And yet another "assault rifle" shooting

[MyrnaLoy]

Been a tough month for people facing AKs in America, over 50 people wounded or dead in like 2 weeks. And then today we get this:

"The suspect was armed with two handguns and an assault rifle, Grill said. Witnesses said dozens of gunshots could be heard blocks away." http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hGJL3-TUhbffkbxQrPjNwamSnCpw?docId=f51ce0099d0840b9b8e2b161d658ef78

Remember though, these are "sporting guns". Well, looks like the sport has been human this month.

"The shooting suspect is in custody, according to Lt. Brent Grill. He says the suspect was armed with more than one weapon, including two handguns, an assault rifle and several magazines. The suspect was also wearing a "webbing" vest.

"He had more than one weapon, several shots fired, some gear on that appeared to be tactical. I did not see any body armor, it's obvious that he came here with the intent to do some killing," http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20105749-504083.html

Sporting, yeah right.

For you Assault rifle type followers, today's shooter opted for the AR-style assault rifle. http://www.swtimes.com/news/article_635031f8-de52-11e0-a5cd-001cc4c002e0.html

Sporting, aww yes it is. Shooting up offices is great sport! "Brown said the suspect fired multiple rounds from an assault rifle, shooting up two offices inside the courthouse."

Read more: http://www.4029tv.com/news/29172397/detail.html#ixzz1XsoNt0kG

[DissedByBush]

1. It's a good thing they don't allow guns in courtrooms

That would have prevented this shooting.

Oh, wait...

Also, I'll give you 100:1 odds it wasn't an assault rifle.

Just more ignorant reporting.

[MyrnaLoy]

3. awww the stupid

assault rifle argument. Yes, that one. You mean the weapon that people buy and outfit with all sorts of combat gear but don't want them called "assault weapons, that one? Do you mean the one that over 50 people were ASSAULTED with this month? That one? Aww yes, that stupid argument. I would venture a guess that more people were shot with the AK this month than small game. You do know that in less than two weeks over 50 people have been shot with the ASSAULT rifle right? Yea, the assault rifle debate, LOL yeah good one!

[gejohnston]

11. assault rifles pit bulls, even when it turns out to be a

black lab or German Shepard, yeah the media is that stupid and lazy. Just like the way the Florida media reporting on Rick Scott's medicare fraud before the election. Wait, that's right, they began mentioning it literally the day after he won a slim plurality in a five way race.

[Maine_Nurse]

13. You do realize that...

my deer rifle, designed in 1895 and firing a round developed in the 1860's is far more accurate and deadly than the false assault rifle which you refer to.

[DissedByBush]

42. Assault rifle has a definition

And the AK copy you buy from a gun store doesn't fit it. Anti-gun ignorance.

An AK is also rarely outfitted with all of that gear since it is normally not sold with rails. I know they exist, but they're not that common.

"Outfitting with combat gear" also doesn't necessarily make one more deadly, but instead often just weighs it down.

True story: Soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan can usually spot a newbie because he has all sorts of attachments on his weapon.

BTW, I have such a rail on my hunting rifle.

Does that make it an assault rifle? It's used to attach the scope.

It's a single-shot.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[TheWraith]

2. If you can't understand statistics versus anecdotes, or how scientific information works...

...why should anyone listen to you? You're doing the equivalent of insisting that because anyone, anywhere, dies from a terrorist attack, it therefore justifies everything that's happened since 9/11 and the complete elimination of civil liberties.

[MyrnaLoy]

4. you did

cuz you responded. You're a boss! I do like however, that you consider 50 people shot with assault rifles in less than two weeks anecdotal. That speaks volumes about you. Ya know chief, at some point anecdotal becomes statistical right?


Why do I never see you playing the anecdotal card at the "good shooting" posts? Odd, very odd, it's like you don't like the evil gun stories. It's like you may want to even censor some news, is that what it is? You support censorship! OMG!

[oneshooter]

5. So what new law, or change in the existing law would you support to prevent this? n/t

[MyrnaLoy]

6. you know the answer to that

ban these weapons, they serve no purpose. They are being used by more and more criminals, just read the news. I know that's what you wanted me to say to engage in some sort of internet fight, you have fun with that.

[oneshooter]

7. OK then ban them. Take them all up. How ya gonna pay for them? n/t

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[oneshooter]

20. How would you "stop the sale of them". The Feds can only control

interstate sales. Intrastate sales are the responsibility of each state.
You would have to get laws passed in all fifty states, not imposable, but very improbable. Also you would have to change Federal laws.
Where would you start?

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[jmg257]

15. I think IF I was to attempt to ban them, I would offer 1X tax rebate for

The value. Which, if they were banned, would be pretty damn low. Turn in during the amnesty period, get a rebate voucher.

After that, get caught with one and you do the time. Couldn't be some half-assed AWB...would have to make a real impact on magazine fed semi-autos in general.

[oneshooter]

17. Check the fifth Amendment, "Fair Market Value"

If you were given the same deal on your house, would you accept it?

[jmg257]

18. What do you think the value will be after a ban?

Or once a ban became imminent? I guess one could always sell them to an FFL and he could deal them away for a bit more? The value of many a house went way down the last few years. Not much I could do about it, other then not sell...but my house wasn't illegal so I didn't have to. :)

[PavePusher]

21. Ahem....

"black market"

[jmg257]

23. There ya go! Take the chance, could be a huge payoff! Personally if it ever

Came to that I very very likely wouldn't take the chance. Doing time in federal prison just doesn't seem all that attractive, or beneficial to me and mine.

[oneshooter]

22. Emanate Domain laws. Again read the Fifth Amendment.

[jmg257]

24. "due process" and "just compensation" should cover it. Value is value.

Wouldn't be the 1st time something had to be given up due to a change in laws. Wasn't that what banning registered guns in NYC And CA accomplished?
Isn't that why we are so opposed to registration? just in case...?

[TheCowsCameHome]

35. WTF is an "emanate domain" law, judge?

Again read a dictionary.

[oneshooter]

45. I get in a rush at times, did not mean to offend your somewhat anal sensibilities

''The Fifth Amendment to the Constitution says 'nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.'"

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data/constitution/amendment05/14.html

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[Tesha]

10. Sure they do (serve a purpose): they give the Right great talking points! (NT)

[Atypical Liberal]

31. I don't care how many criminals use them.

In the end, it does not really matter how many people commit crimes with item X. If you want to stop criminals from committing crimes with item X, then you will have to do it through legislation that only affects criminals. I am not going to allow the actions of criminals to be used as an excuse to limit my Constitutional rights.

[AtheistCrusader]

41. Actually they are being used less and less, but statistics are hard, I know.

[PavePusher]

16. Many people abused their vehicular privledges in the last couple of weeks....

I know what you want to hear but it's not gonna happen. Stop the sale of them. Stop the importation of them and the parts. Ban the sale at car shows. Increased penalties for people who use them in crimes. If a person is caught selling one prison. See I know you want me to use the "C" word but I don't need to. Take the ones used in crimes, sooner or later some fucking progressive has to sell his Prius.

[Maine_Nurse]

19. I guarantee you that far more than 50...

people in two weeks have been stabbed with kitchen knives. So what do you wanna do? How about the more than 50 auto fatalities in two weeks?

[Atypical Liberal]

30. So get back to us when that happens.

I do like however, that you consider 50 people shot with assault rifles in less than two weeks anecdotal. That speaks volumes about you. Ya know chief, at some point anecdotal becomes statistical right?

I'll wait for the FBI UCR data to show a trend before I start worrying about it.

Why do I never see you playing the anecdotal card at the "good shooting" posts?

Because anecdotes only help the pro-gun side. Stories about good shootings don't indicate a trend, they merely indicate that they happen, which is justification enough to allow law-abiding citizens to have the opportunity to defend themselves.

The anti-gun side tries to use anecdotes to show a trend, and they don't.

[AtheistCrusader]

39. Try that line with me. Go ahead. I won't post links or anything.

[ileus]

14. This sucks what an asshat, I love the AR platform and don't like seeing it abused.

At the hands of fuck asses like this....stuff like this keeps up and I'll have to expedite my purchase of a 6.8 upper, and also pickup a stipped lower while I still can.

I also need to pick up a AK before it's too late to add to my collection.

[-..__...]

26. Home builds... gotta love'em.

That's one nice thing about the AR platform... especially since the AWB expired.

After market parts manufacturers and vendors sprung up overnight like mushrooms.

Your choices, preferences and needs are only limited by your imagination and checking account! B-) B-)

AK builds are nice also... but unfortunately, the supply of Com Bloc parts kits are getting harder to come by.

And when you can find them (with barrels), they fetch ridiculous asking prices.

The FAL scene is even more depressing.

All 3 should be in any true "black rifle" aficionados collection, but sadly (and to the joy of some), it's getting to be an expensive game.

And don't even get me started on the cost/price of ammo. :(

[Abin Sur]

25. Unless the AR in question was fully automatic

Which it almost certainly wasn't...then it wasn't an assault rifle by definition.

[oneshooter]

27. She possably knows that. She just don't care to be correct, it detracts from the rant. n/t

[-..__...]

28. That was a rant?

Sounded more like sour grapes (with a dash of bug-eyed sweat beads), to me.

[jmg257]

32. Which is all well and good...but doesn't help if someone were trying

To ban the gun used, which of course is a semi-auto we all know in love. Too bad it wasn't a real assault rifle, then there wouldn't be much case in discussing it for most of us.

We all know the press will do whatever they want with whatever term they want...in the end it is another example of an assault weapon being used in crime.

Not good...for anyone.

[petronius]

29. This would be an excellent candidate for the shiny new 'Guns in the News' thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=460887&mesg_id=460887

Just consider the glory and fame that would accrue to the first contributor!

A couple of points on the thread: "assault rifle" has a specific meaning, and it's nearly a certainty that the rifle in the OP isn't it. It's unfortunate to (apparently) see a police officer making such an elementary error. Made up names like "assault weapon" and incorrect monikers like "assault rifle" applied to rifles that are generally less accurate and less powerful than typical hunting rifles do nothing other than create confusion and bias. Used by those who know better, they're extremely dishonest and intended only to elicit an emotional response. (For analogy, it's the gun-control version of "death tax" or "partial birth abortion.")

Regarding another post: anecdotal does not eventually become statistical. All the anecdotes in the world do not become statistical data unless care is taken in the sampling and treatment of that data. As we know from real data, rifle-related crime is actually quite rare, and becoming more so...

[-..__...]

33. "By popular demand"?

:eyes:

Who writes this crap?

[petronius]

34. I'm in favor of it; am I not popular?

:silly:

[-..__...]

36. Sorry, dude...

but it has nothing to do with who agrees or disagrees with it.

It has more to do with "hey, guyz... here's a swell idea that could work, and here are the rules. We just all have to agree with them".

Been there... done that.

We're not a self governing forum, and to expect otherwise is naive.

If the site owners/moderators decide to implement the posted "policy"/rules, then I'll abide by that.

Until that happens... I'm not about to agree or adhere to some self appointed moderator of rules, guidelines and decorum no matter who they are.

[rl6214]

37. Unrec for the dishonesty

NONE of those were assault rifles. NONE.

[AtheistCrusader]

38. Doesn't matter how hard you bang that drum. The statistics don't lie.

Keep on pushing that boulder uphill though. It would be fun to watch if you weren't making a mockery out of honest debate and discussion over gun policy.

[Union Scribe]

40. Cite for "50 people" claim?

[Remmah2]

43. "webbing" vest??

Was it wabbit season?

[GreenStormCloud]

44. Some statistics for you.

From the FBI Crime in America report for 2009

http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2009/offenses/expanded_information/data/shrtable_08.html

348 people were killed by rifles

801 people were killed by hands, fists, & feet.

If you are all uptight about rifles then hands & feet should really get you moving.