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EPA Improves Its Mileage Estimates, But Stats Still Don't Tell the Whole Story (WSJ)

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lindisfarne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 02:56 PM
Original message
EPA Improves Its Mileage Estimates, But Stats Still Don't Tell the Whole Story (WSJ)
Edited on Fri Jan-12-07 02:58 PM by lindisfarne
With estimates being revised downwards, will the standards manufacturers have to meet for fleet mileage be revised downwards? If not, it at least will effectively serve to up manufacturer's fleet mileage (in the absence of the Bush admin's willingness to do so). It won't be enough, but at least it's something ..

Carl Bialik
EPA Improves Its Mileage Estimates,
But Stats Still Don't Tell the Whole Story
January 12, 2007
http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB116852698135573876-yPA3ncIcKiUTWQqIBAL1DAT9ddU_20080112.html (free today; may change)

Jumping to the last paragraph:
Focusing on consumption rather than mpg ratings can make a big difference. Consider this example: Compare a compact car that today is labeled at 40 mpg, and a sport utility vehicle rated at 12 mpg. Suppose both are being driven 15,000 miles a year. The compact would use 375 gallons of gas a year, and the SUV would require 1,250 gallons -- or 875 gallons more than the car. Now suppose that the compact's mpg estimate drops by 20% to 32 mpg, and the SUV's drops by just 10% to 10.8 mpg. At first glance, it seems the compact has suffered more from the change. But crunch the numbers, and you'll see that 15,000 miles of driving would consume 920 more gallons in the SUV than in the compact. The small car's advantage increased by 45 gallons.

then jumping back to near the top (5th paragraph)
But caveats remain about the new fuel-economy labels, including their reliance on what is essentially a treadmill test of cars, which still may not accurately capture real-world performance. Also, some critics say the focus should be on annual fuel cost, not miles per gallon. Some cars with particularly high mpg ratings, including hybrids, will appear to take the biggest hit under the new rules, when in fact their advantage over lower-economy cars could end up being even greater (more on that in a bit).

skipping a few paragraphs ...
The new mpg ratings take into effect faster speeds (80 miles per hour, instead of 60) and quicker acceleration (eight miles per hour, per second, instead of 3.2.) They also consider the use of air conditioning and driving in cold weather. In general, average city mpg will drop by 12%, and highway will decline by 8%, the EPA says.

The EPA conducted road tests of vehicles, including a test of more than 600 cars in Kansas City in 2004 and 2005, to calculate the effect of the new factors. Then it derived averages for each vehicle class. For now, auto makers are free to use these class-average revisions, or to run their own EPA-monitored tests on each model. But by the 2011 model year, all models must be individually tested. (Current mileage estimates are based on tests car makers conduct using EPA guidelines. The EPA runs its own tests on 10% to 15% of the cars to make sure there are no significant discrepancies.)

and skipping another few:
For its tests, Consumer Reports used its Colchester, Conn., test track and the roads nearby, comparing 303 models with EPA numbers and finding discrepancies as great as 35% to 50% for city-driving numbers. Unlike Edmunds and the auto club, Consumer Reports directly measured fuel usage with a meter situated between the tank and the engine. The organization said that method is superior to the one generally employed by car owners, which is to compare distance traveled with how many gallons are required to fill up the tank -- with "full" measured by the automatic sensors in gas pumps.
... a few more paragraphs before the last (which is pasted in above)
************
Sorry for all the skips but since the WSJ usually requires a subscription, I wanted to paste in the most informative parts of the article, as most people don't subscribe. Most of what is missing either deals with the issue of the earlier EPA standards not doing a good job, or anecdotal stories of how people noticed their mileage was considerably less than the EPA estimates.


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LisaM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
1. Cut the speed limits.
I'm serious.
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NickB79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Ditto
They're testing them at 80 mph? Is there even a state in the US that allows such high speeds legally?

I would love to see the speed limit back down to 55mph across the board. My car, driven at 55mph, gets an honest 40-42 mpg. When driven at 70 mph, it gets 34-35 mpg.
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lindisfarne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. CA doesn't allow it legally but the normal speed limit (in 65 zones)is at least 73 and many pass you
Edited on Fri Jan-12-07 05:02 PM by lindisfarne
at faster rates. So although technically, it's not legal, if the laws aren't enforced, people will violate them frequently. If CA only enforced its traffic laws, the fines would go a long way towards improving municipal and state budgets!
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Actually it is legal
"California's Basic Speed Law, <12> of the California Vehicle Code, defines the maximum speed at which a car may travel as a reasonable and prudent speed, given road conditions. The numerical limit set by CalTrans engineers for "Speed Limit" signs, generally found on all non-controlled-access routes, is considered a presumptive maximum "reasonable and prudent" speed. However, it is technically allowable for a driver ticketed for exceeding this "Speed Limit" to present the argument that his or her speed was "reasonable and prudent" at the time the ticket was issued. While rare, some speeding tickets have been thrown out based on this provision."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_United_States

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CRF450 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. And I think I know the reason behind that
The optimal fuel milage at a given speed is not the same on all cars, it mainly due to how its geared. My 6 speed Trans Am is geared so tall, I cant to into 6th untill I'm around 63mph without lugging the engine, that about 1400rpm too, and 5th at the same speed would go up just over 2000rpm.
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lindisfarne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. You missed the part that said"CA was forced to create a new legal signage category, Maximum Speed..
Edited on Fri Jan-12-07 10:31 PM by lindisfarne
When the National Maximum Speed Limit was enacted, California was forced to create a new legal signage category, Maximum Speed, to indicate to drivers that the Basic Speed Law did not apply on these federally funded highways; rather, it would be a violation to exceed the fixed maximum speed indicated on the sign, regardless of whether the driver's speed could be considered "reasonable and prudent".

I don't see how it can possibly be "reasonable and prudent" to go 10 mph faster than the posted speed limit - one reason for speed limits is to ensure your reaction time is adequate for the road conditions. A few years ago, on a state I can't possibly see how it can be "reasonable & highway that was posted 65, someone going about 85 actually flew off the road and ended up dead - the road is kind of roller-coaster-y and apparently, the car somehow ended up airborne and of course, uncontrollable. Don't ask me for more details as I don't recall more, but I do recall that the relevant transportation agency came out and said that while the road was safe for the posted speed limit, exceeding it could be dangerous, exactly for the reasons that killed the guy (and as long as he's off the road and not killing anyone else, I was not too sad about the whole thing - too many people have been killed by the people who speed like that).
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CRF450 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 11:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Its not just speed that can cause accidents
People can drive fast and be safe about it, others cant. Most drivers dont want to just putt along on an open highway at 55 (most of the highways here in NC are 55) I certainly dont LOL! I never go anymore than 9 over the speed limit, except for those occasions when I have the need for speed.

Look at the autobahn in Germany, they have speed limits that are faster than some of the econo cars here can go, to no speed limits at all! Its also the safest highway in the world because those drivers are trained 10 times better than we are, and the rules their are very very strict!

We really need the driver training that they get over here. If you want to drive at 55, I got no problem with that, I'll just go around.
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lindisfarne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-13-07 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. The higher the speed, the lower the chances of surviving an accident. Your reaction time
Edited on Sat Jan-13-07 01:54 PM by lindisfarne
is the same whether you're traveling fast or slow - thus, if you're travelling faster, you're going to travel a longer distance during the time it takes you to react in an emergency situation.

If you're going 35 and need to slam on the breaks, you're going to be moving much slower when you hit the car in front of you than you would if you were going 80. It's simple physics.

It doesn't matter how good a driver you are if the driver in front of you slams on their brakes - the laws of physics apply to good and bad drivers alike.

Of course, a driver going 80 mph and swerving in and out of traffic, is more likely to cause an accident than a driver going 80 mph and staying in the same lane. But, if both were going 55 mph, rather than 80 mph, they'd both have a greater chance of surviving an accident (and so would anyone in another car).

The argument that some people drive recklessly while others are more careful, is only an argument for lower speed limits overall. Violating the speed limit *is* reckless driving.
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bananas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-13-07 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. That's on federally funded highways only
There was a case in San Diego many years ago,
on a side street in a residential area,
late at night,
the "speed limit" was something like 35,
a police car travelling about 80 struck and killed a person crossing the street.
The police car wasn't going anywhere in particular,
it was not racing to a crime scene or an emergency.
The cop got off because his lawyer convinced the judge that he was going at a reasonable and prudent speed.

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lindisfarne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-12-07 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. You're right. I'm *always* passed when I'm going 67-68 in a 65 zone.
And 65 is too high. Occasionally I'll fall in behind a hybrid driver who's sticking to 65 to maximize the mileage - I've been in "trains" like this of up to 5 cars long - where we'd all like to take a stand against the cars going so fast, but if you're a single car, all they do in So. Cal. is swerve around you, cutting the merge WAY TOO CLOSE - which makes driving the speed limit dangerous (would be nice if CA Hwy Patrol would enforce speed limits). I've had that happen on both residential streets and freeways - where if I had sped up just a little as they were passing, the passing car would have clipped me.
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