Solar power’s dirty secrets

[wtmusic]

"Maybe we should banish the term 'clean energy.' Growing corn for ethanol requires fertilizers and pesticides. Producing and shipping small-scale wind turbines for urban areas generates more CO2 than they save. Production of polysilicon for solar panels leaves a trail of toxic waste in China, as The Washington Post reported back in 2008.

Now a survey and scorecard that ranks solar energy firms points to potential environmental, health and safety issues associated with the production and disposal of solar photovoltaic panels–as well as the reluctance of some well-known industry players even to talk about their practices.

The survey comes from the Silicon Valley Toxics Coalition, an activist group that has produced similar scorecards of the computer and TV industries, designed the shame the laggards into reform. (In the argot of environmental activists, this tactic is known as 'rank ‘em and spank ‘em.') SVTC is calling for mandatory takeback and responsible recycling by solar companies as a step toward reducing the solar industry’s environmental footprint."

http://www.marcgunther.com/2010/03/30/solar-powers-dirty-secrets/

[BeatleBoot]

1. We're doomed to sit in the dark or die of global warming

is that it?

[wtmusic]

3. Probably both. nt

[BeatleBoot]

6. That's the spirit!

:rofl:

[Chulanowa]

10. Hey, the dark was good enough for us for about three hundred thousand years

We're living in what amounts to an anomalous fluke of illumination.

And you might die of global warming. Me, I'm thinking i could go for the whole "desert cannibal" thing. I need some goggles and a mohawk though.

[peacebird]

2. Ethanol should use the waste from food crops, not the easy juicy CORN.

Using corn itself is totally counterproductive.

[Ozymanithrax]

4. I think we will find that all forms of energy have their dirty side.

But, we need them.

[NNadir]

5. Not really. While it is true that there is no such thing as risk free energy, some forms of energy

are worse than others.

Solar PV energy has very low energy/mass density and this is not only an economic problem, and a thermodynamic problem, but it is also an environmental problem.

The main reason that this problem is missed is that solar energy is a trivial form of energy and has failed to become significant, in spite of 50 years of rote cheering for it.

If it ever gets to the point where it produces 1 or 2 exajoules out of the 500 exajoules humanity now consumes each year, it's external costs will be obviated.

[Ozymanithrax]

8. I did not say that some weren't better than other, just that all of them have a dirty side.

[drm604]

7. At least some of this article is disingenuous at best.

For example, growing corn for ethanol is obviously a horrible idea that's been pushed by agrobusiness, and there's no justification for lumping it together with wind turbines and solar cells - unless the author has an agenda.

Notice also that he mentions small scale wind turbines but not large scale wind farms. It seems like the author is picking and choosing his examples to make his point.

Is anybody really surprised that China is environmentally careless? This probably says more about China then it does about solar cells.

The answers seem to be simple enough.

• Don't use food for fuel.
• Build large scale wind farms rather than using small scale urban turbines.
• Have and enforce strong environmental regulations for the production of solar panels (and anything else, for that matter).

[obxhead]

9. hmmm, if you follow the links from the article....

http://www.bre.co.uk/newsdetails.jsp?id=456

The results show that, in windy locations such as the outskirts of Wick and parts of Portsmouth, domestic micro-wind turbines can generate sufficient energy to pay back their carbon costs within a few months to a few years and then go on to make a positive contribution to combating global warming, but in large, less windy urban areas such as Manchester they are very unlikely to ever pay back their carbon costs. Even when optimally sited outside of major conurbations financial payback is unlikely for all but the most efficient, low maintenance, low price turbines.

well duh, putting a turbine where the wind does not blow will not likely be a wise investment. I would hardly say this means a wind turbine, regardless of size, makes it a "dirty" source of energy. The various ways of creating clean energy are only clean if placed properly.

[madokie]

11. Maybe we should build these here where we have enviormental laws to regulate this

rather than continue to let our ceo's send this work where there is little or no controls but where they can force people to work for pennies on the dollar all so the ceo's can pocket even more money. The problem lies with the CEO's not with China per sey

[FBaggins]

13. BP just closed a solar manufacturing plant in MD

Moving production to China and India (among others).

[OKIsItJustMe]

12. I am so tired of that Washington Post article being used to condemn the entire solar industry

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/08/AR2008030802595.html

...

Because of the environmental hazard, polysilicon companies in the developed world recycle the compound, putting it back into the production process. But the high investment costs and time, not to mention the enormous energy consumption required for heating the substance to more than 1800 degrees Fahrenheit for the recycling, have discouraged many factories in China from doing the same. Like Luoyang Zhonggui, other solar plants in China have not installed technology to prevent pollutants from getting into the environment or have not brought those systems fully online, industry sources say.

"The recycling technology is of course being thought about, but currently it's still not mature," said Shi Jun, a former photovoltaic technology researcher at the Chinese Academy of Sciences.

Shi, chief executive of Pro-EnerTech, a start-up polysilicon research firm in Shanghai, said that there's such a severe shortage of polysilicon that the government is willing to overlook this issue for now.

"If this happened in the United States, you'd probably be arrested," he said.

...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=115&topic_id=138545&mesg_id=138545

[Javaman]

14. Uranium Tillings. nt