If you go to Al Anon, please check in here.

[raccoon]

Is there any problem in your area with people sticking to the Conference Approved Literature?

There sure is in mine. I've heard people in Al Anon meetings talking about the book CODEPENDENT NO MORE, reading her own poetry, reading something Rick Warren wrote :WTF:, and reading some dumbass thing about detachment-attachment that she'd written herself.

I called the woman talking about CODEPENDENT NO MORE on it. She was a newcomer.

But often the people doing this AREN'T newcomers. They're old-timers and either they do this crap or else sit there like the cat got their tongue and say nothing when somebody else does it.

Your experience?

[graywarrior]

1. Hell, Jesus freaks show up at my AA meetings!

Amd yeah...if an Al Anon group does not stress Conference Approved Lit, then people assume they can bring anything into a meeting including poems they wrote (arrrrggghhhhh!). It's good that you brought it up otherwise that practice can spread like wildfire.

[raccoon]

2. In the groups in my area, at the beginning of each meeting, someone reads

the statement of purpose in which it says members are asked to refrain from discussions of religion, self-help books, etc., and the use or mention or material of material other than our conference approved literature.

Which apparently means nothing to many Al Anons here, even long-timers.

[graywarrior]

3. I know, but self centered to the extreme people do not hear that

They all want 20 years recovery immediately.

[raccoon]

5. This was the thing she read. I don't know where the hell it comes from.

To Let Go
by: Author Unknown, Source Unknown

To let go does not mean to stop caring,
it means I can't do it for someone else.
To let go is not to cut myself off,
it's the realization that I can't control another.
To let go is not to enable,
but to allow learning from natural consequences.
To let go is to admit powerlessness,
which means the outcome is not in my hands.
.........

And as I've said, what really pee'd me off was that in this room of 20-something people, some of them long-timers, NOBODY SAID A FUCKING THING.

I was so mad I got up and left.

That was my home group. I don't think it will be for much longer.

[astral]

24. Some groups run with a much tighter rein than others

And I happen to like that reading very much. I do not see where it conflicts with anything, although it should be pointed out for the sake of newcomers that that is 'outside literature' or whatever you want to call it.

It would be up to the chair person to speak up, theoretically.

The other thing to consider is newcomers are way more vulnerable to hurt feelings and criticism and it is sometimes better to let things slide in silence for their comfort. Depends on the circumstances.

And, of course (she self-righteously points out) you had as much right to speak up as anybody else who never said a fucking thing. (I say that quite tongue-in-cheek as it seems a tad bit humorous from my perspective but I have been in the same boat with things not being run the way I Thought They Ought so I know how you feel!)

We gravitate towards groups that are run they way we want them to be run, but as a homegroup member you may want to mention this to a homegroup pow-wow if it is an important issue to you.

[raccoon]

25. Someone else I talked to pointed that out.

"you had as much right to speak up as anybody else who never said a fucking thing."

And you're both right.

For me, I've decided this is the deal. If it's a small group, I'd speak out (I have done so before).
If it's a large one, not so sure (though I have done so). If there are others there whom I believe will back me up, I would speak out.

At the meeting I told yall about, I don't believe I'd have gotten any back up if I HAD spoken up. Things others said to me indicated they wouldn't have; they've have rationalized that what the woman read was "similar to" stuff in the literature. That's what two people said to me later on.

I think many people don't want to speak out because they view it as being the "bad guy." Lots of people, in and out of Al Anon, are people pleasers.

For myself, I'll speak out but I don't want to be the one to carry the flag and not get any support. That's how it was in my family of origin; I'd talk about the alcoholism and the rest of the family would ridicule me, shut me up, deny there was an elephant in the living room, etc.
Also at work and school that's happened to me. I'm not going to stand alone against a crowd if I can avoid it. BTDT, and it sucks big time.

What I'll do if this happens again, and I don't feel comfortable speaking up, I'll just get up and leave. That's what I need to do to take care of me.

[sasquatch]

4. That's because AA and their offshoots are in the same business as Rick Warren

I know this will get me flamed but it's the truth. If you want actual help with issues that 12 step groups say they can help you with seek actaul medical help, not religious cults. Get help from actual medically trained and certified individuals not demogauges and their sycophants that're looking to take advantage of tax-free loop holes.

[graywarrior]

6. They are "support groups" not professionals

Peer support works better than no it all pros who have zero alcohol or addiction experience.

[sasquatch]

7. No they don't, they only work as good place to bitch and moan

Which in the end is not helping them because some of the underlying issues that force them to abuse can't be treated because there isn't a doctor present to diagnose the problem.

[graywarrior]

12. I know too many people who stayed sober for 25 years and more because of meetings

[sasquatch]

13. Or so they say

They could go home and get shitfaced everynight for all you know.

[stillcool]

14. I went for several years...

I can't imagine getting, or staying sober without it. I've been sober since 1992. Every shrink I went to recommended AA, NA etc.,

[graywarrior]

21. No, you can always tell when someone has broken out and drinking or drugging

You get good at that when you've been around for a while.

[raccoon]

8. I disagree. While a good counselor can be a great help, a good support group

can also help.

AA and other 12-step groups are supposed to be spiritual programs, not allied with any denomination. However, some groups do get into religion, but they're not supposed to.

[sasquatch]

9. They're not allied because they're their own group

[KitchenWitch]

10. sasquatch, must you piss in every 12 step program thread.

I like you, dude, I do. But this shit gets old.

[sasquatch]

11. Yes, because there should'nt be any confusion to what 12 step is and isn't

And I like you too.:hug:

[RetroLounge]

15. Well, I don't like you

When it comes to 12 step groups, you act like an asshole with a big resentment that needs some help..

RL

[TrogL]

18. Just put him on ignore. I did.

[KitchenWitch]

19. I would, but I happen to like sasquatch.

Seems kind of petty to put him on ignore over this disagreement.

[RetroLounge]

17. No, it's your ever-warped opinion.

Get help. Please. You're tiresome.

RL

[sasquatch]

20. I've had help thank you

[Critters2]

22. Yeah. I tried that. What I learned was that the PhD therapist I was seeing

was really a glorified phone psychic. His job was to keep me in therapy for however long he could con me into being there, spending shitloads of money (who the fuck makes $120 an hour?!), while I was cutting back in other areas, like food. Every time I was doing better in whatever area we were dealing with, Dr. Con Man would find some new "issue" to deal with.

Then, I went to a 12 step meeting. I got a sponsor. I worked the steps. My life improved. For a free will donation of $2 a week.

I spent one last $120 to tell my "actually trained and certified" professional to go screw himself. And never looked back.

[SPKrazy]

23. What a crock of fucking shit

yeah, AA is full of millionaires at the top skimming off a pyramid scheme

only AA is organized as an upside down pyramid, with the individual member having the most power and the farther you go into any type of "organized" part, you have less and less authority. The International office of AA has NO AUTHORITY whatsoever, whereas an individual member has the authority to vote in their home group business meetings about what that group does.

I don't think Rick Warren has a business plan quite like that.

AA is about helping people stay sober, THAT IS FUCKING ALL IT IS ABOUT

no other issues, no other reasons for being, it is a support group that does not discourage medical help when needed, psychological or psychiatric help when needed. But the fact is, alcoholism is not a psychiatric illness, it is a dis-ease of the body, mind, and spirit that seems to respond to the program set forth in the book Alcoholics Anonymous in many cases

In many other cases it doesn;'t.

Quit bashing AA

no more REV Acts spankings for YOU!!!!!!!!




REvvie's MINE!!!!

:D

[sasquatch]

27. A disease of the spirit??? Really!?

That in itself sounds like a crock of shit.

[RetroLounge]

30. ...

:puke:

RL

[sasquatch]

32. I'm sorry bro, that just doesn't sound scientific

[RetroLounge]

33. Your unhappiness must be awful to bear...

:hug:

RL

[RetroLounge]

16. Was this in her personal share?

Or as leader/secty of the group?

I assume AL-Anon follow some sort of traditions, and each group can decide how to run their own group.

It has taken my home group many many years to decide as a group on which readings to do, etc. But when giving a lead, the person that week can read whatever they like. But as far as the group format, we stick to conference approved literature only.

:hi:

RL

[raccoon]

26. She was responsible for the program at that meeting. She had that

"Letting go" paper printed up and passed it around.

[RetroLounge]

29. Ew...

Sorry...

RL

[Debi]

28. Only in one group did I experience that

and that group was pretty fast and loose with all the 'rules'

Unfortunately I never did find a group that I could work with. In each group I was asked for professioinal or politcal advice - during meetings! I got calls at home/office w/needs that were outside of our Alanon relationship. My fellow group members had no problem at all telling others in public settings that we were Alanon friends. :eyes: Geez people it's not a social networking club FFS!

I gave up. I needed to work on ME but was asked to carry other's loads. Glad to hear you've had better experiences.

[Duncan Grant]

31. Only conference approved literature here.

If it were me, I'd mention this during "Al-Anon related announcements" or the next business meeting. Got a group rep you can check-in with?