AP: Dianne Feinstein Endorses Kerry

[DJcairo]

By The Associated Press

September 16, 2003, 2:10 PM EDT


SAN FRANCISCO -- Democrat John Kerry's presidential bid got an influential endorsement Tuesday from California Sen. Dianne Feinstein, who praised him for having the "strength, experience, leadership and judgment to be an excellent president."

Feinstein is the state's senior senator and arguably the most popular politician in vote-rich California. She is one of only two senators to endorse Kerry's presidential bid so far -- the other being his Massachusetts colleague, Sen. Ted Kennedy.

In a statement, Feinstein said she was supporting Kerry for his leadership on a number of issues, including health care, tax policy and the environment. She also singled out his support for gun control and, specifically, a ban on assault weapons, which Feinstein wrote and is trying to extend over Republican objections.

"The assault weapon ban will expire next year," Feinstein wrote. "We need a president who will actively urge Congress to extend it, and John Kerry will do just that."

The endorsement comes at a critical time for the Massachusetts senator, who has seen his presumed front-runner status eclipsed in recent months by the surge of rival Howard Dean, the former Vermont governor.

A decorated Vietnam veteran who has tried to position himself as the best candidate to challenge President Bush on national security issues, Kerry faces competition Wesley Clark, the former supreme NATO commander who is poised to enter the Democratic race on Wednesday.

Other Democratic senators in the field include Bob Graham of Florida, Joe Lieberman of Connecticut and John Edwards of North Carolina, who formally launched his campaign Tuesday.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/ny-kerrycalif0916,0,1838817.story?coll=ny-top-span-headlines

[CMT]

1. Ok, there it is

the big endorsement. It is a good one, but I think it won't necessarily determine how California primary will turnout.

[deutsey]

2. Well, the endorsements are showing the Dem Establishment will

turnout for him. Now, they've got to make sure the people (and a broad center/left/indepedent coalition of people) will also turnout.

If he gets the nomination, I hope he's able to do that. I'm not convinced at this point that he can, but for the sake of our country he better be able to.

[flpoljunkie]

63. Except Diane Feinstein is the most well-liked pol in California!

My daughter is going to UCLA tomorrow to hear John Kerry speak at 5PM. Can't wait to hear how it went!

She has signed onto Youth for Kerry group in Southern California.

[chimpymustgo]

3. That's a biggie all right. Good on you, John.

nt

[Nicholas_J]

4. In virtually all cases

Where Feinstein goes, the California Democratic Party goes.

[goobergunch]

13. I also think Gov. Davis is supporting him

I don't have a link on that, but I've heard his wife is.

[sujan]

15. too bad

[w4rma]

74. July 1-13 CA Field Poll: Dean leads among California Dems at 16%

7/22/2003 #2077: Dean moves into top tier of California Democratic voter preferences with Kerry and Lieberman.

Gov. Dean has 16%
Sen. Kerry has 15%
Sen. Lieberman has 14%
All others are in single digits.
33% of CA Dems are undecided.

In April the CA Field Poll was:
Gov. Dean at 7%
Sen. Kerry at 16%
Sen. Liberman at 22%
Rep. Gephardt at 12%
http://field.com/fieldpollonline/subscribers/RLS2077.pdf
http://field.com/fieldpollonline/subscribers/

[Nicholas_J]

75. Old poll

Saw one today from one of the primary states in Which Dean was ahead which already has Clark running neck and neck with him, the day he announced his candidacy.

Conservative sources are already speculating that Clark is at Clinton's request, in order to avoid a Dean disaster.

[CMT]

80. which state is that?

just curious.

[arcos]

98. Do you have links??

You need to post 2... one for the poll, and another for the other comment of Clark in because of Clinton.

[arcos]

122. KICK!

I want an answer...

[arcos]

125. kick!

[arcos]

126. So, what do you think of today's CA poll???

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=108&topic_id=42906

That is NOT old... and he is the clear frontrunner, leading Lieberman by 8% and Kerry by 12%.

[CWebster]

5. Well, that figures.

Since Kerry has demonstrated where his allegiances lie on the question of Israel.

[davidinalameda]

6. yet another reason not to vote for Kerry

don't like DiFi

[dave29]

7. Didn't she vote FOR the taxcut and for Bush blanket authority in Iraq?

She may be a great senator, but when Bush appeasers support Bush appeasars, I'm not very impressed.

[blm]

8. Unless it's Bush appeasers on Yucca Mt.

and who agree with Bush on deregulating electricy. They're safe here at DU.

[polpilot]

12. Iraqi Bombing Resolution supporters stick together!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bomb sheperds/tax cuts for Ken Lay. Go Di!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dean '04...

[HazMat]

38. Guess what ?

Rove and the GOP engineered the meaningless IWR to split the Democratic Party and give us a weak candidate like Dean so Bush could coast to an easy victory.

If the IWR Dems stick together, it's all over for you guys. The Deanie groupies know and fear this, deep down.

[polpilot]

99. Dean's team is far more politically intelligent than Rove & Co. or the

demos who 'fear' Rove & Co.

'the meaningless IWR"??????????????? Right.

Dean '04...

[genius]

60. Dean supported Yucca Mountain. Feinstein and Kerry opposed it

While I don't agree much with Feinstein, she is a good environmentalist. That is probably a large part of the reason she endorsed Kerry. He is also a good environmentalist. So are Kucinich and Gephardt.

[goobergunch]

61. So is Lieberman for that matter...

I'm not a Lieberman fan, but his environmental record is exemplary.

Yucca Mountain vote

[loyalsister]

85. "Good environmentalist"

Whatever I have talked at length about this issue with a nuclear physics professor who is also one of the environtalists in my city. He was in favor of Yucca Mountain, too. It has to go somewhere, and scientists tend to agree that it is safer for everyone if it is stored at Yucca Mtn with a strict uniform storage policy.

[MercutioATC]

97. YUCCA MOUNTAIN!! $5 for the Dean campaign!

explanation:

http://democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=108&topic_id=9385

This has been addressed ad nauseum here at DU. Simply put, Maine and Vermont needed a place to store their nuclear waste. Texas offered to store it for them. The Texas legislature appointed a commission to recomment a site. They chose Sierra Blanca (admittedly, not a good site). Upon federal review, Sierra Blanca was determined to be an unsuitable site. End of story.

Some have chosen to spin this into a "Dean dumped nuclear waste on poor Hispanics" story. The fact is that Dean had NO choice in determining the site and knew that the site had to pass a federal review before it would be approved.

This is yet another weak-minded arguement that is easily refuted by a review of the pertinent facts. Luckily, Dean will still benefit with a $5 donation.

[blm]

100. Weak explanation excusing Dean.

As usual. Dean's REAL actions and longterm philosophy get no critical examination from his followers.

Why does the word Moonies come to mind?

[MercutioATC]

120. Not true. I have examined this issue. There's no issue.

...and I've posted as such on numerous occasions in the past. The truth in Sierra Blanca is that Dean had zero input into the decision and he knew that if the site was truly unsuitable, it would not recieve federal approval. Why would the Governor of a state thousands of miles away second-guess a legally appointed site selection committee, especially when the site STILL had to pass the federal approval process?

Yucca Mountain is much the same circumstance. It's not Dean's place as a Governor of Vermont to question where Nevada decides to put nuclear waste.

I haven't seen ANY proposed site that makes everybody happy. Until we stop using nuclear power plants, we'll have the continuing problem of what to do with the waste. I see the sense in centralizing storage for safety and security reasons. That's what Dean suports. He's not choosing the site, he's attempting to make storage more secure.

[blm]

121. But he didn't bother to check it out himself, eh?

He was prepared to give 26 million Vermont dollars to Bush in Texas, but never bothered to check out where Bush decided to place the waste? Even after Wellstone alerted him?

[MercutioATC]

123. Why the hell would he? He's no expert on dump sites.

It reems reasonable that he's trust experts to do the research. It's fair to say that almost ANY community would object to a nuclear waste repository being located nearby. Would their objections be valid in a scientific sense? Possibly, but that's why we have geologists and such to determine the real situation.

The Texas legislature legally appointed a commission to recommend a site. They did so. The site then had to pass a federal approval process, which it failed to do. Dean had no input at any stage of the decision-making, nor should he have. That's why we have safeguards like federal approval built into the system. Those safeguards worked this time.

[blm]

127. He was a DOCTOR who had to know the health risks.

And never bothered to check it out.

The ones who really stopped it going through were the environmentalists who made a big stink about it and succeeded in getting media attention.

[burr]

50. One of the 9 DINOs in the U.S. Senate that backed shrub's taxcut..

Senator Feinstein is a great endorsement for anyone attacking fellow candidates who refuse to adopt the position, that taking half the poison pill is better than taking it all. O8)

[DrFunkenstein]

9. That Friggin' Rocks!

<>

:yourock:

That is a HUGE endorsement, not only in Cali - where she is beloved and highly influential - but also on the national level - where she is equally beloved.

:loveya:

[dmkinsey]

10. Has anyone heard

of ANY Senate Dem who doesn't support Kerry?

[CMT]

11. well Patrick Leahy

of course he is from Vermont and supporting Dean. Of course many are still undeclared. I'm sure the other candidates will pick up some.

[goobergunch]

16. Here's a breakdown

Kerry-4 (himself, Feinstein, Hollings, Kennedy)
Lieberman-3 (himself, Carper, Dodd)
Dean-2 (Jeffords, Leahy)
Graham-2 (himself, Nelson (FL))
Clark-1 (Clinton)
Edwards-1 (himself)

UNCOMMITTED-36

[dsc]

21. any citation for Clinton?

If nothing else that would put to rest the idea she is running.

[goobergunch]

36. It's in GD...

I can't find a link, but it seems that Clinton will be Clark's NY co-chair.

[Cocoa]

24. thanks for that

I figured Lieberman, Graham and Edwards hadn't endorsed Kerry, and I knew Kennedy had endorsed him, but the others were news to me.

[NewJerseyDem]

48. How do you know about Hollings and Carper?

There is no mention of them endorsing anyone on politics1.com. Where have you heard about those endorsements? I saw once that Hollings spoke favorably of Kerry but I didn't think he really endorsed him. Also, I would be surprised if Clinton endorsed anyone, but you said there was already a post about it. However, that would only be speculation so far considering that Clark hasn't even announced yet.

The only person I've heard about endorsing Clark is Charlie Rangel. I found that interesting. I assume that the Arkansas delegation would back him as well.

[goobergunch]

51. Hollings isn't a per se endorsement

however, there's a clip here on Kerry's website that has Hollings saying why he supports Kerry. In my "delegate count", I have him in small text, but that doesn't show on DU.

As for Carper, my source is ABC News.

Regarding H. Clinton...there is widespread speculation in GD and LBN that she'll be Clark's NY co-chair. It's not official yet, but this LBN thread is the best source I can find.

[NewJerseyDem]

62. Okay

It just looks like Politics1.com is a little out of date. I thought that that website would have all the major endorsements. I guess not.

The Hillary Clinton thing is just speculation it seems for now. Not that long ago a lot of people said she was running for president so I don't know if it is anything more than a rumor. I guess we will find out in the days to come.

Who knows? Maybe Clark will pull a Schwarzenneger in reverse and decide not to run.

[blm]

64. Hollings will be formalized soon.

They are spacing out the timing of the announcements.

[goobergunch]

66. He did say he'd stay neutral until after the 3 Feb primary (n/t)

[blm]

70. Internal polls are forcing a different tact.

There are other races at stake. Tenenbaum for Senate and some congressional seats. The top of the ticket can add or cost percentage points.

[CMT]

14. While this is a good endorsement

it too (like Edwards announcement) is overshadowed by the Clark news.

[Procopius]

17. It's all about the Assault Weapons Ban

This has to do with nothing else at all. She wants that bill passed and neither Dean nor Bush are high on it.

[Fabio]

18. Really?

Please provide proof of that opinion. Maybe there is a pre-existing relationship? Maybe they have worked effectively together during their shared tenure?

[Procopius]

19. From the article:

The assault weapon ban will expire next year," Feinstein wrote. "We need a president who will actively urge Congress to extend it, and John Kerry will do just that."


Dean doesn't really like it. Lieberman wants Colt Manufacturing exempt from any assault weapons ban. Kerry's the only big gun (and fellow Sen) to endorse it.

[Fabio]

25. That doesn't sound like proof to me.

It sounds to me like she is scoring political points on behalf of Senator Kerry by pointing out that Dean has departed from the mission of many (urbanized) dems to get guns off the street.

[Procopius]

33. She wants the ban passed. I want it passed. Kerry wants it passed.

If Dean really supported an assault gun ban he would've passed one as governor.

[ButterflyBlood]

59. for what reason?

Vermont already has one of the lowest murder rates in the country and no gang violence or anything of the sort. What purpose would such a ban do? (assuming it even passed the legislature which would be unlikely.) "One size fits all gun control" just doesn't make sense, which Dean realizes by being in a high gun/low crime state. We all know that the NRA's more guns always = less crime claims are bullshit, but that doesn't mean the exact opposite is ALWAYS true.

[Procopius]

76. It's good common sense and weapons of war need to be banned.

There's gonna be a grandfather clause if ya just have to have one.

[DrFunkenstein]

20. You're Absolutely Right

Sen. Feinstein is staking her name on a single-issue endorsement. Very politically astute of her.

[Procopius]

22. She's hoping (and I'm hoping) Kerry makes a big deal of it

Maybe Bush will squirm and demand it gets passed. Only problem is pro-gun Dean is in the lead to beat Bush.

[DrFunkenstein]

26. Do You Judge A Game By The Half-time Score?

<>

[Procopius]

29. Yes I do

I played basketball in high school and we were usually out of the game by halftime.

[DrFunkenstein]

40. I Totally Identify With The Guy On The Left

I did a million sports in high school, but I kinda sucked at all of them.

<>

[dsc]

30. of course

"Pro gun Dean" favors renewal of the assult weapons ban.

[Procopius]

32. As far as I know the current one

At least I can agree with the NRA and say a flash suppressor is worthless on lethality. The ban plainly needs to be strengthened and Dean has not championed that.

[dsc]

34. Sarah Brady could be President

and we wouldn't see a strengthening of that ban. Remember we could get any gun control measures through a slightly more Republican Congress in the aftermath of Columbine. If we couldn't get anything passed then I fail to see it happening now.

[Procopius]

35. Well

Gun control is a big issue with me. If Kerry is prez at least it will be better than Bush and he can veto all the NRA endorsed crap.

[ButterflyBlood]

56. what NRA endorsed crap is being pushed now?

did you have any problem with Clinton on guns? Dean is no more pro-gun than Clinton.

[Procopius]

77. I didn't have a problem with Clinton on guns

He did what he could until the Repukes took over. The NRA is pushing this lawsuit stuff down our throats along with nationwide concealed carry.

[ButterflyBlood]

103. Dean can't do anything about concealed carry

it's a state issue.

I'm not talking about Clinton's record as president, but as governor. It's practically identical to Dean's, he had a state with little gun control, and did little about it. But Dean supports all of the gun control measures Clinton put in, plus closing the gun show loophole. So Dean is no more anti-gun control than Clinton.

[slackmaster]

105. Not necessarily just a state issue

One of the next big pushes from gun rights supporters on concealed carry will be nationwide reciprocity like we have for driver's licenses, marriage contracts, etc.

[ButterflyBlood]

114. Dean says it should be a state issue

forcing states to accepted concealed carry permits does not make it a state issue, so I'd imagine Dean would veto that.

[MrBenchley]

27. Actually

I haven't heard Dean say anything at all on the issue...and the Chimp gives it lip service but won't do anything to renew it.

[MrBenchley]

28. Actually

I haven't heard Dean say anything at all on the issue...and the Chimp gives it lip service but won't do anything to renew it.

[Procopius]

31. That's the problem

Dean and Bush give it lip service. Kinda if ya pass it I'll sign it otherwise.......

[HazMat]

23. And the first domino has fallen.

Soon the "establishment" will close in and choke off all of Dean's air.

DiFi is a very well respected member of the Democratic establishment. She's definitely has a national presence now, mostly due to the recall.

If we can get this down to Clark and Kerry, I'd be happy with either candidate. Welcome to The Electable Wing of the Democratic Party.

This has been the first good day in a long time for those of us who care about nominating a candidate who can actually beat Bush.

[indigo32]

37. I'm afraid I'm unconvinced by your

pronouncements that Dean is unelectable. You're gonna have to actually put some effort into it. Frankly I am extremely motivated to beat Bush...take a shot at actually proving to me Dean can't beat him.

[DrFunkenstein]

39. I'll Give You Three Reasons

1. Dean compared Bush to the Taliban. Not very Presidential.

<>

2. Dean supposes it's a good thing that Saddam is gone.

<>

3. http://www.gop.org/Newsroom/RNCResearch/TLvideo2.htm

<>

I'm pissed at Bush, too, but Dean will be painted as an unstable radical in $200,000,000 worth of commercials between June and November. What most Dean supporters don't understand is that most Americans - the ones that think Saddam flew both 9/11 planes - are worried and disappointed in Bush, not hopping up and down mad. And while Howard Beale is entertaining, no one wants a loose cannon in the Oval Office. Already one there, why change?

You asked me.:shrug:

[indigo32]

42. OK Doc

1. I don't remember that happening... help me out?
2. so do alot of people... you're the one talking about the Americans who think Saddam flew the planes...
3. You might have taken notice that Dean wasn't the only one in that commercial... Now we're gonna face that criticism no matter whom we put up... so we better be able to counter it. Counter it with plans for economic recovery especially.

[DrFunkenstein]

53. Help

1. GOP talking points against the candidates mentioned that Dean joked at one point that next Bush would be making school girls wear veils. It's stupid, but I'm sure it will sound insidious in GOP hands.

2. Just about everyone is glad Saddam is gone (although the conditions of that abscence are obviously questionable). What is going to sting is the blase manner in which Dean said it.

3. All of the candidates will have to deal with those clips, but Dean is going to have to deal not just with the words, but with the kinda scary style as well.

I'm not saying these are impossible to surmount. If Dean gets the nod, I will do everything in my power to help do so. But, although Dean is a centrist, his style seems radical, and I don't think nervous SUV moms are going to feel secure after watching the commercials the GOP will inevitably cook up.

It may sound dumb and superficial, but America did make Full House a top-rated show.

[Rooktoven]

87. Not superficial at all---

You are addressing style-- and while Dean breathes fire to the disaffected Dems who long for someone to be combative, His combativeness is not always measured or well-considered. I worry that the careless remarks will add-up into a few audio collages, though I find them personally appealing.

I would submit to everyone that the most effective mouthpiece for Democratic anger is Edwards. He stays on message and can convey fire as well as anyone (part of his trade, after all.)

[DrFunkenstein]

93. I Have Been Growing More and More Respect For Edwards

Throughout the race. Honestly, I was dismissive at first. But he has really stuck to message and kept his head above the fray. The "regular folks" line and touting his background do little for me, but he's got a pretty decent message. And he is one hell of a talker. He's the only one in the race with anywhere near Clinton's charm.

[Fabio]

41. Quick question.

What is it about Dean that makes you think of Wellstone?

[indigo32]

43. Well

honestly Dean doesn't bring Wellstone to mind a whole lot except that they are both fighters. I'm assuming you are asking because of my sig line.

[Fabio]

44. Yes.

Although Wellstone was a little too liberal for me (in the sense of sometimes not being pragmatic), I agree he was a great fighter, a wonderful man, and will be sorely missed. I lost my dad in a plane accident under similar circumstances, so it definately hit me pretty hard.

Anyhow, I sense on the board that alot of people equate Dean with Wellstone. I dont like Dean (at all) but we certainly can meet in the middle with shared affection with Sen Wellstone.

Btw, did you ever see his video from his first campaign (1990?)? Best political advertising I have ever seen.

[indigo32]

45. I'm from MN

you better believe I saw that advertising and LOVED Senator Wellstone. I cried when he died. Sorry to hear about your dad.
To bad you feel so badly about Dean. You're a Kerry supporter right? I don't feel any animosity towards him... I just think he's about 3 steps behind and that doesn't bode well for his leadership abilities.

[Fabio]

47. thanks

yeah, my dad brought home the videos of wellstone in 1990 and showed them to me in the living room. We had a great laugh and wondered who this guy was.

I worked in the Senate in 1989 and had to deal with Rudy Boshwitz (spelling). What a pill.

[HazMat]

52. National security/foreign policy

No candidate can win if they are perceived to be weak on national security/foreign policy in this post 9-11 world. NSFP trumps all other issues, even if polls show the economy is higher on the list. Look a little deeper at the other numbers and it shows that Americans feel insecure. Forget about polls: just look around. Americans will choose the wreckless cowboy who they feel will protect them over an "anti-war lightweight from Vermont".

It doesn't matter that Dean says that he supported Gulf War I, that he won't be afraid to use the military, etc. There's just too much against him. The GOP would absolutely bury him with the "Hamas are soldiers" comment , the "I guess it's a good thing (Saddam is gone)", the "I don't know how many troops we have", the "someday we won't be the strongest military". It doesn't matter that Dean retracted the comment, he became popular by taking a hardline anti-war postion on Iraq, which is an unelectable position. Even if he didn't oppose the Iraq war, I'd still submit that he's unelectable. No NSFP cred, no gravitas, no projection of strength. Even Clinton projected more strength from a physical standpoint (Clinton wouldn't win in this climate but he'd do way better than Dean would). People are shallow. IMO, Dean's height hurts him. He has no gravitas. "Scrappy" won't cut it this time around.

This is not 1992 redux -- some people don't seem to get this. It isn't even 2000 redux. It's closer to 1952, 1960 or 1964. It's not "the economy, stupid". "It's NSFP and the economy, stupid".

The political climate post-Gulf War I is nothing compared to now. We'd just won the cold war and there was the general feeling that there were no more enemies, that we were safe, that nothing like 9-11 could ever happen. Today's climate is the complete opposite.

Some on the anti-Bush left fail to see this; their intense dislike of the pResident blinds them to the facts. As it is, the public perception is that Democrats are weak on NSFP; polls show that the party trails by as much as 40 points on the issue.

Only a Democratic candidate who projects strength, experience and NSFP credentials can win in a general election. Only Kerry fits the bill, and probably Clark.

[indigo32]

57. I would submit

that Kerry doesn't come close to innoculating us from that arguement. If people would listen to Bob Graham for a moment he would probably be able to... except for the physical presence thing... which is probably why people don't listen to the man in the first place. See Vietnam isn't gonna cut it any more... it just isn't. Clark would probably be our best shot in the situation you describe but...
I did a google search... and can find polling to support alot of different things... I tend not to believe them anymore to be honest. I think alot of people are waking up to the disaster that is this administration.

[Rooktoven]

90. Kerry does project strength, etc...

(he would be my second choice) but I think he is running on resume, not message. I'm not sure that's enough.

Question for the crowd-- where do Kerry and Edwards (and their backers) really differ on the issues?

[ButterflyBlood]

46. I was kind of leaning toward Dean before, and now I am even more

while at one point torn between Dean and Kerry, Dean is looking better and better, and this only adds to Dean to me. Screw you DLC whore DINO Feinstein.

[Fabio]

49. you must have been very committed to objectivity.

Someone supports a candidate you are considering and you become enraged. That wins elections.

[DrFunkenstein]

54. Nice Misogyny

No, really. You seem to be a really classy fella. Dean is truly fortunate to count you among his supporters.

[ButterflyBlood]

55. misogyny?

where? Because I happen to dislike a woman? So all Ann Coulter haters are misogynists?

Since Feinstein is doing whatever the DLC tells her to, I don't see how "whore" is any different from when people say things about the "media whores". Same thing.

[DrFunkenstein]

58. Alot Of Coulter-Haters Use Not Very Cool Language

To express their antipathy. I may be alone on this, but I think there is a difference between calling people "media whores" and calling Sen. Feinstein a DLC whore. Not for being PC, but because it is nasty and disrespectful to her and to women generally.

[dsc]

86. You are correct on this

there are lots of ways to let our displeasure with people known. We don't need to use that word to do so.

[blm]

65. If you hate the DLC, why is Dean attractive

to you when he was one of its staunchest centrists for 11 years who helped pull the Dem party to the right?

Kerry, even as a member of the DLC still stayed true to his liberalism and today has a lifetime record closest to Wellstone's of all the candidates.

[goobergunch]

67. IMHO Kucinich's record is closest to Wellstone's (n/t)

[burr]

69. Do you mean of all the candidates running?

Or do you mean of all primary candidates with a Congressional voting record?

[goobergunch]

71. The second one

It's hard to judge how Sharpton's or Clark's voting record would be.

[blm]

72. Not by the formal ratings.

Wellstone has 3% and Kerry has 6% lifetime ratings. Kucinich's were higher based on his earlier prolife stance. If those votes weren't a factor then Kucinich would likely be closer or just as close.

[goobergunch]

73. got it (n/t)

[ButterflyBlood]

83. then why are the DLC trying so hard to sink him?

n/t

[blm]

88. Because he pissed some of them off by

turning on them to gain support from the left. He pretended like he only "read some of their material" when he actually was one of their star centrist governors.

Dean helped push the Democratic party to the right all those years, and then has the nerve to call longtime liberals, "Bushlite" knowing that his record was WAY to their right. Did you miss the Ted Rall article where he said Dean was an opportunist who tacked left when he saw the millions of potential votes in the antiwar crowds?

Kerry was part of the DLC and maintained his liberal credentials. Not all DLCers are centrists.

[molly]

68. I'm curious why you say that?

[ButterflyBlood]

82. Feinstein votes for tax cuts, war, vouchers...

makes a huge profit off the war to boot, her endorsement isn't a good thing to me.

[JI7]

78. feinstein is very popular in california

this is a good one for kerry. although it doesn't gaurantee him the state, it gives a small boost and adds a popular name he can use to promote himself. feinstein is also working VERY HARD for gray davis. she is VERY MUCH opposed to the recall and says she will only vote no on the recall.

[burr]

79. Zell Miller is the most popular officeholder in Georgia...

maybe Kerry can bag his support as well!!! :thumbsup:

[JI7]

81. maybe

but i doubt it seeing their views on issues are too different. feinstein agrees with kerry on gun control, abortion rights, and some other issues. although kerry is more liberal than she is.

[burr]

84. Zell agrees with Kerry on many a thang...

abortion rights, supporting the first, second, and tenth Patriot Acts, support of the Iraqi invasion, support of stem cell research, and kicking some democratic ass before we worry about our fine Texan prez.

Like Feinstein he backs Sharon, deportation or destruction of Arafat, and he loves shrub's taxcuts. And he wants even more tax-free bank accounts fur millioniares, eliminating inheritance tax, and eliminating any regulatory oversight for those corporate mergers...too much paperwork and potential litigation ya see!!!!

Sounds like a great Kerry pioneer ta me.

[ButterflyBlood]

89. Zell is not for abortion rights

he may of been as a governor, but he's totally changed since then. he voted against reaffirming Roe v. Wade this year. For their ratings for the first half of 2003, he gets 100% approval from the National Right To Life Committee.

[blm]

92. Zell scorns liberals, just like Dean did in Vermont.

In fact, if DU was paying attention to Dean's antiliberal antics in Vermont as they happened the past 11 years, Dean would be lumped in with Zell Miller here.

[dsc]

95. I would like the citation for all of the following

The bills sponsered by or signed by Miller that did the following:
a) provided for civil rights for gays (1992 in VT)
b) provided for civil unions for gays (2000 in VT)
c) saved massive amounts of land from development (92-03 in VT)
d) insured most of the children in his state (97 in VT)
e) defending abortion rights in all cases (92-03 in VT)

I would like these citations. You are the person claiming "Dean would be lumped in with Zell Miller here." Now to make it completely, utterly, and totally clear what I am asking for. I want bills that have been signed by, voted for by, or at the very least publicly advocated by, Zell Miller. Do not say you posted this unless you really have.

[burr]

96. I know Zell scorns Democrats....

another reason he and Kerry are political brothers! :pals:

[DrFunkenstein]

101. Which Wing Of The Democratic Party Is That?

<>

Is that the alienating wing of the Party? I know a candidate or two (well, just one) that occupies that wing...

:pals:

[blm]

106. No...Like Dean did in Vermont

>>>>>
Dean kept his distance from his party's liberals during his governorship.

''He seemed to take glee in attacking us at every opportunity and using us as a way to form alliances with more conservative elements,'' said former state Sen. Cheryl Rivers, a leader of the state Democrats' liberal wing and former chairwoman of the powerful Senate Finance Committee.

. . .

Dean trimmed spending or held down increases in areas held dear by the liberals. More than once, Dean went to battle over whether individual welfare benefits should rise under automatic cost of living adjustments. Liberals were particularly incensed when he tried that tactic on a program serving the blind, disabled and elderly, which he did several times.

. . .

Rivers blames Dean for helping a third political party to flourish in Vermont that many say siphons votes from Democrats. ''The Progressive Party gained some momentum during his years as governor because he was so conservative,'' Rivers said, although she said she still may support Dean for president.

http://www.boston.com/dailynews/139/region/Those_who_know_Dean_says_he_s_:.shtml

[dsc]

111. link is broken

You claimed he would be lumped in with Zell Miller. I would like what I asked for not what you wish to provide.

[blm]

115. The link may be broken but you've seen it before.

If DU had been folowing Dean and read about every time he did as Cheryl Rivers describes, then he most definitely would be lumped in with Zell Miller. Miller isn't JUST a centrist, he also takes potshots at the left.


By ROSS SNEYD

Associated Press Writer

MONTPELIER, Vt. (AP) — Howard Dean may be many things, say those who worked with him over nearly a dozen years as Vermont governor, but an elitist liberal is hardly one of them.

He’s actually a lot more moderate — many would say conservative — than the reputation he’s built during his campaign for the Democratic presidential nomination.

Many of the people who were his allies and adversaries in Montpelier over his 20-year political career have been quietly bemused by the liberal persona he’s built as he campaigns in Iowa and New Hampshire, especially through his outspoken opposition to the war in Iraq.
>>>>>>

[dsc]

102. no answer I see

I would like those citations.

[blm]

104. You missed my point, and change it to yours.

Tuff cookies. My point was that Dean scorned liberals while aligning with the Republicans in Vermont. YOU change the point to one that suits you because you know that Dean did exactly that.

My beef isn't with centrism per se, it's with combining the centrism with scorn for the left to further your alliances with the right., which is EXACTLY what Dean did for 11 years.

>>>>>>
Dean kept his distance from his party's liberals during his governorship.

''He seemed to take glee in attacking us at every opportunity and using us as a way to form alliances with more conservative elements,'' said former state Sen. Cheryl Rivers, a leader of the state Democrats' liberal wing and former chairwoman of the powerful Senate Finance Committee.

. . .

Dean trimmed spending or held down increases in areas held dear by the liberals. More than once, Dean went to battle over whether individual welfare benefits should rise under automatic cost of living adjustments. Liberals were particularly incensed when he tried that tactic on a program serving the blind, disabled and elderly, which he did several times.

. . .

Rivers blames Dean for helping a third political party to flourish in Vermont that many say siphons votes from Democrats. ''The Progressive Party gained some momentum during his years as governor because he was so conservative,'' Rivers said, although she said she still may support Dean for president.

http://www.boston.com/dailynews/139/region/Those_who_know_Dean_says_he_s_:.shtml

[dsc]

112. no link here either

n/t

[blm]

116. You know it's a real article

because you've seen it for months and read the whole article. Interesting though, that I can't get it even by googling the author's name. Just like the Gary Hart interview. Just interesting.

I sent you the entire article. Just to refresh your memory.

[Rooktoven]

91. How much do senatorial endorsements matter?

Only Kerry and Lieberman have the support of anyone outside their state-- and then only teo and one respectively. I don't see this as a plus unless you have a good 40% of the party...

[DrFunkenstein]

94. How Much Would A Wellstone Endorsement Matter?

It all depends on how closely you identify with the Senator. But I also find it compelling to see endorsements from people across the ideological spectrum. Kerry is much more liberal than Feinstein, but Feinstein is very much respected by her constituents, and well-regarded nationally.

Kerry's ability to garner the support of centrists without compromising himself is impressive. So is the fact that Nader picked him as his #2 choice after Kucinich.

[blm]

108. That's because Nader actually worked with Kerry

to expose the BFEE on IranContra. Nader did more to help Kerry than most of the Dems in office at the time.

Kerry pursued the issues Nader's Public Citizen brought up back then when Congress tried to move on past IranContra.

[DrFunkenstein]

119. A Progressive That Sounds Centrist, Or A Centrist That Sounds Progressive?

I'll take the former, thank ya.

[whirlygigspin]

107. Have another martini Diane

:beer:

[The Sushi Bandit]

109. So will Kerry now support Davis??

since Feinstein supports Davis in the recall?

[goobergunch]

110. He was going to CA to support Davis

when the recall was ordered postponed.

[DJcairo]

113. Kerry is in CA today

[blm]

117. He always has supported Davis.

In fact, Davis' wife endorsed Kerry months ago.

[goobergunch]

118. Correct.

IMHO Davis's favorite candidate is probably Kerry.

[DrFunkenstein]

124. It Certainly Looks That Way

<>