Chevy Volt debuts at L.A. Auto Show

[wtmusic]

wtmusic got tickets to Sneak Peek night at the LA Auto Show

The Volt is available for viewing but not hood-popping or seat-warming, which I'll take as a sign that a projected 2010 production run is optimistic. Chevy has made a few minor trim improvements since photos were leaked months ago, and IMO photographs don't do the car's rakish styling justice.





BMW's all electric mini was there, and if it meets the specs BMW is claiming it will be impressive. 500 will be available next year in a test lease program in CA, although skeptics claim a 2014 zero-emission mandate will be likely be pulled and with it the all-electric Minis. Get 'em while they're hot.



Almost all of the majors had FCVs on display but all except Honda's FCX are concept cars. And then the usual assortment of toys for the ultrarich like this Spyker Aileron C8, which travels 0-60 in 4.5s and sooner or later will get you up to 185mph. All for only $230,000.

[exboyfil]

1. $30K for a Volt and $12K for Cobalt

What is wrong with this picture? You can buy 2 1/2 Cobalts for one Volt. At $3/gal you are only going to spend $12K for 100,000 miles with the Cobalt.

Granted it is just starting its life cycle, but they better have some quick cost reductions to bring it into the world of reality.

[wtmusic]

2. They're $29K, but 2009 Toyota Priuses are backordered

Go figure. Must be worth it to some to kick the oil habit.

[comtec]

4. And prius' are still around the $20k mark IIRC

The EV-1 was about the cost of the average sedan of it's time, IIRC, so why did GM kill the electric car?
I'm all for American made cars (see below) because when we TRY, we make better cars (OK the Germans are better)
but when was the last time anyone cared that there are better, cleaner, more efficient, SAFE cars out there?
When was the last time the media PUSHED that idea?
oh yeah, the media is owned by GM and PGnE... they don't WANT cleaner cars on the road.. wonder why... Hmmmmmmmm

[wtmusic]

6. The Prius at the show was stickered at $29K

Could have been the loaded model, but they're not cheap.

[TheWraith]

18. The EV1 cost $88,000 to build.

GM was legally required to lease it for the average price.

[wtmusic]

19. Surprised is wasn't more

considering they only made 1,300 and it was hand built.

Do you have a link supporting a legal mandate on the lease price?

"The price for the car used to compute lease payments was US$33,995 to US$43,995, which made for lease payments of US$299 to over US$574 per month.Since GM did not offer consumers the offer to purchase and the end of the lease, the car's residual value was never established making it impossible to determine the actual full purchase price or replacement value. One industry official said that each EV1 cost the company about US$80,000, including research, development and other associated costs.<22> The vehicle's lease prices also depended on available state rebates. In 1999, the cost for the electricity used to power the car was computed to be one-third to half the cost of the equivalent amount of gasoline, and since that time, increases in gas prices may have made electricity relatively even less expensive (depending on customer location, recharging time and electricity billing variations — some utility companies have variable billing for peak vs. non-peak usage rates)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1

[TheWraith]

20. I'm afraid I can't find a link right off.

I think that I read it in the Fortune article on Tesla, in a blurb about previous electric vehicles, but I could be completely wrong.

[lectrobyte]

21. More like $25K if you can find a base model, easy to push $30K

with a lot of the dealers adding on extras such as paint sealer etc. I have yet to hear for selling below MSRP.

[exboyfil]

5. Statement cars

I think Prius and Volt are statement cars (cool kind of like the Hummer once was cool). I personally view a car as simply something to get me safely from Point A to Point B. I want cheap reliable transportation.

I got to wonder, given the recent economic turmoil, how many more people like me are going to start thinking that way. Prius and other statement cars may be in for a rocky road in the future.

Until we build a green electrical infrastructure I can see a proliferation of these electric only cars as a problem. There is lots of possibilities for power balancing (ie charging at night in the garage) and possibly charging at work through solar collectors. Take a fold up collector out of your trunk when you get to work, drape it over the car, and plug it in. Don't know how much power it would generate in 6 to 8 hours though given the limited surface area. Also how the collector would hold up in adverse weather.

[wtmusic]

8. A car covered in solar panels

collecting bright sun all day long will gather enough electricity to run the AC for an hour. Not practical for transportation.

That said, from personal experience I can tell you that electric cars are not only useful but clean, and cheap.

My family uses ours for 80% of our driving. My wife commutes with it, I use it for errands. It costs about $2 to charge. It is the perfect second car, and whoever comes out with a production model like the one I put together (the Subaru R1e is similar) will have a runaway hit.

http://www.aspire-ev.com

[Jack Bone]

13. I read a story here at DU a year ago...

about photo-electric paint. Here's something similar, I don't think it's the same story..


Breakthrough in Paint-On Solar
Jamais Cascio
January 10, 2005 2:35 PM

http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/001918.html

A quantum dot may be tiny, but this development has the potential to be quite big.

Researchers at the University of Toronto have developed a new form of photovoltaic material using "quantum dots" -- confined sets of electrons with unusual optical and electronic properties -- embedded into a thin polymer film. The material can generate the photoelectric effect using infrared light, and is the first photoelectric polymer to have significant infrared sensitivity. When working across infrared and visual spectra, it has a photoelectric efficiency of 30% -- six times better than other polymer photovoltaics. 30% efficiency would make quantum dot polymer solar cells competitive with traditional silicon-and-glass panels, and far more functional. Quantum dot polymer material could be used in device cases, and Ted Sargent, one of the researchers responsible for this development, claims that the material could readily be spray-applied or painted on.<snip>

The big win, of course, would be the possibility of an easily-added solar power layer to the external shell of any device using electricity. It doesn't have to replace plug-in power completely to be a significant efficiency improvement.<snip>

[comtec]

12. There are many companies that make plug-in Prius conversions

so much so that Toyota will come out with one in either 09 or '10.
not soon enuf for me, but oh well.
I'll probably get a smart electrics - road testing in the UK, so I'll have it before you guys :p (Holland)

[kristopher]

15. A lot of the $25 billion for "retooling" the auto industry is for new battery plants.

If they don't spend it as a bridge loan for operating costs instead.

[comtec]

3. The Tesla is faster, cheaper, goes FARTHER than the Honda, AND it sounds really KEWL!

I saw a video report on it, and they spent a fair amount of time making the engine for the Tesla.
It's an electric, but the electric motor that pushes it faster than nearly everything else on the road make a very gratifying sound.
not the rumble of a 450, which is deep and bone vibrating, and not high and whiny, like a over exerted electric motor, but something in the middle, something... nice.

Best part, it's made in the Bay Area.

If I had 100k to blow on a car I'd get it. The range is really high for such a high performing car, and since I'd probably use it for daily stuff (it's even somewhat practical in design) I'd find out how long between charges I could go :)

Did I mention that it's a superior AMERICAN design? =]

[wtmusic]

9. Very disappointed that Tesla was not represented at the show

and I've heard they are having budget problems. :-(

They deserve a subsidy and a generous one.

[comtec]

11. I'd LOVE for Tesla to get a subsidy because of the great work they're doing

They are pushing back development of their sedan, which, imho, is insane because they'll sell a MILLION of those as compared to a dozen or so of the 100k models.

Tesla has a GREAT, WORKING design, that NEEDS to be encouraged.

A car plant structure in the Bay Area, I was so EXCITED at the prospect before chimpy put the final nail in the US economy.

[excess_3]

7. 200 electric MINIs have been delivered

> On Wednesday, BMW introduced an electric version of the Mini compact car at the Los Angeles Auto Show. The first 200 of the cars have already been delivered to the United States, <

> http://www.technologyreview.com/energy/21688/?a=f <

[wtmusic]

10. Not sure if they're in the hands of drivers yet

I was told the application process was still underway, but that pretty spokesmodel could have been mistaken :D

[madokie]

14. Looking at the last pic

who would want a car that the doors opened like that?

[wtmusic]

16. Pretty weird.

They must have some kind of counterweight or spring, I can't imagine having to lift that just to get out. The luxury carmakers now fence off their cars from the riffraff and you have to "sign in" to sit in one. :-(

[CRF450]

22. They use gas shocks to help lift the door up.

I'd actually like something like that on my car! The doors are so friggin long that when another vehicle is parked real close its hard to get in and out.

Heres what my car would look like with vertical doors.






The kit alone which consist of the hinges and gas shocks cost like $1500.

[wtmusic]

23. How do you close them while sitting in the car? nt

[CRF450]

24. I guess just lean forward and reach the bottom of the door.

They do actually stand out several inches to the side so the door can close on its regular locking mechanism.

[hatrack]

17. When it debuts at the nearest GM dealer, I'll get excited

Until then, and considering everything else, not holding my breath here.