Howard Metzenbaum Blasts Congress for not strengthening AWB

[Procopius]

http://www.jointogether.org/gv/news/alerts/reader/0,2061,566697,00.html

[LosinIt]

1. AWB - ? - Average White Band???

These acronyms are annoying.

[Procopius]

2. Assault Weapons Ban

[slackmaster]

3. AWB

[LosinIt]

4. People were hairy in the 70s

wonder what these guys look like now. 2nd guy from the left is definitely bald by now, don'tcha think?

[slackmaster]

5. Bald, gray, portley, and/or dead

I graduated from high school in 1975. The 20th and 25th class reunions were very interesting. I'm one of the few males left who still get "carded" for liquor purchases.

[LastDemInIdaho]

6. jointogether.org

Why did they drop the name Handgun Control Inc? Are they ashamed of their goals?

[MrBenchley]

8. Different group

But thatnks for playing "What's my RKBA fantasy..."

[1a2b3c]

12. HCI is still up and running.

http://www.handguncontrolinc.org/

[jody]

16. That's cruel!

:evilgrin:

[Ergotron]

18. Handgun Control Inc. sounded TOO authoritarian...

They wanted to appeal to a broader segmetn of the public with a touchy-feely name.

[MrBenchley]

7. He's absolutely right!

""Unless Congress and President Bush work together to enact new legislation, UZIs, AK 47s, and a list of other bargain basement military-style killing machines will flood America's streets again," said retired Senator and Consumer Federation of America (CFA) Chairman Howard Metzenbaum. "The existing law is so weak that scores of slightly modified versions of assault weapons banned ten years ago are legally and freely available."
Although President Bush has stated his support for renewing the ban, he has not yet taken action on its behalf."

Even Chimpy knows what a winnner this issue is with voters...which is why he's paying it lip service.

[KS_44]

10. ... Straight from the horses mouth

"Unless Congress and President Bush work together to enact new legislation, UZIs, AK 47s, and a list of other bargain basement military-style killing machines will flood America's streets again," said retired Senator and Consumer Federation of America (CFA) Chairman Howard Metzenbaum. "The existing law is so weak that scores of slightly modified versions of assault weapons banned ten years ago are legally and freely available."
Although President Bush has stated his support for renewing the ban, he has not yet taken action on its behalf."





Straight from the horses mouth mr benchly.

Hes one point off though, UZIs AK 47s and a list of other bargain basement killing machines have been on the streets since 1994 because of the fact that the existing law is so weak that scores of modified (had their names changed) AWs are legally and freely available.

I didnt know my AR15 was bargain basement... $900 bucks sure dont seem like a cheap bargain basement investiment.

Just because of this article, im gonna go buy a cheap $300 AK-47 tomorrow. Who knows why? This guy is making me mad, so I better take one off the streets and put it in my closet.

[MrBenchley]

11. Peddle that rubbish to someone dumb enough to buy it...

[1a2b3c]

13. dumb enough to buy what?

[MrBenchley]

14. Gee, you answered your own question

Dumb enough to buy any part of the RKBA crowd's argument that the reason the gun industry is spending millions trying to get rid of the assault weapons ban is because the law has been totally ineffective.....

Maybe Mary Rosh can explain it to you..

[KS_44]

15. Still trying to save face!

I just saw on the news that the williams sister was shot to death with an AK-47 in California. (which has its own stronger weapons ban than the 1994 ban) My god that ban is working well huh?

As usuall, you try to justify reason A with reason Z.
You cant see anything else besides your own twisted view.
If this ban is streanghtened it jepordizes many rifle manufacturers as I listen on the BAN MUST STAND thread. These rifle manufacturers seem to like making $$, so instead of twiddling their thumbs they donate to keep it from comming back. If it comes back, it will most likely come back streangthened and they will either fold or lose more money. Those banned features are wanted by many people, including me, so when the ban dies I will be buying collapsable stocks to replace my old stocks. Funny thing is, the manufacturers know folding/colapsible stocks are popular and will make them $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ when the ban dies. Kinda easy to figure out if your not arguing with a mirror Mr. Benchly.

[MrBenchley]

17. No, you answered your own question

"I just saw on the news that the williams sister was shot to death with an AK-47 in California."
And this tells YOU there ought to be MORE of these weapons on the street? Disgraceful--but that's all that can be expected from the RKBA crowd.

"the manufacturers know folding/colapsible stocks are popular"
Is THAT why they're spendinng millions trrying to overturn the voters' wishes?

[KS_44]

20. No more spinning bently.

Mr bently, I just noticed something hypocritical from you... as if thats suprising.

From the AWB thread:

"And what do they have to do with the subject under discussion
Or is this just a launching point for more RKBA rhetorical horseshit?"

Here:

"And this tells YOU there ought to be MORE of these weapons on the street? Disgraceful--but that's all that can be expected from the RKBA crowd."

Your getting off subject. Im not here to argue weather or not they should be on the street. Im here to argue that the ban didnt take jack-$h!t off the streets. Not even in CALIFORNIA where the ban is 2x as strong as the federal ban. This is something you have not debated with me. Why can I buy new AK-47s? "because of the corrupt RKBA crowd and the gun industry" Thats nice Mr. Bently, but if thats the case the guns are still on the street then huh?

Stop going off on different tangents as a defense mechanism.

Wasent their an assault weapon ban or something in 1994?

Well, feature ban... excuse me.

[MrBenchley]

21. Surrrrrrre.....

That's why the gun industry is spending millions to get rid of this ban....because it didn't do anything.

Go peddle that to someone dumb enough to buy it.

"According to the most recent statistics from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms:
* In 1993, assault weapons accounted for 8.2 percent of all guns used in crimes;
* By the end of 1995, that proportion had fallen to 4.3 percent; and
* By November 1996, the last date for which statistics are available, the proportion had fallen to 3.2 percent."

http://www.moderatevoters.org/issues2.asp

[GregBarr]

23. I'm Not Sure You Understood The www.moderatevoters.org Site.

The http://www.moderatevoters.org site is IN FAVOR of the ASW ban and the continuation of it.

The statistics sited showing the decrease in crimes with ASWs shows the ban is working and should be continued.

[slackmaster]

24. The statistics on that site are completely useless bullshit

They are based on requests for gun traces submitted to the BATFE, not guns used in crimes. Not all gun traces are for guns used in crimes; many are to locate the owner of stolen guns. The numbers in no way reflect the proportion of one kind of gun or another used in crimes.

BATFE does not even gather statistics on the types of guns used in crimes. It's not their job. The FBI does that, and they do not track "assault weapons" as distinct from handguns, shotguns, and rifles.

Anyone who tries to pass the moderatevoters.org data off as support for the AWB either hasn't dug deep enough to figure out what the numbers mean or is committing a willful deception. Of course if you are simply scared of "assault weapons" and looking for nonsense to support a continuation of the ban, any unrelated figures will do in a pinch.

[MrBenchley]

28. Cry us a river, slack.

Between you and moderatevoters.org, ask me which I believe.

[MrBenchley]

25. Exactly so

I am in favor of strengthening and renewing the ban....as polls show a solid majority of voters are.

[GregBarr]

26. I agree 100%.

I agree with your statement 100%.

I think that is what the http://www.moderatevoters.org article was saying.

Hey, we "Moderates" are in favor of the AWB too!

[MrBenchley]

27. It's a winning issue

There's no reason to put those weapons on the street.... Like Clark (not an endorsement) said the other day, "If you want to shoot assault weapons, join the army."

[RoeBear]

29. Strengthening?

Whatever do you mean?

[MrBenchley]

30. Try looking at the actual bills being proposed, roe...

You know, the ones the Democrats are proposing....

[Ergotron]

19. As much as I am loathe to admit it, I have to agree with Mr. Benchley

I am among the group that Mr. Benchley refers to as 'gun nuts', but that is not the issue here. I believe the gun industry IS spending millions to ensure the expiration of the AWB for purely selfish profit motivations.

There are many others who, like me, support the expiration because they see it as silly, pointless, and ineffective government intrusion where there should be none. However comma I don't believe the gun industry's motives are the same as mine.

[DoNotRefill]

22. Where's the profit motive?

"I believe the gun industry IS spending millions to ensure the expiration of the AWB for purely selfish profit motivations."

They make their money regardless of if there are bayonet lugs or similar features on guns. The reality is that the expiration of the ban will probably DECREASE sales of AWs and their post-ban clones until more legislation comes up to try and ban them again. It's the same deal as plywood on the East Coast right now...Everybody's panicking, so prices go up and the supply is exhausted.

Once the ban is gone, I expect prices (and profits) to remain the same or drop slightly, since there will be no legislation-induced market distortion.

Once they start making new "AWs" with the bad features, you don't seriously think the price structure will stay the same for pre-ban guns, do you? Their prices will fall through the floor, back to pre-94 price levels. After all, who would pay $1500 for a pre-ban AR-15, when you can get an identical one manufactured last month for $800?

Now POST-ban guns may become collector's items, as a relic of failed legislation, but I doubt they'll command a premium.

[RoeBear]

9. He's still alive?

I thought he was in his 80's when he retired from the senate.