Ashtabula County: Judge tells residents to "Arm themselves"

[friendly_iconoclast]

http://www.wkyc.com/news/local/news_article.aspx?storyid=133951&catid=3

Ashtabula County: Judge tells residents to "Arm themselves"

Jeff Maynor Updated: 4/9/2010 5:36:18 PM Posted: 4/8/2010 6:24:43 PM

JEFFERSON -- In the ongoing financial crisis in Ashtabula County, the Sheriff's Department has been cut from 112 to 49 deputies. With deputies assigned to transport prisoners, serve warrants and other duties, only one patrol car is assigned to patrol the entire county of 720 square miles. ....

....Ashtabula County Common Pleas Judge Alfred Mackey was asked what residents should do to protect themselves and their families with the severe cutback in law enforcement.

"Arm themselves," the judge said. "Be very careful, be vigilant, get in touch with your neighbors, because we're going to have to look after each other."

Ashtabula County gun dealers and firearms instructors tell WKYC their business has really picked up since the Sheriff's Department cutbacks began some months ago.....

[underpants]

1. Financial crisis you say? Check out what JP Morgan did to Birmingham Alabama

long read but well worth it. It is Tiabbi so you know it will be interesting
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x529094

[TheWraith]

2. One patrol car? Seriously?

They couldn't summon up the money to keep two or three of them? That's fewer police vehicles than the village I live near, which is just 4 square miles.

[tburnsten]

22. My hometown of about 10,000

has at least eight patrol cars, an SUV, a boat or two, and the county sherriff's office in the middle of town.

It's a very tightly laid out town by Maine standards too.

And many of the cops on the force are true dickheads.

[Chulanowa]

3. Jeeze.

This seems to go way, way beyond the gun issue.

[bluestateguy]

4. This is a wonderful opportunity to reevaluate nanny state drug laws

In other words stop enforcing non-violent drug crimes, unless someone is driving under the influence, drug use is none of the state's business, and we can't afford to enforce those laws anymore anyway.

[spin]

5. It's been twenty years since I visited Ashtabula county ...

drugs were easy to find back then. Marijuana and pharmaceuticals were readily available. (Note: I prefer beer myself. Some of my old acquaintances liked stronger stuff.)

[TheWraith]

6. Agreed entirely.

If you can choose to smoke tobacco, which is the most fatal drug on the planet, then we shouldn't be wasting our time and enforcement money on other drugs either.

[Berry Cool]

7. Nothing like telling people "You're on your own" when it comes to protection.

Makes me glad I don't live in Ashtabula County.

[TheWraith]

8. Technically, you're always on your own.

Legally the police have no obligation to protect people not in their custody. They're only legally required to investigate crimes and protect the community as a whole. Not individual members of it. First and foremost you are always responsible for your own protection. That's why people use the cliche that when seconds count, the police are just minutes away.

[jazzhound]

10. Honest question -- have you been relying on your local police for protection,

and what makes you think that they'd arrive in time to protect you in case of an attack, or that you'd even be in a position to dial them up if you were?

[spin]

11. Be glad you don't live in Ashtabula County period ...

It snows all winter as it is in the Lake Erie snow belt, it rains and is dreary in the spring and fall and there's only a couple of weeks of summer.

I grew up in Ashtabula County and left in 1969. At that time it was filled with factories belching noxious pollution that would eat the paint off your car if you worked at one. The salt that was thrown on the roads would eat up your fenders in a year or two and you would be driving around in a rust bucket.

Life in Ashtabula County sucked at the best. People in their 30s looked pasty and sick, probably from all the pollution. Many were alcoholics or strung out on drugs.

I moved to Florida which was the best decision of my life.

The only good thing about Ashtabula County was the covered bridges.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

12. My father was born there and left due to the snow.

Lake effect snow. Hated it.

He graduated from high school in 1929.
Came to Houston in the 30s because he had an aunt and uncle that lived in The Heights.
My mom grew up in East Texas.
They met in a dive in Houston on Telephone Road, and the rest is history! ME! :rofl:

His brother and sister stayed in NE Ohio.

[farmbo]

13. I just pulled 6 spring-run steelhead out of the Ashtabula River (catch & release)...

... which was designated a state scenic river in 2008. Along with Conneaut Creek and the Grand River, Ashtabula County now hosts best steelhead fishery in the Great Lakes region.

A dozen or so vinifera wineries have sprouted up in that Lake Erie shoreline micro-climate which, along with the covered bridges, are now drawing in tourists during the summer months. Also, the winters aren't nearly as bad now as they were in the 60s and 70s-- climate change has had a discernible effect.

Its not all candy & roses, though. Judge Mackey (who just by the way is a Democrat) is rightly concerned about cutbacks in the Sheriff's budget-- there is unfortunately a chrystal meth problem in the county and this public statement is his way of pressuring the Commissioners into finding the money to keep the sheriff's cruisers on the roads-- especially in the rural down county areas.

[spin]

17. Well Ashtabula does mean "river of many fish" ...

in Iroquois.

When I was living in the area the river was heavily polluted. I understand that efforts have been made to clean it up.

I did some fishing in Conneaut Creek when I used to return to the area to visit my in laws. I used to catch and release smallmouth bass. Great fun. A divorce ended my visits.

My son in law mentioned that perhaps the crime rate in Ashtabula County is low enough that sheriff's cruisers are not necessary. Obviously there are State Troopers. Out of curiosity does the county have a high crime rate?

[farmbo]

19. The main problem is crystal meth labs out in the rural areas...

I don't live in NE Ohio anymore either but I do get up there several times a year and hillbilly heroin seems to be the main law enforcement challenge. A lot of farms have been burglarized for their anhydrous ammonia, and B&Es are on the rise from the meth-heads. It hasn't translated into a lot of violent crime-- yet.

The Ashtabula River has been dredged from the mouth upstream a mile or so and a lot of the more heinous coal slag piles have been removed and landfilled. There's still a lot of work to be done in the harbor area, but solid environmental gains are being made.

Look for a vibrant offshore wind industry to take root in the Central basin of Lake Erie in the next five years. That can mean jobs and revitalization in the area.

[tburnsten]

23. The Bridges of Ashtabula County? N/T

[SteveM]

14. Coming to a county near you?...

The Sheriff of Hudspeth County, Texas, pretty much said the same thing to his citizens. The story was posted in this forum a couple days ago.

Here in Travis County, the various "anti-drug" forces are gearing up for Austin's new status as a major distribution point for illegal drugs -- and the crime wave that is expected to accompany that "status." El Paso (next to Hudspeth County) has twice debated the "wisdom" of the war on drugs, but has failed to take action to stem the coming flood of gang-type violence which threatens to spill out of Juarez (some 230 deaths in the FIRST WEEK of this year).

The GOP far-right has made great hay out of the W.O.D., bullying-down Democrats as "soft on drugs," and electing vast quantities of sound-alike right-wingers to replace them. Since the Dems are cowed and without credibility on the issue of legalization/regulation (the War on Drugs was successfully framed by the GOP far right as a national security-type issue, only the "front" is domestic), it will probably take (once again) the GOP to break the gridlock on legalization. Perhaps Schwartzenegger in California? Crist in Florida?

The most effective group in drug war politics is the Marijuana Policy Project.

[spin]

9. Ashtabula county sheriff's dept has a interesting web site ...

http://www.ashtabulacountysheriff.org/

the interesting info to me is on the concealed carry page.

First is the Sheriff's Office Application Policies:

* The department will only receive 25 applications a day. Applicants may come to the Sheriff Department's front office window and draw a number between 1 to 25 each day the applications are being excepted to be placed in line. If you are number 26 you will be sent home to return another day.
* County residence will be processed before out of county
.
* Applications will only be received between Tuesday and Friday beginning at 9:00am. ending 3:00pm
.
* Applications will not be received on Mondays due to the current Sheriff's Sale.
.
* Applications will not be received during weekday holidays.
.
* The new policy will take effect Tuesday, April 20th.

http://www.ashtabulacountysheriff.org/ccw.html

This amazes me. I live in Florida and we send our application through the mail to the state for processing.

I find it difficult to imagine sitting in the Sheriff's office for hours waiting to turn in my application and missing work. Who devised this stupid rule? Let's say I took a day off of work and journeyed to the office and found I was #26 and had to return on another day.

It sure looks like Ashtabula county is doing its best to discourage concealed carry. This may not be wise as they have cut back drastically on Sheriff's patrols.


The second interesting thing on that page is the survey on CCW. The question is "Do you support the new CCW law?" Out of 951 votes, 95% or 907 supported CCW while only 35 or 4% didn't.

[Big Al Mac]

15. Comments on the Sheriff's website

excepted? --- accepted
residence? --- residents

0900 to 1500 two days a week is 12 hours, an ORC 2923.125(I) violation.

Since April 20, 2010 is a Tuesday I have to assume that this new policy goes into effect this year even though the copyright notice at the bottom of the page is four years out of date.

EDIT: I just checked. Ashtabula county issued 288 CHLs and renewed 108 in the entire year of 2009.
That's less than 8 applications per week. I wonder why they decided they needed to establish a "take a number" system. :roll:

OBTW - When you visit their website don't forget to vote. 95% YES right now.

[spin]

18. That isn't very many concealed permits at all ...

Highlands County in Florida has a population of 87,366 and has 3942 Concealed Weapons Permit holders.
info from
http://www.stateofflorida.com/Portal/DesktopDefault.aspx?tabid=95
http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/stats/cw_active.html

Ashtabula County has a population of 102,000, larger than Highlands County. But Florida has had "shall issue" concealed carry far longer than Ohio.

Florida has 709,591 currently valid concealed carry licenses while Ohio has approximately 178,240.
http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/stats/cw_monthly.html
http://starbeacon.com/localsports/x1399741576/Outdoors-Insider-with-Dale-Sunderlin-Conceal-carry-licensing-stronger-than-ever/print

Concealed carry is popular in Ohio according to this column from the Star Beacon, Astabula's newspaper:

For the past three years, Ohio has seen a steady increase in the number of licenses issued. Governor Strickland signed enormous improvements to concealed carry rules into law in his first session. Those improvements brought renewed interest in CHL’s. Make the product better, and more people will want it.

***snip***

In his press release announcing the report, Attorney General Cordray remarked that "if there’s something to take away from these numbers, it is that more and more Ohioans are comfortable exercising the right to carry concealed handguns. We are pleased that we have a strong partnership with the county sheriffs who issue concealed handgun licenses, and we will continue to work together to help eligible Ohioans take advantage of this law."

Even with the surge in total outstanding licenses, the number of suspensions and revocations remains minute compared to other state-issued licenses. Less than one half of one percent have ever been revoked, and among that small number are many CHL’s revoked because a license-holder died, decided not to renew or moved out of state.

We have enjoyed concealed carry for almost six years in Ohio. It is clearly working well and is popular with responsible, law-abiding adults who care about safety.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=post&forum=118&topic_id=309077&mesg_id=309292

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

24. Ohioans can obtain permits from neighboring counties.

If a neighboring county issues permits faster or the experience is smoother, many opt to use the neighboring county instead of their own. For example, my county takes the full 4 weeks or whatver the limit is and only one county over takes about 1 week.

My guess is perhaps ashtabula county is slow so people shop elsewhere.

[GreenStormCloud]

21. BETWEEN Tuesday and Friday. Meaning Tu/W/Th/F

I will admit that it is a bit ambiguous wording, but that seems to be what they are saying.

[Big Al Mac]

16. Also WRT face to face application for CHL

The reason Ohio required an "in person" application for a Concealed Handgun License is to insure that the picture, name, and address that will appear on the license match the person that supplies the fingerprints for the background check.

Each of the 88 Sheriffs in Ohio have a different system. Some require an applicant to return and pick up their license in person, others will mail it to the address listed on it. Some require appointments to come in and apply and others have an open door policy, that is "first come, first served".

[spin]

20. There are several excellent news videos on the story at this link... ..

http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/7225