Found Gun Goes Off, Wounds Child

[CO Liberal]

Another case where a gun wasn't safely stored - Wayne

* * * * * * * * * *

Found Gun Goes Off, Wounds Child

5-Year-Old Boy Shot In Face

LOS ANGELES -- A 5-year-old Lancaster, Calif., boy was shot in the face while he and other children were playing a gun, a sheriff's lieutenant said Thursday.

Sheriff's deputies responded to a 911 call from a home in the 45100 block of Beech Avenue about 7:05 p.m. Wednesday, said Lt. Pat Nelson of the sheriff's Lancaster station.

A neighborhood child apparently found a loaded revolver in an alleyway behind the home, Nelson said.

While she was showing the gun to several other neighborhood children, she dropped the gun and it went off, wounding the boy, Nelson said.

<more>

http://www.nbc4.tv/news/2510268/detail.html

[slackmaster]

1. This story fails the smell test

The gun probably went off when one kid pointed it at another and pulled the trigger.

If only the children had been taught how to deal with a gun (Don't touch. Leave the area. Go tell an adult.) this could have been avoided. But instead they are bombarded since infancy with usually bloodless gun-play in cartoons, movies, TV shows, etc.

[hijinks]

5. Don't touch. Leave the area. Go tell an adult.

Go tell that NRA pantload to somebody who gives a sh!t.

[slackmaster]

6. Illogical, fallacious reply

Appeal to Ridicule is always easier than making a constructive criticism of a statement with which you disagree.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-ridicule.html

[hijinks]

7. psst...

... that was sarcasm. Sorry.

[slackmaster]

8. It helps to put pseudo-HTML tags in your post

Or use a smiley. You're new so I have no idea what you are about yet.

Apology accepted.

[hijinks]

9. I thought

that my reply was so over the top it would easily be sniffed out as sarcam.

The problem with the internet is that you get none of the phisical/verbal cues to infer someones meaning.

[slackmaster]

10. Read MrBenchley's contributions to see where I was coming from

I jumped to the conclusion that you were some kind of Benchley lap-dog. There have been one or two over the last week or so.

[jody]

13. Consider adding the following for sarcasm

:evilgrin:

[Superfly]

2. Found gun later gets up and walks away...

Goes to Starbucks and gets a cup of coffee.

Shit, you'd think that this gun was a sentient being the way these "reporters" write the story.

[hijinks]

3. don't leave guns where kids can find them...

...check.

[slackmaster]

4. I think everyone here agrees with that

No debate here. However, from the story I think it's likely that gun was discarded in haste by a criminal. It's tough to get them to obey laws or apply common sense.

[RoeBear]

11. I'd be interested in knowing...

...if a gun avoidance program, like Eddie Eagle, had been shown at the school prior to this incident. And if not, if they might consider it now.

[CO Liberal]

12. Anything But "Joe Camel With Feathers"

That program has been shown to be as useless as the NRA itself.

[LastDemInIdaho]

14. I would guess the NRA safety programs are more useful than...

Hypnosis and alternative therapies to learn gun safety.

The NRA actually has some very good gun education for children.
Their Eddie Eagle program gets very good marks from the NEA.

[MrBenchley]

17. I would guess that the foul fowl is more effective than

shooting kids yourself, too....

The plain facct is that the program is worthless....and it puts the onus for safety on the kid and not on the "law abiding gunn owner" who is idiotic enough to leave loaded, unlocked guns lying around....or on the corrupt gun industry that refuses to make child-proof guns.

[RoeBear]

15. Let's see now...

...Joe Camel encouraged kids to smoke. Eddie Eagle encourages kids to don't touch guns, leave the area, tell an adult. Yeah exact same thing.

"That program has been shown to be as useless as the NRA itself."

Other than a Diane Sawyer / Prime TIme episode do you have any other proof that Eddie Eagle doesn't work?

[MrBenchley]

16. Who are you trying to kid, roe?

Eddie Eagle is absolutely worthless...and the NRA knows it. They have repeatedly refused to let scholars study its effectiveness.

[RoeBear]

18. Prove it...

...big mouth! Post a link. And, how could the NRA stop someone from studying the effectiveness of Eddie Eagle?

[MrBenchley]

19. Who are you trying to kid?

http://www.vpc.org/studies/eddiecon.htm

"how could the NRA stop someone from studying the effectiveness of Eddie Eagle?"
By not cooperating...or inviting study...

You'd think if Joe Camel with Bullets was really worthwhile, they'd be calling on every educational group and expert they could find to take a look at it.. But instead they're tryinng to use their inbred members and corrupt GOP lackeys to muscle it into public scchoools unexamined.

[RoeBear]

20. The VPC is not an unbiased report...

...the website "The Future of Children"

at least appears to be less biased.

And yes I read the part about Eddie Eagle first.

It's not a study, they just suggest that there may more going on than just Eddie Eagle. And I agree, a 56% percent decline in fatal firearms accidents for children is a HUGE decrease. One we should all be happy about.

[MrBenchley]

21. Sez you...

I'll take the VPC over the dishonest NRA.

So tell us, what is inaccurate about the the VPC's report? Do enlighten us.

[RoeBear]

22. I din't post anything from the NRA..

...and you didn't post anything showing a study proving that Eddie Eagle is ineffective.

[MrBenchley]

23. Rubbish!

You're here pimping for Eddie Eagle, but that has nothing to do with the NRA? Ri-i-i-i-i-i-i-i-i-i-ght..

"you didn't post anything showing a study proving that Eddie Eagle is ineffective"
The hell I didn't. And except for your silly wail about "bias" you've yet to point to a single thing in the VPC's study that is inaccurate in ANY way.

[RoeBear]

25. Whether it's accurate or not isn't the point...

...they provide no information that Eddie Eagle isn't part of the reason gun accidents with childeren are down 56%.

Do you have anything besides that Prime Time episode with Diane Sawyer to prove that Eddie Eagle isn't effective?

[MrBenchley]

28. You mean actual failure on nationwide TV

isn't enough?

Bet you still expect the WMDs to turn up in Iraq, too....

And as for the 56%, the website YOU posted showed you why invoking Eddie Eagle for that was a load of crap.

[RoeBear]

26. Here's an inaccuracy:

"And, since gun safety courses like the NRA's Eddie Eagle never address the consequences of mishandling firearms, it is not uncommon for children who have taken such courses to be shocked when faced with the physical trauma of a gunshot wound."

They constantly refer to Eddie Eagle as a 'gun saefty' program. It is a gun avoidance program; stop, don't touch, leave the area tell an adult. A gun safety program would disuss the safe use of a firearm, big difference.

This is about gun safety:
http://www.kuci.uci.edu/~dany/firearms/gunsafety.html

[MrBenchley]

27. Who the hell are you trying to kid?

Get real!!

The copyrighted name for this load of crap is "The Eddie Eagle GunSafe ® Program" and you're trying to tell us it's not supposed to be taken as a safety program?

"Ever heard of Eddie Eagle? He's a cartoon character used by the National Rifle Association over the last 12 years to teach kids about gun safety."

www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=1201

"The Eddie Eagle Gun Safety Program is sponsored by the National Rifle Association and used by schools, law enforcement agencies and other organizations ..."

www.gunsafety.org/EddieEagle.htm

"The purpose of The Eddie Eagle GunSafe® Program isn't to teach whether guns are good or bad, but rather to promote the protection and safety of children.
Eddie Eagle neither offers nor asks for any value judgment concerning firearms."

http://www.nrahq.org/safety/eddie/index.asp

Among the value judgements it doesn't ask is "How come your idiot parents didn't lock up their gun?"

[RoeBear]

24. For example:

" The cartoon camel catapulted Camel cigarettes from a brand smoked by less than one percent of U.S. smokers under age 18 to a one-third share of the youth market...within three years."

Why would they compare a mascot that encourages people, and indirectly minors, to smoke. And one that encourages gun avoidance and has contributed to a 56% decrease in gun accidents among children?

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

37. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MrBenchley]

40. Because they're both cynical attempts

by corrupt industries to attract kids.

And this is the THIRD time you've trotted out the 56% that YOUR OWN SOURCE said had little or nothing to do with Eddie Eagle....

[CO Liberal]

29. I Found Something

From the San Diego Union-Tribune:

But studies have found that Eddie-Eagle type warnings to kids don't work.

Marjorie Hardy, a psychology professor at Eckerd College in St. Petersburg, Fla., ran experiments with more than 100 middle-class children between the ages of 4 and 7 who had been through such courses.

After promising not to touch guns, the kids were placed in a room where real, but disabled, guns were scattered among a variety of toys. A hidden camera recorded most of the kids playing with the guns, aiming them at each other and chatting happily about the discovery.

And most of them lied about touching the guns when later asked.

<more>

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/reports/younglives/20010411-9999_1c8guns.html

[CO Liberal]

30. And Another

Report: Gun Safety Programs for Children Don't Work

By Helen Rumbelow
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, July 19, 2002; Page A24

Gun safety programs aimed at young people do not work and have done little to reduce the toll of 20,000 children killed or injured by guns in the United States every year, according to a foundation report released yesterday.

It found that children's curiosity and teenagers' love of risk make them resistant to efforts such as the National Rifle Association's Eddie Eagle campaign and others run by gun control advocates to keep children away from weapons.

In some cases, it was feared the programs increased the appeal of guns, said the child health specialists who wrote "Children, Youth and Gun Violence" for the Future of Children, a journal of the David and Lucile Packard Foundation.

The report said the easiest way to save young lives would be to make guns more "childproof" with built-in safety devices, although the industry has been slow to adopt these measures.

<more>

http://www.wmsa.net/news/WashingtonPost/wp-020719_gun_safety.htm

[jody]

33. Your report says "Gun safety programs aimed at young people do not work"

That must mean that NRA's Eddie Eagle" program and the Brady Center's "Parent Education Project" don't work.

The article also said "In some cases, it was feared the programs increased the appeal of guns". How ironic, a group of gun-haters like the Brady Center sponsoring a program that could increase the appeal of guns.

Looks like neither the NRA nor Brady Bunch have an answer to the problem.

[FlashHarry]

39. Locking.

I hate to do it, guys, but this thread's getting ridiculously nasty. If somebody wants to re-post this topic, please do so.

FlashHarry
DU Moderator