Should suppressors be taken off the NFA list?

[cms]

I think so. They make shooting very comfortable without hearing protection with most calibers of firearms. Those who have fired guns with suppressors mounted know that they aren't "Hollywood quiet" like in the movies. What is the reasoning for putting them on the NFA list in the first place?

[slackmaster]

1. They're Hollywood quiet if you use sub-sonic ammunition

I think they should be kept as regulated items, but anyone who wants one should be able to get one after a federal background check.

They were put under the NFA because of a few prominent gangsters getting shot in public places back in the '20s and early '30s.

[progressiveBadger]

2. Because they are unnecessary

for the two purposes American's are supposedly allowed to have guns for:
Protection
Hunting

Just a guess.

[cms]

3. Have you ever...

fired a firearm? ...and i'm not being a smartass or disresectful. They are very loud. Some are even with earplugs. Suppressors don't make a gun silent, they just muffle the noise. I just think its funny that we have to use a muffler on our cars and trucks to keep noise pollution down, but we can't do the same for firearms.


If not taking them off the NFA list, why not make them a AOW? That only requires a $5 tax stamp versus a $200 tax stamp. That would bring them within reach of most sportsmen, and it still requires the fed. background check.

[slackmaster]

8. There should be a "Firearm Owners' Hearing Preservation Act"

To make sound suppressors available to anyone with a clean criminal background.

[NorthernSpy]

4. I think it's polite and considerate to use a silencer

Noise pollution is a real problem, and we should all do our part to reduce the din. Using a silencer is socially responsible. I say, make them as readily available as guns.

[alwynsw]

5. Don't stop there!

IMO, firearms laws should be restored to the 1933 level.

[cms]

7. Give that man a cigar!...

but you know all of the anti's will say "Then we'll just have a bunch of Tommy gun wielding Al Capone's on our hands....don't do it...for the children!"

LOTFLMAO :crazy:

[Columbia]

10. Hear hear!

You need a new sig.

How about:
Caution: Genius at work

[alwynsw]

18. It's getting deep in here.

Thanks, guys.:toast:

[sierrajim]

22. OH YEA

Thats the one and I would like to get rid of all the stupid firearm laws in this state.

[MyMouth]

6. Yes, and especially for the guy next to me

At the gun range, who, inevitably, will be sighting in a 30.06 while I'm firing my humble .22.

[Torque67]

9. When it comes to being on the range:

There is a rule at the range I use that there will be no silencers. It's a safety rule. When there is more than one person involved, and in an area, you want a gun to sound like a gun. It let's folks know that there is activity one range over, and to stay behind the benches until a cold range is called. Also makes poaching on club grounds harder, as there is a strictly enforced no hunting rule on the club grounds. We've had to walk out and chase turkeys so we can begin a match before.

I've shot supressed firearms before, and they do make indoor ranges far more pleasant. I like the 5 dollar tax stamp idea also. The 200 dollar tax stamp is pretty prohibitive when tacked onto a 300-700 dollar purchase.

[cms]

11. My range allows...

anything. Machineguns, rifles, pistols, anything thats legal. I go with a friend who has many NFA items. Last time we were there I saw a post-sample minigun. That is one fine weapon. There are routinely C3 shooters there. Most are kind and will let you fire their rifles and smg's. Many suppressors as well. I've never fired at an indoor range but I could imagine that a suppressor would be a welcomed object.

[MyMouth]

12. $200 tax for a $300-700 purchase

Remember, that was put in place in 1934. Think about a $200 tax on a $15 gun!

[cms]

14. At the time the cost of the Thompson .45 SMG was...

actually $175, and $200 with a Cutts compensator. That was ALOT of money back in those days. Prices from 1921 of I'm not mistaken.

[MyMouth]

27. I would apologize...

For getting the prices wrong(I've seen 1910-1920's era catalog pages with pistols/rifles under $10), but I'm too busy drooling over the thought of all that full-auto goodness for $175.<G>

[cms]

29. I have the original page from the catalogue....

My Great Grandpap owned one back in the day. I found the page behind a picture of him holding it. Must have been nice...but if you factor in inflation, it was alot of money back then.

[Jack_DeLeon]

13. I think they should be unregulated...

they are in many European countries.

[Squatch]

15. I never understood why they were banned to begin with

Do they somehow make a gun more dangerous?

[Krinkov]

45. they make it harder for police/citizens to identify a crime in progress

They make it easy to 'get away with murder', and don't have any use (that I can see) in self defense or armed resistance to the state.

I don't see them as protected under the second amendment, as they aren't arms themselves.

Though personally I wouldn't mind them legal with registration/regulation (neither would my Buddhist neighbors!)

[cms]

46. They are....

legal with registration. I'll expand on your argument to say that you are right...they aren't even firearms...so what are they doing on the NFA? As stated before suppressors aren't "silencers". With the exception of .22, they don't make a shot so quiet that you can't hear it. They just make it sound like something other than a gunshot. It wouldn't make getting away with a murder any easier than killing someone with a knife. Knives don't make any noise at all...

[Krinkov]

49. well, 2 things

knives arent long range, and the sound of a supressed firearm would blend in alot better with the noise of the city than a gunclap.

And subsonic ammo does make it practically silent.

[cms]

50. True...but...

Do you seriously think a criminal is going to go to the trouble of buying a suppressor, buying a handgun capable of mounting a suppressor, and then purchasing subsonic ammo? Its allot easier to put on a clove and hold a plastic soda bottle over the muzzle. I'm sure it may come into play in rare instances, but not enough to justify banning them again. Just look at European countries with no laws prohibiting suppressors. Although there are less firearms in these countries, I still haven't heard of any crimes committed with suppressors. May be an interesting search. I'll google it and report back later. Just my .02\

CMS

[Krinkov]

51. cool

also, what countries are you referring to?

[Paladin]

16. My, My, My

Would you just look at all the self-satisfied little Gun Huggers on this thread. Take suppressors off the NFA list? A "Firearm Owners Hearing Protection Act"? Roll firearms laws all the way back to 1933? Whence all this strutting cockiness? Wherefore all this cheerful grandiosity?

Is it just a coincidence that all this optimistic bloviating is taking place on the same day that George W. Bush was inaugurated for another four years?

Looking forward to thoughtful replies from all you gun-loving "Democrats."

[cms]

17. My my...look what we have here...

someone is afraid of firearms. It wouldn't surprise me if you were misfit brother of the owner of Palidin Press...you know...the one who sells books about how to be a hitman and how to build bombs. LoL...mad at big brother?

[Paladin]

20. Let's See.....

....Which of my firearms am I afraid of? One of the cluster of pistols stored upstairs---.22's, .38's, a .357, one .45? Perhaps that Weatherby rifle I used to shoot deer with, sitting in the same closet; maybe that's terrifying, now. Or that pretty little Ruger bolt-action with the classicly designed stock I always liked; might be spooky today. Oh, and there's that beautiful old Winchester 73 I got from my grandfather years and years ago; jeez, no telling what I'd think of it now. I never got around to buying that Beretta 12 gauge I wanted a few years back, maybe I was too afraid to go through with it. And there's that reloading set I got 20 years ago for Christmas, dies included; should have done more with that, I guess, but it's sitting up in that big dark attic now.

It's a common misconception that anybody who owns guns must be a 2nd Amendment absolutist, adhering to the NRA party line. I've encountered that kind of non-thinking blather time and time again here in the Gun Dungeon. The truth is, I used to be involved in hunting and shooting sports and now my guns are stored away, because I didn't like the kind of brain-dead, right-wing, racist, Democrat-hating company I had to keep. If this forum is any example, it doesn't look like I'll be getting my guns out anytime soon.

And I'm confident that your collection of Paladin Press publications is a lot bigger than mine. But then, I'm a real Democrat......

[sierrajim]

21. Can you please stop with snide remarks

Paladin.
On another note thou what kind of reloading setup do you have and if you havent used it in years might it be for sale?

[jody]

23. Probably a powder horn and ram rod.

:bounce:

[Paladin]

24. Sorry To Be Such A Disappointment

I thought a snide retort was more than justified.

And as far as the reloading stuff, long bitter experience in the Gun Dungeon has taught me to avoid personal contact with participants. It's not personal, you're probably a first-rate guy. That's not true of everybody, though, and I've learned to be cautious. Oh, and ask Jody if he's ever seen a powder horn with the letters "RCBS" on it........

[cms]

26. Well....

I never said that you have to follow the "NRA Party line", but you are pretty stupid for not trying to protect the right that allows you to have those firearms.

BTW, I don't own any books from Palidin Press and never will. I'm a law abiding citizen and I'd bet that every book they put out involves breaking one law or another.

[Township75]

28. Have you taken you sides advice...

and turned in those guns. They are just going to kill your family members if you leave them there. Why haven't you done that? I at least hope you have registered them with the police.

THey have gun locks on them right? When was the last time you checked on them to make sure they weren't stolen?

It's all about gun safety!

[Fescue4u]

34. "real democrats"

Support the consitition.

[Paladin]

35. "Real Democrats"......

...can spell the word "constitution."

[Fescue4u]

36. WOW

You're right.

we should throw out our civil liberties because I made a typo.

You are a master debater and I bow to your incredible powers.

I'll turn in my guns tomorrow.

[Billy Ruffian]

37. spelling flames are lame

even if there's a spell checker.

[Paladin]

38. You Know, It's Not As If........

....you guys are being called on words like "antidisestablishmentarianism" or "Albuquerque." No, you make mistakes on words involving things that are important to you, things you routinely say you're willing to fight and die for. It's "constitution," not "consitition," and it's the "Second Amendment," not the "Second Ammendment." And when you're talking about the political party of which you're supposedly members, it's "Democratic," with big fucking capital "D."

Think of where you are, in a public, internationally viewed forum. Moreover, it's a Democratic forum, and there is substantial opposition to the gun policies you're trying to shove down the party's throat. And thanks to guys like Ted Nugent and the occasional mass murderer, your hobby is already burdened with a lot of negative stereotypes. Still think correct spelling is no big deal? Suits me fine. Me and the rest of the folks on the other side of this issue......

[NorthernSpy]

40. shucks...

You Know, It's Not As If you guys are being called on words like "antidisestablishmentarianism" or "Albuquerque."

For the matter of that, a counterfactual condition following "as if" should take the past tense of the subjunctive mood, not the present tense of the indicative mood:

You know, it's not as if you guys are were being called on words like "antidisestablishmentarianism" or "Albuquerque."

But it would be bitchy to point that out.

And those quotation marks after Albuquerque should precede the period. Also bitchy!

I mean, be fair. "Consitition" was just a typo. We all make errors. And we all know what he meant to write.

[Fescue4u]

41. Its an informal chat.

loosen up.


In a sense I like it when folks I arguing with start talking about spelling. It tells me they lost, feel insecure and need to change the focus to an area they feel superior.

Congratulations, you are a master speller in addition to a master debater.

[Paladin]

42. Owkey. Hev itt yur wey.....

n/t

[Fescue4u]

43. I always do.

[Billy Ruffian]

44. Spelling flames are still lame

Not everyone is a perfect typist, either.

[alwynsw]

19. It's entirely appropriate - especially today.

Who signed the '86 FOPA that truly did diminish our firearms rights? Also, you may want to peruse this thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=98032&mesg_id=98032

It's all about freedom.

[TyObe]

32. In Norway, suppressors are considered polite and neighborly.

[turnkey]

25. They are illegal in Missouri...

But full autos aren't!...Go figure. :)

[Wickerman]

30. People will just go back to putting potatoes on the muzzle's

right?

/ducks

[Billy Ruffian]

31. Only if they want mashed potatoes! :-) n/t

[MyMouth]

33. well duh....

....how ELSE am I supposed to make a potatoe gun?

:D

[aikoaiko]

39. Yep, I wish they were more easily available.

Many gunshots are 140 decibels and most sound suppressors only suppress about 40 decibels. 100 decibels is still plenty loud.

No need to worry about actual 'silenced' guns.

[benEzra]

47. Hunting rifles can exceed 170 dBA at 1 meter...

well above the threshold of instaneous hearing damage for the shooter.

[aikoaiko]

48. True enough......

...my unclear remark in #39 was to reiterate the point that silenced guns are not actually silent -- far from silent in fact. The way I understand it, most suppressed guns still require hearing protection (except for some of the tinier calibers).

Because suppressed guns are still plenty loud, I think the general public would not need to worry about them facilitating stealthy criminal acts.