More Women Buying & Carrying Weapons...

[spin]

An unprecedented number of women are taking their protection into their own hands by getting a gun. Gun stores are seeing more women customers than anyone can remember. Many women are also getting permits to carry a concealed weapon.

Apparently, Jeffery is not alone. Homer Cole has owned Shooters Supply for nearly a decade. Cole says, when it comes to sales of guns to girls...

Homer Cole, Shooters Supply & Sporting Goods: "I guess, when we first started, if we sold one in ten to fifteen, it was pretty good. Now, it's not unusual to have one in three, one in four to ladies purchasing handguns."

Others have had so many inquires from women who want to get a license to conceal and carry a weapon they are offering the course free to females. So, what's driving all this? Well, some say it's a concern about the gun laws that could change, but others say it's simply that when the economy goes down, crime goes up, and many are concerned about personal safety.

http://www.local12.com/news/local/story/More-Women-Buying-Carrying-Weapons/SsRnkNAXwkCK72h_ldG4kQ.cspx

[FLAprogressive]

1. hopefully more would-be rapists will get another thing coming to them.

[Hoopla Phil]

3. I'll second that!

:toast:

[spin]

5. In the late sixties, Orlando Florida had a rape problem...

In 1966 the police in Orlando, Florida, responded to a rape epidemic by embarking on a highly publicized program to train 2,500 women in firearm use. The next year rape fell by 88 percent in Orlando (the only major city to experience a decrease that year); burglary fell by 25 percent. Not one of the 2,500 women actually ended up firing her weapon; the deterrent effect of the publicity sufficed." (Congressional Record, 90th Cong., 2d sess., January 30, 1968, p. 1496, n. 7) Five years later Orlando's rape rate was still 13 percent below the pre-program level, whereas the surrounding standard metropolitan area had suffered a 308 percent increase.

http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/article3939.html

[Israfel4]

30. Wow.

Where do you FIND this stuff Spin!!!! LOL. You wouldn't happen to live in FL would you???

[spin]

32. Sure, a transplanted Yankee...

I've lived in Florida for 40 years. I grew up close to Lake Erie in the snow belt. I decided to move to a warmer climate after some time in the Air Force. It seemed that a lot of people who lived in Ohio planned to move to Florida when they retired. Sounded like a good plan. I decided to bypass living in the polluted hell of Ohio and head south while I was young and able to enjoy all the sunshine.

My plan worked out well. I lived in Tampa for 37 years. The worst part was watching the Tampa Bay Buccaneers fumble and bumble their way through football games for many years under an owner who was more interested in owning a football team as an investment rather than owning one as a hobby.

I remember hearing about the police training the women in Orlando and how successful the program was.

[Hoopla Phil]

2. Yep, my wife recently looked into getting her CHL. Problem

all the classes for new CHLs are booked up for 6 months:eyes:

[ProgressiveProfessor]

4. The number of "non-traditional" gun owners is changing the dynamics in stoping more uneeded gun laws

More and more of my GLBT friends are arming themselves as are women and younger people. They get it and its not about hunting. Its a joy to behold.

[spin]

6. An excellent web site for women interested in firearms for self defense...

is http://www.corneredcat.com/TOC.aspx

In fact, although the site is oriented toward women and firearms, it's a great resource for anyone considering self defense.

Many topics are addressed including firearm safety, kids and guns, ethical and social considerations, choosing firearms and the basics of shooting.

For those who are interested in a alternative to a firearm for self defense, an excellent article discusses pepper spray.
http://www.corneredcat.com/Gear/pepperspray.aspx

an excerpt from this article:

If you do use the stuff on an attacker, your best immediate-action drill is to spray, dodge, and flee. Do not just stand there! Dodge to the side as you spray, then run away.

After you spray the assailant, there will be a brief gap while the spray takes effect. During that 3 to 5 seconds, a lot can happen. Be prepared for this gap and have a plan. Never expect the spray to do all your work for you; be prepared to fight your way to safety if you must.

And if you have to fight ...
... Fight like a cornered cat.

[Hoopla Phil]

7. Thanks. Bookmarked for my wife.

[RamboLiberal]

36. Thanks for the link - looks interesting - bookmarked it for later n/t

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hoopla Phil]

9. What a wonderfully sexist remark. Be sure to pick up your parting

gifts on your way out of DU.

[Caliman73]

10. What a progressive point of view...

Well alright then perhaps we should keep all them women folk barefoot and in the kitchen so they won't hurt themselves or anyone else huh? :eyes:

Between that and taking the country back 200 years, you're having a great start here on DU. Perhaps you can go to the GLBT forum and tell them how they don't deserve the right to marry...:sarcasm:

This is the GUN forum on DU but we are liberals, progressives, and moderates here. We don't subscribe to sexist ideology, perhaps you should find a right wing forum on which to post.

[spin]

19. You're definitely are far from being politically correct...

however I did laugh.

Damn, now I'm ashamed of myself!

[JonQ]

11. Good

Firearms are a great equalizer for physical differences. It never made sense to me that women weren't more likely to be firearm owners.

[goddess40]

12. What good is a concealed gun

If someone grabs you from the rear you'll never be able to get the gun out. Even if they approach you from the front you will have to know their intent so you can get your gun out in time. Sounds like another way for the bad guys to get more guns by taking them from the women. Why not carry the gun in the open if you really are that crazy about guns?

[Howzit]

13. "Why not carry the gun in the open?"

Same reason you don't carry cash in the open - it draws the wrong kind of attention.

[slackmaster]

14. A good self-defense class puts strong emphasis on situational awareness

If someone manages to grab you from the rear, you have failed to be aware of your surroundings.

Even if they approach you from the front you will have to know their intent so you can get your gun out in time.

Everyone has some natural ability to judge the intentions of strangers. Work on it, or take a class and hone your skills.

My tax accountant has a concealed handgun permit. He used to carry cash for a business he was working for. He was robbed once, and got the permit. Since he's been carrying, his behavior has changed in ways that signal a potential attacker that he's not someone you want to fuck with. He's never had to draw his weapon.

[spin]

18. Situational awareness is an important part of any martial art...

as it allows you to avoid confrontation. Most reputable martial arts schools teach you to avoid using your training if at all possible. Self defense with a firearm is a martial art.

I call it "keeping my radar out". If I walk down the street with my head up my ass I'm a target. I make eye contact and am always respectful but watchful of those around me. If I really feel uncomfortable in a situation, I attempt to go elsewhere.

If you practice and "hone your skills" as you suggest, it's amazing how much you will observe about those around you. It can actually become an entertaining game especially if you're with a partner. People are interesting and fun to watch.

Most people today walk around with a cell phone glued to their ear totally obvious to the world around them.

If you are the exception and you do make eye contact and show that you are alert, the bad guys will find a less observant target.

[slackmaster]

29. The people with cell phones or ear buds are extremely vulnerable

Especially joggers who are listening to music and running in the street without paying any attention to traffic. They are relying on other peoples' driving skills to keep them from being run over.

If you are the exception and you do make eye contact and show that you are alert, the bad guys will find a less observant target.

Yes, that is often all that it takes. They teach that in retail bank employee training. Many would-be robbers chicken out when a branch manager or supervisor looks them in the eye and says something.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

15. Some do...it upsets some people, but in many places its legal and the number is growing

Your scenarios also assumes that most events happen by surprise, which is actually rare.

As for open carry, I do in the spring on my land...lots and lots of snakes. I am also doing open carry this weekend as well, though I have not had the interlopers this year that I had over the last several. Something about a massive gate backed up by a truck.

[spin]

16. Many people do favor open carry and there are good arguments..

on both sides of the issue.

Your point is valid. A gun in the hand is worth two deeply concealed weapons. That's why I carry a 38 caliber snub nosed revolver in a pocket holster placed in my front pants pocket. If I notice anything that raises the hair on the back of my neck, I can drop my hand into the pocket on the revolver.

I can remember only one incident over many years when I felt this action was necessary. I was headed to work on graveyard shift and on the way I stopped at a Walgreen's liquor store to buy some cigars. Two men in their twenties were in the store. One was madly rushing around the aisles for no apparent reason. The other was at the counter with some items to purchase.

The individual at the counter asked if I wanted to go ahead of him. I politely refused. I walked a slight distance away near a row of counter shelves so I could seek cover if necessary. I casually put my hand in my pocket on the revolver and watched the situation.

The guy at the counter reached in his pocket and said, "Damn, I forgot my wallet." He walked out to his car to get it.

I calmly waited. When he returned he eyed me, bought his items and left with his friend.

I bought my cigars and talked to the clerk for a few minutes and left for work. I arrived late, but I was the shift supervisor. Sometimes it's good to be the boss.

Now I can't say that the two men had any evil intentions. Something triggered my radar.

Fortunately nothing happened. Had the man drew a weapon and threatened the clerk, I would have had to make a very difficult decision. If all the man wanted was the money, it would have been the best choice to let the situation play out. Drawing my weapon could have elevated the situation causing serious injury to someone that could have been avoided. If the man would have acted violent or unstable, I might have attracted his attention away from the clerk and drew my weapon. I would have assumed that if he was willing to hurt the clerk he would have also been willing to shoot a witness.

I could have drawn my revolver from my pocket much faster than I would have been able to draw a holstered weapon from under a jacket or a shirt. As I pointed out earlier, a firearm in the hand is worth two in deep concealment.

It could be argued that if the two men were up to no good and I had entered the store with a .45 auto in a belt holster, the two men might have just left. Another point is that since I was unwilling to leave and was a witness, the two guys just decided to go elsewhere and were unaware that I was armed.

But irregardless of rather or not I was being paranoid, the situation resolved itself.

All's well that ends well.

[virginia mountainman]

17. It is called "Situational awayness"

Situation awareness (SA) involves being aware of what is happening around you to understand how information, events, and your own actions will impact your goals and objectives, both now and in the near future. Lacking SA or having inadequate SA has been identified as one of the primary factors in accidents attributed to human error (e.g., Hartel, Smith, & Prince, 1991; Merket, Bergondy, & Cuevas-Mesa, 1997; Nullmeyer, Stella, Montijo, & Harden, 2005). Thus, SA is especially important in work domains where the information flow can be quite high and poor decisions may lead to serious consequences (e.g., piloting an airplane, functioning as a soldier, or treating critically ill or injured patients).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Situational_awareness

Even if you do not carry a sidearm, EVERYONE should practice it...

No one has "surprised" me or my wife in YEARS.... We make it a point to be aware of our surroundings, 360 degrees 110% of the time. Down to even reading the body language of those around us. We have done it so much, it is completely automatic...Just like shifting gears in a stick shift car, it is done without giving it a second thought.

Only a Dumb ass would not..

[spin]

20. Check your title "Situational awayness" is what most people practice.

a very good description.

[virginia mountainman]

24. LOL good catch!! ROFLMAO!!! NT

[Tim01]

21. A gun is just a tool. A much better tool than a rape whistle.

Try not to let strange people too close to you. If they try to close the distance get on the move.

I get my first shot on target in about 1.5 seconds from concealment. An average to slow time for a trained person.Many people are much much faster than me.
You need to keep the bad guy away from you for about 1.5 seconds.

A gun is just one tool in the tool box.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

22. How would carrying a gun in the open prevent an attack from behind?

[Statistical]

27. How would carrying a concealed weapon prevent an attack from behind?

[spin]

34. If the weapon is properly concealed...

nobody knows you have one. If the weapon is hanging off your belt openly in a holster, everybody knows you have it.

The weapon itself is a valuable and enticing target. The individual who carries openly has to be far more careful of whose behind him than one who carries concealed.

Open carry requires a different holster, for example:


Safariland 6070 Raptor Mid-Ride Level III Retention Holster

Police go through gun retention training and while a good retention holster is virtually snatch proof, an experienced person who knows the secret of the holster can frequently snatch a weapon especially from behind. Plus a retention holster is slower to draw from and requires practice to become proficient.

For a short forum discussion thread on retention holsters and police experience with them visit this link:
http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37402

A concealed carry holster has to retain the weapon securely, but doesn't have to be snatch proof. For example:

Don Hume inside the waistband holster

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

41. I didn't say it would.

[benEzra]

23. That depends greatly on where and how the firearm is carried...

And women most certainly CAN use guns competently. The idea that "teh little wimmin" can't competently use guns as well as or better than a typical male police officer is an astonishingly sexist concept.

[spin]

25. Agreed, women learn how to shoot proficiently...

far faster than most men.

Men are harder to teach because men consider themselves experts from the beginning. They learned everything by closely watching shoot-em-ups on TV and the movies.

My daughter can shoot a .44 mag S&W revolver without problem and she weighs just slightly more than 100 pounds. She does enjoy shooting her favorite revolver, an S&W Model 25-2 45 acp, more. It's the same size as the S&W 44 mag, but does have less recoil.

[benEzra]

26. Yup. My wife shoots a Glock 26 and an SKS...

and wants a Colt Gold Cup or 1991A1 when we can afford one. :)

[Statistical]

28. This has been empircally documented.

Women tend to be learners, they enjoy the process of learning. Not interested with final results but rather the process.

Men tend to be more goal driven and competitive. When trying to learn a new skill this can be a hindrance. They want to rush into putting 10 out of 10 in the bulls eye right away and pick up bad habits from incomplete instruction.

Now there are exceptions to the rule. Some men are very slow & methodical and some women aggressive & impulsive. Still take 100 random men and 100 random women and give them equal instructions you will see higher initial performance from women across the board. The scores for the men will vary wildly some very good and some very poor.

In the Army we had a saying to trying and prevent this phenomenon.
"Slow is smooth; smooth is fast".

We used it to SLOW DOWN the pace of training so soldiers picked up good fundamentals rather than "race" to the end state.

[paulsby]

43. ime as a firearms instructor for cops

women are (on average) quicker studies when it comes to target practice - iow, slow fire precision shooting.

men tend to be a little better otoh at rapid fire IPSC type stuff.

either way, individuals vary far more than the average variance between the genders.

[rl6214]

33. Please show us

an incident where a gun was taken away from a woman, or anyone for that matter so we can see how common this is.

[old mark]

37. In many states, is is perfectly legal to carry a gun openly, and many

gun owners advocate doing that. I would rather carry mine concealed, as I have for the last 15 years.

Since you don't seem to approve of guns, you don't have to get one.


mark

[RamboLiberal]

38. That is a stupid old canard that was used to keep women from

choosing firearms for self-defense. The bad guy might take it away from the little lady and use it on her.

IMHO women should also take some unarmed self-defense training so she can fight her way out of a grab in order to get to her gun.

Same for men.

I like the combination of having trained in both unarmed & armed self-defense in order to get me out of the situation.

Oh and all who have said situational awareness are correct.

I like the idea of the Jeff Cooper color codes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Cooper_(colonel)

[spin]

42. Your advise on learning unarmed self defense...

is logical and very important. There are many excellent techniques that will allow you to escape from a person who grabs you from the front or rear. They are simple, very effective and require little body strength.

Using these techniques can allow you to escape without harm or having to use a firearm. Using a firearm should always be your last choice.

[Israfel4]

31. Does anyone know of any

Annie Oakley's of today???? I think female shooters need more recognition today.

[spin]

35. I can't find any info about current female exhibition shooters on the web...

there are a lot of female shooters in various completions that can hold their own with most other male competitors.

Female exhibition shooting looks like a wide open field. Perhaps this is because any female shooter would be compared to Annie Oakley.

She could handle a rifle or a six-gun with an artistry unsurpassed by that of any human being before her time or, probably, since. And when she appeared with Sitting Bull and other notables in Colonel Cody's Wild West Show, she thrilled your father and mother -- not as Phoebe Anne Oakley Moses but as "Little Sure Shot," the immortal Annie Oakley.

http://www.cowgirls.com/dream/cowgals/oakley.htm

[DonP]

39. Becky Munden?

Bob Munden's wife (I think it's Becky?) shoots with him in some of his appearances, mostly long gun work.

She's pretty good with a long gun and have no doubt she knows her way around a Single Action Army as well.

I don't believe she does any shows on her own though. It's a family business from what I can tell. They've been shooting and traveling together with their daughters (all grown up now) for over 30 years.

Bob is incredible with the fastest draw ever recorded.

I saw him shoot an 8 inch balloon on one show with a .38 snubbie with a 1 and 3/4 barrel at over 100 yards. I could barely see the damn balloon.

There are also a few women shooting on the shotgun curcuit too I think.

[RamboLiberal]

40. Try the competition shooters - there are a number of them

Julie Goloski who http://www.juliegoloski.com/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-uQ9t7sNng

Kay Miculek http://uspsaladieszone.org/?page_id=9

Jessie Abate who not only wins USPSA but also Cowboy Action http://www.jessieabbate.com/accomplishments.php

And a lot of up and comers.

Competition shooting is where its at these days for men & women to make a name in the shooting sports.