Ocean Spray Lubricates Hurricane Winds

[phantom power]

This is one of those ideas that might need to be filed under "cure worse than disease", but it's an interesting possibility.

It also makes me wonder about what facilitates sustained high winds over land. I suppose that winds over land are not sustained over such large distances, or for such long periods of time.

Berkeley -- Hurricane Emily's 140-mile-per-hour winds, which last week blew roofs off hotels and flattened trees throughout the Caribbean, owed their force to an unlikely culprit -- ocean spray.

According to a new study by two University of California, Berkeley, mathematicians and their Russian colleague, the water droplets kicked up by rough seas serve to lubricate the swirling winds of hurricanes and cyclones, letting them build to speeds approaching 200 miles per hour. Without the lubricating effect of the spray, the mathematicians estimate, winds would rise to little more than 25 miles per hour.

"This is not a small effect," said Alexandre Chorin, professor of mathematics at UC Berkeley and faculty researcher at Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory (LBNL). He and fellow UC Berkeley mathematics professor Grigory I. Barenblatt, also of LBNL, along with V. M. Prostokishin of the Shirshov Institute of Oceanology in Moscow, published their analysis of the effect of ocean spray in the Early Online Edition of the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

"If you could develop a detergent to reduce the size of the droplets, you might be able to stop a hurricane," he said. "That's not as far fetched as it sounds. In ancient times, sailors carried oil to pour out on the water to calm storms. Pouring oil on choppy waters was not a superstition."
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/07/050726074054.htm

[iamjoy]

1. Hurricanes Weaken Over Land

I always thought it was due to friction.
I am not sure it is a smart idea to try and alter the molecular structure of our ocean's water, even to weaken hurricanes - and I live in Florida.

This sounds like another wild idea, kind of like using jet engines to blow hurricanes away from land.

[phantom power]

2. It is still friction. What's a bit surprising is...

the reason that friction is less over water. Apparently, it's not because it's more flat, with no trees, etc.

The other reason hurricanes lose steam over land is that warm water is the source of their energy. Over land they lose the mechanism that drives them.

[donsu]

3. someone prove to me that "sailors carried oil to pour out on the water

to calm storms. Pouring oil on choppy waters was not a supersitition."


nutty, nuts, insane

prove it.

[phantom power]

4. Well, I found this...

Why does pouring Oil on the Sea make it Clear and Calm? Is it that the winds, slipping the smooth oil, have no force, nor cause any waves?
- Plutarch, Morals--Natural Questions (XII)


How Bishop Aiden foretold to certain seamen a storm that would happen, and gave them some holy oil to lay it.
- Bede "The Venerable", Ecclesiastical History (III, 15),
heading of chapter

http://www.giga-usa.com/gigaweb1/quotes2/qutopnavigationx001.htm

[One_Life_To_Give]

6. USCG Required Lifeboats to carry

"supply of storm oil and a perforated oil bag to help in riding out breakers on rough seas" (WW2) USCG


I had heard of this before in reference to use in following seas. Although it is now illegal under MARPOL. Shipping interests in the early to mid 20th century could have deposited significant amounts of oil on the surface of the worlds oceans doing this.

[Dogmudgeon]

8. Try it yourself

Ben Franklin occasionally used it as a trick to astonish his friends. He filled a hollow stick with oil and "calmed" the rough water on a local pond. Then he'd usually tell his pals how he did it.

It works pretty well with choppy water, but not in all-out storms. I've never heard that sailors carried oil for the purpose.

--p!

[phantom power]

9. Are there two separate phenomena here?

These historic references seem to refer to reducing chop, in other words the waves. This wind-speed business appears to be referring to reducing the turbulence in the wind, near the surface of the ocean, not reducing waves.

I also notice that they refer to surfactants to reduce droplet size, not oils.

So, maybe that guy's reference to the ancients was not quite the right analogy.

[Dogmudgeon]

11. It might be similar

When I read the original article -- about ocean spray -- I was astounded. But if it is using a similar mechanism, it's a plausible theory. It's still going to have to be scrutinized and tested, but that should be an interesting pursuit.

Changes in the physical dynamics of air and water like these may be far more consequential than we think. If global climate change is altering some of the "constants" of climatology, then we will have to backtrack and rethink a lot of our ideas with this new finding in mind. Now, that's standard practice in the natural sciences, but with something as significant as climate change involved, it could become a truly Big Deal.

--p!

[longship]

5. Who could have imagined

That there would be a connection between cranberry juice and hurricanes.
:shrug:

[One_Life_To_Give]

7. Some things just "Bog" the mind n/t

[NNadir]

10. Next time Exxon dumps a few million barrels of oil in the ocean,

they can tell us that they're engaged in "hurricane prevention."

In another time I wouldn't have worried so much about avenues for scientific distortion, but man, these are times quite unlike any other.