Center-fire rifle legality in California. Or, why people are skeptical of "reasonable regulations"

[Atypical Liberal]

http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.html

[msongs]

1. 2A does not contain the words "reasonable regulations" so kids n felons can own guns too nt

[gejohnston]

2. you missed the point

Those reasonable regulations have been around since FDR on the federal level, before that in the states. The problem is that "reasonable" and "sane" are never defined' Whenever I asked someone on the other side, I might have gotten one answer. No answer to the question of what about current federal laws are not reasonable or sane.

Now, please explain how these regulations, which relate to looks not function, are "reasonable or sane"? How do these features relate to gums used in crimes? Hint:rifles of all types are rarely used.
Other than Brady or VPC propaganda, is there any evidence of these being used by street gangs to any large degree?
Has the passage of the law have any empirical benefit?

How are they more lethal or powerful than any other rifle of the same caliber?

Although called "assault weapons", which is a propaganda buzz word and kind of legal term that varies, they have no relationship with what is technically called an assault weapon (which are often defined as destructive devices under the National Firearms Act of 1934. They include things like flame throwers, mortars, etc.)

Assault rifle is a technical term, but none of these are (although they look similar and are based on the designed). A true assault rifle is regarded as a machine gun under the NFA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_weapon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_rifle

[Remmah2]

6. Infringed? nt

nt

[Straw Man]

7. OMG! I guess we'd better repeal that sucker, then!

That'll piss the little criminals off. Serves 'em right.











Jackassery: it's what's for dinner.

[SteveM]

13. Are you an "extremist" or on the "fringe?" A gun-control/prohibitionist poster...

suggested that this forum might be "hidden" in the future due to those characteristics. Do you support such a move on those or any other grounds?


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=437x4859

[We_Have_A_Problem]

17. True - but not in the way you're trying to present it.

Kids of course may only possess what their parents allow them to, so the whole bit about "kids owning guns" is pure, unadulterated bullshit.

Felons, on the other hand, are obviously not permitted to possess weapons while incarcerated, but until 1968, could and did immediately regain their 2nd Amendment rights upon completion of their sentence. That is how it should be. A man goes to jail as punishment for a crime. Continuing the punishment in perpetuity is wrong.

[krispos42]

3. Well, that beats the tar out of actually reading the California law.

Still sucks, though.

[ileus]

4. What an idiotassed chart...I never realized it was that bad in cali.

Sad state of affairs the people let themselves get into.

[spin]

5. Has any real benefit resulted from these regulations ...

or is this just another "feel good" piece of legislation?

[Atypical Liberal]

8. Hell I can't figure it out, I don't know how a criminal would.

[slackmaster]

11. That's a great question, spin

I believe the simple answer is "No."

A more scholarly answer would account for all the money and resources that have been wasted, and discuss the philosophical implications of placing arbitrary restrictions on liberty for which there is no measurable return in something good like public safety.

[saras]

9. I thought it was perfectly clear and easy to read. The regs themselves seem cumulative.

it doesn't appear that they back up and rewrite all the laws every time they pass a new one, so things get pretty convoluted. But if we can't get Congress to pass one law, why would we expect them to delete twenty and then pass twenty new sensible ones that all work together?

[Euromutt]

14. The *flowchart* is easy to read, yes; that's its purpose

But the flowchart was produced by some guys at CalGuns to help California gun owners navigate the regulations, which are spread across at least three sections of the California Penal Code and two sections of the California Code of Regulations, and while that may not seem much, bear in mind that if you were starting from scratch, you'd have to find those sections first.

[rrneck]

10. This is how government facilitates

disaster capitalism.

Produce laws that stimulate the marketplace based on fear and short term reactions to (erzatz) difficulties in people's lives.

[SteveM]

12. Yes. I remember, now. The schematic on my 1964 portable reel-to-reel.nt

[Euromutt]

15. By way of illustration, note Appendix B lists the Olympic Arms PCR

As their FAQ explains, "PCR" stands for "Politically Correct Rifle." It was a model series OlyArms built specifically to comply with the 1994 federal "assault weapons" ban, by making the weapon with an unthreaded muzzle and without a bayonet lug. Unsurprisingly, OlyArms stopped making them after the federal AWB lapsed.

Still, this is a rifle that was specifically made to not meet the defining criteria of a so-called "assault weapon," and the Cal DOJ still banned it by name. It doesn't even matter if you remove the original stock and pistol grip and install one of those U15 or MonsterMan monstrosities, thereby bringing it into compliance with California law: since 2001, you can't bring one into California, period.

[iverglas]

16. sorry, I don't want to click on your link

If you're going to post something at this site, post it.

An opening post consisting of nothing but a link to somewhere I don't want to go to ... nope.

[spin]

18. who cares? (n/t)

edited for typo

[iverglas]

19. oh look; you got it

Nonetheless, there is a separate point.

An opening post consisting of nothing but a link, and especially a link I prefer not to sully my mouse by touching, is not appropriate.

[spin]

20. I see your point ...

It's better to post an excerpt and the link rather than just the excerpt without a link, a blind link or just a link.

Sounds fair to me.