EDITORIAL - Stop epidemic of gun violence

[CO Liberal]

Stop epidemic of gun violence

Health department, law enforcement join forces for public safety

PETER SAFIR
Special to The Observer

Over the past few years the Mecklenburg County Health Department's Fighting Back Program has effectively engaged in partnerships with thousands of neighborhood residents in a comprehensive campaign against drugs and alcohol. The success of this effort has generated awareness and concern about other serious issues, including the gun violence that is frequently committed under the influence of alcohol and through the trafficking and usage of other drugs.

The increasing frequency of death and serious injuries resulting from firearms represents a major problem that makes gun violence more than just a criminal justice issue, but also a critical public health concern.

In Mecklenburg County, 66 percent of last year's homicides were gun-related deaths, with firearms responsible for an increasing number of serious injuries. Since January, guns are responsible for 63 percent of 35 reported homicides and aggravated assaults. These numbers contribute to national statistics that represent a fatality rate roughly equivalent to that associated with HIV infection.

Recognizing that these trends are unacceptable, the health department has joined with the U.S. Justice Department and other law enforcement agencies in an effort to stem the tide of gun-related injuries and deaths. Like disease, gun violence does not occur at random. Its causes are predicable and, therefore, preventable. What is required is a combination of efforts, including law enforcement strategies, public health techniques and prevention efforts that involve the entire community.

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http://www.charlotte.com/mld/observer/news/6837471.htm

[jody]

1. "firearms responsible for an increasing number of serious injuries"?

Thank goodness criminals didn't cause any of the injuries.

The editorial says the causes of gun violence "are predicable and, therefore, preventable." We have discussed this very topic implicitly in various threads on the J/PS forum but we must have missed the research that produced a model that "predicts gun violence". Does anyone have a link to that a report?

It is one thing to predict in an actuarial sense that x number of deaths will occur in a given population, but it is another problem to predict when John Doe will die. All the research I've read on firearms and violence deal with populations and not predicting at the individual level. The recent postings on this forum show that many seemingly normal people commit crimes.

Other than aggressive enforcement of firearm laws, I still haven't read any proposed law that would reduce firearm related crime and not infringe upon a citizen's inalienable right to defend self and property.

[GOPFighter]

2. Inalienable right to use a firearm for protection?

Why not grenades? Maybe we can rim our property with plastic explosives and trip wires.

Protecting one's life and property may be an inalienable right, but why do you assume that that inalienable right includes the use of firearms? Shouldn't society have a say in what is allowable for self-defense and what isn't? Why do all the pro-gunners always assume self-defense equals firearms?

[RoeBear]

3. Let's say it was your decision...

...what would you allow for self-defense?

[jody]

4. As a starting point, citizens use the same arms for self defense as

criminals and law enforcement personnel. Note that neither criminals nor law enforcement personnel have an inalienable right to defend self.

Are you saying that law abiding citizens should be limited to sling shots when criminals and law enforcement personnel use handguns?

[GOPFighter]

5. So when criminals up the ante...

...then we can too? And how many criminals have to use a more powerful weapon before we can use it? One, ten? A thousand? People must understand tha criminals will ALWAYS have the upper hand. They can choose when to strike, who to strike, and they will never recognize any bounds on the weapons they use. I don't want to live in a society where criminals make the rules.

[DocSavage]

6. Criminals making the rules

We make the rules, criminals break the rules, that is why they are criminals. Criminals will not always have the upper hand. He/she does when they attack an unarmed unprepared person, they do not when the person pulls a pistol and knows how to use it.

The people that feel the 2nd applies to all law abiding citizens also accept reasonable gun control. We do not accept the concept that law abiding citizens should not have the ability to buy or carry a weapon when they wish. Your agument of wiring you property with concertina wire and claymores is a tad over the top. That is not what the 2nd is about.

[GOPFighter]

8. Dang...

...I should never get sucked into gun arguments when I'm at work.

"He/she does when they attack an unarmed unprepared person, they do not when the person pulls a pistol and knows how to use it."

He/she does when they attack an armed person when he/she knows they are carrying. There is nothing magical about being armed! Too many people live in a make believe world that just by carrying a gun, they cannot be mugged, or if they are mugged the criminal will kindly let the victim pull his gun and shoot, or something. (I'm sorry, I just get sick and tired of gun enthusiast who believe that carrying a gun is the magic bullet (pun intended) for self-protection.)

[library_max]

9. Where do you think "criminals" get their guns?

They get them in the same places as law abiding citizens, or they get them FROM law-abiding citizens. If law-abiding citizens couldn't get guns, where would "the criminals" get theirs?

The pro-gun argument always assumes that somehow "criminals" are a different species from people and can do all kinds of magical things.

[jody]

10. Sorry but "According to the 1997 Survey of State Prison Inmates,

among those possessing a gun, the source of the gun was from -

* a flea market or gun show for fewer than 2%
* a retail store or pawnshop for about 12%
* family, friends, a street buy, or an illegal source for 80%
UNQUOTE

See BJS Firearms and Crime Statistics

Note selling or giving a firearm to a known criminal is a federal offense with penalties up to 10 years in prison.

Recommed you become famiiar with your local library. It's amazing what useful data they have available to treat ignorance.

[library_max]

11. Family, friends, street buy, illegal source

So where did that gun come from? Those are all non-answers. An "illegal source" could be anything. The others are equally meanignless. Where, ultimately, did the gun come from if not from a source where "law-abiding citizens" get their guns? China? An army base? Oz?

You're giving an awful lot of credibility to a survey of felons conducted by Ashcroft's Justice Department.

And BTW, I am a librarian myself. I am quite familiar with finding data. I also know how to find propaganda. And I even know how to tell one from the other.

[slackmaster]

12. Ultimately they came from the Earth itself

Mined, as metal ores.

Or you could push it back farther to the Big Bang.

[jody]

14. Sorry, but the survey was conducted by Janet Reno's Justice Dept.. eom

[BullDozer]

15. Sigh

You're giving an awful lot of credibility to a survey of felons conducted by Ashcroft's Justice Department.

"According to the 1997 Survey of State Prison Inmates, among those possessing a gun, the source of the gun was from "

Thus it was not conducted by Ashcroft's Justince Department.


Where, ultimately, did the gun come from...

If you go back far enough in the chain you'll see that they come from the earth. Minerals are mined and refined into metals and so on. :spank:

[MrBenchley]

20. Of course, we are never supposed to ask

where "family, friends, a street buy, or an illegal source" might have bought THEIR guns....evidentl;y the RKBA crowd believes the gun fairy left them under a cabbage leaf.

[slackmaster]

13. I have an actual answer to your attempted rhetorical question

If law-abiding citizens couldn't get guns, where would "the criminals" get theirs?

They would import them from other countries, or manufacture them in clandestine machine shops, or both.

[library_max]

18. This ever happen in the real world?

Got any support for your assumption?

[jody]

19. Perhaps you should check with your library because a google query

on "gun making" " middle east" turned up a number of hits confirming gunmaking in rustic shops much more primitive than we have in the US.

Darra, North-West Frontier Province: "Darra is just an hour south of Peshawar in the Northwest Frontier Province. Here craftsmen have been making guns and ammunition for over 100 years"

[MrBenchley]

23. Gee, jody, how many guns from Darra and Peshawar

end up in East St. Louis?

[jody]

7. as Roebear asked "what would you allow for self-defense?" eom

[Wcross]

16. Jody

Maybe the fetal position? With any luck my attacker will be skilled and do it quickly. Of course, I am a man so I wouldn't have to worry about the rape part.(I HOPE!)

Oh, My! I believe I will keep and bear my arms, thank you very much.

[RoeBear]

17. The silence was deafening...

...wasn't it?

[demsrule4life]

21. Your entire post you imply that criminals do make the rules

what is your point?

[Withergyld]

22. That article sayes...

A whole lot of nothing.
<snip>
"Like disease, gun violence does not occur at random. Its causes are predicable and, therefore, preventable."

It does not list ANY causes.

<snip>
"Through the Fighting Back Program, the health department is working to identify and support a network of concerned citizens who are informed about the dangers of gun violence and armed with effective strategies to create safer neighborhoods. We are working with community police officers, churches, health professionals and neighborhood leaders who are mobilizing in the belief that something can and must be done to stop the violence. We will continue to support the efforts of violence prevention groups such as Mothers of Murdered Offspring and school-based programs like "Do the Write Thing" that are dedicated to reducing firearm-related deaths."

It does not say HOW or WHY these programs are effective.

<snip>
"Gun violence is a preventable tragedy, but in order for these grim statistics to go down, sustained and committed community collaboration and involvement must go up. As we begin Project Safe Neighborhoods, I am convinced that our community is ready to take the necessary steps to reverse this epidemic of gun violence."

I agree that in most cases this is preventable, but no information is given on HOW they intend to prevent it. They mention the names of several program wihout telling HOW or WHY these programs will reduce violence.