Does size really matter?

[elfwitch]

Not that kind of size you bunch of gutter minds!

I was driving to work the other day and heard a story about a couple that had been "engaged" for a really long time. The guy told his girl that he would finally marry her but only if she could fit in to the jeans she wore when they first met. Basically he was saying I'll marry you if you lose weight.

Now that, in of itself, it pretty horrific. But the truly disgusting part of this story is that the lady in question was currently a size 6 and he wanted her to get back down to a size 2.

Let me put this in perspective for you. A size 6 is at the high end of the scale 34-26-36 a size 2 is 32-24-32. So we are talking about a 2 inch difference at the bust, waist, and hip. In either case, these are pretty tiny girls we are talking about.

And she agreed to do it. Low self esteem must be a real bitch.

So the question is... Does size matter? Would you stop dating someone for getting a little bigger? Would you not marry someone who had creeped up a couple of sizes? Would you make weight loss (not for health reasons but for YOUR vanity reasons) a requirement for continuing a relationship?

[lazarus]

1. only for health reasons

That's it.

I fell in love with a person, not a body. Anybody that shallow is also going to be the kind to dump her when she gets "too old" and he needs another trophy to show off.

And I agree with you regarding her self-esteem issues.

[elfwitch]

5. Would you dump them

if their weight was effecting their health or try to get them some help?

[lazarus]

10. Oh, help

Just help. Dump the person I love? I still love them, even if their health is in danger.

If she got cancer, I'd still love her. Same thing.

[underpants]

2. Why wouldn't yuo say something when it was happening?

NOt scolding them or anything but just encouraging them and so forth.

Pretty dicey subject anyway but no I wouldn't tell them that is why, maybe I am being dishonest but I would like to think I would find another way to breach the subject.

[pagerbear]

18. I can assure you...

...it will not have escaped her notice that she has gained weight, and the only thing you could say that would be appropriate would be that it makes no difference--only when asked.

[david_vincent]

3. Not me

Never have in the past, and this is a topic that could quite easily be exploited in my current relationship, but I won't do it. She is all too keenly aware of her weight gain and absolutely doesn't need me adding to her self-consciousness. I *never* discuss it.

[BlueEyedSon]

4. Low self esteem is

letting yourself go from size 2 to size 6.

I know, I had an awful winter and gained a bunch of weight.

:(

[elfwitch]

9. you've got to be kidding?

Low self esteem wouldn't cause a shift from 2 to 6. There are many natural factors that could cause such a shift. What if she was living amiserable life as a 2? What if staying a 2 meant she wasn't eating right or taking pills to stay that way?

And a 6 is in no way large. The average size of American women ranges between 10-16. So a 6 is really small.

[BlueEyedSon]

21. Not to belabor the point,

The "average size" of an American (male or female) is not the world average or "optimal" size for a healthy human being.

[LagaLover]

46. Size is is NOT really small

I'm 5'9 140 and I wear a size 6.

[dawn]

54. It's small.

I'm 5'5" and 130, and I'm an 8, which is considered medium. (Well, at least in my opinion.) But then again, according to some on DU, I'm a heifer.


Of course, at some stores like Ann Taylor, I'm a 6, but their sizing is way off.

[amazona]

58. hmmm

I'm 5'3, 120, and I wear a size 6 -- well, at least in the thrift store. I went shopping for new clothes recently and couldn't find a thing until I dropped down a size. I guess there is no real standard but it makes it frustrating to shop when they keep changing things.

[dawn]

52. Hmmm...low self-esteem isn't always tied to weight gain.

And you know what..alot of people are like me. I eat when I'm happy, and don't eat when sad or stressed.


Unfortunately, I am usually happy, so I have to exercise quite a bit so I don't gain weight. :)

[Nikia]

66. Probably not

It said that they were engaged for a really long time. Gaining weight over a number of years is not that unusual. If they started dating when she was relatively young like late teens or early twenties, increasing in size is normal. Shoulders, hip bones, and other frame bones continue to grow until most people reach their mid twenties. She may have been a very low fat both before and after if her hip bones grew a couple inches. If she was older, most women start gaining weight as they approach menopause if they do not change their diet or exercise patterns.
As far as being healthy, most women at size 2 are at an unhealthy or at least less healthy weight than their optimal weight unless they are very small framed. Size 6-8 is the size that most medium framed women are at optimal weight for health. Being underweight can be just as if not more unhealthy than being mildly overweight. Every woman is different but probably for 90% of women, it is healthier to be size 6 than size 2 from a purely medical standpoint.
My husband has made not the nicest comments about large women, some of who are my friends. He was alright with me being 155 pounds at 5'5'' though. When I lost weight and then lost more than I intended when I got sick, I got down to 120 pounds and he still thought I was attractive. He made some comment about how he felt that he was getting a variety by the change in my body type. Now I am holding steady at 130 pounds, size 8, which seems to be a good weight for me.
My husband, himself, is overweight. He was overweight when I met him and taller and larger framed than I thought that my "ideal" man would be. I love him though and would have never made him lose weight if he wanted to marry me.
If I were this woman, I'd be concerned. Is she going to be able to maintain size 2 when she gets older? If he does not find her attractive at size 6, will he find her attractive at age 45? 55? 65? Physical beauty is fleeting. Lasting relationships need to be based on more than just physical attraction.

[VelmaD]

6. She shouldn't just dump his ass...

she should whack him upside the head with a tire iron.

[ewagner]

11. The only women I was EVER

interested in would have chosen the tire iron option.

that is, I'd only be interested in women who were emotionally strong, smart and wouldn't put up with that kind of crap from their SO.

[smirkymonkey]

35. Here, Here!!

I second that. Unless you are about 3 feet tall, there is no way that a size 6 can be considered big. Unless, of course, you are an asshole.

[camero]

7. No

Everyone gets bigger as they age. The funny thing is that the girlfriends I've had had lost weight when they were with me for some reason. Maybe from all the activity? :)

[afraid_of_the_dark]

8. Size doesn't matter.

That guy is a pig - especially considering she was a 6 to begin with. If you don't like the way your partner looks, then either deal with it or get out of the relationship. If the person has healthy eating habits and they are at a healthy weight (not too thin or heavy), I don't see why a few pounds makes a difference.

[scarlet_owl]

12. That's disgusting.

What is this marriage going to be based on? "I'll love you as long as you're thin, honey." I was a size eight when I met my husband, a size ten when we were married, and now I'm a sixteen. He still loves me just as much, and he is supportive of my trying to lose weight, not demanding. And I might add that he's gained forty pounds in that span of time, but he still makes me think I'm the luckiest gal in the world every time I see him. True love isn't based on appearances. I hate to sound like this, but don't expect this marriage to last long.

[elfwitch]

13. My hubby...

has had the decency to put on two pounds for every one of mine.

[pagerbear]

22. You are one lucky woman!

Does he have a brother? <wink>

[elfwitch]

31. He did...

His older brother was quite cute and quite gay. Alas he died many years ago in an accident.

[Kolesar]

23. "Through thick and through thin..."

That's what the vows said!

[cally]

14. Dump the guy now

If the relationship is based on this, than noone needs it. Life gets complicated and noone can be the same as when they were young. He's not just asking about weight and size but showing that he wants her to remain the same as when he met her. That's just scary.

A size 6 or 2 is very small. Only a small percentage of adult women are this size even if they have no fat on them.

[skippysmom]

15. That's horrible

First of all, size 6 is NOT big. Most women would love to be a size 6.

Second of all, the guy sounds like an ass and a control freak. It sounds like she'll never measure up to his standards. If I were her, I'd run. People like that are scary.

[KinkyDem]

16. As someone with some unusual relationship "rules"

I have little room to judge someone else. On the other hand I think this is a bit extreme. I would want to know more before I would say this is a terrible thing. What if this woman is 4 foot 10 inches tall? A size 2 doesn't sound out of the question.

My brother and his wife had a similar deal, he though, had to quit smoking ciggerettes. He went on the patch and she bought a tred mill.

Even if it is not the way you would live your life, must we go about criticizing others simply because they make choices we disagree with ... even superficialy?

[elfwitch]

17. If we didn't do that...

we wouldn't have much else to talk about. One can only discuss important issues for so long before your head gets numb. Superficial stuff is fun.

[VelmaD]

20. I think there's a big difference...

between the kind of "unusual relationship rules" you're talking about and this situation honey. There was no indication that they were in "that" kind of relationship.

And frankly, even if the woman was only 4'10" a size 6 is still teeny and it's nobody's place to tell her what her weight has to be. Anybody who makes their "love" conditional on your weight wouldn't really know what love was if it came up and bit them on the ass. I think this guy is a loser and she should dump his ass...after she hits him on the head with a tire iron. :)

[KinkyDem]

33. I don't

I wish more people would look at marriage realisticly.

It is a contract between two people(I'm not gonna pick nits if you don't, most of you already know where I stand on this one). Aside from that it should in my opinion involve love and sexual desire between the people involved.

If part of that contract states that she is to reach and maintain some ideal wieght for him, who cares? In my opinion, it would be less healthfull for him to say require her to wear a corset or some other restrictive undergarment.

The questions I would ask here are; what has HE given to the mix? Is he buff? Is he a fat slob who doesn't take care of himself? What deal breakers is she allowed to bring in?

We simply don't have enough information to judge this.

[VelmaD]

37. Sorry, but I still think...

this guy is a superficial shmuck. If your deal-breaker for marrying someone is what size clothes they wear then you don't deserve a life-partner as far as I'm concerned.

[elfwitch]

38. Amen sister!!

If he is in love with the size 2 he could just go find somebody else who fits that size. If he was in love with the woman, it really wouldn't matter what the tag on her clothes said. Besides, size is really relative. You can't go to four different stores and pick out four of the same size and actually have them be the same size.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

19. i think that size does matter

what people deem attractive differs from person to person..however i think its mean to say i will marry you if you lose weight...if you are no longer attracted to someone i think you should break up..but make a legit reason that is not cruel..i think its just as cruel to stay with someone you are not attracted to..i think the woman in question deserves someone who loves her as a size 6...not someone who only loved her as a 2...

i recently went up from a size 4 to 6 and i think its a significant difference...

[elfwitch]

24. I haven't been a size 6 since Jr. High...

Most women cannot be that small. I couldn't be that small if I cut off my boobs and borrowed a skinny woman's butt.

One of the things that irks us curvy girls more than anything else is hearing a size 6,4,2,0 saying how they need to lose weight. Where are you going to lose it from?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

25. from my tummy and thighs

i have big boobs and a butt even when i am a size 4

[VelmaD]

30. I wanta make sure you take this the right way

I'm concerned for anyone who is a size 4 or 6 and thinks they need to lose weight. This comes straight out of my own experience. I was a size 22/24 a couple of years ago and am now a size 10. I know what fat really is. I hope you aren't being hyper-critical of your body.

[VelmaD]

27. No shit

Nothing drives me more nuts than hearing some woman I who I could wrap my hands completely around her waist tell me she "feels so fat". :eyes:

Hell, I wasn't a 6 in Junior High - was already too curvy for a 6 back then. I'm a size 10 now at age 33. (Down from a 22/24 back in February of 2002.) According to the BMI I'm at a normal weight for someone my height (I'm just under 5'9"). I'm working on being an 8 but I'm not killing myself to do it.

I couldn't be a 6 if you liposuctioned my entire body. Got hips. :)

[La Lioness Priyanka]

29. yes but i am much shorter than you

and i think a four is appropriate for me

[VelmaD]

32. Could be...

if you're happy and healthy at a 4 then go for it. :) I've met people naturally that teeny (usually people with the metabolism of a hummingbird who could eat everything in sight and not gain weight).

[La Lioness Priyanka]

64. i am happier and healthier at 4 than i am at 6

and my gf is a 10 and she was a 8 when we met...and i will not break up with her...however if i am unattracted to her for whatever reason i owe it to her to leave

[GOPisEvil]

26. That's pretty f-ing revolting!

I wouldn't mind if my SO were to show concern about my health and suggest I drop some lbs, but require it? That's sick. And to go along with that requirement? Even sicker.

[SarahB]

28. I think I was loved more when I was fatter

I'm still not a skinny minnie. I'm a rather voluptuous 10, but I used to be an 18 and there seemed to be less problems in my marriage when I was. I was less secure with myself and was therefore more of a doormat, other men hardly noticed me, and he didn't have to feel insecure. The first thing that happened when the baby weight came off again was wicked insecurity started rearing it's ugly head in snappy attitudes and controlling behaviors (which was there before, but became even worse) which has pretty much driven me away emotionally.

[KinkyDem]

34. SarahBelle

How long ago was the kid born?
How much weight has the hubby gained?
Is he felling left out with the baby there?

Men have some very strong reactions to having a kid in the house and sometimes it's pretty frieghtening to loose that attention. Then on top of that to have other men suddenly leering at your wife .. yeah, some men will have a problem with that.

Can he talk about any of it or he simply closed off and lashing out?

[SarahB]

36. Well

Our oldest is 12 and our youngest is 2, so we've been used to children for a long time. He's not much heavier than we were when we were married. It's not about an adjustment. This is a long term permanent issue that has been talked to death. Something I used to think was "cute" when I was 18 and we were first together, but as a grown woman who has been faithful to him for 13 and 1/2 years, it has become exhausting and personally limiting to keep trying to placate someone else's insecurities.

[11 Bravo]

39. She should RUN, not walk away from this jerk.

At age 47 and after giving me two beautiful sons, my wife will never again fit into the clothes she wore when we met and fell in love. But when I look at her I still see the most beautiful and most desireable woman on the planet.

[elfwitch]

that is what my hubby says about me...

We've decided to go all Burton and Taylor and get louder and fatter and rowdier as we get older.

[nini]

40. OH HELL NO! After I got done kicking his ass...

... I'd pack his stuff and out he goes. Actually, I don't even know if I'd pack it - I'd just throw it outside. Maybe even a bonfire :evilgrin:

I would NEVER put up with someone so superficial and who obviously doesn't understand what love really is.

If you love someone - truly love them - you would NEVER put any kind of demand on them especially for appearances only. Worrying about their health is one thing but for the reasons above.. NO WAY.


It's always going to be something with someone like that. It's a control tactic and that girl should run for the hills and find someone else.

urgh

[GOPisEvil]

41. No wonder guys are scared of you Amazons!

;-)

[nini]

44. LOL.. Like I could even be a size 2 EVER

God, You're such a smartass.. no wonder we get along :-)


Hey.. someone doesn't like me big - to hell with 'em! It's their loss and I don't have time for such nonsense. Ah, the joys of getting older and not worrying about other's opinions anymore.

[GOPisEvil]

48. Better a smartass than a dumbass!

I've said that twice today! I think it should become my motto or something. :-)

[nini]

57. maybe that should be in your sig line.

you're no dumbass - that's for sure.

smartass - yes.. Dumbass - nah

[Vladimir]

42. Physical attraction is part of the equation

The guy in question is an asshole, but if I was dating someone and over time didn't find them attractive any more, I would break up with them. Making demands like that is ridiculous, but if a relationship isn't working anymore on whatever level... best to end it.

V

[nini]

47. yep, but after some point in the relationship it should be soul..

to which you are most attracted. While you may prefer your mate to be the size you want it shouldn't make you think you should leave.

I guess if you do then you didn't really love the 'person' in the first place so maybe you should leave.

[Vladimir]

55. No doubt

but sometimes the only way you know for sure you aren't in love is when the spark goes... thing is a lot of people like to delude themselves that they are in love. Maybe I am just a cynical bastard.

V

[CShine]

43. Anyone else notice the slender girls in elfwitch's sig & avatar????

I think she's already answered her own questions.

[elfwitch]

45. My sig girl is not slender.

Here is the whole picture.


This girl has junk in the trunk , her thighs more than meet at the top and she has matronly upper arms.

[Blue-Jay]

49. Do these pants make my ass look fat?

I'm just asking...

[elfwitch]

50. Nah...

It's the fat!

Just kidding. You are hot no matter what size your pants are!

[dawn]

51. No. And I feel sorry for that girl.

If someone said that to me, I'd show them the door.

I'm sure she could get someone better than that prick.

[amazona]

53. I was in a similar situation, the man has an illness

I dated a man who I did not recognize at the time was suffering from full-blown bulimia and exercise bulimia. All I saw was that he was at his all-time lowest weight (I didn't know at first that he had ever been slightly overweight) and that he had that skinny look I liked. But soon there was trouble in paradise. I was (still am) a size 6/7 but he said that he preferred that a woman not have curves, which is not really possible for me without surgery or anorexia. I was already getting into some eating disordered behaviors that were quite unhealthy, and the more our relationship went on, the less I was able to eat. I wasn't deliberately trying to vomit or to starve myself; it was like a compulsion, my throat would close and I could not force food down. Or if I did, I would throw up even if I tried to keep it down. Since that experience, I have been convinced that eating disorders are a contagious disease.

At this time, I am involved with a man who is frankly fat, and I do have hang-ups about it, but if I am obsessed with an unhealthy heroin chic skinny look then it is my job to shut up about it and not pass on my problem to my partner. That is what love is all about. I will support him in safe weight loss efforts if and when he chooses, but I am also realistic that he (like most fat men) may not be able to lose all the weight. Demanding, pouting, and screaming that someone change something not under their control is just drama queen behavior and not conducive to a loving relationship.

In other words, for the sake of her own life and sanity, the woman in your news story should tell the man to take a hike. Fetish is fine, but to ask someone to do something unhealthy to their body before you accept them -- that just plain crosses the line. I'm even fairly conflicted about pro-ana (when a woman is anorexia by choice because she prefers that look) -- mainly because I'm not sure it is a choice. I don't think I put my fetish for skinny in my own head; I think it was put there by the fad for skinny when I was growing up. If I had a choice, I would choose to be attracted to a normal fully developed body without having to undergo lots of mental gyrations.

[MrSlayer]

56. It does matter.

At the risk of being insensitive I'd like to say that if my wife turned into a whale I would not be physically attracted to her anymore. Not that I wouldn't still love her but fat chicks do not turn me on.

[elfwitch]

61. What is your definintion of a WHALE?

Is a size 12 a whale? How about a size 16? Maybe a 20?
Where does whaleness begin?

[dawn]

62. But at what point is she considered fat?

That's part of the point. And while I appreciate your honesty, I don't care for the use of the word "whale" to describe a female.

[IronLionZion]

59. actually some women might be too thin

for my tastes but no I'm not that shallow. I've said it before and I'll say it again...I like big butts and I can not lie!

[Florida_Geek]

60. IMHO, depends on the guy

If he is a health nut and has the classic 6 Pack then yes. Else no.

[ScreamingMeemie]

63. Here is my story...if you are interested. I dated my husband at 19 when

I weighed 118 lbs, which at 5'9" is a health detriment. We went our separate ways. I ran into him again 3 year later at around 150, we fell in love...again (maybe we never fell out ;) ) and got married. Due to depression issues and several failed pregnancies, I ballooned up to 298. Guess what? He stuck around, I still got kisses, he still wanted to see me naked. ;) Then I got sick and lost 150ish pounds. Guess what? I'm still with the same guy!!! And we have wonderful memories spanning that entire period! Crazy, ain't it? :hi:

[Samurai_Writer]

65. I have had men break up with me because of my weight

While I was in college, I dated this guy for about a year. I was not thin, 5'10" and about 170#, a size 18 or so. I did not gain any more weight while we were dating, but after a year, he breaks up with me. Reason: I'm too fat.

Well, you can probably figure out that it was a tremendous blow to my self esteem, especially in the college years, when 20-somethings are so hung up on what other people think of them, for the most part. I did not date again for two years after that.

I have been every weight between 120# and 320# in the past 30 years of my adult life. I'm now about 275#, size 24/26. It took me a long time to learn to love myself no matter WHAT my size, and to realize if someone is so shallow they don't appreciate me just because of my size, screw 'em!

Now I do BBW modelling, and have all these 'model groupies' who beg to go out with me. It's a terrific boost to my self esteem and self confidence (not that I need it, but it feels great!), even if I don't accept the dates offered (most of the time I don't).

Anyone who demands a person change themselves physically for a relationship has some serious issues and it is better to leave that person before they do serious emotional damage.