Help! (I'm an insecure, clueless male)

[Merusault]

I need some insight as to what is going on (hopefully some female DUers have some insight)..... I called a girl last Sunday and asked her out for drinks. She seemed really happy, said "yes," and said we should go on Wednesday. Well, I called her on wednesday, and got no answer. I've been calling once a day since then and I'm not getting any answers. I even tried calling from my friend's phone to see if she was just avoiding me, but she still didn't pick up. I'm not ready to give up yet, because she has given me mostly positive signals thus far. I know for a fact that this girl is lonely and has been looking for male attention, so maybe she's just being coy and testing me. I don't know.

[citizen snips]

1. Women are very complicated.

You might as well give up.

[Merusault]

6. Giving up.........

That's not in the spirit of Tony Montana.

[citizen snips]

11. I know.

You can keep on calling her for the next 2 weeks but after that if she does not answer give up.

[coloradodem2005]

10. I am inclined to agree.

If you did not read my rants last week let me tell you. THere was this girl I met online. We emailed each other. She was gregarious, as was I. I felt that we had a lot in common. There were not many things we disagreed on, it seemed. Hell, there may have been no things that we really disagreed on. It evolved into calling each other for about a week. I asked if she wanted to meet, she said yes. We met, talked for a couple of hours. I was being respectful and funny. I asked her if she wanted to go to a movie afterwards. She said yes. So we were leaving and she said she wanted to take separate cars so she would not have to backtrack. So, I followed her to the theaters, she pulls off into a shopping center and I follow her. She says that she got a call from her friends mom that her friend had been in an accident and was in the hospital and she could not go to the movie. She said she would call me tomorrow. She didn't. One of my friends told me that people forget to call and I shouldn't give up on her just because she didn't. I wish I did not listen to his advice.

On Wednsday, I tried calling her. At 6pm, I called and her cell phone went to voicemail. I tried an hour later and she was on the phone. THen I tried 20 minutes after that and it went to her voicemail again. On Friday I even sent an email expressing my concern over her and her friend and she didn't respond. It became pretty clear that she did not like me.

Of course I have come to the conclusion that all women hate me. Love stinks!!!

[citizen snips]

15. Men will never understand women.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

20. Sad to say, I think you got the brush-off there

I don't know why. It may be nothing that you did wrong, just that she's messed up somehow. Or mean. Or socially inept. Or so socialized to be "nice" that she has to make lame excuses for turning you down.

Not all women hate you. Years ago, I could have thought that all men hated me. It wasn't true. Not all men hate me, but I'm not for everybody. There was a time when I had one unrequited crush after another, and it took forever to find someone I could aactually get together with.

[Merusault]

21. Love doesn't stink,

it's just a pain in the ass.

[Deja Q]

31. Love does stink... and it's not what you think!

Smell the room before and after and tell me different! :P

[Th1onein]

38. Wouldn't it be nice.....

if everyone could treat everyone else as a friend? And be honest, and up front, and just tell them the truth? Isn't that how you would treat a friend?

The girl is not interested in you. She has neglected to tell you this. But she should.

[Amaya]

44. Yes, that would be nice ....

n/t

[Deja Q]

26. Hey, men are easier, according to stereotype...

And I can't seem to land even a one-night stand.

Speaks volumes, doesn't it?

[dorktv]

2. I would take a few days off then call again...if no answer, look

elsewhere...(by the by, is she depressed?)

[Merusault]

5. I don't think she's depressed.......

just lonely. She's extremely attractive (but very nice), and I think guys are intimidated by her.

[Kathleen04]

3. You left a message, right?

Make sure you leave a message and give her some time to call you back.

[blondeatlast]

4. Something could have come up.

A family emergency or such.

Don't give up yet. Try a weekly call, if you get no response after 2-3 weeks, move on. Of course, you should keep your options open in the meantime.

[jeter]

8. I'd move on at this point

The onus is on her now. If there was an emergency, she'd call and let you know. That she hasn't is a sign that she's not interested, but maybe is afraid to hurt your feelings.

Stalking is not the answer.

[Droopy]

12. I don't think our love seeking fellow is stalking

Just calling once a day does not qualify as stalking. I'd be wanting some answers, too. It sucks being stood up.

[Merusault]

18. Damn right (n/t)

[ant]

23. maybe not deliberately

But personally, as a woman, I can tell you that I'd be weirded out if, for whatever reason, I missed a date and then the guy was calling me every day.

Maybe she had an emergency and had to leave town, and then she comes back to all these daily phone messages. (Didn't that happen to George in a Seinfeld episode?) And if she HAS been getting the messages then she's clearly blowing him off.

Never leave more than two messages, and leave at least a day or two between them. If she hasn't gotten the message, she will eventually. And if she has gotten the message and didn't reply, that's that. There's just no point in calling more than once or twice.

[blondeatlast]

40. I'm a woman, okay? I don't call it stalking, just

allowing for something to have happened. Also, I said once a WEEK; once a day is def over the top.

If she doesn't respond in a couple of weeks, then move on (and keep his options open in the nmeantime as well).

[ant]

41. uh...yeah, it's ok

(A) I wasn't responding to your post, so I'm not sure why you're getting so defensive with me, and

(B) there's no disagreement here: you agree once a day is over the top, and once a day is what he was up to.

[acmavm]

7. You called from a friend's phone and she still didn't answer? Well,

that leaves open a lot of possibilities. Like, maybe something has come up and she's not currently available. Like maybe she's had a lot of stuff to do and none of it involves avoiding you. Maybe she's working overtime, having family problems, or whatever.

Why would you jump to the conclusion that the problem is you?

[Merusault]

9. Insecurity.......

desperation, and being a virgin.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

17. Desperation--bad thing!

No matter how desperate you are, you must never, ever show it. Women can smell it a mile off, and it's a turn-off in most cases.

There's a scene in the original (1967) version of Bedazzled (I never saw the remake) in which Dudley Moore's character is transformed into a singer singing in an anguished voice, "Love me! Please love me!" Then the devil starts singing, "I don't care. I don't know. Don't call me. Go away. You fill me with inertia." And the female audience flocks to him.

It's an exaggeration, but there's a lot of emotional truth to it. The whipped puppy attitude never won fair lady. You don't have to be mean (as some ill-informed males say), but at the early stages, you have to indicate that you'll be fine whether she likes you or not. Because in fact, you will.

(A breakup of a long-term relationship is another matter entirely, and you may not be fine for a long time.)

[Sticky]

13. Maybe she meant NEXT Wednesday?

:hi:

I hope it ends up being one of those funny misunderstandings that you'll laugh about in years to come.

[smirkymonkey]

14. It depends, if you called her the last minute

on Wednesday, she might feel that you don't respect her time. Usually if I make vague plans with anyone, male or female, and I don't hear from them w/in a day before our tentative plans were made, I usually just write them off or forget about it and make other plans.

She could just be really touchy about things like that. I get kind of insulted when anyone that I don't know REALLY well, calls me an hour or so before they want to do something. I feel like they are just making an assumption that I am always available and that my time isn't valuable.

Of course, it could be something else entirely. Are you sure she's ok?

[Droopy]

16. It sounds to me like they made plans a good 3 or 4 days ahead of time

[Merusault]

19. Yeah, we did.

I don't know. I didnt call her until 8:30 wednesday night. Maybe that irked her.

[smirkymonkey]

29. Actually, if someone didn't call

me until 8:30pm the night we were supposed to go out, I think I would have blown him off. It's just cutting it too close.

I know you asked her a few days ahead of time initially, but I don't consider it a plan until it's been confirmed. If I was actully seeing somebody, it would be different. But in the initial phase of dating, I don't consider "Hey, let's do something Wednesday" a solid date. They would at least have to call earlier in the day to confirm.

We all have our issues w/ time - some people are more spontaneous, while others need a little lead time. I think I would feel like someone who called me that late was playing "power" games with me.

I know that probably wasn't your intention, but it could be the way she interpreted it. Just sharing how I would have reacted in her place, not criticizing you. :)

[zelda7743]

33. You called at 8:30??

I'm a single female. If a guy asked me out then didn't call until 8:30, you can be damn sure I'd be pissed enough to not answer phone calls.
Write this one off....next time, make sure to set things up more solidly at least 24 hours before the date.
Best of luck. :)

[salinen]

22. Point No. 1

Next time, with another girl, you give her your number. Don't even ask for hers.

Point No. 2

Don't ask her on first date to go out for drinks! Gee, can I get you drunk.

Point No. 3

Don't call repeadedly. Yes, desperation is a big fat zit on your nose.

BTW I am a dude.

[billybob537]

24. WOMEN

I'VE BEEN MARRIED FOR 25 YEARS IF I KNEW ANYTHING ABOUT WOMEN I'D TELL YOU

[Exultant Democracy]

25. Scrap this one and try again, big sea, lots of fish.

Go out rent the movie Swingers and listen to the advice it gives on the pursuit of women. I know that it advises many things that drive the ladies nuts, but it works like a charm. Women like to pretend that they want one thing, but the fact is that they also want a challenge.

edit: just to be clear, no more calls.

[Philosophy]

27. Maybe she's dead

That would be a good excuse.

[Endangered Specie]

28. make sure you ask her to call you back...

maybe you could tell her your "worried" where she is??

Heh, you may not want to take my advice, Im in the same boat

[Susang]

30. Just read the whole thread and here's my 2 cents

It does sound like something may have happened that is keeping her extremely busy, a family emergency or maybe she might have had to go out of town, something along those lines. Since you hadn't spoken to her in a few days, she may have misunderstood and thought that your plans weren't definite.

I know you had made plans for Wednesday, but waiting until 8:30 to call her is way too late IMHO. She may have already thought you had blown her off at that point and been very upset. Just a suggestion, but next time, give her a call earlier in the day to confirm plans together. That way, if something has come up in the days in between, you would know about it.

Hope everything works out. Trust your instincts on this. If she seemed like she wanted to go out with you, she probably did. My guess is some sort of misunderstanding occurred that you will eventually get cleared up. Good luck!

[SarahB]

32. Relax and back off

If she's into you, she'll call back. If not, move on quickly. It's hard enough to deal with things like this that happen AFTER it gets intense and mutual. No need for heartbreak before the connection's even been made.

[SOteric]

34. I'm surprised no one else has pointed this out, but..

are you certain she hasn't been called out of town on a family emergency? Do you know whether she's perhaps been called away on business?

I mean, if she's not answering even when you call from someone else's phone...maybe she's just not there.

[freeforall]

35. It sounds as though

she might have had second thoughts about going out, in which case it would have been courteous to let you know that she had changed her mind. Barring that, she may have had to go out of town or something (but it is still polite to call and let you know).

In any case Merusault, this says more about her than it does about you. Women who are lonely and looking for male atttention, then play coy are not worth the trouble. There are plenty out there who will be direct and courteous if they can't keep a date. Sometimes it's hard to say, "I've changed my mind" and do it diplomatically. But that kind of honesty is a valuable quality.

Always, always, people's behaviour is not about you - but about themselves and things they are dealing with. So, you might be better off with a woman who would be happy to keep her date with you.

<end of soapbox lecture, LOL!>

BTW...I'm a female, so "been there, seen most of it, if not all!"

Good luck.

[put out]

36. Did you give her your number?

Perhaps you could leave one last message, and give her a way to get ahold of you. Then it's up to her, and you are not doing all that calling. Please stop all the telephone calls. Give her your number. Why not, you have hers.

[Th1onein]

37. Don't read things into her behavior......

She's probably busy and not at home.

[Merusault]

39. Interesting replies

I really appreciate all the suggestions. I'm going to trust my instinct on this one, which tells me to back off a little but not give up. I think that once I do get a hold of her I'm going to apologize for not calling until almost 9 the night we were supposed to go out. That was dumb.

[TXlib]

42. My suggestions:

Always set a specific time and place for the first date. The first date should occur as soon as is convenient after you ask, and should be something small and non-committal -- going to a coffee shop, for example.

Exchange phone numbers or email addresses. Offer yours (one phone number, and one email address -- any more info and you becoem "creepy desperate guy"). If she reciprocates, take it; if not, don't push it.

If your intended misses the date, do not immediately assume you were stood up. Wait that evening for her to call. The next day, call her, and indicate your concern that wrong happened. If you get her personally on the phone, you'll be able to tell if there's any sense pursuing it. If so, set a new date. If you get an answering machine or roommate, leave a message WITH YOUR PHONE NUMBER AND NAME.

Then don't call back for a week; If you haven't heard by then, the most likely reasons are that she is not interested, or that she was extremely preoccupied; either way, daily calling will NOT be appreciated. It is fairly unlikely that she lost your number or didn't get the message. A week after your first message, call back once more, but not again after that. She's either not interested, or too busy for a relationship now.

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that, since you are the kind who called every day, and even called from a different number to see if she was just avoiding you, and that you described yourself as desperate, that it is likely that you display your desperation on your sleeve.

If you have any female friends, I would suggest asking them to help you perform a personal inventory, and ask them to be brutally honest.

[ieoeja]

43. Walk Away

If you didn't call til 8:30p you are DEFINITELY on the shit list. Some guy pulled that on my ex-wife. He tried calling her several times afterwards. Finally he paused for about a month before trying yet again "just to make sure everything was okay". She managed to be cordial when she told him to take a hike.

[hussar]

45. Women don't make me scream

They want you then they don't so you say ok forget it and hey they want you even more so you say ok and then they blow you out!

It's a no win situation my friend, I'm 46 and still don't understand them and I thought us men were supposed to be unemotional.