Hamas leader Meshaal acknowledges Israel exists

[oberliner]

DAMASCUS (Reuters) - Hamas acknowledges the existence of Israel but formal recognition by the group will only be considered when a Palestinian state has been created, the movement's leader Khaled Meshaal said on Wednesday.

Softening a previous refusal to accept the Jewish state's existence, Meshaal said Israel was a "reality."

"There will remain a state called Israel, this is a matter of fact," Meshaal said in an interview in the Syrian capital, where he lives in exile.

"The problem is not that there is an entity called Israel," said Meshaal. "The problem is that the Palestinian state is non-existent."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070110/ts_nm/palestinians_meshaal_dc_1

[Howardx]

1. what do you think?

is this a significant change or mainly symbolic? or just a acknowledgement of reality finally?

[David__77]

2. That is a significant departure.

I don't think Hamas will accept that formulation. Their goal is to establish a non-Zionist state on the whole of the former Palestine mandate.

[Kagemusha]

5. Meshall seems to believe that he IS Hamas.

Certainly not that pathetic prime minister guy elected to the Palestinian Authority government.

This is not to say you are wrong, mind you. The jury's out on what Hamas will accept. I agree that this is a significant departure, because Hamas would not even stoop to acknowledging obvious reality before.

[oberliner]

3. I think that Hamas is adjusting it's rhetoric somewhat

in order to be perceived in a more positive way by the international community.

I think they realize that it will be impossible to lead the Palestinian government without more international support and are thus implementing a few alterations in the way they present themselves.

What are your thoughts?

[Howardx]

6. good assessment

that makes sense and really what are they giving up by saying that? a refusal to accept the reality of the situation? no big loss there. i hope this is one of the baby steps that needs to be taken towards peace.

[Violet_Crumble]

14. Here's my 2 cents worth...

I think he's repeating what has been a reality for Hamas for a long time. Israel exists and they can't pretend it doesn't. There was low level communication and cooperation between Hamas and the Israeli govt when it came to things like the electricity supply for Qualigya (sorry my spelling is shit)...

On one hand I'm thinking it's not that important whether or not Hamas officially recognises Israel. Israel doesn't recognise Hamas as being the democratically elected govt of the Palestinians and imo it's a bit unrealistic to expect that given the hostile nature of things that Hamas would do the full official recognition of Israel thing while Israel's got no intention of returning the recognition...

On the other hand, official recognition is something that's apparently very important to Israel, and if it's that important, then I think Hamas should recognise Israel officially. If there's even a chance of that move clearing the way for future talks and a mellowing of the stance of both sides, then there's no reason not to do it. It'd be a sign of good faith and though I suspect Israel would swiftly forget that the official recognition ever happened, it'd tell me that Hamas would have moved past that stage of theirs of wanting a Palestinian state in not only the West Bank and Gaza, but also Israel...

[MADem]

4. Not that my opinion counts, but this is a BIG DEAL

This is HAMAS, not Fatah. Maybe the Saudis told them to cut the shit or they'd cut the funding.

Why would the Saudis do that?

Because the Saudis told Dick Cheney to back off dialogue with Iran or they would fund the Sunni insurgency in Iraq. Cheney likely said "Well, aside from oil, ya prick, what's in it for ME?"

To which the Saudis replied: "We'll cool of the I/P mess for you, so you can focus on other hotspots without sweating that one."

One hand always washes the other....

[On the Road]

7. Despite What You May Hear,

pretty much all parties in the region -- including Hezbollah and the Arab Leaare on record as recongizing Israel provided that the Palenstinian entity aslo created in 1948 is independent and has borders somewhere in the neighborhood of the original boundaries.

[MADem]

10. Well, Hizb'Allah and Hamas are apples and oranges

Hizb'Allah is shi'a, and they just finished having a war that didn't go too well for them with Israel. And given the Shi'a - Sunni tensions in the region of late, I doubt one has much if any influence on the other. I am not familiar with Arab Leaare...unless you mean Arab League?? They have to do business with the world, so that's not surprising at all.

And as for the factions within Palestine, it's a pissing contest without end, AMEN. You aren't going to hear much Kumbaya-ing from those guys anytime soon; they aren't done jockeying for position yet: http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=41532007

That said, the money spigot, which was shut off when they took over, will start flowing if they DO recognize Israel, and perhaps they are also hoping to forestall a reoccupation of Gaza, presently under discussion.

This IS a big deal for HAMAS. A very big deal.

[Shaktimaan]

16. Not that their word is worth much.

Nasrallah pretty much sums up his views on the subject with his chilling yet snappy statements.

"if they all gather in Israel, it will save us the trouble of going after them worldwide."

"There is no solution to the conflict in this region except with the disappearance of Israel."

"I am against any reconciliation with Israel. I do not even recognize the presence of a state that is called 'Israel.'"

"If they go from Shebaa, we will not stop fighting them. ... Our goal is to liberate the 1948 borders of Palestine, ... The Jews who survive this war of liberation can go back to Germany or wherever they came from." OK, this one is from a different Hezbollah official, not Nasrallah.

"If we searched the entire world for a person more cowardly, despicable, weak and feeble in psyche, mind, ideology and religion, we would not find anyone like the Jew. Notice, I do not say the Israeli." But this one is classic Nas, all the way.

[Taxloss]

8. This is extremely good news.

If it can be codified into the movement's doctrine that Israel exists, then this is a big step towards peace.

Good!

[Totallybushed]

9. Great.

He acknowledges the reality. Does 'formal' recognition mean that he will no longer try to alter that fact? Probably not.

Next time Israel goes to the negotiating table, they should demand "peace" as a precondition for "land".

Sp long as the non-existent "right of return" is demanded by the Arabs, kust so long will the conflict continue.

[geek tragedy]

11. This is a very positive development.

Of course, PIJ will blow up a bus or the IDF will blow up a car near a bunch of schoolchildren within a week, but good news is good news.

[oberliner]

12. Here is the full Meshaal interview

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/812079.html

Excerpt:

Q: Does that mean you accept Israel exists?
A: We do not want to go into issues that complicate the struggle. We are offering a real chance that the Arabs and Palestinians believe in. There will remain a state called Israel, this is an issue of fact but the Palestinians should not be required to recognize Israel. Not all international relations are based on the basis of recognition. Who will be the one to grab this chance?

Q: Does that mean you can formally recognize Israel?
A: We as Hamas and as Palestinians do not talk about recognizing Israel or accepting it as a reality. As a Palestinian today I speak of a Palestinian and Arab demand for a state on 1967 borders. It is true that in reality there will be an entity or a state called Israel on the rest of Palestinian land. This is reality but I don't deal with it from the point of view of recognizing or admitting it. It is a fact that was the
result of historical factors.

[oberliner]

13. ANALYSIS / Meshal declaration basic shift in Hamas position

From Ha'aretz:

Khaled Meshal's declaration outlines a Hamas road map toward recognition of Israel. According to this outline, Meshal recognizes that the State of Israel is a "fact," but this "fact" still requires formal recognition. It is not clear what this entails.

In practice, Meshal is trying to create an equation in which sovereign states recognize one another; but, for this to occur, we must first wait for the establishment of the Palestinian state, so that a similar legal entity can recognize its neighboring state- Israel.

This is a fundamental shift in Hamas' position. In the past, Meshal made it clear that there was no point in accepting earlier agreements with Israel, which included recognition of Israel, so long as it did not fully implement them. By this he hinted that the issue of recognition was not ideological but political. However, Wednesday's statement is his most direct reference to this issue.

http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/812084.html

[Phx_Dem]

15. Update

Hamas denied Wednesday that its Damascus-based political chief Khaled Meshal told Reuters in an interview that his group would consider recognizing Israel once a Palestinian state is established. (Click here for the full interview)

One hour after the Reuters interview was published, the Hamas government spokesman Ghazi Hamad told Haaretz that Meshal said, "Israel exists - and that's a fact."

However, Hamad maintained that Meshal did not say anything about recognizing Israel. "There was no change in our stance that Hamas does not recognize Israel," he said.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=811997&contrassID=1&subContrassID=1