Help me understand Atkins

[TrogL]

Ank just went on atkins. He claims that as long as he's eating protein he can eat as much as he wants. He just baked a meat loaf and ate half of it in one sitting.

This doesn't make sense to me.

Update, now he's screaming about chest pains.

[Kazak]

1. I would advise against any diet...

that calls for one to avoid vegitables. It's not good to purge one's body of carbohydrates. Whatever happened to sensable diet and exercise?

[lazarus]

6. It IS a sensible diet

What happened to reading and knowledge?

Atkins calls for eliminating most carbohydrates from the diet at the beginning to break the body's addiction, then adding them back slowly and selectively until one finds a good healthy balance.

BTW, a good chunk of the Atkins diet is vegetables, even at the beginning. Tomatoes, carrots, salad greens, I ate tons of those.

Man, I wish people would bother to find out what Atkins really is before they condemned it.

[TrogL]

9. Ank has the book

Haven't read it yet but I've been researching it on the web.

I just don't get it. Whatever happened to "eat less"?

[lazarus]

13. depends on what you eat, Trog

Doesn't matter how much you eat. If all you're eating is Twinkies, you're going to die, right?

[Sandpiper]

17. The funniest thing about Dr. Atkins

In a sad and ironic way is that the poor old fella died at 72, two years shy of average life expectancy. Slipped on some ice on the sidewalk in front of his practice, smacked his head and died. I guess the 'ol low carb diet isn't a rock solid guarantee of living to an advanced age.

[lazarus]

28. Yeah

Had he not been eating a good healthy diet, he might not have been outside walking...

[supernova]

52. This is dispicable.

And tasteless. :thumbsdown:

Dr Atkins had a freak accident outside his office. It had nothing to with his eating plan or anything he advocates.

Tell me Sandpiper, do you plan to be active and working into your 70s?

[Sandpiper]

122. I was merely making a point

If you don't like it, do the letters TS mean anything to you?

[LynneSin]

48. Thank you Laz!!!

I swear people think those of us on Atkins slaughter an animal every day and eat the meat raw

:crazy:

I eat plenty of fruits and veggies.....and yes, I'm on Aktins

I wish folks would learn about the diet before making assumptions

Geez!!!

[MissMillie]

63. NOT carrots

carrots have a very high glycemic load

stick to broccoli, green beans, asparagas, turnip, yellow & green squash.

No carrots, no beets, and only one tomato per meal.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

71. We ate tomatoes and still eat them frequently

just not in large amounts.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

54. Atkins DOES Include Vegetables

that is a common misconception about the diet...

[AlienGirl]

2. Atkins is supposed to send the body into ketosis

The idea is that as long as you're in ketosis, youre burning fat.

It seems to work for short-term weight loss, but to me it looks like a k for short-term weight loss, but it looks to me like it'd be a very bad idea long-term.

Tucker

edited because of rat on keyboard

[WilliamPitt]

3. I am a machine because of Atkins

I eat flesh 6 times a day, run 3 miles a day, and then lift weights twice a day, bedcause of Atkins. Be smart, pay attention to the regimen, IT WORKS.

[VelmaD]

42. And yet you still find the time...

to run truthout and raise hell. You DA MAN. ;-) *snort*

[camero]

4. You can eat as much protein as you want.

But you also have to drink plenty of water so your kidneys can process it. That's what my doc told me.

[mac56]

38. Absolutely.

Atkins carries with it an increased risk of kidney stones.

Having gone through that twice (w/o the Atkins diet), I know I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

[camero]

87. I had one of those

Cursed like a sailor too. But it wasn't from Atkins but from too much calcium. Probably from drinking too much coffee.

As long as you drink plenty of water the risk of kidney stones is minimal.

[lazarus]

93. really?

Studies are wildly inconclusive on that.

[mac56]

100. Well, okay -

I suspect there are studies that are also wildly inconclusive about whether water is wet.

But try this:

http://www.atkinsdietalert.org/consumer.html

"High-protein, very-low-carbohydrate weight-loss diets are designed to induce ketosis, an abnormal state that also occurs in uncontrolled diabetes mellitus and starvation. Over the long run, ketosis can contribute to a variety of physical problems, including calcium losses, increased risk of osteoporosis, and an increased propensity to form kidney stones."

Footnote refers to: Wiederkehr M, Krapf R. Metabolic and endocrine effects of metabolic acidosis in humans. Swiss Med Wkly 2001;131:127-32.

[pasadenaboy]

5. his appetite will go down

don't worry.

[Maddy McCall]

7. Can have veggies...but not sugar veggies.

I ate lots of squash and zuchinni when I was on atkins.

Lost 30 lbs quickly.

[populistmom]

8. I've been on it for a year

I'm almost to my goal (well another 15-20 pounds). It broke me of being a sugar junkie.

Heres what I ate today:

Breakfast:
low carb bar
coffee

Lunch:
big salad
3/4 cup 4% fat cottage cheese

Snack:
handful of macadamia nuts

dinner:
chicken breast cooked in olive oil with broccoli, mushrooms, and onions
sugar-free chocolate

also:
about 90 oz.water
multivitamin
calcium supplements (don't drink milk anyway)

[TrogL]

12. What's this about chicken breasts stuffed with carbs?

Ank says I'm buying the wrong kind of chicken breasts. I get them in big 30 kg. cases because they're cheaper that way. He says I need to buy a different kind that don't have carbs.

What gives?

[lazarus]

14. Ank is doing drugs

How can chicken breasts have carbs? Are they stuffed with something? Jammed full of sugar?

[TrogL]

20. Here's what the chicken box says

Boneless skinless chicken breast fillet removed
seasoned IQF 4 kg. (OK, I thought they were 35, shoot me)

Golden Classic
minimum 16% meat protein
seasoned boneless skinless
chicken breasts, filet removed

Ingredients: Boneless, Skinless Chicken breasts, water, salt, flavour, corn syrup solids, sodium phosphates

Nutrition information: (per 100 g)

Energy 87 calories
Protien 16 grams
Fat 1.8 grams
Carbohydrates 1.4 grams

Prepared by TNT foods, Newmarket Ontario

[lazarus]

29. yeah, it's the breading

Just get real regular chicken breasts, whole. Those corn syrup solids (that's just sugar, basically) are there to try to add flavour. That's what cooking's for.

[TrogL]

86. Ank says they inject it

He says they inject carbs, sugar and salt directly into the chicken to plump it up. Washing won't get rid of it.

I'll look again, but I found regular chicken breasts more expensive.

[lazarus]

94. Well, yeah

They're more expensive. Because you're paying for meat, instead of corn syrup. Your choice.

Me, I'd rather by chicken, and buy my corn syrup in a bottle labelled corn syrup.

[Dogmudgeon]

33. Chicken Breast Carbs

If it's got 1.4 g of carbohydrate per 100 g of food, it's low-carb.

The corn syrup solids account for the carbs. If you wash the chicken real well, that 1.4 probably goes down to .2 or .3 or so.

That chicken is low-carb kosher. (But a Rabbi might disagree about the original kind of kosher!)

--bkl

[populistmom]

16. If they're breaded it's a problem

Other than that, I don't know. I eat much more chicken than red meat and rarely do I eat sausage or bacon.

[camero]

19. Check the ingredients

Even chicken if it's breaded has some refined sugars added to it.

[Sandpiper]

10. Atkins and other low carb diets

Have about an equal number of supporters and detractors. To get both sides of it, I'd recommend visiting:

www.atkins.com for the pro side, straight from the horses mouth

and

www.atkinsdietalert.org for the con side, by the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine

Or better yet, the American Heart Association report on high protein diets: http://216.185.112.5/presenter.jhtml?identifier=11234

I'm currently on Atkins as a means of losing my post holiday spare tire. It's working for me, but that doesn't mean I think it works for everybody.


>>Edited to get the URL's correct<<

[mike_c]

11. by the third week he'll be eating MUCH less if he sticks with it....

Seriously. I'm on Atkins and I typically eat 3 scrambled eggs and a couple of sausage patties for lunch (coffee for breakfast-- my one big cheat but I'm usually not hungry until afternoon) and often nothing more than a ceasar salad (without the croutons) or some broth-braised vegies for dinner-- and I'm NOT hungry at all. When you first start Atkins you still have much stronger food cravings than after a couple of weeks. Of course, it's a good idea to be alert for diminishing cravings and scale back rather than continuing to jam out of sheer habit.

And don't neglect the water! Gotta flush those kidneys!

[Lostmessage]

15. Is meatloaf on Atkins?

I thought that you couldn't have bread.

[populistmom]

18. You can use low carb bread

It's made from soy flour.

[K8-EEE]

21. LOW CARB BREAD, ARRRRGH!!!

It's soooo bad. I would rather just eat a little bit of the really good kind!

[Lostmessage]

24. They have the nerve to call it bread

:puke:

[populistmom]

41. There's actually some new stuff out

Country Kitchen makes it I think and it's 4 grams per slice, but it's mainly just high fiber wheat. It's very good.
Arnold also has a good one that's 6 grams per slice.

[Mr. McD]

82. So does Roman Meal

Whole wheat and 12 grain. 6 gm per slice, not to bad.

[dawn]

74. Me too!

I tried some of that and didn't like it.

They also have low-carb pasta now. Next, we'll see low-carb rice. Eeek!

[Kathy in Cambridge]

80. Most Low-Carb Pasta SUCKS, but we've found one good brand

Bella Vita, available at Trader Joe's. Mr RR is Italian and he will eat this. Other brands we tried were revolting.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

55. There are some low-carb Bread Crumbs Also

Keto Crumbs, made from soy. I would suggest doctoring them with Parmesan cheese and Herbs because they're pretty bland...

[AlecBGreen]

22. my take on it

emulate what our ancestors ate - mostly fruits, veggies, nuts, with a little carbs and meat thrown on the side. I think atikins is just "trick" to play on our body - it may help you lose weight but our bodies were not designed for a super-high protein diet. HUnter/gatherers would find and eat meat when they coould but subsisted on all the other goodies nature has to offer. In summary, vary your diet, balance it, and dont pig out on ANY substance

[Cronus Protagonist]

23. Sensible advice here

Good job :)

"Lick Bush" Buttons, Stickers & "Lick Bush" Buttons, Stickers & Magnets[/center>

[Andy_Stephenson]

25. I lost 75 lbs on Dean Ornish's

Eat more weigh less. But it is real low on protien and I was missing meat.

BTW Have ya'll tried the new wraps at Subway...they are Atkins approved.

[VolcanoJen]

27. I'm with you, AlecBGreen.

Eat naturally, lose weight, maintain your loss. It's really quite simple.

Great analogy, Alec!

[lazarus]

30. actually

our ancestors ate mostly meat, with some veggies thrown in when they could get it. Recent studies of what made up the bone structure of cave men showed we started out much more carnivorous than previously thought.

On edit: It's just damned hard to survive on the gathering side of hunting/gathering.

[VolcanoJen]

26. Well, I think the Atkins Diet is evil incarnate.

But maybe that's because I manage an Italian restaurant, and a coupla nightclubs, and I'm getting way tired of folks asking for vegetables (NO CARROTS!) instead of pasta, and more low-carb beer choices.

:eyes:

I've been relatively fit and thin for years, and I attribute it all to a sensible, low-fat diet (no more than 30g per day), and a few nice sessions of power yoga a week. That's all... and it's easy as pie. Natural, nothing but fresh foods, and I'm never hungry (once I got used to it, that's all).

I'm not damning the Atkins diet to hell, but restricting carbs to such an extent just seems unnatural to me. It's amazing how full you can get on a little rice, a nice starchy vegetable, or some pasta with spicy marinara...

[sendero]

43. Your strategy...

.... works great for people who need to lose 10 lbs, but not hardly at all for those who need to lose 40.

I think Atkins is probably the most effective diet for losing a lot of weight. But you *will* have to give up things like pasta and other refined carbs pretty much forever, unless you have the discipline to eat just a little now and then.

I find it interesting - a decade ago fat was the big problem. Low fat, low fat, low fat - and it made some kind of sense. But really, think about it. What foods are relatively new in the human diet? Refined carbs. The human body is not made to handle them, and I firmly believe it is not a fatty diet that is making Americans obese, it is refined carbs - which screw with your metabolism in a major way.

Few things are as effective as packing on pounds as, would you believe it, insulin. Bodybuilders use it to gain weight. When you eat a big plate of pasta, or a bunch of sweets, you get a huge insulin spike. Really good for packing on weight :) Plus, it sends your overall metabolism into a shock. When it wears off, your blood sugar can go low again, and you are hungry. It is a vicious cycle.

Drop the refined carbs people. Even if you are not dieting, they should be eaten in moderation. Fat is not the problem, they are.

IMHO of course :)

[VelmaD]

46. Actually that strategy worked for me...

and I have lost nearly 120 pounds.

I eat sensibly and eat smaller portions and exercise. A lot. Like 5 times a week.

My diet is actually percentage-wise fairly high in carbs, but it's very low calorie so it isn't really "high" in anything. I'm losing weight the old-fashioned way - by burning morme calories every day than I consume. It's a slow process - lost that 120 pounds over a little less than 2 years. But the lifestyle changes are what's important because I'll keep it off.

[sendero]

47. Congratulations....

... I can imagine how much discipline that takes and kudos to you.

Exercise is always a great idea, but it is not as necessary with Atkins. In any event, almost any diet will work with the proper discipline and attitude. But some are overall less tough than others.

As I said in another post, I've never had to "lose weight" per se, I have used Atkins to drop my bodyfat percentage. It is unbelievably effective. Overall, I think more people can adjust to a diet like Atkins, which allows you to eat a lot, but stick to specific foods, than a "reduced calorie" diet where you have to watch every bite.

But everyone is different for sure :)

Also, to Volcano - lots of businesses are taking advantage on Atkins by providing what their customers want. I do not think it is going away, because it works. Might be a good idea to add a few "Atkins" dishes to the menu :)))) Fact is, nobody who is serious about another type of diet is going to eat at an Italian restaurant :)

[VelmaD]

49. The reasons I worry about...

my friends and family members who are on Atkins is because they don't "have" to exercise to lose weight...so they don't. I have to wonder how healthy that is in the long run. It's possible to be skinny and still be out of shape and in poor health.

[CivilRightsNow]

53. Exactly...

It's a great lazy American diet.

Eat a whole tub of mayo, and a 14 oz NY strip, but dont eat starchy veggies like corn, potatoes.. on some rice, that is bad for you.

Oh, and dont worry about excercising.

I have a friend who has been battling reocurring kidney stones because of this diet, and yes, she drinks and has always drank enough water to drown an elephant. This isnt a friend of a friend of a friend, this is a direct experience. I mean really, who doesnt have a direct experience with someone on this diet, so many people are looking for an easy way to fit into the clothes in Cosmo. Yes, Im sure this is an isolated case and she had some type of predisposition, but in anycase this diet still aggravated her system enough to cause the onset of these problems.

I'm happy to say that I've lost 40 lbs just by eating sensible portions, not stuffing my face with every last scrap of food available and following a vegetarian diet. I eat tofu, TVP, etc for protein, use flax seed to supplement omega 3s. After I dropped the first 20 lbs, I started a low impact excercise plan incorporating yoga and tennis and Im waiting on my windsor pilates tape to see if I can get even more results. I dont deprive myself of carbs, I just try to eat them during the right times of day, when Im needing energy and am able to use all the energy my body is creating. I dont eat carbs at 9pm and then go to bed. So now Im down to 158 from 198, on a 5'5" frame. I was definately classified as obese and had alot of weight to lose.

I will say this in response to the hormones and general crap in meat that some think is nonexistant. I suffered from endometriosis for 12 years, some studies have linked endo to meat consumption.. specifically because alot of our meat today contains dioxin due to run off pollutants. I've had 3 surgeries and a great deal of medication trying to combat the pain. After a year of eating no red meat, I find that I am virtually pain free, my periods are much less symptomatic and they are actually regular!.. it has truly been a blessing. I wasnt one of those folks that got all PETA crazy and decided to make a stand. I just happened to live with a very nonpreachy vegetarian and it was easier to not eat meat. But then, as I began to feel better, I started researching why. What I found was enough to make me never even crave red meat again and I cut my 2 times a month chicken intake completely as of the first of the year. I cut fish awhile ago, the levels of mercury in most farm raised fish are like cracking open a thermometer and taking a swig.

Diethylstilbestrol is a carcinogen that they put in american meats for 40 years until they could no longer deny the links between it and cancer and were forced to bann it in the late 70s. They just replaced it with Oestradiol. Oestradiol is a carcinogen, it has been banned in the EU, but america continues to use it, why? Because it grows bigger cows which means more profit. Then we have bovine somatotropin and recombinant bovine growth hormone which have been linked to prostate and breast cancer. There are also questions about wether these hormones have added to standard american rage, the level of violence, the earlier onset of puberty, etc in americans.

http://www.preventcancer.com/consumers/general/hormones_meat.htm

I wont even start on the antibiotics! There are currently many new studies to see just how the use of antibotics in such ridiculous ways have made us susceptible to the new breeds of viruses and epidemics that we are seeing.

Back to Atkins,

The thing is, this diet doesnt seem to be about honestly getting more healthy. It seems to be about losing weight. That's great and all and maybe you will look fantastic while sitting on your ass on the couch. But I reevaluted my life and my diet so that I could start using my body, not just using it as a prop.

[sendero]

56. For people who need to...

... lose 100 lbs or more, losing weight *is* healthy. Better to use a diet that works well enough that people will stick with it (because results are immediate and ongoing), than conventional diets that have (look around you) for the most part been miserable failures... because 9 of 10 people do not have the discipline to wait a year for meaningful results.

Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good :)

[CivilRightsNow]

106. I understand that point..

But my point is that as a culture we are always in for the quick fix, not nessecarily the most healthy one. When you have 100 lbs to lose you really need to be looking at your lifestyle, not just what food you are putting in your mouth. Losing 100 lbs is definately healthier then gaining 100 lbs, but if you dont fix what's going on in your head it doesnt really matter, you replace one obsession with another obsessive compulsive "diet" plan.

For instance, here are some links to look at a culture that has historically eaten Carbs like they were going out of style:

Defying Atkins: Italy's Pasta Consumption High, Obesity Low
http://caima.net/_Press/000000d6.htm

Italians Say Ciao To Their Old Diet
And obesity among children is rising
http://www.newsday.com/news/printedition/health/ny-dsdrug3596283dec23,0,4314047.story?coll=ny-discovery-print

Italy's fasting solution http://www.guardian.co.uk/elsewhere/journalist/story/0,7792,1035599,00.html

"Meanwhile, Italians and other Europeans have become ever more sedentary, their diets more fat-laden and their lifestyles increasingly resembling those of Americans. "The Americanization of diet and the Americanization of lifestyle, that is how this disease is exported," obesity task force spokesman Rigby says.

In Crete, for example, consumption of unhealthy saturated fats — the main dietary cause of unhealthy cholesterol levels, and mostly derived from animal products — has doubled in 40 years. They now make up 16% of the diet of young people, according to Anthony Kafatos, professor of Preventive Medicine and Nutrition at the University of Crete. Middle-aged men there now walk less than 1.5 miles a day; in the 1960s, they walked an average 8 miles a day."

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2003-11-17-europeans-obese_x.htm

[dawn]

79. Yeah, I have heard people say that too.

It's not healthy! You need to exercise.

And yes, you can definitely be skinny and very out of shape. You just can't see it as much.

[dawn]

77. I could never live without rice.

I could drop the bread, and maybe the pasta, but not the rice.

I do agree that Atkins does help you lose weight if you need to lose 40 lbs or more. For me, I just want to lose that last five. I am trying to do it by cutting calories and just working out alot. I lost 10 pounds last year that way.

I don't think it would be easy to lose more than that without a strict diet, Atkins being one option.

[Dogmudgeon]

31. Wistful Low-Carb Eater

I say "wistful" because I am now broke and do not have enough money to spend on a low-carb diet. Poverty has forced me into de facto vegetarianism, and my health is suffering for it. I lost about 60 pounds eating low-carb, and have gained about 30 back. Still, that's a net loss, and my blood pressure is still lower than it was. When I avoid carbohydrate-based food, I have much more energy, much less pain from my several ear operations, and seldom get ear infections, which are now almost constant.

Anyway, I am now being considered by not one, but two potential employers, so things are looking better.

There are so many myths out there about low-carb diets that it's amazing. Here's a short list:

There is no low-carb Italian food. False! There's plenty of Italian food that isn't based on pasta. When I am eating low-carb, I eat several Italian specialties.

Ketosis is bad for you. Nope. In fact, ketones are used preferentially as energy sources by the heart and the brain. Ketones can make your breath bad. My breath doesn't get bad, but if yours does, get some sugar-free breath mints.

It's all water loss. Disproved by several major studies.

It's a heart attack waiting to happen. Serum lipids become much improved on low-carb. Triglycerides bottom out, LDL decreases, and HDL ("good" cholesterol) increases. Newer studies show similar beneficial decreases in C-reactive proteins and increases in homocystine.

It's all a conspiracy by the powerful, right-wing cattle ranchers. This is nonsense. Do you really think that the crop-based agribusiness congolomerates like ADM and Cargill are radical, even liberal?

You'll get Mad Cow and die. Bwahaha! If you think it's a cause for glee, maybe you should visit a university hospital and attend a seminar on Creutzfeld-Jacob Disease. I was an EEG tech once, and tested three or four such patients, and if you're wishing this on anybody, than you're just as bad as Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell wishing death on non-Christians. CJD patients die horribly, and the dementia is worse than anything I ever saw among patients with other dementing illnesses, including AIDS.

You'll gain your weight all back real fast. Low-carb eating is usually a life-long change, but even if it isn't, it takes a while to gain all the weight back. I've been eating a high-carb/vedge diet since August, and have only regained about half of what I lost, and a lot of it has been from water retention brought on by increased blood sugar. Even then, 20 of the 30 was gained in the last two months, as my blood sugar finally destabilized and went back up.

I'm a vegetarian and I'm as healthy as can be. When I eat meat, the Death Hormones make me sick. Everybody is different, and many people thrive on vegetarian diets. I've tried them and they sicken me every bit as much as meat sickens some vegetarians. One size does not fit all, whether the evangelist is low-carb or vedge. As for the Death Hormones, they probably don't exist, but if eating meat makes you feel bad, by all means don't eat meat.

Look what happened to Dr. Atkins. Bwahaha! Atkins died from a fall on ice, partly as the result of being very active in his 70s. More macabre gloating, similar to the "God-is-punishing-us-for-for-our-sins" line we heard after 9/11/01. Don't buy into it! And, incidentally, Dr. John Pennington, one of the pioneers of low-carb research, is still alive and active in his 90s.

A Friend of a Friend had an aunt who went on Atkins, and she died. That's a shame, but statistically, low-carb diets improve health pretty quickly. I'm also not sure that a low-carb diet has ever really contributed to a death, in spite of hundreds of cases being suspected, investigated, and finally resolved to exonorate the diet.

You can eat All You Want and lose weight. Well, not quite. You can eat until you're satisfied in most cases. Eating five pounds of anything, with or without carbohydrate, is not going to be very healthy for you.

Vegetables are forbidden on Atkins/Low-carb. Nope. In fact, many vegetables have close to zero digestible carbohydrate. Fiber is a carbohydrate, but it's indigestible, so it's not counted in a food's "effective carb count."

You mean I'll never be able to eat ice cream, pasta, brown rice, or mashed potatoes again? Wah! Of course not. You'll just have to eat them in smaller amounts, and less often. Or you can pig out from time to time -- just not often, either. There are also low-carb versions of many foods, and they will only improve in quality and decline in price.

You have to drink too much water! Nope. There's now some question as to whether you have to drink a lot of water at all -- but until the question is resolved, drinking half-again-as-much water isn't usually a big deal for anyone.

Anyway, there's plenty of good information on the internet, including many of the studies posted in full. There are tens of thousands of recipes. There are several approaches to low-carb and all are well-represented.

Although no one diet will fit everyone, if you're interested, do yourself a favor and look into it. Whether you try low-carb eating or not, it should prove most enlightening!

--bkl

[sendero]

44. Good post...

... and best of luck with your job search!

[jpgray]

32. Do Atkins only if you have zero willpower

It's terribly rough on your kidneys. Just eat like the pyramid says, but eat about 500 calories fewer a day. That's virtually the same as being on Atkins, except you can eat pasta and whatever grains and fiber you want. Life without grains and fibers is *miserable*. Protein makes you "feel" full on less calories than carbohydrates, so when you eliminate carbs you usually drop 500 cals or so from your average diet. Better to eat the proper proportions of everything but in sensible amounts (i.e. not super-American-sized portions).

edit: and as for the exercise angle, no way in hell could I ever run my usual 25-50 miles a week without *plenty* of carbs.

[lazarus]

35. zero willpower?

It takes a lot of willpower to break the addiction to carbs.

Maybe life without grains and fibers is miserable for you, it feels great to a lot of us.

And no way in hell I could run 25-50 miles a week ever. I can barely walk. I eat carbs, I get fat. I'm disabled.

Atkins isn't rough on kidneys at all, btw. That's a myth. And did you ever notice that Americans started getting fat about the same time the government came out with that pyramid, recommending all the pasta and grains and fiber you want? But that's just a coincidence, I'm sure.

[jpgray]

36. You're right--sorry for the inflammatory post subject

I personally think we Americans are fat because we eat too much of everything, not too much of one thing. Protein will make you feel more full than carbohydrates, and that will help you take in fewer calories. Whatever the diet, eating fewer calories than what you'd eat to maintain your weight is what makes you lose the pounds.

As far as the kidneys, if you eat too much protein, it takes a lot of processing in the ol' kidneys to take care of that nitrogen. Again, this would be eating *too much*, and drinking plenty of water helps.

So yeah, people are eating way too many carbs, but they're just eating too much in general. If Atkins works for somebody, I won't rain on the parade (even if I did already--sorry!), but my preference is a balanced diet, including all the food groups.

[lazarus]

95. No problem

Us Atkins folks get a bit sensitive sometimes, and over react sometimes, too.

[sendero]

45. Ummm....

... I'll have to take exception. The Atkins diet is anything but a picnic. All that meat, cheese and eggs is really good for about 3 days - after that it is a chore.

My natural body type is ectomorphic (thin) so really, I've never had to diet specifically to lose weight. I have dieted (Atkins) to lose bodyfat. It is very effective. But it is anything but easy.

And frankly, the "reduce calories" diets - well lets just say I've known lots of people who do them and they are often completely ineffective. Unless coupled with an hour of cardio a day, your body will just adjust to the lower intake, and you might lose a half pound a month.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

57. I Agree-Sick of Meat and Unemployed Here-Just Bought Boca Burgers

I have never been a big meat eater and it is a chore to eat it all the time. And I'm a great cook, IMHO! ;-)

[jpgray]

62. But regular exercise or a limited balanced diet has the same effect

Assuming you're not eating *lots* of junk food, a weight gain problem has to do with taking in more calories than you burn. There's nothing magic about protein calories that makes you slimmer compared to those in carbohydrates.

Atkins *is* a "reduce calories" diet. Add up the numbers for yourself, check the # of calories you ate before the diet and the # you eat now. You will find generally a 300-500 calorie difference, and that is the source of your weight loss. It goes without saying that eliminating junk food carbs is helpful, but that has everything to do with a healthy balanced diet anyway and is hardly exclusive to Atkins.

The healthiest way is always a balanced diet and exercise. Barring that, a balanced diet in smaller portions will help you maintain good bodyfat % and a good weight. If you can't stand feeling hungry and/or hate exercising, Atkins I suppose would work fine.

[supernova]

66. Read my post jpgray

you are not understanding why atkins works for some folks. YOu are not paying attention to the very real phenomenon of insulin sensitivity.

Better yet, let the Atkins folks explain it themselves:

http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/9/24-483295.html

Links to all research topics at http://www.atkinscenter.com

http://atkins.com/science/researchsummaries/index.html

[jpgray]

68. Okay. :-) (nt)

[Kathy in Cambridge]

75. My thyroid went haywire and I gained 35-40 lbs

I was a near-vegetarian (fish only and chicken/turkey very occasionally), ate lots of whole-grains and veggies. And exercised religiously. Medical problems can cause weight gain-and does in a lot of people.

My sister found out she was allergic to wheat (she was a vegetarian and gained a ton of weight). She gave up wheat and is back to normal.

Also, as supernova points out, you are ignoring the real problem on insulin-sensitivity. Not to mention that obesity is more common in the poor, who often buy the cheaper, processed foods that are available. Fresh food is VERY expensive. My grocery bill has increased 20% in a year-and I've cut out goodies. I only buy necessities.

[jpgray]

83. Well, you were taking in more than you burned

Unless your body defies the laws of physics, of course. If you look at impoverished countries, such as North Korea, where the portions are rather cruelly controlled, you will not see many obese people. Except for the ruling class, of course.

Or take modern nations as a comparison:

Only 6.5% of Italian males and 6.3% of Italian females are obese, compared to our 19% male and 25% female. Do they eat fewer carbs in Italy? The land of pasta, bread, and the Mediterranean diet? I don't think so--the problem is portion control and exercise.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

88. No, I wasn't. Hypoactive thyroid means your thyroid slows down

I was training for a triathlon when my thyroid began to tank. The odds of me not burning off my calories when I was running 5-10 miles 5 days a week, kickboxing, spinning and mountain-biking are very slim. Hypoactive thyroidmeans your body is not producing enough of the thyroid hormone.

Links:
http://www.mtauburnobgyn.com/thyroid.html

http://thyroid.about.com/cs/basics_starthere/a/thyroid101.htm

http://seasilver.threadnet.com/Preventorium/thyroid.htm

[jpgray]

104. My bad, I read it as "hyper". HOW did you exercise that much with that?

I couldn't run 5-10 miles 5 days a week unless I took it re-a-al slow. I usually split my week like this: Tuesday/7 miles, Thursday/8 miles, Sunday/10 miles. If I'm gearing up for a race, I'll bring those up ten percent each week until I have a fifty mile week. Of course I may do 8/400m or Yasso 800s in the between days, or lift weights. But doesn't a thyroid problem involve pretty serious fatigue?

[Kathy in Cambridge]

119. Yes, in fact I just pushed myself

despite tiredness and ended up flat on my back for weeks.

[jpgray]

120. Yikes. Glad you're doing well these days

:hi:

[PVnRT]

50. Zero willpower?

I'm not on the diet, but I'm a little curious as to how it takes "zero willpower" to deny yourself things like cake, ice cream, donuts, cookies, pasta, etc. Explain that one to me...

[jpgray]

59. Is whether or not to eat a twinky your great battle of the will?

Eating healthy has never been an issue of willpower to me. You eat what you buy--if you don't want to eat something, don't buy it. If I lived at my Mom's house, maybe I'd need to watch myself a little. :)

[populistmom]

98. Who says there's no fiber?

I had some hot cereal this morning- 3 grams of carbs and 12 grams of whole wheat fiber. I had tomatoes with my lunch.

I agree however on the exercise. If you run 25-50 miles a week, you will need plenty of carbs. But for those of us who walk 5-10 miles a week and need to still get some weight off, we don't need as much.

[Bolo Boffin]

34. I did Atkins for two weeks

the Induction phase...and lost ten pounds.

I never got back on it, but it took four months to gain that back. I had some mood problems, but I'm about to hit the Atkins for real in the next week.

Plus, get some exercise. I bought an elliptical trainer, and I've got weights as well. The theater I'm a part of is doing Caberet, and I want to be the MC so bad...

By the way, I've found a low-carb bread (seven carbs per slice - and two of those are fiber) that tastes great. I saw some Atkins brand bread and bagels in the Kroger the other day, but the tiny little loaves were $5.49 a piece!

$5.49, for six bagels? Yeah, they had 11 grams of fiber each (!!), but come on!

[LynneSin]

37. Ok, that is so NOT Atkins

First, Meat Loaf uses Bread Crumbs which are carbs. Eating an entire meat loaf um....not cool.

Atkins, like any other diet plan, require portion control. It just happens that the portions you are eating the first several weeks on the plan are protiens & fats with a few carbs scattered in.

I've been doing this for 2.5 months and I'm eating healthy carbs along with my protien. I've lost about 37lbs so far.

[hlthe2b]

40. Thank you LS: To suceed with Atkins, you have to DO Atkins!

Same with the other low carb diets. That means getting and reading the book, educating yourself on the concepts, and FOLLLOWING IT.

I never cease to be amazed at folks who repeat the fallacies about one of these diets (that they have no vegetables on them, or that you can eat,eat, eat, fat and protein until they cart you off in a piano crate), then wonder why they aren't working.

For those who are convinced these diets are inherently unhealthy, that was medical dogma for many years. However, the top nutrition, obesity and biomedical researchers are finding otherwise. Do a medline literature search and look for findings from folks like Walter Willett at Harvard, the Duke University Group, and Jim Hill at University of Colorado. They have all spoken out on the weakness and fallacy of the Food Pyramid, with its reliance on carbohydrates, including those that raise blood sugar rapidly, and unrealistic restriction on even the healthy fats, which has caused an explosion in Type II (noninsulin-dependent) diabetes rates.

For those with some medical background, medical dogma is sometimes slow to resolve. Just think back to the conviction that gastric ulcers were the principal result of stress and diet. We now know that a bacteria, Helicobacter pylori is the leading cause, but the medical elite castigated that researcher for nearly a decade before finally being convinced.

Losing weight is difficult no matter how you approach it, and these diets really work best for those who actually ARE carbohydrate sensitive (unstable blood sugar, carb cravings, insulin resistance).
If that is not you, then other diets may work better. Clearly lack of exercise is probably our number one reason for obesity (raises hand silently). No crash diet is ever going to be the answer. They all require lifestyle changes.

[lazarus]

97. And one thing Atkins stressed

Is that his diet isn't necessarily for everyone.

[Pobeka]

39. pluses, minuses

Atkins works. I know several people who've benefited from the diet, each was under the guidance of a health-care professional.

And though I don't need to diet, I noticed I could removed a bit of the extra weight around the belly by changing the ratio of carbs / protein for only a few days.

That's the plus. The minus is that some people get such a craving for bread and pasta that by the end of the diet they just blow it all away satiating that craving.

But if you're overweight and get zero aerobic exercise, I think Atkins in moderation plus exercise would be the way to start.

Pardon me while I go eat a bagel... ;)

[supernova]

51. Atkins is a terrific eating plan

Yes, I said plan not diet. Atkins isn't something you do for a few weeks then stop. If you decide to eat Atkins style, it is a plan for eating for life.

Atkins is a graduated program, meaning you start out eating very restricted carbs for the first couple of weeks (called Induction). Some people, while they are not eating the usual pasta and bagels, do find themselves eating more meat the first few days. (I personally think there's something of the eating of forbidden foods thing going on too. But that's probably just me.) It's ok. After the first few days, your body begins to be satisfied with more normal portion sizes.

And for the hundredth time to the anti-Atkins whiners, Atkins DOES insist that you eat your veggies, just not ones with high sugar content. Salad greens, broccoli, artichokes, cucumbers, zuchhine, squash, etc. There's a terrific list of induction foods at atkinscenter.com. You can also have berries such as raspberries, blueberries, strawberries, and melons. Again, all are low on the glycemic (sugar) index. Ask any diabetic, they can tell you all about it. Apples for instance, as much as I love them, also have a high sugar content. So for this part of Akins they are off limits.

After the first two weeks, you start to add foods (more veggies and fruits that are higher up the glycemic index) back into your eating plan. Plan to add one or maybe two new foods each week. What you are searching for is foods with a higher fibre to sugar ratio. You want the fiber, not the sugar. What you want to find is foods that will still let you lose weight by not sending your blood sugar levels soaring.

And you are exercising all during this. Akins is not a couchpotato diet.

Gradually, as you approach your goal weight, you start to add the more complex carbohydrates back into your eating. Things like whole grains, and legumes. By then you should know how often you can eat these things without having them disturb your blood sugar levels.

Why all this talk about blood sugar levels? It goes by a variety of names: "Metabolic Syndrome" "Syndrome X". It is a kind of pre-diabetes. At this stage after a lifetime of eating lots of bread and pasta, and things made with processed flour, your body begins to produce too much insulin for sustained periods. Why is insulin bad? First of all, your pancreas is getting overtaxed trying to process all the sugar in your blood. Second of all, insulin is the hormone that tells your body "use for fuel what's coming in. Don't touch the fat stores." Well, if you're trying to lose weight, that's not much help is it?

After so many years of being overtaxed, your pancreas will quit. That is called Type II Diabetes. Insulin shots, anyone?

Atkins works by focusing on proteins and foods low on the glycemic index to get insulin out of your way. Ketosis can then proceed normally. Then you get to lose weight. Yay! I worked for years trying to lose weight on the Dean Ornish plan. I exercised and I ate right. It didn't work. In fact I gained weight. I was always hungry, despite eating normal portion sizes.

This is not a slap at Dean Ornish. Wonderful guy. If his plan works for you, more power to you. It didn't work for me. I don't think just one plan is right for everyone. Each of us has to find what works for us.

For the first time in my life I am able to control my weight. My abdomen is flat, not round. I feel alert, engergized, and I don't get the afternoon slumps. Plus my skin, hair and nails are much improved. I eat normal portion sizes and don't feel hunger afterwards. In fact, I don't even think about food unless I'm physically hungry, or it's time to eat. I've also stopped snacking at night. I rarely eat past 6 or 6:30pm.

Interesting experiment. Before I did Atkins, I didn't realize I was so sensitve to the blood sugar roller coaster. Now when I eat bread, pasta, potatoes, I notice that I simply cannot quit! I'm never satisfied. I keep stuffing my mouth! It's like empty calories to my body. Except it's not because a day after eating them, my stomach pouches out like I'm pregnant! :P

I am also an admirer of Walter Wilette at Harvard Medical School. He does advocate eating more whole grains and more of the healthy oils like olive oil. And the oil-laden fishes. And chocolate!

People who do slam Atkins, simply haven't done their homework about what it is or does, or why it works for some of us. About the Italian restaurant: I love to order scallopini! :9 And I eat the toppings off the pizza and leave the bread.

It's all about educating yourself to make the right choices for you.

[jpgray]

67. I agree, but a healthy balanced diet shouldn't include that much sugar

Eliminating refined sugar, flour and other foods high in glucose isn't exclusive to Atkins. Whole wheat pasta, bread etc. are great alternatives to white bread, white pasta, and the rest if you want to avoid that "leave the fat reserves alone" body reaction. That precaution is unnecessary if you exercise enough to burn off the sugars *and* the fat, but if you want to take it a little easier, just eat carbs with less refined product. You don't have to ride a blood-sugar rollercoaster just because you keep your carbs on the bottom of the pyramid. :) Maybe it's easier on Atkins, I don't know.

[supernova]

72. Actually it is easier on Atkins

to avoid the blood sugar roller coaster.

And I do exercise, but because of my heart condition I cannot exercise enough to get rid of a mostly carb-based diet. That's why I do Atkins. So you are ill-informed in that regard.

I agree about the balanced diet. I do infact eat some of those things, but probably not as much as you, that's all.

It's all about balance, afterall. Again I refer you to Walter Willette at Harvard.

[jpgray]

76. Okay (nt)

[TrogL]

73. How in hell am I supposed to afford this??

We tried switching to veggies and fruit, but veggies are expensive. NOW I find out even the veggies I could afford eg. apples and carrots aren't on the list, and a lot of inexpensive bulk items contain carbs as additives.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

84. It IS Expensive, Trogl. I'm cutting back myself

Frozen veggies are a good way to go-I but frozen cauliflower, broccoli and spinach and flavor them with butter, oil, sour cream or spices.

Chicken thighs are cheaper than breasts, and taste great in a stew as they have more flavor.

There are definitely ways to cut costs, but it is an expensive diet.

[lazarus]

101. Doesn't anybody buy whole chickens anymore?

Hell, buy a whole chicken and cut it up yourself. It's not that hard.

And as for affording it, Trog, it's a lot cheaper than the medical bills, I'd think, in the long run.

[TrogL]

107. I don't like forking out good money for bones

However, Ank is saying you can buy frozen, boneless, carb-less thighs so I may look into that.

[supernova]

91. Heh. My typical grocery list:

- Chicken - usually legs or thights can be had for as little as 99 cents/lb.
- Sometimes I get the frozen chicken breasts (deboned, deskinned)
- Salmon if it's at a good price. OK, so now I'll look for wild salmon and not farm raised until they change the feed.
- Pork loin (it's very lean meat)
- If I feel like treating myself I may go to Whole Foods and invest in something bizzare like ostrich or buffalo.

I don't get all of these every week, I rotate depending on what's a good buy.

eggs - I rotate eggs and a very good low-carb hot cereal for my breakfast most mornings.

cream for my coffee (skip the coffee if you're on induction)

Veggies
- Bell peppers. I love them. I eat them like apples. I eat about 1/2 of a large bell pepper every day.
- Broccoli (I buy frozen. It's just easier.)
- Salad greens. I buy the prewashed prepared stuff. I find washing the stuff to be almost prohibitively tedious.
- Artichoke hearts
- Olives
- frozen turnip greens (love them zapped with a little vinegar)
- Occasional roma tomatoes if I'm making a special recipe.

There's others but those are my consistent staples. I periodically refer back to the Atkins list of what different foods are worth carb-wise.

Bottle or two of red wine.
Unsalted Nuts. Usually pecans or walnuts.
Cheese about every other week.
Splenda once a month.
Mushrooms sometimes.

Drinks? Tea, coffee, usually. I drink a lot of tap water. And I adore seltzer water. SW is dirt cheap compared to sodas. Most of the time I can find it on sale for .50/liter.

That's it. No rice, no sugar, no frozen pizza, no beans. No flour, no bakery products. I occasionally get the jonsing for lentils but that's about it. I may eat more legumes them when I feel more confident at this maintenance phase.

Atkins calls this shopping on the outside aisles of the store. LOL! Get all you want on the rim of the store, just don't go down the middle aisles with all the processed foods.

Total food bill for the week for me: about $70 w/ the wine. About $50 without.

Once a month I go to the nutritional store and get some atkins products, like protein bars. I usually have one of those on the evening for supper. I prefer Atkins bars because they do have fiber in them, and no sugar. Compare lables with other nutritional bars and you'll see the difference. I also get my low-carb cereal. Buying at the beginning of the month gets me 20% off all this stuff.

Total bill at nutritional store: about $45-50 for the month.

[TrogL]

121. That looks halfways affordable

A lot of that stuff I'm buying already.

What IS a good lo-carb hot cereal?

[Kathy in Cambridge]

58. Mr. RR's Cholesterol DROPPED 100 points on Atkins

therefore dispelling many of the myths surrounding meat consumption and cholesterol...we both feel a lot better on Atkins.

[jpgray]

60. Ack, must have been eating some unhealthy-as-hell carbs (nt)

[Kathy in Cambridge]

61. Nope-he was a lot stricter than me and is still

I cheat here and there, but he has remained consistent. We do eat tons of vegetables (but we always have), just not white flour, white sugar, white rice and potatoes. There have been studies about the effects of these high-gycemic foods on Cholesterol.

I've lost 35 lbs-he's lost 25 and feels great.

[jpgray]

64. Well, feeling good is the whole idea anyway, right? :-) (nt)

[MissMillie]

65. addicted to carbs

I think the theory is that if you're burning the carbs/sugars that you take in on a daily basis, you won't burn the fat you have stored.

Also, when you eat carbs, you burn them quickly and then your body goes looking for more.... so you end up consuming more calories.

While I applaud this theory, I worry about any diet that cuts out FIBER so much. I've chosen the South Beach diet instead. You get to keep your veggies (even in the beginning). The diet stresses protein, but also stresses that their are right fats and wrong fats. After 2 weeks you can add grains back into your diet, but only those that are high in fiber (white bread, white potatoes, white rice, white pasta are all no-nos, and need to be replaced with whole grains and sweet potatoes).

Sugar is frowned upon.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

70. Atkins Allows Veggies in Induction Too

and we have re-introduced high-carb veggies like squash, carrots, and sweet potatoes into our diet during Ongoing Weight Loss. Berries are allowed and I eat them every morning. So Atkins is similar to the South Beach diet after the initial restrictions.

[bedtimeforbonzo]

81. it doesn't cut fiber

You can eat as much fiber as you want, since it doesn't affect your glycemic index.

[ScreamingMeemie]

69. Atkins equaled a heart attack for my Mother in Law.

I think the plan is abused and misused. You are supposed to phase things back into your diet, and a lot of people don't do this.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

78. You're right-some people go overboard with meat consumption

and the diet can have disastrous results. It is important to treat a diet like a medication: use only as directed. I have also heard of kidney issues, but again it's usually among people who don't drink enough water.

Sorry about your Packers, BTW :-(

[MissMillie]

99. not to mention that there are some fats that are better than others

Beef and pork not so much, chicken and fish are better (especially fish high in Omega 3--fabulous for your heart)

[CivilRightsNow]

111. Flaxseed is better..

Ground up or in oil form.. then farm raised fish of any type. Here is the study finding on Salmon being higher in carcinogens.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/salmon_01-09-04.html
http://www.healthscout.com/news/68/516856/main.html
http://www.salon.com/tech/wire/2004/01/08/salmon/

Eating more than a meal of farm-raised salmon per month, depending on its country of origin, could slightly increase the risk of getting cancer later in life, according to the study published Thursday in the journal Science.

[supernova]

113. Due to the feed

They are doing the same things to farm-raised salmon that they did to beef. Feeding ground up species parts back to the animals. Sick. IOW, they are feeding ground up salmon meal back to the fish, making them unintentional cannibals. You are getting all the toxins back to the fish in a more concentrated form. That's why farm-raised salmon have higher toxin levels than wild salmon.

That practice has to stop!!

[Mr. McD]

85. Fallacy: You eat too much protein when doing Atkins, which is bad for the

Fallacy: You eat too much protein when doing Atkins, which is bad for the kidneys.

Fact: Too many people believe this untruth simply because it has been repeated so often that even intelligent health professionals assume it must have been reported somewhere.

But the fact is that it has never been reported anywhere. No one has as yet produced a study for review, or even cite a specific case in which a diet high in protein causes any form of kidney disorder. The only remotely related phenomenon is the fact that when someone is already suffering from far-advanced kidney disease, it is difficult for that person’s body to handle protein. But protein has nothing to do with the cause of the kidney problem.

[TrogL]

89. "Willing to be hungry"

I used that phrase in an attempt to explain that switching food groups may simply not be enough.

I'm the first to admit I don't understand. In my younger days I could go to Christmas dinner, stuff myself 'til the tryptophan rendered me unconscious, and LOSE WEIGHT due to stress. These days I'm 6'0 and 149 pounds (I think) and miffed about not being able to get back down to 144 or even 137, my old plateaus.

On Friday, I forgot my lunch at home. I had money in my wallet, but I can't afford to run across the street to the restaurant. My ham sandwiches cost about 50 cents to make. I'm gonna spend at least $5.00 for store food. So I skipped lunch - no big deal. Yeah I had the growlies by the time I got home but so what. I'm willing to be hungry.

Ank isn't. The concept is heresy. He just repeats over and over "you have to eat". This is not the first person I have run into to have this concept. Could somebody explain to me either what he's talking about or how to get him off this script?

[TrogL]

90. On the flip side

I feel for him.

I was on an anti-depressant called Remeron that screwed up the neurotransmitter levels in my stomach, making me always feeling me hungry even when I'd over-eaten. I was eating four chicken breasts at a sitting and not even noticing. I'd be hungry again an hour later. I went from 144 lb to 182 in four months. It's taken over a year to get back down to 149 and I'm stuck there.

While on it, if anyone had suggested "be willing to be hungry", I'd have punched their lights out, but then again over-aggressiveness is why I went off it in the first place.

*sigh*

[supernova]

96. Actually you must eat on Atkins

he's right there.

Because you are keeping your bloodsugar levels low on carb-regulated diets, you can bottom out and feel faint or dizzy if you don't eat. The recommended pattern is going no more than 6 waking hours without eating. (excluding evenings after supper).

So I do eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner most days.

[jpgray]

105. Jesus man, I'm 149 at 5'10"

Not much fat on me either--it's "normal" weight, I think, for my height.

[TopesJunkie]

92. It's based on half-science that ignores the current state of the art --

I'm not sure why we have to go down so many wrong roads when it comes to diet.

[TrogL]

102. So what's the current state of the art?

[TopesJunkie]

114. Spend some time at the Harvard Health sites --

Their publications and books are wonderful. It's state of the art within context. And there's no big marketing push to sell products such as with Atkins. It's the real bottom line when it comes to nutrition and health science.

For a very basic review, start here:

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/index.html

But go and check out their periodicals and books. Dr. Willett's book is wonderful.

[lazarus]

117. Interesting

A good deal of misinformation about Atkins diets, which is shameful from an educational website with the name Harvard attached to it.

Atkins doesn't teach that carbohydrates are "evil." He says that carbohydrate addiction is bad, because we tend to fill our bodies with bad carbohydrates. Just as the Harvard site does, he makes a distinction between the various types of carbohydrates, and what kinds are okay to include in the diet.

As for the risk of heart disease, they've been saying for years to lower cholesterol. And along comes the Atkins plan, and one's cholesterol goes down on it. And suddenly, they change and say, wait, it's not just cholesterol, there's more....

The key is, Atkins isn't "low carb" for the entirety of the plan. It's low carb at first, to break the addiction. You add carbs back as you go through the phases, until you reach "maintenance", which is the level of carbohydrates at which you no longer gain or lose weight. Which seems fairly balanced, doesn't it?

[TopesJunkie]

118. You really need to read far more than that --

That site is far more honest than the purveyors of Atkins, who have failed to use science to back up their money-making scheme.

[lazarus]

103. Care to expand upon that?

I'd really like to hear what the "current state of the art" is when it comes to diet, given the sickeningly obese state of Americans these days.

[TopesJunkie]

115. See post 114.

[Paranoid_Portlander]

108. Does Atkins allow meat loaf?

I'm not sure exactly what is in meat loaf, and I never eat it, but aren't there bread crumbs or other similar carbs in the meat loaf that would not be allowed? In order to stick to the Atkins diet you need to know all the ingredients on your plate.

[supernova]

112. Meatloaf is so-so

for low-carb carb purposes.

It varies but the typical meatlof recipe is:

1/3 ground beef
1/3 ground pork
1/3 ground lamb

Add in about a C of bread crumbs (that's the problem child) and 1 or 2 eggs. Add onion and salt and pepper and any other seasonings you like.

Mix well. I prefer using my hands, but for some there's the raw meat Ewww factor. :shrug:

As others have suggested you can substitute low-carb crumbs, I don't know how that would taste though.

[TrogL]

109. What about pork chops?

I can get frozen pork chops real cheap. I'm on the Atkins website but I haven't found a list of acceptable/not acceptable foods.

[supernova]

110. Atkins Carb Counter

Porkchops are fine. Any meat that isn't deli meat is OK (b/c of the nitrates - carcinogens).

If you are on the Atkins site, from any secondary page (not the home page) look on the left of the screen about 2/3 of the way down.

There is a light blue tab that says: "Carb Gram Counter" Click it. Popups must be enabled. You can check a variety of foods and get a good sense of what carbs count or don't count.

The typical formula is:

Total carbs - Fibre carbs = total carbs counted for Atkins purposes.

[TrogL]

116. Available as a pdf

http://atkins.com/img/assets/609/atkins_carbgramcounter.pdf