A. Einstien ripped off Henri Poincar`e as to theories of relatvity

[DEMVET-USMC]

Check it out. Poincar`e gave a speech regarding all and published at least 1-2 years prior to Einstein`s work and Albert had to have his math professor work out the equations. With that I leave you, Oscar

[AP]

1. No copyright it ideas. If you want the world to move forward you stand

on the shoulders of those who went before you.

[DEMVET-USMC]

2. How pointless, a rippoff is a rippoff and on and on.

[Neoplatonist]

3. Logicians, meta physicians, and epistemologists borrow from their peers

Peers are equals in the eye of many. I study symbolic logic, metaphysics, epistemology and mathematics, so I see philosophers borrowing from their peers all the time. Bertrand Russell, my favorite philosopher, borrowed from idealists (he was actually a Hegelian in his early career), especially in his metaphysical realism, which seems strange because Russell was an empiricist who believed in Bundle Theory. He originally believed in Substratum Theory, which I believe in as well, but became skeptical about bare substratum being the subject of attributes (qualities) in particular material objects.

Anyway, Einstein was always an average mathematician, that still doesn't take away from his greatest equation. If he needed help formulating it, it's still his creation nonetheless. Credit is almost always given where credit is due--Einstein shouldn't be an exception.

[DEMVET-USMC]

6. He did not work out the equation,his math proffesor did.

[AP]

15. So what?

Are you upset that he didn't cite his sources?

[Name removed]

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[Dogmudgeon]

4. Einstein and Poincaré

There were several theories that were similar to Special and General Relativity before Einstein's first paper on the subject. The problem was, none of them were sufficiently comprehensive or testable. Einstein's work simplified the problem, presented mathematical tools that could be tested, and subsumed the work of the others. At that point, the "loose ends" in the other theories were either "tied up," or presented new opportunties for research.

Poincaré's work wasn't plagiarized, it was extended, and I believe that Poincaré is co-credited with the development of Special Relativity. I would not be surprised if Einstein even cited Poincaré in his papers.

Here's a quote from an excellent article I found on Poincaré:

In applied mathematics he studied optics, electricity, telegraphy, capillarity, elasticity, thermodynamics, potential theory, quantum theory, theory of relativity and cosmology. In the field of celestial mechanics he studied the three-body-problem, and the theories of light and of electromagnetic waves. He is acknowledged as a co-discoverer, with Albert Einstein and Hendrik Lorentz, of the special theory of relativity (underline by bkl).

Incidentally, Poincaré did not die broke and forgotten. He is one of the giants of the scientific world, rightly hailed as one of the pioneers of nuclear physics.

Poincaré achieved the highest honours for his contributions of true genius. He was elected to the Académie des Sciences in 1887 and in 1906 was elected President of the Academy. The breadth of his research led to him being the only member elected to every one of the five sections of the Academy, namely the geometry, mechanics, physics, geography and navigation sections. In 1908 he was elected to the Académie Francaise and was elected director in the year of his death. He was also made chevalier of the Légion d'Honneur and was honoured by a large number of learned societies around the world. He won numerous prizes, medals and awards.

The article, at http://www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Mathematicians/Poincare.html (Jules Henri Poincaré), is an excellent brief biology of this amazing man.

--bkl

[Neoplatonist]

5. Nice reply, BareNuckledLiberal

I am not as astute in my mathematics as I am in symbolic logic, metaphysics, or epistemology. You did a fine job summerizing what I failed to. LOL.

[Name removed]

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[DEMVET-USMC]

7. How many know the name Poincare` as to Einstein, That is my point.

Einstein did not work out the equations, his math prof. did. Albert denied knowing of Poincares` work. Though he clearly did.

[AP]

17. That's not Einstein's fault. How many professors in any discipline are...

...famous?

Whatever was going on culturally that allowed Einstien to be seen as a hero I think we should embrace. I'm not so upset that the movement didn't sweep up everyone upon whose work Einstein based his own. Every professor builds on the knowledge of others. Media star-making doesn't have the time for the others.

When has knowledge and the university ever been given that sort of respect in our society?

Since Einstein, the most attention Princeton has gotten in the media (other than whe discussed in terms of the priveleges of wealth enjoyed by its graduates) is when it has made the NCAA basketball tournament.

[DrWeird]

19. There was also the Nobel prize...

that Einstein recieved for his work on the photoelectric effect. That tends to make people famous.

And his work on blackbody radiation.

And a shitload of other work that he did.

Einstein was an incredibly prolific physicist. Relativity was just the cream of the crop.

[Salviati]

22. And people tend to forget...

that it was his work on brownian motion that really put the last nail in the coffin of those people who doubted the atomic theory of matter...

[AP]

16. This settles this debate.

[Name removed]

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[Forkboy]

11. Tough night?

[DEMVET-USMC]

12. A VERY TOUGH LIFE MY FRIEND.

[Mnemosyne]

13. So sorry DEMVET, Thank you for all! Hope better soon.

[Mnemosyne]

14. Worse ripoff

Edison. Tesla. Now using Tesla's brilliance for HAARP, deeply disturbing.

[DrWeird]

18. Einstein was a god at math.

It's a common urban legend, usually found among people that can't even understand simple algebra, that Einstein wasn't any good at math.

This is, of course, ridiculous.

The belief stems from the poor marks Einstein recieved from his mathematics professor. If you actually read what the instructor wrote, Einstein got the bad grade not because he didn't understand the math, but because he was day dreaming and not paying attention.

When the math necessary to prove the Theory of Special Relativity did not exist, Einstein invented a whole new form of calculus in order to do the job.

More over, Einstein gets full credit for the theories of Relativity. Yes, the idea had been kicked around before that energy and matter could be related, notably by Poincare and Lorentz. But Einstein was the first the grasp the whole significance and put it down in a fully researched, peer-reviewed paper. There were a few minor mathematical errors, as always happens which such things, nevertheless they were not significant and were easily corrected.

Einstein deserves all the credit he's gotten.

Of course in the hundred or so years since he published it, there have been no shortage of people trying to discredit him.

Notably the nazis, because he was jewish.

And of course all the pseudoscientific kooks who think the moon landing was a hoax. They like to bring this stuff up too.

[Dogmudgeon]

20. Why the myth?

Do you think it may have been because Einstein dramatically simplified the applied mathematics required to describe and "use" Relativity?

If it's just a matter of childhood events, Edison was thought to have been retarded. One of his schoolmasters wrote that he was "addled". Whereas Tesla was an excellent scholar, but after a near-fatal fever he had as a teenager, he really WAS "addled"!

--bkl

[DrWeird]

21. You mean about Einstein being bad at math?

I think it's told a lot to children who are having problems with math. Just look at Einstein, his teacher gave him bad grades at math and he was a genius! Sort of like Abe Lincoln and the log cabin.

It's also brought up by people who aren't smart, but like to think they are by bring other people down. Oh look, Einstein wasn't that smart, I'm a genius!

At least that's my explanation.