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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 07:07 AM
Original message
Obama pushes Australia on military bases, on uranium sales to India
http://antinuclear.net/2011/11/15/usa-pushes-australia-on-military-bases-on-uranium-sales-to-india/

USA pushes Australia on military bases, on uranium sales to India

Australia under nuclear pressure, Independent Australia, 15 Nov 2011 The prime minister announced today that Australia is set to overturn its ban on uranium sales to India, a non-signatory to the nuclear non-proliferation treaty. The reason why she’s doing this is simple, Barack Obama asked her — because it’s good for the US economy. Noel Wauchope reports……



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kristopher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 09:35 AM
Response to Original message
1. Not Obama. The uranium mining companies in Austraila are making a full court press.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. If I work all day in the Blue Sky Mine
There will be bread on the table tonight.
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kristopher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. If that has a meaning it isn't at all clear.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. It's a song by Midnight Oil
Whose song writer and singer became a minister of parliament in Australia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Sky_Mine
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kristopher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. OK, thanks.
A lot of people folks aren't aware of how the US is often used as a bogeyman on local politics overseas. The picture of Uncle Sam cracking the whip is a classic appeal to nationalism (in this case Australian).
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TheWraith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-16-11 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Here, you and I agree on something.
I for one am sick of the US and particularly the US federal government being used as a universal Big Scary Monster, both here and abroad, to justify everything from political spin and jingoism to outright conspiracy theories. Not everything that happens in the world involves us.
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Nihil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
6. Well, that sucks.
> The prime minister announced today that Australia is set to overturn
> its ban on uranium sales to India, a non-signatory to the nuclear
> non-proliferation treaty. The reason why she’s doing this is simple,
> Barack Obama asked her — because it’s good for the US economy.

So much for the non-proliferation treaty when it gets in the way
of re-election chances ...

:puke:
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Vehl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. The NPT is one of the most discriminatory treaties in the world
Edited on Tue Nov-15-11 06:28 PM by Vehl
It stipulates that only the "big five" can have nukes while the rest cannot. India has been one of the vocal supporters of global nuclear disarmament from the 40s and it had repeatedly stated that it will not sign the NPT because its discriminatory. They are a global leader in nuclear energy technology, and are but a few years years away from having their thorium reactors coming on line (one is already operational). Coincidentally, India has the world's largest thorium reserves. They really do not "need" Aussie uranium to make more nukes; as according to one calculation, their existing reactors make enough enriched uranium for about 200 warheads per year. It is their self imposed limit that sees their stockpile of nukes in the region of 100ish and not more. This uranium will be used to fuel their energy needs.

For all the "talk" about getting rid of nukes, will the big five get rid of theirs? nope. As for reductions..its but a ploy, because with today's super accurate missiles, one does not need the tens of thousands of cold-war era stockpiles. So I would not put much stock by the reductions(to a mere 7000ish!! nukes each?) of nuclear weapons by the US/Russia either.

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Nihil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-16-11 06:04 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. I'm sure Iran feels the same way ...
... but, strangely enough, Obama isn't trying to persuade anyone to
break the treaty and sell weapons material to them is he?

Gosh ... what a surprise ... a president who is a hypocritical toady to the
obscene armaments industry ...

:eyes:
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Vehl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-16-11 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. India didnt break the treaty, cos they didnt sign it in the first place
Edited on Wed Nov-16-11 11:11 PM by Vehl
Sucks to be Iran, cos it went ahead and signed it. This is what happens when people/countries follow the bandwagon just cos everyone else does. It's truly amazing how the big five hoodwinked pretty much every single nation in the world into signing it. Kudos to India for sticking by its values.

Umnn not sure how the armaments industry plays into this, given that India is not buying any nukes from the US. The Indian-America nuclear deal saw India putting all of its civilian nuclear facilities under the watch of the IAEA. Any Uranium procured from Australia will fall under the oversight of the IAEA and used only in the civilian facilities to produce electricity.

They have an extensive nuclear facility/infrastructure and every single civilian facility is under IAEA watch. So I dont see whats the big deal about this Aussie business.

Link to map
http://www.dae.gov.in/publ/nucmaprev3

^^ add a .jpg to the end of the link. cos the link is kinda messed up and shows the image on the post instead of just displaying the link.
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pscot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-15-11 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
7. I was really hoping for solutions
when I voted for the guy. He seems to be clueless to the point of irrelevance. We might have well as elected McCain for all the difference it's made.
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The Northerner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-16-11 03:42 AM
Response to Original message
9. Is anyone here willing to defend this? n/t
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kristopher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-16-11 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Defend what? There is zero evidence the claim in the OP article is true.
It is a typical use of Uncle Sam (and this public face the Obama admin) to stoke nationalism in a parochial political spitball fight. There are no quotes, no evidence presented at all that the US is pressing the policy claimed.

I do not endorse the nuclear industry, but it isn't necessary to fabricate objections to their activities, practices and technologies; there are plenty of legitimate problems available that condemn them.
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-16-11 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. If you want some quotes, just follow the links in the article
For example the article discusses and links to a radio interview with Dr M.V. Ramana:
http://www.independentaustralia.net/2011/business/australia-under-nuclear-pressure/

<snip>

There is much press coverage about how upset India is, about this. However, as it turns out, it is not all that important. According to Indian experts, such as Dr M.V. Ramana, who spoke on the ABC ‘National Interest’ programme last week, this issue is “purely symbolic” — as India does not need Australia’s uranium, having its own supplies and several other countries who do export to India. Also, India’s grand nuclear future doesn’t look too bright as domestic opposition to new nuclear power plants is growing stronger all the time in the Republic.

Chillingly, Professor Ramana reminds us that by selling uranium to India, Australia would promote its nuclear weapons development, in that Australian uranium for “peaceful” purposes would simply free up India’s uranium for its weapons program.

But now, Australia is coming under intense pressure from the U.S.A. to change its policy on uranium sales to India. Why? Well, the U.S. was foremost in the pressure on the Nuclear Suppliers Group to grant the exemptions that now permit sale of nuclear technology to India. The U.S. is intently pushing India to change its Nuclear Liability Law — to enable technology sales to India.

Yes, it comes back to the USA’s determination to make money out of nuclear technology. While USA’s domestic nuclear industry founders – unable to get investment for new nuclear reactors – its big hope is in selling nuclear technology to “developing” countries — India, China, anybody!

<snip>

If you follow the embedded link in the article you go to the radio website which has transcripts and audio:
http://www.abc.net.au/rn/nationalinterest/

day 11 November 2011

Listen Now Download Audio (25.0 MB) 18:10 The round-up - listen download
18:15 If mining loses its boom - listen download
18:30 Uranium exports: the India conundrum Transcript listen download
18:45 The fight for the right to repair - listen download
19:00 Feedback - listen download


Follow the transcript link and you'll find that Ramana also quotes other people:
http://www.abc.net.au/rn/nationalinterest/stories/2011/3362894.htm#transcript

11 November 2011
Uranium exports: the India conundrum
listen now download audio

<snip>

Pakistan has vowed that it is going to try and match India to the extent that it can. It's expanding its plutonium production capacity because India is doing this. They've stated repeatedly that the energy neighbours had propelled it to sort of expand its nuclear fissile material production.

Those are the facts on the table. Now it's for Australia to decide whether they want to add fuel to this process, as it were.

<snip>

Right. The Nuclear Suppliers Group is a body that works on consensus. Now, we know from all accounts that there were huge differences of opinion within the group about whether India should be given a special waiver or not. And we also know from all public records that the United States and France and Russia, which were looking to get reactor sales, put a huge amount of pressure on every country that was opposing it.

And then Jayantha Dhanapala, the former United Nations Undersecretary General for Disarmament Affairs, described what the United States and other countries did as a 'campaign of brutal and unconscionable pressure.' So this was not some kind of a very goodhearted decision where everybody said, 'Oh, India's such a great country, we need to sell things to them.'

<snip>

And the hope was that by importing uranium from other countries to be used in safeguarded reactors, India could free up its own domestic uranium reserves for use in its nuclear weapons program. And this was an opinion that was registered by, among others, K Subrahmanyam, the former head of the National Security Advisory Board of India, who argued that given India's uranium ??? and the need to build up our nuclear deterrent arsenal as fast as possible, it is to India's advantage to categorise as many power reactors as possible as civilian ones to be refuelled by imported uranium and conserve our native uranium fuel for weapons-grade plutonium production.

<snip>


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kristopher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-16-11 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. I'm sorry but that doesn't support the claim about Obama.
It doesn't even come close. I have no doubt the uranium mining companies are eager for change, but you can't lay that at the feet of the administration.
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