AshKKKroft's Gun Rights Idioocy

[MrBenchley]

"It turns out that the attorney general -- best friend to gun fanatics -- refuses to allow the FBI to use a law enforcement database to investigate whether alleged terrorists have purchased or tried to purchase firearms. In other words, Ashcroft would rather stay loyal to the gun lobby than find out whether terrorists have Tec-9's.
Ashcroft has a history of Second Amendment absolutism. A member of the National Rifle Association, he was the subject of a flattering profile in its magazine earlier this year. And, as head of the Justice Department, he has been the NRA's lackey.
In May, he wrote the NRA leadership a letter in which he abandoned long-standing Justice Department policy to declare that the "Second Amendment clearly protects the right of individuals to keep and bear firearms."
Previously, the Justice Department had supported reasonable restrictions on individual gun ownership.
In a stunning exception to his treatment of noncitizens since Sept. 11, he has decided that gun-purchase records may not be used to check whether foreigners have tried to buy firearms; they have a right to privacy that must be protected.
They have no other rights, mind you. "

http://www.callandpost.com/callandpost/law/default_article.asp?id=302

[slackmaster]

1. Another crock of shit brought to you by the VPC/Brady Center

The law (Section 922 in Title 18 of the United States Code as amended by the Brady Act) requires the National Instant Check System to:

"...(A) assign a unique identification number to the transfer;

(B) provide the licensee with the number; and

(C) destroy all records of the system with respect to the call (other than the identifying number and the date the number was assigned) and all records of the system relating to the person or the transfer...."

There is no provision for retention of personal identifying information once the check is completed.

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/cgi-bin/htm_hl?DB=uscode18&STEMMER=en&WORDS=922+&COLOUR=Red&STYLE=s&URL=/uscode/18/922.html#muscat_highlighter_first_match

In other words, Ashcroft would rather stay loyal to the gun lobby than find out whether terrorists have Tec-9's.

That is an absurd statement. At no time does any data about the type of gun being sold ever enter the NICS database. NICS data is simply a list of individuals known to be prohibited from owning firearms.

If the FBI thinks a person is enough of a risk to be worth monitoring, they have plenty of legal means to do that available to them. This so-called issue is a distraction, a sideshow.

[MrBenchley]

2. Pimp for AshKKKroft over at highroadrage.com, slack

Nice playmate you got there....

[Superfly]

3. Tell me something, Bench

How does it feel to be wrong all the time? I don't know how you do it...

[MrBenchley]

5. Not being an RKBA loony, I wouldn't know, fly....

Why don't you tell us....

[slackmaster]

7. Another Guilt by Association/Personal Attack

Benchley, do you have anything of substance to contribute to the discussion today?

[MrBenchley]

14. Gee, slack, you lie down with AshKKKroft

and see what you get....

[slackmaster]

16. Guilt by Association

Seems to be your second favorite fallacious argument.

Do you have anything constructive or instructive to add to the discussion?

[MrBenchley]

20. Just pointing out birds of a feather

Now go cry about it to somebody who gives a shit.

[slackmaster]

21. Yup, that's guilt by association and a personal attack.

Claiming that John Ashcroft and I have anything in common.

[MrBenchley]

28. Gee, slack, who's that pimping AshKKKroft's views

why...it's you and the rest of the RKBA crowd!

[slackmaster]

32. More guilt by association

Got substance?

[slackmaster]

4. When you don't have a leg to stand on the the debate

A basic argumentum ad hominem will get you through the day.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/personal-attack.html

[MrBenchley]

6. Yeah, we could tell from your "crock of shit" comment

that you didn't have anything but hot air, slack....

[demsrule4life]

9. Earlier today you said us RKBA types

cound not handle reality, what is your excuse?

[MrBenchley]

12. Dems, I'M not the one pimping for AshKKKroft

that would be the RKBA crowd....

[slackmaster]

17. More Guilt by Association

Classic example of the time-tested bogus argument.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/guilt-by-association.html

[MrBenchley]

19. Gee, slack...you pimp for AshKKKroft

and I'll associate with decent people....

[slackmaster]

23. I've never met Mr. Ashcroft

So cut the crap.

[MrBenchley]

24. And yet you pimp for his idiotic views

[slackmaster]

26. Another personal attack

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day, Benchley. If Ashcroft wants to go with a strict interpretation of a very simple, clearly written law in this case that's fine with me. That position is protective of peoples' privacy. If someone is suspected of terrorism the FBI can get all kinds of information without going on a fishing expidition through data that is required by law to be discarded.

[MrBenchley]

30. Nope, just an acccurate description

"If Ashcroft wants to go with a strict interpretation of a very simple, clearly written law in this case that's fine with me."
So tell us, how do you feel about his revisionist assertion that the Second Amendment confers an individual right to own guns?

"That position is protective of peoples' privacy."
Yeah, to hell with public safety when guns are involved. Some swell position, that is.

[slackmaster]

33. Finally your fallacious responses are getting more interesting

So tell us, how do you feel about his revisionist assertion that the Second Amendment confers an individual right to own guns?

Ladies and Gentlemen, we have a Red Herring!

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/red-herring.html

I've always liked canned fish.

[MrBenchley]

34. Gee, slack, dodging the question?

Never mind...we already knew all along you WERE pimping AshKKroft's nutcase views here.....as is the rest of the RKBA crowd.

[slackmaster]

35. No, avoiding your obvious smoke screen

You've been caught with your pants down advocating a position that is inconsistent with obeying the law, and are unable to admit that you were ignorant of that law.

[MrBenchley]

36. Yeah, surrrrrrrre....now go pimp for AshKKKroft and

his nutcase views elsewhere.

[slackmaster]

10. And still you don't even try to address my point

I quoted the actual text of the law that prohibits NICS data from being used for the proposed purpose. That safeguard was intentionally put into the Brady Act to prevent NICS from being used (i.e. abused) to create a gun registry.

If you don't like it your time might be better spent lobbying to get the law changed.

[MrBenchley]

13. Gee, slack, I'm not even going to bother

with that pantload...

[slackmaster]

15. Another Appeal to Ridicule

You think the LAW is a pantload?

LOL!

[MrBenchley]

18. No, slack

I think your post is a pantload.

[slackmaster]

22. I quote applicable law and you call it a pantload

What's the problem MrB? Do you disagree with the law? Think the cited source does not accurately quote the law? Think it's not really applicable (and if so why don't you explain why)??

[MrBenchley]

25. Yup, I do...

Now go tell someone else what a good job AshKKKroft is doing...and I'll keep telling the truth....

[slackmaster]

27. Your replies have no substance at all

You have made no attempt to address the legal issues I have pointed out. All you have is personal attacks, guilt by association, and straw men. If I taught a debating class I'd use your contributions here as examples of how not to conduct a debate.

[MrBenchley]

29. Yeah, surrrrrrrrre.....

Now go snivel to someone who cares about what a good job AshKKKroft is doing...

"If I taught a debating class"
Your students would be at a severe disadvantage in any debate.

[slackmaster]

31. And another empty personal attack

You are the Ninja Master indeed.

[RoeBear]

8. Interesting link...

...looks like it was aimed at high school students. Benchley will have to work at it awhile to get up to that level.

[slackmaster]

11. Looks like it's run by high school students too

"No web site is configured at this address."