying to get them to stop the contest.

[Pithlet]

80. I hope they bring criminal charges against them. Manslaughter, at least.

I don't think it's enough they lost their jobs over this.

[CactusJock]

58. see, if we encouraged more young people to go to raves...

they'd learn the wisdom and lore of pill-popping ravers, including the fact that too much water can mess you up.

Personally I think the radio station should get slapped down with a lawsuit, if only so that all those other dumbasses working in tv and radio realise that if they want to put regular people in challenging situations for entertainment purposes then they should at least examine all the risks first.

[Rabrrrrrr]

59. Prosecuting them is bullshit. It was her choice, she should live with it

(so to speak).

Of course, the article gives scant information about what really occurred, but anyone willing to kill themself for a fucking video game - well, maybe said person isn't so good to have in the gene pool, though clearly she has managed to reproduce herself already.

I can't see in any way why these DJs should have been fired, why they should be charged with anything, or why they should be prosecuted.

They did nothing illegal, and nothing unethical or immoral. The closest they have come to doing anything wrong is to forget that there are always people far stupider than we think, and we need to take that into consideration in what we are doing.

[Solon]

64. The DJs KNEW about the danger, SHE DIDN'T, they didn't tell her!

Jesus Christ on a Popsicle stick, I can't believe the callousness of some people, you people disgust me to no end!

[Rabrrrrrr]

75. Oh, yeah, that's right - we should trust in Big Brother to make sure we're okay

God forbid we take any personal responsibility for our own health.

If, for example, radio DJs tell us to do something, then we should just go ahead and do it because we should expect them to be taking care of our health.

:eyes:

Bull-goddamn-shit.

[Pithlet]

81. Depraved indifference.

Just because there are people willing to risk their lives over a video game doesn't mean you can legally tempt them to do so. You don't have the right to place people in mortal danger for entertainment purposes, whether they're willing participants or not. They knew the dangers involved, and did it anyway, and someone died. They tempted people to take part in a deadly dangerous act. They continued to do so even after they were warned about what could happen. They didn't care because they thought a waver would protect them. Their response to But someone could die was Who Cares? They signed wavers. Our butts are covered. But wavers don't protect people from criminal acts.

[AmyDeLune]

74. "As God as my witness...

I thought turkeys could fly."

(not directed at the OP, just rather stunned by the number of people blaming the victim...)

No matter what one may think of the woman's intelligence, or the reason she entered the contest, the station is still liable for her death. It was their responsibility as sponsors of the contest to research and disclose any dangers for an activity they were promoting. Despite what some posters seem to think, water intoxication is not that well known. I guess there are still people, like the woman who entered the contest, who are naive enough to believe that a radio station wouldn't run a contest that could result in the death of its participants.

*sighs and wanders off*

(edit for splenning)

[Pithlet]

82. Exactly. If they were hell bent on doing it anyway

they had a legal, ethical and moral obligation to let the participants know that this is a potentially deadly activity, and to take all precautions to make it as as safe as possible. Did they a doctor present, or at the very least an ambulance with medical professionals waiting, the way a responsible company who's sponsoring a dangerous activity does? Was there anyone medically competent there checking on the contestants to make sure there were no signs of over-hydration? If not, then they absolutely were criminally responsible.