Police: Western Pa. man, 18, playing with gun shoots teenage girl to death at drinking party

[jpak]

http://www.dailyjournal.net/view/story/1fe03ec104524ee7b0a349b9d83941a9/PA--Teenage-Girl-Shot/

CLAIRTON, Pa. — Police say an 18-year-old is facing charges after the shooting death of a teenage girl in western Pennsylvania.

Police in Allegheny County say several young people were drinking beer in a garage in Clairton early Sunday when one produced a pistol.

Authorities say he allowed partygoers to play with it, and then was loading the weapon when it went off and a bullet struck the girl.

The county medical examiner's office says 17-year-old Karrie Linnen, of Clairton, was pronounced dead at about 2 a.m. Sunday at Jefferson Regional Medical Center.

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[enki23]

1. If the other partygoers had been carrying legally, they would have shot him before this happened.

.

[friendly_iconoclast]

8. And if they'd had a car, they would have been wrapped around a tree.

Newsflash: Teenagers do stupid shit on occasion. Drunk teenagers are prone to do even more stupid shit. Details at 11...

[iverglas]

13. dead teenagers will always be with us ...

and there just ain't a damned thing we can do about it.

Oh ... look ...

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/article/840145

Young drivers in Ontario will be subject to some of the toughest age restrictions on drinking and driving in the country starting Sunday.

Under the new rules, drivers aged 21 and under cannot consume any alcohol before getting behind the wheel.

“My hope is that this legislation will contribute to a reality where adults in the future will not drink and drive at all,” Transportation Minister Kathleen Wynne said at a news conference Monday.

... Statistics show people aged 19 to 21 are nearly 1.5 times more likely than older drivers to be involved in fatal crashes and injuries as a result of drinking and driving.

Under the legislation, drivers 21 and under found to have alcohol in their systems will face an immediate 24-hour licence suspension at roadside, a fine of up to $500 and a 30-day licence suspension.

New drivers of all ages will also be subject to zero tolerance until they get their G2 licence, which can take upwards of two years to acquire.

It's been less than a year since the measure took effect, but will you keep us apprised of the stats?

Surely it isn't going to have any effect on crashes, injuries and deaths caused by drunken teenagers.

Nope, there's just nothing one can do to reduce the harm associated with teenagers using alcohol.

Certianly not when it comes to them having access to firearms, anyhow.

[friendly_iconoclast]

16. That's good- but *all* those under 21 are prohibited from drinking in the States.

I also note that the law you cited doesn't actually prevent any under-21 from drinking and driving.


I know the civilizing mission is a difficult one, but you really should keep an eye on these details.

"Take up the Canadian Person's Burden..." (after Rudyard Kipling)

[iverglas]

17. so?

That's good- but *all* those under 21 are prohibited from drinking in the States.

What are the consequences if they do? Not much, I think.

I also note that the law you cited doesn't actually prevent any under-21 from drinking and driving.

Bully for you. Did you also also note that I didn't say it did?

Did you also also also note that I have never suggested that any law anywhere anytime has ever prevented anyone from doing anything? Do laws prohibiting murder prevent murder? Apparently not.

Are laws part of a set of measures that can be effective to deter and reduce certain conducts?

Please, say no.

[friendly_iconoclast]

21. I'll say "yes- as long as they are not aimed at some nebulous social goal...

...and eliminated or modified if demonstrated not to have a net practical effect." Like the Commonwealth Of Massachusetts' "Liquor

ID"- it has the same form factor as the non-driving state ID and driver's license for those over 21 ('landscape' v. 'portrait'

for the under-21 version).


ALL it does is identify the holder as someone qualified to buy alcohol- but so do the state ID and driver's licenses.

The only reason these things exist is a section in state law that says "liquor retailers may require a liquor ID

as proof of age". My ex-SO is fighting to get this requirement removed, as the liquor ID carries the same info as the plain

ID, but costs more than that or the driver's license. Why should those that don't drive have to pay more?

[AtheistCrusader]

31. Well, that's lovely.

Given that the 18 year old broke the law by not only drinking, but also by carrying a handgun, clearly more regulation is the answer.


In my state, consequence is jail for the underage drinking. I am neither convinced that this is an effective tactic, nor do I know the punishment in the state in question.

[RSillsbee]

20. Canada is irrelevant

in the discussion of AMERICAN gun policies.

Now if you want to talk about RUSH or The Mackenzie brothers we're on it like Caucasian on rice

[iverglas]

22. ah, and then there are the things that are sadly not irrelevant

People who are not jingoistic exceptionalist chauvinists actually look around them and consider how others in this big wide world of ours do things, and whether some of the ways they do things are worthy of consideration.

People who are not wilfully ignorant educate themselves about a whole spectrum of things, including how others in this big wide world of ours do things, and whether some of the ways they do things are worthy of consideration.

But then of course there is the actual practical relevance of Canada in the discussion of USAmerican gun policies: Canada is significantly adversely affected by them.

But then I know the answer to that: you would suffer some minor inconvenience if policies that reduced that effect on Canada were adopted in the US, and you are more important than Canada.

It's not like this is my first day here, y'know?

[RSillsbee]

24. What policies would you like to see enacted?

People who are not jingoistic exceptionalist chauvinists actually look around them and consider how others in this big wide world of ours do things, and whether some of the ways they do things are worthy of consideration.

The focus of this forum is American gun policies not Canadian gun policies

People who are not wilfully ignorant educate themselves about a whole spectrum of things, including how others in this big wide world of ours do things, and whether some of the ways they do things are worthy of consideration

I must concede this point Iam willfully ignorant of Canadian gun laws the have no effect on me nor any bearing on me. I have no interest in anything that comes out of Canada w/ the exception of Moose McGlade and Katey Montague.


It's not like this is my first day here, y'know?

And you've won how many converts to your position?

[friendly_iconoclast]

25. Really! Were one of us to post at some "New Democratic Underground" in a like manner...

...I doubt their feet would touch the threshold before their asses hit the street.


Please realize the civilizing mission is not easy and The Canadian Person's Burden is a heavy one, so allowances must be made.

I think we've been rather tolerant, all things considered.


Besides that, Paisley Syndrome sure does provide juicy quotes....

[RSillsbee]

26. Were you replying to me or she who must not be named? NT

[iverglas]

28. it's actually called rabble.ca / babble.ca

and if one were to go spewing the right wing / gun militant agenda there, you're absolutely right: their feet might hover on the threshold a while, but their bums would indeed hit the pavement.

I wonder whey we don't have Canadian gun militants hanging around the Canada forum at this place? I guess they're too busy playing at freedominion and LUFA ...

[friendly_iconoclast]

30. I was referring to an attituded of assumed cultural superiority, and a barrage of...

...posts that repeatedly riff on the "Well, this is how we do things in the States..." theme.

It wouldn't smell any better aimed north than it does aimed south.

[iverglas]

27. your copy&paste skills seem to be wanting

or is it your reading comprehension ... or ... something else?

The focus of this forum is American gun policies not Canadian gun policies
you missed? --
But then of course there is the actual practical relevance of Canada in the discussion of USAmerican gun policies: Canada is significantly adversely affected by them.


I must concede this point Iam willfully ignorant of Canadian gun laws the have no effect on me nor any bearing on me. I have no interest in anything that comes out of Canada w/ the exception of Moose McGlade and Katey Montague.
this is supposed to be a reply to --
People who are not wilfully ignorant educate themselves about a whole spectrum of things, including how others in this big wide world of ours do things, and whether some of the ways they do things are worthy of consideration.?
Not other than as a demonstration of what I said, it isn't.


It's not like this is my first day here, y'know?
And you've won how many converts to your position?
Hahahahaha. Did you think that was what I was trying to do?

:rofl:

[RSillsbee]

29. Did you think that was what I was trying to do?

Not at all. I know exactly what you're trying to do

[SteveM]

10. Sounds like they were teens. Does the law allow them to carry guns?

BTW, who has supported your speculations? Anyone here?

[TexasProgresive]

2. More details please

How does a pistol accidentally go off when loading. That just doesn't make sense to me. Maybe with some revolvers?

[Journeyman]

3. Start with "drinking party," add "after 2 am," and mix in "young people". . .

A simple equation, the product of which is "stupid accident." Or maybe the killer had something against 17-year-old Karrie Linnen.

[DrDan]

4. add "a gun"

[friendly_iconoclast]

7. Or "a car", or "more booze". Underaged drinking parties are just dangerous, period. n/t

[DrDan]

12. more so with guns

[friendly_iconoclast]

15. True, but more of the little snowflakes end up doing the job with cars+booze n/t

[iverglas]

14. good lord

Start with "drinking party," add "after 2 am," and mix in "young people". . .

and conveniently leave out GUN.

How about we do leave out the gun?

Anybody dead here?

Unbelievable.

[Journeyman]

18. "Gun" was the topic in the response (#2) to which I replied . . .

And yes, without guns (or knives or weapons of any sort), the equation I gave results in deaths many, many times each year. Young people drinking late at night kill each other and themselves in many fashions - cars, hot tubs, alcohol poisoning, falls, fighting - or were you unaware of this?

[iverglas]

23. young people kill other young people *accidentally*

in many fashions - cars, hot tubs, alcohol poisoning, falls, fighting

do they?

Cars, yup. Not many accidental drownings of other people in hot tubs, accidental alcohol poisonings of other people, accidental killings of other people in falls, accidental killings of non-participants in fights ... or accidental killings of non-participants with knives or other weapons ...

Other than the cars, my friend, you have yourself a fine barrel of apples and potatoes.

[ileus]

5. Where is your 17yo at 2am?

[MineralMan]

6. In her own words, "None of your business."

Few parents have a lot of control over 17 year olds.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

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[ileus]

19. another gun vitimized by drinking....