I was fired for stealing

[realisticphish]

Well, no, I was fired for an accusation of stealing. I stole nothing.

It was a crappy 8/hr retail job that I had worked for 2 years with little incident. The safe came up $5 short, and they fired me. Some lady had dropped a five dollar bill. The manager put it in the safe monday night. Thus, the safe should have been $5 over. I counted it even the next morning. I don't know if I miscounted, or what, but there it is.

Here's my problem. I'm trying to move on, and just get a new job. But I don't know how to describe this firing in my resume. I wasn't downsized, or anything like that. And all the resume sites say to never put anything negative about managers, and also to never lie

SO WHAT THE FUCK DO I PUT?

I thought about saying "will discuss," but I don't know if that will work. If I write "accused of stealing, but I didn't do it" BWAMP, right into the trash can.

I also thought about writing to the manager who did it, who is at least a former friend, and basically asking her to not sabotage me to another company. But I don't know if that's a good idea, and I certainly not going to ask her to lie.

I'm fucking panicking now. I was ok last night (fired yesterday afternoon), but after thinking about what I need to do now, I am lost.

[NJmaverick]

1. If this is a large chain store I would contact the HR department

this sounds like a case of wrongful termination. I would also contact a labor lawyer to see if you have any legal options, as well as the labor board.

[MajorChode]

41. I seriously doubt there are too many options

If you don't have a contract, you are considered an at-will employee which means your employer can terminate you at any time for just about any reason. Just about the only exception is for violation of one or more equal opportunity laws and from the OP's description this doesn't appear to be the case. A few states do have good faith laws regarding terminations, but even those laws are pretty toothless. If an employer wants to fire you, there's not a lot you can do about it.

[PassingFair]

2. Downsized due to staff reduction.

It's probably the truth anyway.

No future employer will question it.

Please don't sweat this. $5.00 is not
worth going around the bend over, which
is why I suspect that the missing money
was just construed as an opportunity to
down-size you.

Good luck!

:hug:

[peekaloo]

3. that was my impression, too.

I agree with the use of "staff reduction" .

Don't know what has changed in the past few years but it used to be a prospective employer can only call to confirm past employment, nothing else.

:-)

[realisticphish]

5. well

LEGALLY, yes. But I wonder how much that's followed...

[peekaloo]

13. Take post #1's advice and contact the HR Dept.

That dept. is the one who would (or should) be contacted by any future employer. In my experience, at least, they go by the book so as not to get the legal team involved.

Good luck. :hug:

[Arkansas Granny]

16. You're right. Some employers are not aware that there are legal limits to

the information they are allowed to give on former employees. Many are completely unaware of the limits on questions they can ask prospective employees.

[AlienGirl]

17. I had a former employer give a reference that included health data!

He told the HR department what I'd been out sick with--MRSA--as well as telling them that I was "overly emotional" and "eccentric." I learned this in my post-hire review, when I got to look at my personnel file including all the notes from the references the new employer had called.

Tucker

[Arkansas Granny]

19. I've had to remind my boss before that he can't ask age, marital status

and other questions when interviewing job applicants.

[KamaAina]

31. Can't ask about disability, either

just "Would you be able to perform the duties of the job, with or withour reasonable accommodation?"

NOT "How far can you see with those glasses, anyway?", "How long have you been in a wheelchair?", etc.

[Ineeda]

42. when I was a manager,

even when an employee was caught red-handed, we could NEVER imply theft. They were fired for "mishandling of company funds." One has to actually be charged - police involvement, etc. or risk a lawsuit. Keep that in mind if you get wind that your former employer even has hinted such a thing, and threaten suit. Don't for one minute think they don't know that. Also, yes, all we could do if called for a reference was to verify employment, not even answer the question, "would you hire him/her again."

[realisticphish]

45. that's what I'm thinking

but... I've heard managers say much more than that, personally. Of course, to be fair, I don't know if that was an employment verification, or if they were listed as a reference.

[grace0418]

14. Really depends on the place. I know they are supposed to only confirm past

employment but I've personally witnessed a lot more being asked and/or revealed about former employees. It pissed me off.

[realisticphish]

4. what scares me

is that this is the longest job I've held. If I put "cannot contact previous employer," like many applications put, that's suspicious as hell. If I flat out lie, could that come back to haunt me?

I've never left a job on anything other than amicable terms, and I just don't know what to do.

[ipfilter]

7. I wouldn't sweat it too much.

Unless your next job requires a security clearance or something.

[joeybee12]

29. Don't worry about it...say reduction in staff...no charges were filed, right?

They'll never check...

[Deep13]

6. more like a math error

Who the hell steals $5?

[realisticphish]

9. no shit

I just don't understand; these managers were my friends. The store manager is only 20, and I worked with her with both of us as cashiers when I started.

The only thing I asked them is how they could think that I would jeopardize my job over $5 goddamn dollars. They didn't answer.

To top that, on another occasion, I told her that the safe was 20 dollars over. I VOLUNTEERED THAT. Another time, my drawer was 50 short. I told them about this, and offered to replace the money on the spot!

I have plenty of cash in the bank. I've bought food for people, I lend people money, I've helped people move. And this is what I get. Not even a breath of consideration. Not even a warning!

Fuck them, I'm glad to leave. That job sucked balls. I just don't want to screw up getting a NEW job.

[SacredCow]

8. Over 5$????

You WERE downsized.... They were looking for ANY reason to get rid of you and took this as their opportunity. However, I think this was a bad choice on their part. Unless they can prove this wasn't an error, I think you have grounds for wrongful dismissal. But if you hated the place anyway- maybe it is best to move on.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

10. Friend of mine got fired from a bank for bouncing a check...

Wasn't even his fault, somebody else's check bounced and that caused him to have an overdraft.

And some companies really will terminate you if the drawer is off. Period.

I would fudge on the subject until you get to the interview, then explain the situation. Most people in the industry know the policy (and many don't agree with it), so you're likely to get a fair hearing.

[realisticphish]

12. I'm good in interviews

I'm just trying to choose the best way to make sure I get TO the interview.

[realisticphish]

11. well, I'm not looking for any trouble

I'm not going to apply for unemployment (Ohio is an at-will state, so there would be a lengthy contest between my and the company), I'm willing to move on. I just don't want to sabotage my job applications by fucking up now.

[grace0418]

15. RIF, reduction in force. The bright side to the recession, if you can call it a bright side,

is that sooooooooooo many people have been laid off that no one bats an eyelash at the reason anymore. No one even bothers to ask much about it. I got laid off last December and have been working steadily as a freelancer ever since. If I were to go in for an interview for a full-time position tomorrow, though, no one would question why I've been "out of work" for almost a year or why I got laid off. I have lots of friends who were laid off the same day who *are* looking for full-time jobs still, so I know how it is out there. Not to scare you about it, because these were people making $50K or more. I think you'll find a job as least as good as the one you had pretty quickly. Just try not to panic, and remember to write that you were part of a Reduction in Force, because it's the truth. Hang in there.
:hug:

[JVS]

18. Get yourself some whiskey and forget about it for now.

You're probably still too shaken up from your mistreatment to think logically enough, or maneuver skillfully enough in your dealings with potential employers/ the managers. Get settled and then proceed calmly with a plan.

[realisticphish]

20. you're probably right

I've always had a bad habit of dwelling on things, and imagining alternate ways it could have happened, etc, etc. Which helps not at all.

I think I've calmed down enough to move on now. Not really panicking anymore. This morning I basically sat and stared into space for an hour, just thinking. I just can't do that anymore :D

[Sanity Claws]

21. Apply for unemployment

They will likely challenge it because they will claim you were fired for a disqualifying cause. That's when you get a hearing as to what this was about and that they have no proof as to the alleged reason.
An order that you be paid unemployment because the accusation is baseless will help you in clearing your name, and I hope, get you a job.
good luck.

[rcrush]

26. Or they might just throw away the notice when they get it

If they do that then you automatically get approved for unemployment. At least here they do.

[datasuspect]

22. say nothing

except that you were laid off. it wasn't about the 5 bucks. the manager might have just been an ass. refer prospective employers to the corporate office if there is one for strictly employment verification.

or list my company on your resume and i will give you a glowing reference. say you did contract work for me for the past 5 years or something.

[tonekat]

23. Don't sweat it too much

It was a cowardly way to downsize you.

Most professional employers will only tell people you worked there, period. There are lots of penalties for those who make unsubstantiated remarks, and they know it. Don't draw attention to it.

[zonkers]

24. I'd hire you. You seem straightforward, conscientious and have good english comp skills!

[rcrush]

25. Lie. They most likely will not check

And most places have a policy not to discuss why former employees leave the company. I worked at 3 retail stores that had that policy they wouldnt tell anyone if a person quit or got fired.

[JonLP24]

27. I don't have anything helpful to add

My observation is this thread has quite a high view to post ratio. That is all. :)

[la_chupa]

28. it was a dead end job and you're looking for more of a challenge

Is there an old manager whose name you could give who doesn't work there anymore?

Is it unethical to brainstorm on ways to lie about this?

I'm thinking the HR suggestion was the way to go, something fishy is going on and they used this $5 as a lame excuse.

Tell them the manager was stalking you and fired you when you took out a restraining order. It won't get you another job, but chances are they will remember you.

[realisticphish]

38. this is what I'm thinking

my old manager, who is now at another store in the area, was great to me. I think I'm going to email her and tell her what's going on, and ask if she will be my business reference for that job. She hates my current manager, so I'm inclined to think she will.

[TZ]

30. Well if this had happened this time last week

I would have driven into Columbus and kicked some idiot retail ass for you...:hug:

[realisticphish]

40. a skeptical hit squad

the S-Team :D

[ZombieHorde]

32. I don't have any advice, but I wanted to say I love your avatar. nt

[Gormy Cuss]

33. List the job on your resume and talk up the positives.

No reason to show that you were fired on the resume, but you should be prepared to address it honestly in an interview. By honestly I mean state that you were accused of stealing $5.00 without any proof and that you were not given an opportunity to clear your name. Lying about it has a high potential for backfiring.

I'd also pursue the matter as others have mentioned. It sounds like you were fired on a very weak basis and it may in fact have been an attempt to avoid paying unemployment.


and my standard caveat:I'm not a lawyer and I don't play one on DU.

[Rabrrrrrr]

34. Put "They didn't have the balls (and were too stingy) to tell me I was laid off, so they trumped up

some bullshit reason to fire me for 'stealing' so that I couldn't get unemployment."

Or, just put down no reason. Just tell 'em you left.

The store that you left can't disclose the real reason for why your job there ended.

[mnhtnbb]

35. Do not lie on a job application. Contact your State Bar association and see

if they have a list of local labor attorneys who will give a pro bono opinion or reduced consultation
fee on your chances of at least getting the employer to list your termination as a layoff so
you can get unemployment. If you've been fired for cause I don't think you're eligible for unemployment.

Some big companies love to get rid of people without going through proper documentation when people
are fired for cause.

You may also have a very good case to sue the company for reinstatement (although personally, I wouldn't want to go back to work for someone who'd treated me this way)or at least some kind of damages.

[realisticphish]

39. and this is the thing

I don't really care about reinstatement, or even unemployment. I just don't want to lose out on a future job because the word "steal" is in there somewhere. I was already planning in finding a labor lawyer to at least discuss that aspect with. Honestly, they didn't actually say what the firing is listed as. I don't really want to contact the store manager, but it's kind of important. I might try calling corporate, and just asking. Or calling a coworker who's still there.

[necso]

36. Sounds like you were wrongfully terminated.

I'd get some legal advice. There's probably a state (county?) office you can call, but I'd also look for the advice of a labor advocacy-group/lawyer.

Making a stink might leave a bad aroma, but acquiescing in this wrongful termination might seem like admitting a crime.

Get some knowledgable, experienced, practical, disinterested(!) advice.

[XemaSab]

37. That SUCKS

I hope you find something else soon. :(

[jobycom]

43. My spouse was fired for theft once. She's a bank VP now.

The place that fired her was torn down and replaced with a huge casino. No remnant of it remains. (Oh yeah, she didn't do it, either. One of the owner's kids was stealing, and he fired several people, one after the other, to avoid admitting it was his own child.)

Don't sweat it, life is made of little stories like that. You'll move past it and you'll look down on the petty idiots who fired you, and probably be a better person because of it.

As for how to handle it on a resume, just put "terminated." Don't explain unless they say in the ad you have to explain, then just explain as simply as you can. Evasiveness is the worst approach, so don't try euphamisms, in person or on the application. That will make them assume the worst. On the other hand, don't say theft unless you have to. "Terminated because my register came up $5 short," is ok--they might think theft, but they won't be sure.

In person explain the situation, but don't whine or get defensive, and don't seem smug. And NEVER sound like you are attacking your supervisor, even passive-aggressively. Just the facts. "The till was five dollars over one night, and five dollars short the next day. They weren't sure if I stole it or miscounted, but they decided to terminate me over it." Answer any further questions bluntly, not defensively. "No, I didn't steal it, but of course I had no way to prove it." Leave your feelings of them out of it. That alone will win you brownie points. On the other hand, don't sound cavalier, or that will seem suspicious, as though you just don't care.

And if they ask for a resume, send a cover letter extolling your virtues. You write well, and that will make you seem smart, and that will be enough to get them past the word "terminated" in your resume. Don't put anything negative in the cover letter unless they demand it.

One more thing: since they didn't prove you stole anything, they may not even put "theft" in your file. When I used to manage retail, high turnover was expected. There was a general fear of lawsuits for defamation of character and wrongful termination, so they rarely put "theft" in a file unless they could prove it. The less certain they are, the less they want someone questioning them about it. One of my friends was fired for suspicion of theft, but we were told that on employment verification questions to just say she was laid off. Companies in general are afraid to give too much information in verifications. So don't worry too much about callbacks. The company probably won't brag about firing you for an unproven suspicion.

Just my thoughts. And understand, at least some of your emotion right now is the anger and frustration of being falsely accused. It's always hard to believe that someone can believe that about you, and that's making you feel even worse. It's a shock that takes a little while to set in. Just realize your emotions are going to be messed up over it, and try to compensate by heightening your rational reactions to it, and minimizing your emotions over it.

And good luck. This is a minor blip in your life and you'll barely think about it by Mardi Gras next year. Keep that in perspective.

[realisticphish]

44. thanks

that is a lot of great advice. The manager and assitant that fired me might have had something else to say, but I walked out as soon as they said that they had to "terminate my employment." I was afraid of what I would say or do.

Seriously, that is a great post. It should be on the front page :D

*as an aside, I find it intriguing that this is probably getting the most replies out of any thread I've ever started. The internet loves misery ;)