'Dean Divers' put spotlight on candidate's record

[Feanorcurufinwe]

For hours on end, they camp out at the state archives housed in an 1890 mansion, scouring public records, documents and correspondences in a search of crucial details about former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean, the Democratic presidential front-runner.

State officials have dubbed them "Dean Divers."

<snip>

Some searchers have spent hours at Chittenden Community Television, watching public access television tapes of Dean's news conferences and debates.
Jess Wilson, channel director at the station, said one woman from rival Dick Gephardt's campaign spent the better part of a summer day watching tapes of news conferences in the 1990s, when Dean discussed budget cuts and Medicare. Since then, Gephardt has accused Dean of changing positions on some issues.

<snip>

Some researchers have asked to open records kept in 145 crates at a state warehouse in Middlesex, Vermont, but Markowitz said he reached an agreement with Dean to keep those private for 10 years after the governor left office. Two of Dean's predecessors made similar arrangements, although the records were cracked open after just six years.

"What was new was the political aspirations of the person being negotiated with," Markowitz said of the length of time records will remain private.
http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/10/21/elec04.prez.dean.divers.ap/index.html

[w4rma]

1. Again the "news" media prints a smear without the Democratic response

…
This effort to compile a dossier on Dean either to use against him or to boost his candidacy extends beyond the archives in the secretary of state's office. Some searchers have spent hours at Chittenden Community Television, watching public access television tapes of Dean's news conferences and debates.

Jess Wilson, channel director at the station, said one woman from rival Dick Gephardt's campaign spent the better part of a summer day watching tapes of news conferences in the 1990s, when Dean discussed budget cuts and Medicare. Since then, Gephardt has accused Dean of changing positions on some issues.

"Some of the flip-flop stuff Gephardt's been talking about sounds awfully familiar," Wilson said.
…
http://abcnews.go.com/wire/Politics/ap20031021_717.html

The "news" media would *never* publish anything like that about Bush without also publishing a response from Bush. But, they publish this crap on Dean and other Democrats. Here is Dean's response which should have gotten at least a quote in this article:

Gephardt's Attacks: Out of Context and Out of Line

Dick Gephardt has turned his negative campaign machine on fellow Democrat Howard Dean, blatantly misrepresenting Dr. Dean’s positions on the vital issues of Medicare and Social Security. The Governor believes that Iowans and Americans deserve a campaign based on a real discussion of ideas, and that only by providing hope in the face of the Bush administration’s campaign of fear will a Democrat be able to lead the Party to take our country back.
…
http://www.deanforamerica.com/site/PageServer?pagename=community_labor_response

[Feanorcurufinwe]

3. Actually Dean did support cutting Medicare.

Dean had harsh words for what he called the "radical right wing" in Congress, particularly members of the House, and Gingrich's Contract With America.

However, he applauded the efforts of Senate Budget Committee chairman Pete Domemici, R-Nev., who presented his own balanced budget plan last week.

Dean said he disagreed with some of the details of Domenici's plan. But he said Domenici's was a serious proposal that did not include tax cuts and recognized the need to put a permanent end to federal budget deficits.

Dean also said he could defend Domenici's approach to reducing Medicare costs. He said he supported more managed care for Medicare recipients and requiring some Medicare recipients to pay a greater share of the cost of their medical services.

"I fully subscribe to the notion that we should reduce the Medicare growth rate from 10 percent to 7 percent, or less if possible," Dean said.

The Vermont governor has been an outspoken critic of the Contract With America, which he continued to describe Wednesday as the "Contract On America".
http://12.32.36.99/TimesArgus.pdf

Was Dean a 'fan' of Gingrich's? No. Did he praise the same Domenici plan that Gingrich backed? Yes.

Does Dean still want to 'reduce the Medicare growth rate from 10 percent to 7 percent'?

[Punkingal]

14. Domenici is from New Mexico....

just for the record.

[redqueen]

16. With all due respect,

does that response really address the issue? It seems to me to be just a claim that Gephardt misrepresented Dean's positions, without any actual substance to back up that counterclaim. Am I wrong?

I noticed a lot of deleted messages, and I have to wonder, is being reactionary really helping the candidate you support? I'm not attacking Dean's supporters alone for this, because I see it here and there in all camps.

It just seems to me that this period of time is best used for ... how to put it... maybe like 'practice fighting'? Or 'sharpening our claws'? Sort of like when kittens attack each other, they're preparing for the real fights they'll likely face later in life.

Just posturing will not make these concerns go away, so perhaps we should work on better phrasing our message to address the concerns, so that by the time we get down to fighting the real opposition, we're well prepared for those battles.

It's cliche, but... 'just my .02' :)

[indigo32]

2. and you approve of this lame activity?

good for you.

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

5. Is there something wrong

with backing up your arguments with references? :eyes:

[ProfessorPlum]

6. Why, goodness no!

.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProfessorPlum]

11. Terrific!

With any luck they'll find some new links for Dean-haters to use, FC. Won't that be dandy! How fulfilled their little lives will be then, with even more links to post again and again.

Each little "diver", like a miner laboring in the bowels of the earth, will bring forth their shiny jewels, perhaps a tale of an environmentalist who didn't get what he wanted from Dean, perhaps a 10-year old quote from Dean which doesn't quite mesh with something he said 3 months ago.

Think of the frissons of pleasure we will share as they relate these treasures about the dirty Dean to the rest of the world, and watch his support (which will abandon him at the first sign of adversity) melt away like so much dross in the furnaces of their scrutiny.

Oh how I'll bet they wish they could be there with the divers, proctoscope in hand, delving deep through the duplicitous doctor's detritous, trying to find the GOPs next talking point.

kisses, FC. Thanks for the post.

[gully]

12. he he...

:yourock:

[Feanorcurufinwe]

13. Interesting how the archivist compares Dean's case to Bush's case

The 'Willie Horton' example was raised. It is an unfortunate reality that attack ads have become part of our political culture. It would be impossible to anticipate how opponents might mis/use even the most innocuous of documents. Setting new barriers to access in an attempt to anticipate attacks would be, at best, unfortunate. Ironically, such barriers would probabley become an issue, detracting from the Governor's proud record of achievement ( the reality of the possibility is evidenced by controversy surrounding President Bush's gubernatorial records, Mayor Giuliani's records, and records of former Governor Gilmore;
---
President Bush did not use his election to put restrictions on his gubernatorial records, beyond thos allowed by Texas law. The Texas Attorney General recently furthered clarified Mr.Bush's gubernatorial records by declaring them 'state records' subject to the Texas Public Information Act.
---
In the face of public outcry, Governor Bush's records were recently removed from his father's presidential library back to the Texas State Archives for review under the State's open record law.
---
Again, the reality is that gubernatorial records are part of our collective institutional (state government) records and thus are important to government continuity accross institutions.
http://www.judicialwatch.org/archive/2003/dean.pdf

[Octafish]

15. Could Dean's sealed records contain ties to Utilities?

It's just a thought. Before his supporters pop a vein and send money to Trippi's bat, take a read:

Dean raises money from energy sources

February 27, 2002
By David Gram
ASSOCIATED PRESS

MONTPELIER — When Gov. Howard Dean wanted to raise money for a possible presidential bid, he followed the example of a former governor of Texas and called on his friends in the energy industry.

Nearly a fifth of the roughly $111,000 collected in its first months by Dean’s presidential political action committee, the Fund for a Healthy America, came from people with ties to Vermont’s electric utilities, according to a recent Federal Elections Commission filing.

It should be no surprise. Dean and utility executives have had a long and friendly relationship.

One donor who gave Dean’s PAC the maximum amount allowed — $5,000 — said he did so because he and his wife “agree with many of the things the fund is talking about — fiscal conservatism, education, health care.”

That donor is Robert Young of Proctor, who also is a top official at two utility companies that have had a lot of important business before state government during Dean’s nearly 11 years in office. Young is chief executive at Central Vermont Public Service Corp. and chairman of Vermont Yankee Nuclear Power Corp.

CONTINUED...

http://timesargus.nybor.com/Legislature/Story/43125.html

Question to the brains of the Dean Defense Force: What kind of access did Dean mean?

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

18. No. n/t

edit-

Please give a link to Kerry's papers. I'd like to look at them.





Didn't think so.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

19. the link you wanted

http://kerry.senate.gov/

[UnapologeticLiberal]

17. An article from a Vermont paper

recently said that researches have been there constantly and have tried everywhere to dig up serious dirt and can't. The thing is, the conservative wing of the Republican Party in Vermont ran such a nasty campaign against him (and some of their own members!) in 2000 that if there were anything serious I think it probably would have been dug up then.

Mousepads, Shoe Leather, and Hope

[Feanorcurufinwe]

20. What are you talking about?We've been reading the dirt on Dean daily at DU

The environment, campaign finance, family farms, due process, Medicare, Social Security, energy deregulation, tax policy, the NRA -- no wonder the Republicans didn't consider any of this 'dirt' -- they agree with most of it!