A Wild Night in Springfield MA

[mikeb302000]

http://www.masslive.com/news/index.ssf/2011/09/springfield_shooting_reports_k.html">MASS Live.com reports

A flurry of back-to-back shooting reports kept police busy early Monday morning, just as the city's entertainment district was shutting down for the night

This is the result of several years of increased gun sales coupled with lax or non-existent gun laws. On a good night there are so many shootings the cops can't even keep up.

The fact that Massachusetts has fair gun control laws obviously is not enough. They need to be stricter and they need to be applied to all the other states.

That's the only way to diminish the flow of guns into the criminal world. As it stands now, it would seem in Springfield MA, and in every other big city in The Bay State, there are as many guns available as anyone could want.

The real mystery in all this is why would truly legitimate and law-abiding gun owners not want to do everything possible to stop it? I can see only two possible reasons.

1. the slippery slope - they are so paranoid they really believe all the NRA nonsense about "registration leads to confiscation."

2. selfishness - they are so self-centered their only concern is to not be inconvenienced themselves.

What's your opinion? Is there another explanation for the inexplicable resistance on the part of folks who call themselves law-abiding gun owners?

Please leave a comment.
http://mikeb302000.blogspot.com/">(cross posted at Mikeb302000)

[TheWraith]

1. why would truly legitimate and law-abiding gun owners not want to do everything possible to stop it

With all this terrorism going on, why would you not want to do everything possible to stop it? After all, if you haven't done anything wrong, you have nothing to fear from airport patdowns, warrantless wiretapping, and random searches. :eyes:

Funny how some "liberals" suddenly go all police-state-friendly when it's about something they disapprove of. Particularly when faced with the fact that MA's gun laws, some of the most stringent in the country, don't stop crime.

[mikeb302000]

7. that's a bullshit argument and you know it

no one is talking about "police state" anything.

We're talking about background checks and licensing and registration. Those are not considered tyrannical when applied to cars, so if you'll forgive the comparison, how could they be for guns?

Police state my ass. You like to use inflammatory words to mischaracterize the gun control position.

[geckosfeet]

12. MA already does all that - and more. Does not seem to stop the gun traffic.

[pipoman]

14. Inflammatory words, huh?

Now that's the tree calling the pickle green, now isn't it?

"1. the slippery slope - they are so paranoid they really believe all the NRA nonsense about "registration leads to confiscation."

2. selfishness - they are so self-centered their only concern is to not be inconvenienced themselves."

Unrec, as usual, for pumping your juvenile, inflammatory, and silly blog.

[beevul]

15. As I'm sure you've been told a hundred times...

Those are not considered tyrannical when applied to cars, so if you'll forgive the comparison, how could they be for guns?

As I'm sure you've been told a hundred times, there are NO background checks required to buy a car, nor is licensing or registration required to own a car.

You, like so many others, are deliberately pretending that background checks licensing and registration applies to automobiles, and hopeing nobody will notice. It all sounds so reasonable, except its all FALSE.

If you want the same regulations as cars, then what youre looking at, is any states concealed carry license, being recognised by every single other state...Youre in luck - WE are working on just that.

What youre also looking at, is no background checks to buy cars even at retail, no license or registration simply to OWN one.


But thats not what you want at all, is it.


So how about you stop the misrepresentation of reality that you engage in in an effort to get what you want, eh?

If the brand of gun control you seek is so good right just or popular, why the need to compare it to a reality that isnt?

[michreject]

19. I don't see cars mentioned in the Bill of Rights

But I do see guns mentioned. It's in the 2nd Amendment. Before you start with your militia bullshit, the Supreme clarified it to mean an individual right.

[Remmah2]

25. Licensing and registration = taxes and fees on my Second Amendment right.

And the ability to increase taxes and make my rights non-affordable.

[SteveM]

29. Yet, the violent crime rates (including murder) are down in the U.S. nt

[gejohnston]

2. non existent?

Please read up on US federal and state gun laws. Mass. gun laws are stricter than Italy's.

. the slippery slope - they are so paranoid they really believe all the NRA nonsense about "registration leads to confiscation."
what evidence do you have it is nonsense?

In other news, gangsters kill gangsters everywhere.
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5g7c8yftJ0wIfp8Zyp471PCKTxPkg

[mahina]

3. Springfield sucks.

It's a shithole. I don't know why...industry died and it's a little microclimate of poverty and ignorance. It should be evacuated and fenced off for future generations.

Dear DU'ers from Springfield: nothing personal. You know it's true.

[Skittles]

4. a wilder one in NY!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44403609/ns/us_news/

[mikeb302000]

8. yes indeed nt

[Remmah2]

23. NYC; case study of registration leading to confiscation.

NYC=no gun zone (except to the political elite and well connected.)

[rl6214]

5. As usual you are adding in your own commentary when in reality

you don't have a clue what you are talking about.

"This is the result of several years of increased gun sales coupled with lax or non-existent gun laws. On a good night there are so many shootings the cops can't even keep up."

Can you show us where and how you came up with this little tibit? Especially this part: "on a good night there are so many shootings the cops can't even keep up."

[mikeb302000]

9. I have more than a clue of what I'm talking about

so my explanations about why things are as fucked up as they are, are pretty solid. You just don't like them.

[AtheistCrusader]

21. Cite to evidence, please. Check your hyperbole at the door.

OR, you can just stuff your objections to comments above like 'police state', which are significantly less hyperbolic than the drivel in your original post.

[friendly_iconoclast]

28. No, you don't- and here's the proof:

"Research is unnecessary when writing an anti-gun column"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=360440

Care to explain to us why Manchester, New Hampshire (in a decidedly gun-friendly state) has lower violent
crime and murder rates than two similar cities (Fall River and New Bedford) in "gun-safe" Massachusetts?

I got the stats from the FBI's website (links in the thread) if you want to try to disprove them.

[mikeb302000]

35. sure, it's for the same reason that any two cities differ

there are a number of other factors besides gun availability which contribute towards gun violence. Some cities have lots of guns but less severe problems in unemployment, poor education, drug and alcohol abuse, etc.

Gun availability is one of the most tangible and concrete contributing factors in the gun violence problem. It's the one we can address quickly and effectively while we work on all the others which require more long term solutions.

[friendly_iconoclast]

36. But guns are more easily available *legally* in the city with the least problems

And restricting legal availability was gospel for decades in places like Chicago and DC and Baltimore. Pols in those cities
would (and some still do) tell the voters that restricting guns was helping to keep them safe even as it was clear to any
honest person that those places were decidedly unsafe.

[SteveM]

30. Well, you have the clue; now let us have it -- w/out posting in your other blog. nt

[krispos42]

6. There are as many guns available as anybody wants?

Oh no! What a horrible situation! We should fix that, with some sort of... Prohibition. Yeah, that's it.

[defendandprotect]

10. GOP/NRA's "Wild West America" -- !!! RW "Third World America" -- !!

[friendly_iconoclast]

27. Got to harsh your mellow here, Sunflower: Violent crime is decreasing in the US.

We will now return to your regularly scheduled programming of "Meat Eating Is Patriarchal", "Capitalism Is Altering Earth's Rotation", and "Stanley Kubrick Was In On The Moon Landing Hoax".

[SteveM]

31. I think D & F is being sarcastic and vaudevilleian. nt

[geckosfeet]

11. MA laws are already fairly restrictive. But the laws restrict legal gun ownership,

not illegal ownership.

The only way to diminish the flow of guns into the criminal world is to not put guns in the hands of criminals. And keep guns stored in a way that prohibits theft.

To legally buy hand guns in the state of MA you MUST be licensed with a MA class A license to carry. As far as I know there is no other way to legally buy a hand gun in MA. But criminals seem to have found a way around that. Who would have figured?

[ileus]

13. Let's deminish the criminals...leave my RIGHTS alone.

[jmg257]

16. "Non existent gun laws"? When did it become legal in MA to shoot people with guns??? nt

[PavePusher]

17. "lax or non-existent gun laws", in Mass.?!

Ghod, your demonstrate your profound idiocy more and more every day.

[RSillsbee]

34. Well, they DO say

Too much blog flogging is bad for your mind

[ileus]

18. I like the comments section....funny how only a few blame guns.

[AtheistCrusader]

20. "This is the result of several years of increased gun sales coupled with lax or non-existent gun la"

ws"

Cite to evidence please.

[rrneck]

22. This is the result

of a woefully deficient educational system coupled with the ability to impact others far beyond one individuals limited ability to do harm without the help of powerful technology.

There is nothing in the OP to discuss beyond the posters feelings. Opinions don't have to be supported with evidence. They don't even have to make sense. This thread is just one big, fat group therapy session where all the gun owners have to listen to what horrible people they are.

The first, and still greatest, natural resource is human emotion. It is inexhaustible and costs almost nothing to exploit.

[SteveM]

32. Hey, that's pretty good. nt

[Remmah2]

24. "entertainment district " = bar zone.

2am?

I'll bet it was a CCW convention.

[azureblue]

26. what is the NRA's policy and proposed solution

to this problem? Is there a link to it, if there is one?

[Atypical Liberal]

33. "fair gun control laws"

The fact that Massachusetts has fair gun control laws obviously is not enough. They need to be stricter and they need to be applied to all the other states.

That's the only way to diminish the flow of guns into the criminal world. As it stands now, it would seem in Springfield MA, and in every other big city in The Bay State, there are as many guns available as anyone could want.

Why is it that the places with the strictest gun control policies also have the least effect on gun-related crime? If the problem is "all the other states", why don't those other states have such problems?

The answer is simple: The problem is not the guns, it's the people in those locations.

The real mystery in all this is why would truly legitimate and law-abiding gun owners not want to do everything possible to stop it? I can see only two possible reasons.

1. the slippery slope - they are so paranoid they really believe all the NRA nonsense about "registration leads to confiscation."

2. selfishness - they are so self-centered their only concern is to not be inconvenienced themselves.

There are many problems in society that I am not willing to do "everything possible to stop it", because I enjoy freedom.

We could stop pool drownings by outlawing all swimming pools. We could stop drunk driving by outlawing alcohol and automobiles. In fact we could mandate that every citizen be raised in a rubber room, safe from all harm. There are many "possible" things that we could do to ensure safety. But, as Benjamin Franklin noted, most of us put a higher premium on freedom rather than on safety.

Furthermore, violent crime continues to decline. So obviously whatever we are doing is working.

But even it if was not, so what? I am not going to allow the actions of criminals to be used as an excuse for curtailing my actions. If this is selfish, tough.