The 2nd amendment. It would be civil war.

[Tim01]

Just a word about the idea that we would use our guns to fight an oppressive government. And that we wouldn't stand a chance against government troops.

It would never get to the point that it would be us civilians against the federal govt. There would be states leaving the union long before that. It very possibly could be just like the last one, and maybe the outcome would be similar.

But it would not be a handful of shop owners with their ARs trying to stand up against a unit of Army ground troops with armor.It simply wouldn't go down that way.

Some of my civilian relatives used their weapons to capture straggling union soldiers, after the formal battle was over. Not that the whole war went so well, but I'm just saying it did actually happen.

[Captain Hilts]

1. Nearly every household in Soviet Russia had a firearm of some kind. 'Nuff said. nt

[GreenStormCloud]

6. Could you please provide more information on that?

I was under the opposite impression.

[Captain Hilts]

7. Between the military and the hunting tradition most homes had - and have -

firearms. It was always the case.

It might explain why Soviet leaders didn't go out and work the crowds more often.

When packs of roaming dogs became a problem in the early '90s the govt. just gave folks specified hours to shoot them to take care of the problem.

[GreenStormCloud]

19. I am having difficulty believing that.

In the rest of Eastern Europe, the Warsaw Pact nations had draconian gun control. I just can't get my mind around Communists allowing private ownership of guns of any kind. I do know that they did allow some hunting rifles to rural people, but handguns in cities?

I am sorry, but your claim is so counter to the way that Communists in general, and Stalin in particular that I must ask you to provide some references.

[wired]

26. I know its hard to believe but its true

My wife is Russian and Ive spent quite a bit of time in Russia. Ive seen guns that have been stashed in basements and atticks since the Tsars were in power. My wifes grandmother whom the Nazis had held in slavery in WW2 had a very nice PPSH-41 machinegun in her closet. Hunting in the Soviet Union was common even among the city dwellersand just about every male ofver the age of 40 Ive met had at least one gun under the bed . If it moves and has hair its fair game to shoot in the Soviet Union . Russians look at cute fury animals and dream of coats and hats. Goose and duck hunting is common etc. More guns than you'd believe.

[cabluedem]

8. Its utter nonsense. The Czars had guns most common folk couldnt afford one. nt

[GreenStormCloud]

18. Czars in SOVIET Russia? LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!

Sorry, but you get a huge FAIL on your post. Soviet Russia refers to the Communist period of Russian History. The last Czar was before that. He and his family were killed by the Communists.

I will instantly agree that the average Soviet citizen was rather poor, as were the subjects under the Czar.

[oneshooter]

20. Please study your history texts BEFORE posting. n/t

[Buzz cook]

22. Not sure of the USSR but Saddam's Iraq

Was heavily armed. Saddam distributed AK's to every household.
If the NRA's dogma is correct the Iraqis would have had a revolution, and a successful one at that.

Face it kids there were no successful revolutions that depended on citizen firearms. That includes the US, which depended on the French and Dutch, for arms and money.

The period of the largest revolutions was the late 20th century when the Warsaw Pact was overthrown by largely unarmed citizens.

In the US historically armed citizens have tended to side with oppressive government over those seeking redress of wrongs. The NRA was founded to train citizens to help put down future revolutions.
If we do get a real oppressive government it will be a conservative fascist one. Do you really think all those conservative gun owners are going to help us liberals overthrow it? Far more likely that they'll turn us in to the tender cares of Homeland Security.

The 2nd amendment doesn't do squat to protect us from oppression.

[Katya Mullethov]

23. Why not a socialist fascist state ?

Does that sound too much like naziism ?

[PavePusher]

25. I don't think you can compare potential for an armed revolution between Iraq and the U.S.

The regional cultures in the Middle East are far more accepting of authoritarianism then the main or regional cultures of the U.S.

The political crap that occurs daily in Iraq post-Saddam would be more than sufficient to start a shooting war here in the U.S., let alone Saddam-era shennanigans.

As always, guns alone are not the answer.

America... it's where the liberty is.




"The 2nd amendment doesn't do squat to protect us from oppression."

I would say that that premise hasn't been tested yet. I don't particulary ascribe to the U.S. Civil War being about oppression/tyranical government in the 20th/21rst Century implication. But I could be wrong. I know, let's ask some Southerners!:evilgrin:

[Katya Mullethov]

28. Of course you're wrong .

You're a fucking yankee !

[PavePusher]

29. Unashamedly!

:evilgrin:

But I like grits... With smoked bacon and real Vermont or New Hampshire Maple Syrup. Accept no substitutes!

[X_Digger]

30. Bah.. garlic cheese grits, baby!!

A chunk of velveeta and some garlic mixed in with a pot of grits? Hoo doggie! ;)

[PavePusher]

31. Velveeta?!?!

And they wonder why they lost that war...

I'll spot you some Vermont Cabot Farms Extra Sharp Cheddar, you poor red-dirt person, you... :toast:

[safeinOhio]

2. I think BlackWater will have a list of

NRA members names and take away their guns first.

[Tim01]

4. Are you serious? nt

[safeinOhio]

5. Break out the tin foil for every one.nt

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[east texas lib]

10. Hmm...The only one getting all worked up and spewing out nuts, spittle and angry rhetoric is you...

Lighten up Francis, give yourself a break.;)

[oneshooter]

21. "Black water" no longer exists. FAIL n/t

[PavePusher]

24. There aren't enough of them.

Don't Panic. (Mostly) Harmless.

Where the hell is the D.P. smilie button icon?!?!

[jwirr]

3. The reaction to the secession of states may be acceptable in the

arguments today. There are many theories that the US is ready to break up into regionalism because of the differences in religious and political beliefs. I actually see those theories as hopeful. The books I am talking about are "The Long Emergency" by Kunstler and "After the Empire" by Todd. Both books see it as a solution to the impasse we are at with social issues.

[rrneck]

13. Kunstler hopeful?

Accurate maybe, but not hopeful. His blog is titled Clusterfuck Nation

[jwirr]

15. I see him as hopeful because I am old enough to have lived when

we did not have all the goodies we have now. I was born in a one-room house with no electricity and an wood stove in the corner to heat. We raised our own food and yes we went without many of the things we have now but we were not unhappy.

Maybe one of the reasons I see him as hopeful is because he allows (at least in his books) for us to pull together and start the work of survival. Even on ClusterfuckNation he gives an if only. I remain hopeful because in The Long Emergency I live in the area he has the most hope for and I also live in a family that is getting ready for the emergency.

He continually says we need to stop thinking we are going to recreate the world before booosh. He is right but we can recreate a world that is not totally gloomy. I for one lived in a sane world until about 1950 when "modern" became the way of life and many of us were thrown into a kind of poverty that is hopeless.

[rrneck]

16. That makes sense. nt

[jpak]

11. The South still LOST

losers

:evilgrin:

[rrneck]

12. We didn't lose!

We just didn't win. :7

[PavePusher]

14. They've been fighting a 150 year holding action...

:evilgrin:

[rrneck]

17. Save yer Dixie Cups

The south will rise again!

[Witan00]

27. Unfortunately, they didn't :-(

The Civil War was like Iraq. We won the "war", but lost the "peace".