Turkish PM Erdogan: Bar Israel from UN over Gaza offensive

[DogPoundPup]

Turkey's prime minister on Friday said Israel should be barred from the United Nations while it ignores the body's calls to stop fighting in Gaza.

"How is such a country, which does not implement resolutions of the UN
Security Council, allowed to enter through the gates of the UN (headquarters)?" Recep Tayyip Erdogan said.

more: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1056158.html

[GoesTo11]

1. Who else should be barred from the UN?

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/war/kurdistan-turkey-insurrection.htm

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[GoesTo11]

5. Seems like a bad place to be.

Hamas wanted to both get Israel to attack and to have as much civilian damage as possible (hence their intertwining militant activity with just about every public facility and civilian neighborhood) in order to get the pictures to make Israel look as bad as possible. In this regard, their judgment was correct.

[DogPoundPup]

7. Israel broke the truce...let's never forget

[cali]

10. Take a walk trhough Darfur

Take a walk through any number of places on earth that are just as bad or worse than Gaza.

It's dumb to talk about kicking a country out of the U.N.

[DogPoundPup]

12. KICK 'EM OUT! Can't abide by the agreements...do it

The U.N. agreements sure came in mighty handy to punish SADDAM when they needed an excuse to invade Iraq, didn't they? It would would be progress if the same rules would hold for Israel as were held for Iraq.

Oh, and how's that CNN reporter doing today that you saw yesterday IN GAZA...did he show you any scenes like this?

[cali]

17. how ridiculous. So The U.S. and GB and dozens of other countries

should be kicked out of the U.N.? Please think, before sputtering outrage. And the UN did not sanction the invasion of Iraq.

[Howardx]

2. since we are talking about israel here

it doesnt matter who else. the "hey look over here" strategy is really a non starter.

[GoesTo11]

3. Goes to credibility of the source

Turkey obviously values Hamas lives much more than those of Kurdish civilians.

[AnOhioan]

36. Um...Turkey is an Israeli ally....just goes to show that...

Israel lost in the court of world opinion.

[oberliner]

6. Let's only arrest blue eyed people who commit murder

If you have brown eyes and you kill someone, you will not be arrested - only those with blue eyes.

Pointing out the unfairness in such an arrangement is not a "hey look over here" strategy.

It is making people aware of the fact that blue eyed people are being punished for doing something wrong while brown eyed people who commit the same transgression are not.

That would not be fair.

Same goes to punishing Israel for something that other countries are also guilty of, but not being punished for.

[GoesTo11]

8. If every country that deserves to be was ejected from the UN, there would be no UN

For example, the entire UN security council.

[Howardx]

13. i call them like i see them

you arent someone i expect to agree with me.

[oberliner]

14. That is fair

I do agree with you that sometimes people try to deflect attention away from Israel by pointing out the actions of other countries when Israel comes under international condemnation.

In this case, however, I think it's fair to say that there are other countries that ought to be expelled from the UN before Israel (or at least in addition to Israel) if Israel were to be expelled for its actions in Gaza.

Would you agree with that?

[Howardx]

21. certainly

that doesnt however mean that we should discuss them first before we discuss israel, i sometimes wonder what people think is going to be discussed in the "israel/palestine" subforum if not israel.

[oberliner]

22. My question is - what actions justify removal from the UN?

Has Israel reached that threshold and is Israel the only country to have reached that threshold?

[Howardx]

23. has there been a historical threshhold?

has any country been kicked out? if so why? i just want to point out that i never advocated kicking israel out of the un, i just advocated NOT trying to change the topic. considering israel's cavalier disregard for the UN im not sure why they would care if they were kicked out or not.

[oberliner]

24. I believe the ROC (Taiwan) is the only country to have been kicked out of the UN

I believe they passed a resolution saying that the PRC was the sole legitimate representative of China to the UN and expelled the ROC in 1971.

There may have been other such incidents - so if you have additional info I'd appreciate it.

[Howardx]

25. i would have to say

a historical unwillingness to abide by UN resolutions should be a criteria, targeting UN installations ranks pretty high up there i would say, please dont bother trying to convince me its always an accident when israel does this, first lebanon and now multiple times in gaza, no accident.

[oberliner]

26. Why do you think that Israel deliberately targets UN installations?

What is the motivation behind those actions?

[Howardx]

27. in the case of gaza

they do not want the UN there helping the palestinians, i believe the goal is to make gaza unlivable so the palestinians leave "on their own". i also believe the israelis do not want the international community witnessing their actions in gaza, the ban on journalists tends to reinforce this for me.

[oberliner]

29. Do you think Israel wants to/plans to re-occupy Gaza?

Do you think the eventual goal is for Israel to incorporate Gaza into Israel and deport all the Palestinian inhabitants elsewhere?

[Howardx]

30. there is an element that wants that

the upcoming election will tell me more.

[oberliner]

31. Here is the most recent polling data

http://www.angus-reid.com/polls/view/likud_kadima_fight_for_first_place_in_israel/

[Howardx]

32. thanks

i'll take a look.

[backwoodsbob]

9. I hope Israel refuses to allow the UN to enter their country

will see how that goes over.

[Marrah_G]

11. They've been ignoring UN resolutions since day 1

Why would now be any different.

[Behind the Aegis]

15. You really don't know what you are talking about.

Also, Israel is far from the only violator, should all others be tossed out as well?

[Marrah_G]

19. I'm suggesting that the UN is useless since no one listens to them anyway

And I do know what I am talking about. They have been ignoring the UN resolutions from day 1. If your only response is "so have others" then we agree- UN resolutions are useless when they are never enforced.

Frankly, there are many times I would like to tell YOU that you don't know what YOU are talking about. But I have refrained from doing so because I would like to think we have a friendship of sorts and to say something l;ike that would be rude and insulting towards you.

We have very different views on this and in the name of peace between us I am going to avoid any further discussion on this with you.

Peace my friend.

[Behind the Aegis]

20. I'd agree with that is some respects.

The UN is a weapon.

If I don't know what I am talking about, then tell me, because I will usually respond.

However, I can respect your candor and position, so, on this topic, I will also refrain from addressing you.

Shalom, chevra.

[hack89]

16. Sudan? North Korea? Myanmar? Zimbabwe?

aren't there other nations in line for expulsion before Israel?

[Vegasaurus]

37. Those paragons of virtue?

The line of miserable dictatorships, that oppress, kidnap and murder their people is long.

And then there is the list of miserable autocracies and theocracies that offer no/few civil and human rights, no freedom of religion, press, speech (the entire Arab world, in fact), and abysmal records with women's rights.

But true genocides, ethnic cleansings, etc are really not important in the court of public opinion, where anti-semitism ranks highest.

[Behind the Aegis]

18. Says the PM from a nation in violation of UN resolutions and occupying power.

[LeftishBrit]

28. Yes, bar all countries that engage in illegal occupations.. Or does Erdogan really want to go there?

[ProgressiveMuslim]

33. LB... you dont support violent resistance, or BDS, or other nonviolent moves that isolate Israel for

its behavior.

What DO you support to stop the behavior?

[LeftishBrit]

34. I support clear and consistent international laws applied to all.

Perhaps that's pie in the sky. But it's what I support.

ETA: As regards Israel, I support nonviolent resistance by Palestinians. I support American use of financial 'carrots and sticks' in support of peace rather than war. I support petitions and protests against bad actions by Israel (as by any country).

Most of all, I support peace movements.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

35. Do you thin Israel should be taken to the international count of justice over its

actions these past 23 days?