Did ESPN announcer insult Jews?

[oberliner]

That's on the AOL home page, linking to this:

Sean Salisbury Might Have Said Something He Shouldn't Have

On Monday's edition of "NFL Live" on ESPN, analyst Sean Salisbury made what I hope was just a massively unfortunate slip of the tongue when talking about Peyton Manning's 2nd half performance against the Patriots.

Here's what actually came out of Salisbury's mouth:
"I saw a calmness about him. We've always known he's a great player, but a calmness that said, 'You know what, no need to panic. We'll nip, we'll tuck, we'll go, we'll crunch, we'll Jew, we'll do it all.' And he nickeled and dimed 'em, and Peyton made the play when it mattered."

ESPN's official position is that Salisbury said "chew," but you can hear the audio here, via Pro Football Talk, and to me, that sounds more like a "J" sound than a "ch" sound.

I'm not entirely sure what it would mean to "Jew" your way down the field (of course, I don't know how you "chew" your way down the field, either), but I hope it's not some kind of NFL locker-room lingo that ties into a stereotype that might also have to do with "nickel and diming."

http://www.aolsportsblog.com/2007/01/23/sean-salisbury-might-have-said-something-he-shouldnt-have/?ncid=NWS00010000000001

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

1. I could go either way with that one

On one hand, it doesn't go along with the context of that sentence, but would once he continued on. Listening to the audio, I compared his other "j" sounds to the word in question, and it's not an exact match, but it definitely could still be it.

I wouldn't doubt it one bit from Salisbury, who's been known for his sort of "in your face, tell it like it is" style (I don't really like him very much, honestly). Still, I find it hard to say definitively either way. If I were him, I'd apologize one way or another.

[burythehatchet]

4. In football, chewing up yards is common terminology

to mean gradually working your way downfield.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

12. Believe me, I know.

Played the game for 12 years. And my icon might be a clear giveaway that I follow the sport. :hi:

[burythehatchet]

16. I like you so as a Jets fan

I won't go into my disdain for Belichek

Plus you guys have had your share of rings. :)

Seriously, I'm glad Mangini had a good year. He obviously learned well from Bill.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

20. Since Parcells and Edwards are gone, I don't mind the Jets.

Couldn't stand either of those guys. Didn't like Parcells when he was ours either and I was happy to see him go (though I give him credit - he invigorated the franchise). Certainly, I mind losing to you guys a lot less than the f'ing Dolphins!

I know we've had our share of rings, but I was really hoping to add one more this year. That's the price we pay for not having receivers that can catch a fucking football. x(

[burythehatchet]

23. The fish are gonna be losing for a few years

and yeah, beating them is very most satisfying.

[JackRiddler]

27. Dear Fellow Mets Fan

Please never again refer to dolphins as fish. Thank you.

[burythehatchet]

28. OK so they're mammals

but we do like to filet and poach them. :)

Delgado is going to miss opening day:(

[JackRiddler]

57. don't scare me

I thought this meant he was injured!

Birth of child is an acceptable excuse - even for a guy making whatever gazillions.

As for poach & bake, I really do hope this refers to the football team, not even a joke against the cetacean, which far as I'm concerned should be cared for above human life by our own value system (brain size = worth).

[burythehatchet]

62. Actual Dolphins

are my most favorite animals in the world. Yes of course I was referring to the football team.

[trumad]

47. Really--- we've split with you guys the last couple of years

and we've sucked.

[Ken Burch]

100. Your icon is the Red Sox logo.

That indicates that you follow A sport, but it doesn't clarify that you follow THIS sport.
However, I'll take your word for it.

[damntexdem]

22. And is likely what he said.

Now, I await some bears' chewing on some colts.

[oberliner]

51. have you played the audio?

Does it sound like he is saying chew in your opinion?

Are you familiar with the word "Jew" being used as a verb related to stinginess? (i.e. to "Jew" someone down)

If he later admits that he did say "Jew", do you think he should be fired?

[burythehatchet]

63. Holy shit. Up the meds, please.

[oberliner]

78. Meds?

I don't follow.

I was just curious if you thought you heard chew rather than Jew when you played it or if you just hadn't played it.

Or is it just a non-issue either way?

[EdwardM]

2. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

It would make far more sense for him to say chew and not jew there, considering he just said crunch.

[yellowcanine]

3. Yep, he said "Jew". To say it was "chew" sounds like a "Dick Armey explanation."

You know, when Dick Armey blamed his saying Barney "Faggot" (Frank) on his tongue getting stuck on the roof of his mouth.

I would guess from the context that "Jew" here meant "nickel and dime". Yes, it is an insult.

[AlCzervik]

5. "We'll Jew" makes no sense at all to me, i think it was either an annunciation

problem or maybe the mike wasn't working well. As a jew i think i've heard them all--except for that one.

[Renew Deal]

17. Stingy Defense

Give them as little as possible.

[Bucky]

65. To avoid misunderstanding, he should have just said "We'll be niggardly with the yards we give up."

That would've clarified that he meant no offense, right? Beside "Jew them" makes no sense. Wouldn't "jew" them mean refusing to tackle unless it was absolutely necessary? I'm really not up on my slurs, unfortunately. I guess I don't see the context the same way I'd see "chew" here.

[Renew Deal]

67. It's an incredibly stupid thig to say.

It's not even conversational. :dunce:

[Recursion]

92. No, I think he was "clarifying" (after a fashion) when he said "nickel and dime"

and I know some people who would normally use "to jew" as a verb but will say "to nickel and dime" when they need to be polite.

The point in either case is that the team will make them pay for every bit of yardage they take; the slur comes from the (medieval) stereotype that Jewish bankers or merchants would stubbornly haggle for every last penny in a transaction.

[JackRiddler]

25. If it was an annunciation

Well then he's holier than any of us, anyway.

[deadparrot]

55. Yeah, it doesn't make any sense to me.

I've never heard "Jew" used as a noun, and even then, it doesn't sound insulting, it just sounds strange and awkward. :shrug:

[EllenZ]

6. There is a lot of worthwhile news out there

that is not being given any airtime, the media manages to fill its time slot with PC statements. So he made a comment about jewing someone down, it was a common figure of speech when I grew up in NYC, which was/is full of Jews, including my father. And who cares that a sitcom actor does not like gays and made a comment about them? That just breaks my (gay) heart that some actor does not like my lifestyle.

How about some real news for a change.

[Lurking Dem]

19. The N word was a common figure of speech

when I grew up in the South which is/was full of African Americans.


There's all kinds of news out there in the big world. Bigotry on the airwaves is news.

[NYCGirl]

7. Following "crunch", I'd bet on "chew." NT

[Recursion]

93. Followed by "nickel and dime", I'd bet on "Jew." NT

[aquart]

8. "Jew them down" means to bargain, negotiate for a lower price.

And it's a common expression in some heavily Christian areas.

[Buzz Clik]

10. And it makes no sense in this context.

[aquart]

61. It goes with "and he nickeled and dimed them."

[Buzz Clik]

9. Much ado about zilch.

Why would he say "Jew"? It doesn't make sense.

Somebody needs something better to do than try to make a stink about mindless blather on endless sports analysis.

[cubs4life]

11. LOL, thanks for the link.

I think he said "Jew" but I'm a lot like Woody Allen's character in "Annie Hall." "Jew you?"

Seriously, I think he said it. My mother always told me that there is a phrase, "Jew them down." It is supposed to represent bartering, you know, trying to get a cheaper price. Falls into all the stereotypes about Jews being cheap and their relation to money. In today's PC world people use the term "Chew them down."

As a Jew, "Chew them down" makes me just as queasy.

[TZ]

13. To Jew is synonomous to...

nickel and diming. So yes, I am sure that he was trying to use the term "jew" but he is probably not even intelligent enoough to realize its 1)a slur and 2) he used it wrong even. I have met many people (even a fellow Jew) who do not realize that its insulting. This word/term has been around for a long time and in some quarters the origins are forgotten...which is very sad..
So I would say sadly this is just mere ignorance...

[A-Schwarzenegger]

14. Somebody's gotta be kidding.

[Renew Deal]

15. It means stingy defense.

This is the second time I've heard something like this in the last month. That's just dumb.

[Marnieworld]

18. You can Nickel and dime in football

Quick scan of the responses so far and it seems as if no one has pointed this out.

To nickel and dime in this context would be to acquire yardage in short spurts, 5 (nickel) yards here and there to attain the 10 (dime) yds required for . Makes sens describing Manning's last drive where he calmly led them down the field throwing short passes to the outside to stop the clock and move the chains.

He more than likely said chew because the word Jew, in this context is nonsensical. I have been a football fan for over 20 years and I can tell you that this is being blown way out of proportion. Considering how wrong it would be to use slurs people should be careful when they accuse.

[dad]

21. He absolutely said jew

Although it doesn't make sense, that is what he said. So the question would be, what did he mean to say? Salisbury is pretty much a dumbass anyhow, so I'll give him the GWB defense, meaning his mouth can't spit out the words his brain is trying to process.

[bmbmd]

70. I think he said

"We'll eschew..." then lost his train of thought.

[Hobarticus]

24. In context, it doesn't even make sense...

Seems much ado about nothing.

[CBGLuthier]

26. Ho could have just had a true slip of the tongue

Not a freudian slip but just tripped over his own tongue.

He absolutely did not say chew. But that still does not mean he meant to say jew.

I think I would just let this one pass and then see if he says anything else unfortunate before condemning him as an anti-semite.

Besides, the whole thing reminds me of a conversation from Annie Hall where Alvie said the guy was anti-semitic because he said, "Did you eat? No, Jew" where the guy probably actually said said "No, D'you"

[ProfessorGAC]

29. Well, I Heard Chew

I know most here heard the "J". I heard the "ch". And, "chew" makes more football sense.
The Professor

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

30. It Is A Fact He Said Jew. Anyone Who Says Chew Is Wrong. This Is A Firm Declaration.

It is not open for discussion, debate or question.

OMC will not say something with that firmness if it isn't true, so you can bank on it. No matter how passionately someone tries to argue that it was chew, they are plainly wrong and a victim of their auditory perception. They might mean well and truly believe what they're hearing, but it has still deceived them.

He said Jew. I was hoping he didn't. He did. No debate, no mystery, no wondering if someone else thinks this or that, no giving benefit of the doubt, no 'well you can't tell for sure', no question.

He said Jew. Period. OMC says so.

[ContraBass Black]

80. "OMC says so."

Is this the standard of absolute truth?




He does indeed say "Jew," but as he seems to be describing Payton Manning making tight, rapid, controlled movements, the word that fits contextually is "Juke."

[TornadoTN]

31. Salisbury is a tasteless jerk - also a giant pervert to boot

So it's not surprising that he would say this sort of thing. However, ESPN will never do anything to him for some reason.

Last year, he was suspended for a week because he had been sending pictures of his penis from his cell phone to female co-workers.

[maveric]

33. Salisbury is a bushbot and fundie type from N San Diego county.

I can recall him praising bu$h on several occaisions. He also was one of those athletes that came out against stem Cell Research.
And a shitty QB to boot.

[TZ]

34. that explains it

He is definitely stupid and ignorant enough to use the verb "jew":dunce:

[Strawman]

35. Exactly what I was thinking

totally fits Salisbury's idiotic personality.

How does in the hell does he even still have a job with ESPN after the cell phone thing? What else does he have pictures of on there?

[TornadoTN]

37. Yet, Harold Reynolds gets fired because of a "hug"

Reynolds, if you recall, was a African-American commentator for baseball coverage and was a regular on Baseball Tonight. He was fired because he hugged a female employee, which was deemed inappropriate.

Yet Sean can send pics of "Little Sean" and get a one week vacation.

Makes you wonder about the powers that be at ESPN. I rarely watch them anymore unless they have an exclusive game on. Just can't tolerate sports coverage pitched to the lowest common denominator.

[Strawman]

38. Not to mention Chris "You're with me Leather" Berman

[bmbmd]

68. Here's the link:

http://deadspin.com/sports/sean-salisbury/if-sean-salisbury-asks-you-to-look-at-his-phone-dont-do-it-226599.php

[NewJeffCT]

40. Hmm, is Salisbury is a fundie

I'm surprised he wasn't caught sending pics of his penis to male co-workers...

[TornadoTN]

44. My thoughts exactly!! n/t

[Greyhound]

Are you certain it wasn't juke?

as in a feint or fake during a run.

[Marnieworld]

52. yet another term that would make sense in context

juke is a football word. Jew is not.

I wonder how many people that think he said jew know anything about football?

[TZ]

53. Want to test me?

I could give you the detailed history of the Redskins for the last 25 yrs. I know all the teams in the playoffs and can recite past Super Bowl winners for waaay back. I am a woman but probably know more about football than many men. And it was jew.

[Marnieworld]

54. ok I believe you

Then how do you reconcile that even in the most ant-semitic minds the word in this context makes no sense whatsoever? I understand (and believe me I object when I hear it) the slur use of the word. "Jew" someone down from a price etc. But in this context the slur use makes no sense. There is no financial transaction. It's football- you know where they have a nickel defense etc.

chew, grind, work, these are words to describe a tough effort. Jew grind work? doesn't make sense even if you are on the Nazi sports center.

I'd be the first to hate this person if he said it. I personally long for the day when Mel Gibson arrest video can be leaked so we can all see the hateful disgusting creature for who he is. But jew makes no sense in this context and sounds so close to a word that does I just can't convict.

[TZ]

73. I actually don't think he realizes its perjoratvie..

and although its awkward it fits better than chew. Really most people who use this term use it unthinkingly

[pettypace]

56. Redskin is a pretty offensive pejorative...

How does the NFL get away with using that as a name?

[TZ]

72. MONEY

I try to refer to them as just Washington or Skins. It wouldn't be hard to make them something like the "pigskins". But they are the one thing Dems and Republicans both love here so I don't see the name changing anytime soon.

[Lurking Dem]

74. Back when I cared at all about football

I called them the "Foreskins". But that was when Landry coached the Cowboys.

[TZ]

75. sadly

I used to use sports to get my mind off the depressing politics. Doesn't seem to help as much anymore. But I still enjoy it to some extent..

[Lurking Dem]

77. If it isn't baseball, I'm not watching.

And if the Yankees aren't playing, it's not baseball! Other than that, I LOVE sports! LOL!

I think I stopped watching when I caught myself referring to the players as "kids".

[Greyhound]

81. I wouldn't be surprised at the idiocy of anybody that makes their living in the

field of gladiatory spectacle, but the word jew just doesn't fit nor make any sense, even if he was trying to insult Jews.

[Igel]

82. It wasn't 'juke'.

Even if it was a speech error, replacing 'ch' with 'j', the word had either a voiced consonant at its end (d, z, g ...) or nothing. The vowel's simply too long to end in a 'k'.

[TZ]

32. its jew- I have heard it in similar context

He was trying to communicate that they were just gaining small yardage. I do think stingy was what he was trying to go for in some way. He didn't use it correctly exactly, but to jew is to be stingy, cheap or dole out in small increments. As I said, many people do not realize its a slur. Coming from an ex-jock, no it is not surprising

[ms liberty]

36. How many here have had to spell things on the telephone to people?

As someone who has professionally had to transcribe information from people on the phone (for many years), I can tell you that some sounds are virtually identical when heard, and have to be spelled. This would be why the police dispatchers use things like 'charley-bravo' instead of CB. The letter B can sound like D, or V or other letters depending upon the speakers enunciation. In that same way, the sound 'ch' used in a word like chew, can sound like a 'j', especially if it's used in a word in the middle of a sentence. Additionally, if the speaker is not talking slowly, easily mixed up letter sounds begin to run together. This could well be the case in this instance. Why would a commentator use the term "to jew" (as in to nickel and dime) and then use the phrase "nickel and dime" just a couple of words later? If, as other posts have noted, "to chew" is a known football term, then the likely answer is that that is what he said. You can listen to the tape a dozen times, and the people who want to hear 'jew' will hear it, and the people who want to hear 'chew' will hear it. People who listen objectively will hear one of the two. But what you hear might be WRONG. He didn't stop and spell the word, so it will always be speculation on anyone's part, unless or until the commentator comments.


I'm editing to add that I didn't listen to the audio, and don't intend to. I don't much care one way or the other. I don't even know who the guy is you're all talking about or anything about him, so he could be a real jerk. I'm just commenting with the perspective of someone who understands that words are easily misheard. During a conversation, people have the opportunity to correct, repeat, or spell the word. In situations like this there is not that opportunity.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

39. Nope, It Was Jew. Deliberately. I Understand What You're Tryin To Say, But It Was Still Jew.

It was clear and it was deliberate. It is fact that's what he said, not an issue of perception. I know you mean well, but I must state the reality here. It was Jew, no if ands or buts about it.

Have you listened for yourself, by the way?

[Ravenseye]

42. Really? You know it was deliberate?

Look, I agree with you when you say that he said Jew. I understand what the other poster says, because I had a simliar thing happen to me before. I was speaking on the phone and metioned that we had to 'pay the dues'. My accent contains some english affectations thanks to my mother so dues sounds an awfull lot like jews. I had to then explain what I meant and we got sidetracked with me explaining that I said dues (pronouncing it differently so they would understand better) and not jews.

The thing is chew and jew can be the same.

Or he had a speech slip. That happens to me alot as well. I say things incorrectly, not out of any predjudice or reason, but just because I'm so dumb i can't talk right sometimes. What if that happened.

It seems unfortunate, and I did hear 'jew' from the audio, but to say it's deliberate takes it to another level with no evidence, and honestly in context, right after 'crunch'...'chew' makes alot more sense.

[ms liberty]

43. No, I haven't heard it...

And I don't intend to listen to it. I don't actually care enough to listen. I read the post out of curiosity, and felt that my experience and insight might add to the conversation of those who seem to think this is important. How do you know that it was what he said, and was deliberate? Were you in the booth? Did you see his mouth as he spoke? Did he spell it for you? That's really the only way you could know for sure. For all I know the guy could be a raving bigot, and might have said it and meant it - I have no idea, I don't even know who the guy is!

To me, this ranks as one of those DU issues that starts a major flamewar on an issue that is NOT that important. I often ignore those, because I don't like it when people get mean and rude. Here at DU, we have this tendency to jump on some things and parse them to the nth degree - and some of them aren't really important enough to get worked up about. Sometimes it's great...without DU I think some of the crimes of the Decider and his minions of evil would have fallen into a black hole. But at other times it's just too much carping. Like the threads about removing the word 'bitch' from the English lexicon. Silly. Meaningless excuses for nastiness and argument.

[TZ]

41. Some things are ingrained

Okay look-
I don't go around shrieking that person's a bigot all the time. But there are certain attitudes and sterotypes that are ingrained in the culture. I am jewish. I have heard the verb "to jew" used quite frequently in my life. No its not the worst thing you can say. And some of the people who have said it are friends that I have made sure I have corrected. A lot of people do not think about word origins. This particular word and attitude has been around for a long time (see Shakespeare's Merchant of Venice as a huge example of ingrained anti-semitism). I also know football. Even though gramatically speaking it wasn't correct, jew fits and chew doesn't. I am also not saying the guy should be fired for this particular incident. But he should be informed about the roots of the word. And it would be nice if he gave a public apology about this being ignorance on his part (which I believe it was). Its not like he's praising hitler here (which was done in a class in high school in front of my sister here in "enlightened" Montgomery County, MD) but its still prejudice, even if it is totally unconcious. Sorry- I will get off my soap box now.:rant:

[ms liberty]

45. Believe me, I understand that...

I'm a woman - an opinionated, independent woman. I'm southern. And I'm forty-something. I've just about heard it all; in fact I may HAVE heard it all! (LOL) And the guy might have said it - I have no idea. I was simply offering my experience, knowledge, and insight to the conversation, in the spirit of information and objectivity. If he did say it, then he should be in trouble somehow, but if he didn't say it then it's a non-story that's getting blown out of proportion.

[TZ]

49. maybe I'm sensitive but

I believe what I believe having dealt with it from time to time. I'm not going to criticize you for your opinion either. I understand where you are coming from. I actually think this is a productive topic because it does show that there is a certain underlying prejudice here and I think bringing that to light and discussing at as rational adult people is very helpful and enlightening. I would hope that people can come away from this discussion having learned something. Thats all I really wanted to accomplish here. In the end it probably doesn't matter what he did or did not say, obviously its not going to keep people from dying in Iraq and sometimes perception can distort things but I think the discussion is helpful.:)

[in_cog_ni_to]

46. It's as plain as the nose on my face. He said Jew. It's as clear as a bell...no doubt about it.

I have no clue what that means, but he said Jew.

[Nimrod2005]

48. Why? who said Jews don't chew?

[Raydawg1234]

50. It's not like he said that Jews are responsible for all our wars or anything

[JackRiddler]

58. I won a game of Scrabble(tm) using "jew"

Of course, you can't use proper names, so I had to point out it was a verb, and in the dictionary as such. Got me, like, 90 points. Should I be fired?

[TZ]

76. No of course not..

But I think the fact that it is in the dictionary makes my point about it be ingrained or unconcious

[JacksonWest]

59. Wouldn't "Juke" make sense? That's a football term.

Jew doesn't make sense.

[Behind the Aegis]

64. Perhaps...or perhaps...

...as another poster said...

Bleachers7 (1000+ posts) Wed Jan-24-07 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
15. It means stingy defense.
This is the second time I've heard something like this in the last month. That's just dumb.

If this is the case, then it is a slur and should be condemned.

[JacksonWest]

66. Yeah, I guess. I don't like the jump at all.

I don't think Jew should mean stingy, but I don't really have a say. I've never heard an anti-semetic slur in the context of NFL defense...but there's a first for everything.

[Poiuyt]

71. Except that he was referring to Peyton Manning, who is an offensive player

I didn't hear it so I can't really comment, but "chew" would fit the context of what he was saying.

[newyorican]

87. My BS meter just blew up...

Imagine that, talk of condemning a slur, from someone who is a moderator in a forum on a rather hateful, sad little website that espouses Puerto Ricans steal hubcaps...because they are, well, Puerto Ricans.

You have no credibility when it comes to slurs, unless you are making or propogating them.

You owe me a new meter.

[Name removed]

88. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Violet_Crumble]

89. Gee, get with the program, Newyorican...

Don't you know it's okay to make disparaging comments about Puerto Ricans and if anyone thinks they're slurs, well, they're whining sissies!! You've got to understand that slurs against Puerto Ricans are merely the result of them thinking it's funny...or being yr fault coz they're sooo angry at you ;)

[newyorican]

90. But hubcaps?

Do cars even come with hubcaps anymore?

[Name removed]

94. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[newyorican]

95. So sad..

...if I posted "nothing but lies" then why did someone on your hate-site feel compelled to make a horribly, failed attempt at an apology?

I can't link to it because of rules against linking to hate sites from DU, just like rules against calling members liars...but rules must be for "other people" in your angst-addled perception.

Yes, you owe me a meter, but I never expected someone like you to pay up.

On Edit: Thanks to Colorado Blue for trying though. The slurs don't mean anything to me, I have heard much worse, they only damage those issuing them and those that oversee the forum from which they are issued.

[Scurrilous]

96. The apology isn't going over too well w/ some.

From the other site admin:

"Not so fast with the apology. My hub caps are now missing. That's what I get for going to NYC for the weekend."

[newyorican]

97. I guess...

any slur is ok, except for an anti-semitic slur. Then some line has been crossed (a line that exists only in a twisted psyche).

Takes a lot more than that to faze me, and that's from people that actually know me personally. From anonymous racists...meh, only making themselves look stupid.

[MrSlayer]

60. A simple mispronunciation.

People mispronouce things all the time, especially in a live broadcast. If I had a dime for every time a hockey announcer accidentially said fuck instead of puck I'd be rich. Gimmie a break on this, no one in their right mind is going to purposefully insult Jews on live TV. Beside the fact that it makes no sense at all in context. More manufactured outrage over nothing.

[KoKo]

69. There's so much worry that anti-semitism is rising everywhere

I wouldn't be surprised to see Think Tanks and Jewish Support groups going into High Alert to monitor it all.

[taught_me_patience]

79. The audio could go either way

but Jew makes no sense. He probably meant to say either of two things:

"chew up yardage"
"chew up the clock"


both of which are part of the football vernacular.


taught.

[Igel]

83. I heard 'j', not 'ch'.

Could be a speech error. Doesn't need to be.

To cause a person to incrementally give up his (bargaining) position is commensurate with 'jew'. "Nickle and dime 'em" isn't standard football lingo, but it makes sense ... and is simply repeating the semantic content of 'jew'.

Did he insult Jews? Dunno, but probably not. I think it depends on intent and I just don't see a reason to believe he intended to give offense Jews in that utterance.

Would Jews take offense? Probably.

"Insult", after all, is ambiguous: "Tom insulted Jim" can mean "Tom acted such that Jim took offense" or "Tom acted in order for Jim to take offense." If Tom didn't intend offense, "Tom insulted Jim" says something about Jim's state, and nothing about Tom ("Jim felt insulted"). If Tom did intend the insult, it says something about Tom's actions or words, and Jim's perception are usually, but not necessarily, at issue ("Tom insulted Jim, but Jim was simply too stupid to realize it"). But one can *also* easily be insulted with no intent on the part of the 'insulter': "Tom accidentally insulted Jim" sounds fine, "Jim was accidentally insulted by Tom" sounds stranger, "Jim felt accidentally insulted" sounds damned strange.

The problem is that most people assume "Tom insulted Jim" can only mean "Tom acted in order for Jim to take offense", even though they know better. They simply privilege the hearer (themselves) over the speaker (some other schmoe), unless, of course, they're speaking. (It's a common enough human trait, literary critics and scholars do the same--although they're almost completely parasitic on authors' output, they frequently believe themselves far more important than any author; this has always struck me rather like remora's believing that the shark exists only for its sustenance.)

[Lurking Dem]

84. For the record

I find that only being able to discuss (potential) anti-Jewish bigotry in the Israel/Palestine forum to be a conflation of "Jews" and "Israel" which I personally find unacceptable.

[oberliner]

85. I did not post this in the I/P forum

It has nothing to do with Israel at all.

I am not sure how/why it ended up here.

[Lurking Dem]

86. I know you didn't.

I wish someone would explain how it ended up here is all. I don't think a reasonable explanation can be given, frankly.

[Journeyman]

99. Well, I could certainly have many questions about what happened here. . .

and believe resolution of such concerns is possibly very important, but I've learned my lesson.

Good luck with your quest if you decide to seek answers.

Me? . . . I'm going to keep to myself, since that's whats valued round here.

Best in all you do.

~ Washington Irving

[Recursion]

91. Given that the next thing is "nickel and dime", probably n/t

[calzone]

98. Woody Allen already did this joke. n/t