GUNS IN THE NEWS--October 14, 2003

[MrBenchley]

As CO Liberal sez:
1 - Feel free to add any CURRENT stories to this thread by replying to this message.
2 - Both pro-gun and anti-gun stories are welcome in this thread, as well as gun-related editorials.
3 - Do not change story titles. In other words, if the Oskosh Gazette's web site runs a story titled "Two Killed in Holdup", the title of your message should read "Two Killed in Holdup". Don't change it to "Gun Owner Kills Two People", or anything else that changes the meaning of the story.
4 - In order to be considered current, stories should have been originally posted to the 'Net within the past 24 hours, or provide follow-up to a story that was previously posted on the J/PS board.
5 - Comment on a story by replying to that story.

[MrBenchley]

1. Teen In Critical Condition After Shooting

"Police said a 17-year-old man was critically injured in a shooting Monday evening.
The victim was found in the 1200 block of South 39th Street at about 6 p.m. Officers said he appeared to be suffering from multiple gunshot wounds. He was taken to an area hospital, where he is listed in critical condition. "


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20031014/lo_kmbc/1829588

[MrBenchley]

2. Child Shot Outside Fast-Food Restaurant

"A young girl was shot at a fast-food restaurant late Monday night in southwest Houston.
Police said the girl was outside the Kentucky Fried Chicken on Beechnut and Fondren waiting for her father to finish ordering food.
The details of what happened next are unknown, but police said the girl was somehow shot in the leg. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20031014/lo_kprc/1829873

[MrBenchley]

3. Student Accused Of Shooting Classmate On Bus

The cost of letting the scummy gun industry dictate public policy via the GOP...

"Police arrested an 18-year-old Detroit City High School student for allegedly shooting a classmate, Local 4 reported.
Authorities believe Clifton Darron shot a 17-year-old student while riding on a school bus en route from Randolph Vocational Training Center to City High on Oct. 6.
Darron was apparently showing the gun to friends when it accidentally went off, according to police. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20031014/lo_wdiv/1829521

[CO Liberal]

4. (Missouri) High court refuses to intervene in gun law suit

The ongoing saga continues..... - Wayne

* * * * * * * * * *

High court refuses to intervene in gun law suit

By Tim Bryant
Post-Dispatch
10/13/2003

The court case challenging Missouri's new concealed gun law will remain in St. Louis for now because the state Supreme Court decided Monday against taking up the dispute immediately.

In a one-page ruling, the court denied the state's request to set aside a St. Louis judge's order that blocked the law from taking effect Saturday.

"Extraordinary relief is not available where the law provides a remedy by a later appeal," the court said.

As a result, St. Louis Circuit Judge Steven Ohmer, who on Friday put the law's effectiveness on hold, will keep the case until he decides whether to make the enforcement ban permanent.

<more>

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/News/E92F28EDCD131C9086256DBF000E563D?OpenDocument&Headline=High+court+refuses+to+intervene+in+gun+law+suit++

[CO Liberal]

5. Burglars take 40-50 guns from Warner Robins store

Guess they really needed to fortify that side wall. - Wayne

* * * * * * * * * *

Burglars take 40-50 guns from Warner Robins store

WARNER ROBINS - About 40 or 50 pistols, including three antique Colts, were stolen from a Warner Robins business late Sunday.

The Green Street business was fortified with steel doors and iron bars, but burglars cut a hole through a side wall and apparently kicked their way in, said Dean Betz, sales manager of Watson's Used Cars and Peddler Pawn and Knife Shop.

Betz arrived at work at 9 a.m. Monday to find all the glass display cases smashed and a gaping hole in a side of the building.

"It just surprised the hell out of me," said Betz, who has managed the store at 111 Green St. for nearly four years.

<more>

http://www.macon.com/mld/macon/news/7007641.htm

[MrBenchley]

7. He didn't have a burglar alarm?

Sounds pretty negligent.

[DoNotRefill]

17. Most burglar alarms...

are wired to doors and windows, not to side walls.

[CO Liberal]

19. How About Motion Detectors?

They would have sensed someone in there.

[MrBenchley]

20. For that matter

He don't take the guns out of display cases and put them in a safe?

[DoNotRefill]

22. He should be pilloried....

for failing to set up his store in a huge bunker, with at least a platoon of security guards with tanks on duty 24/7, and for not having robotic automatic weapons slaved to motion trackers to automatically kill anybody who entered the store without authorization... <snicker>

[MrBenchley]

24. Gee, refill

You mean you think he SHOULD have left guns in display cases?

[DoNotRefill]

27. in a fortified building with steel doors and iron bars....

why should he have taken them out of their display cases?

How many layers of security are necessary? These people knocked a FUCKING HOLE IN THE WALL to get in. That's not something you do with a rock, it requires real tools to do it. If they could breach a wall, they could breach a safe.

[CO Liberal]

26. Transporting Your Entire Inventory into a Safe Would be Impractical

Fortifying the building would make more sense.

[MrBenchley]

28. Appears to be 40-50 handguns

left in glass display cases (which also had no burglar alarm). How long could it take to lock up 50 handguns each night?

[DoNotRefill]

29. 50 handguns...

figure a minute per to recase the guns and carry them to the safe, plus at least a minute per to take them out each morning and rearrange the display, plus wipe off fingerprints from handling them to prevent rusting, so 2 hours seems a reasonable estimate...

[MrBenchley]

30. Or they could be tossed into a cart

and rolled into the safe.....

But then I forgot that gun nuts have to fondle each one for a minute coming and going....

[DoNotRefill]

31. Uh huh....

Would you toss any other metal commodity into a cart without protecting it from damage?

I guess your suggestion is a good way to encourage "scratch and dent sales"...

[MrBenchley]

32. Yeah...

The only goods I'd take extreme care with would be breakable goods...

But then I don't have a gun fetish and don't see any need to fondle them.

[DoNotRefill]

33. So, if you had a bunch of $500 cappuchino machines on display...

and wanted to move them, you'd just pile them on top of each other, risking that the finish would be marred?

taking basic precautions to protect something from damage isn't "fondling"....

[DoNotRefill]

21. Have you ever worked retail?

banner ads/hanging displays make motion detectors unpractical.

[CO Liberal]

23. Yes, I Have Worked Retail

In stores with banner ads, hanging displays, and motion detector security systems.

[MrBenchley]

25. I worked retail

and we locked up items we didn't want to go missing in a safe...

Jewelers do it routinely.

[CO Liberal]

6. Byram teen shot dead (New Jersey)

Byram teen shot dead

Posted Tuesday, October 14, 2003 by Webmaster

By LYNN OLANOFF
Herald Staff Writer

A former Lenape Valley Regional High School football standout was found shot to death in Brooklyn early Sunday morning.

Mark Fisher, 19, of Byram, was found dead at the scene on Argyle Road in the Prospect Park South section of the borough with one gunshot in his torso, police said.

The motive was unclear and no arrests have been made, police said.
Neighbors questioned at the Fisher family’s Lynn Drive home were uncertain why the teen, a sophomore at Fairfield University in Connecticut, was in New York.

The Fisher family had no comment regarding the death on Monday night, said neighbor Richard Fergus.

Witnesses told police that Fisher, who had gone home to New Jersey for the holiday weekend, was with friends at Bar Harbour, on Manhattan’s Upper East Side, on Saturday night before he left with an unidentified woman to go to a party, the Associated Press reported.
Fisher was seen leaving the bar at 2 a.m. on Sunday, the Associated Press reported. No wallet or identification were found on his body.

<more>

http://www.njherald.com/news/newspro/viewnews.cgi?newsid1066138631,9798,

[MrBenchley]

8. Sniper Suspect Muhammad Pleads Innocent

"VIRGINIA BEACH, Va. - John Allen Muhammad entered innocent pleas Tuesday as the death-penalty trial of the 42-year-old sniper suspect got under way a year after a series of deadly shootings terrified the Washington area.
Muhammad pleaded innocent to capital murder and firearms charges. He initially remained silent when asked a routine question by Circuit Judge Roy F. Millette Jr., but later answered after whispering with an attorney.
Muhammad and Lee Boyd Malvo, 18, are charged with 13 shootings, including 10 deaths, over a three weeks last October that left many Washington area residents ducking for cover as they filled gas tanks and ran errands. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=2&u=/ap/20031014/ap_on_re_us/sniper_shootings_trial_12

[MrBenchley]

9. Shooting Leaves 2 Children Dead

Another family made safer by guns...

"A man shot and killed two children and critically injured a mother and another child in Orange County Tuesday, authorities said.
The suspect is the woman's boyfriend of 11 years. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20031014/lo_wesh/1830026

[MrBenchley]

10. Teen shot in spine may be paralyzed

"ROCK HILL - A Lancaster High School senior was apparently paralyzed from the neck down after he was shot early Saturday during a party in Rock Hill, police said Monday.
A second man, Xazabria "Zay" Burris, 20, of Rock Hill, was shot in the stomach. Reuben Curry, 18, of Lancaster, was arrested at the scene and charged in the shooting. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/kr/20031014/lo_krcharlotte/teenshotinspinemaybeparalyzed

[MrBenchley]

11. Panel amends, OKs concealed weapons bill

Yeah, we sure want to follow the nutcase GOP on this sort of crap....NOT!

"Churches, businesses and hospitals could post "no guns allowed" signs under changes Republican state senators made to a controversial bill that would let Wisconsin residents carry concealed weapons.
In addition to authorizing 11-inch-by-11-inch signs near the entrances of public buildings, the three Republican senators on the Senate Judiciary, Corrections and Privacy Committee decided that places banning concealed weapons also would have to provide a verbal warning.
Huebscher questioned why priests, pastors, ministers and other spiritual leaders should have to open worship services, weddings or funerals by specifically warning those in attendance that concealed weapons are not welcome. That is not a very "worshipful" way to open spiritual services, he said.
Zien grudgingly agreed to the provision letting owners of commercial and non-profit businesses post signs telling visitors that no concealed weapons are allowed, he said.
Those signs can be a "magnet" for the mentally ill and would make people, in general, uncomfortable, Zien said."

http://www.jsonline.com/news/state/oct03/177042.asp

[MrBenchley]

12. Double Barreled Double Standards

Mary Rosh makes the headlines again...

"If economist John R. Lott didn't exist, pro-gun advocates would have had to invent him. Probably the most visible scholarly figure in the U.S. gun debate, Lott's densely statistical work has given an immense boost to the arguments of the National Rifle Association. Lott's 1998 book More Guns, Less Crime -- which extolled the virtues of firearms for self-defense and has sold some 100,000 copies in two editions, quite an accomplishment for an academic book -- has served as a Bible for proponents of "right to carry" laws (also known as "shall issue" laws), which make it easier for citizens to carry concealed weapons. Were Lott to be discredited, an entire branch of pro-gun advocacy could lose its chief social scientific basis.
That may be happening. Earlier this year, Lott found himself facing serious criticism of his professional ethics. Pressed by critics, he failed to produce evidence of the existence of a survey -- which supposedly found that "98 percent of the time that people use guns defensively, they merely have to brandish a weapon to break off an attack" -- that he claimed to have conducted in the second edition of "More Guns, Less Crime". Lott then made matters even worse by posing as a former student, "Mary Rosh," and using the alias to attack his critics and defend his work online. When an Internet blogger exposed the ruse, the scientific community was outraged. Lott had created a "false identity for a scholar," charged Science editor-in-chief Donald Kennedy. "In most circles, this goes down as fraud."
...In calling Lott's overall thesis junk science, Skeptical Inquirer magazine noted his tendency to make "arguments so complex that only other highly trained regression analysts can understand, let alone refute, them." This was not meant as praise. "

http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2003/42/we_590_01.html

You might recall that Lott also used his pseudoscience to try and cover up the disgraceful disenfranchisement of black voters in Florida...

"The dissenting opinion, which relies heavily on Dr. Lott’s improperly designed and conducted statistical report, provides no credible discussion of the issues posed by the study of ballot rejection in Florida’s presidential election. ..."

http://www.usccr.gov/pubs/vote2000/report/appendix/app10.htm

And that the crackpot currently jumped up to defend Rush Limbaugh's bigoted blather....

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/lott200310080943.asp

Quick.....who is surprised that a leading light of the gun rights crowd is a) dishonest and b) racist....

Not me.

[MrBenchley]

13. Police Hope Good Pictures Will Help Find Brazen Robber

"It was a dramatic scene captured by high-tech surveillance equipment: a suspect holding a semiautomatic handgun on a Riverside store clerk, yelling at him to hurry up and turn over some cash.
The gunman got away, and police have not been able to find him. But with high-tech video equipment capturing the robbery on tape, they're confident someone will recognized the robber and turn him in. Police say going after a gunman -- even by someone armed -- is a bad idea. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=422&ncid=422&e=2&u=/ibsys/20031014/lo_wjxt/1829304

[MrBenchley]

14. Two die in apparent murder-suicide in Lakewood

Another family (and their neighbors) made safer by guns...

"LAKEWOOD - Police found two dead men in a Lakewood apartment early Monday, and authorities said they were investigating the case as a murder-suicide that followed an argument and heavy drinking.
A 24-year-old man apparently shot and killed a 41-year-old man who was dating his mother then shot himself in the head when a SWAT team arrived, Lakewood police spokesman Steve Davis said.
The mother, 43, was wounded in the foot, Davis said.
When police arrived, they found blood and spent shell casings outside the apartment then summoned a SWAT team and evacuated two nearby apartments."

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/local/article/0,1299,DRMN_15_2345869,00.html

[MrBenchley]

15. Gunman takes thousands from church in Baltimore

"With a robber holding a pistol to a church secretary's head, a Northeast Baltimore priest was forced to open a rectory safe yesterday and hand over thousands of dollars from Sunday collection baskets, the pastor said.
"This is the first time anything close to this has ever happened here," said the Rev. Michael J. Orchik of the Shrine of the Little Flower Roman Catholic Church, in the 2800 block of Brendan Ave. "It was rather brazen, but could have been worse."
When the secretary returned with a brochure describing a clothing drive, the man pulled a gun, police said."

http://www.sunspot.net/news/yahoo/bal-te.md.robbery14oct14,0,153055.story?coll=bal-newsaol-headlines

[CO Liberal]

16. And Of Course, That Crime Would Have Been Prevented....

...by posting "No Guns Allowed" signs at the doors of the church.

Just like all the school shootings would have been prevented by posting the Ten Commandments - NOT!!!!!

[MrBenchley]

18. Hey, what if the priest went around heeled all the time

After all, remember the verses in the Bible about Jesus capping Pontius Pilate's ass?