Israel To Begin Unilateral Cease-Fire At 2 A.M.

[The Magistrate]

Presumably local time, which would be several hours off. Still, it may pass for good news till something better turns up....

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1056178.html

[LeftishBrit]

1. At least, better than the news we've been having for a while.

[babylonsister]

2. If they mean it. Remember the boy who cried wolf? nt

[The Magistrate]

3. They Pretty Much Have To Keep It Straight For A While, Ma'am....

[Chulanowa]

4. A... unilateral cease-fire?

So, what, they stop shooting, Hamas doesn't get the memo, keeps shooting, nd suddenly Israel can say the other side broke the cease-fire?

[The Magistrate]

5. Should The Hamas Leadership, Sir, have The Sense God Gave Geese, They Will Stand Down As Well

It is not as if their fire has done any damage to the enemy, after all, and they gain no political advantage from continuing if the Israelis halt.

Odds are pretty good Egypt will be able to bring them into 'unstated acceptance'....

[Chulanowa]

8. I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice

But I think Hamas is going to keep shooting (for all the good it does them, true) so long as Israeli forces are in Gaza. Are they pulling out?

I just can't wrap my head around a unilateral cease-fire, since they tend to involve, y'know, two parties. Hopefully this last mad dash gets it out of the Israeli warmonger's system for the next eight years.

[The Magistrate]

10. It Depends On How Suicidal the Leadership of Hamas Is, Sir

Once the bombs and shells stop coming, it is unlikely anything which starts them up again will be very popular with the people of Hamas. For all the 'strugglicious' blather in propagandists' pieces, it is about as certain as anything can be that the overwhelming majority of people in Gaza simply want this to stop, yesterday if at all possible, and have for some time.

[Vegasaurus]

17. But since Hamas has not show that it has two brain cells among its 20,000 mythical fighters

they probably will continue their insane rocket shooting, and prolong the misery for their people.

[The Magistrate]

23. Do Not Misunderestimate Your Enemy, Ma'am

Hamas has till present gotten a good deal of political milage out of this, and it is an open question whether what damage Israel has done to them will be sufficient to outweigh that.

[Vegasaurus]

67. Hamas's political mileage comes at the price of enormous misery for their people

Their will may be strong, but their common sense and sanity are non-existent.

[The Magistrate]

70. That Is Frequently A Source Of Political Milage, Ma'am

People use the tools they perceive to be available to them to attempt to secure their ends, and their perceptions of what is available and suited to the task can be conditioned by factors such as temperament, cultural mythos, and even sheer habit, in such a way that, by the lights of an observer who does not share a particular suite of influences, it seems they are leaving some very useful implements laying on the ground, and picking up instead things to wield that are not very apt. But that is not nearly the same thing as foolishness, or mental derangement, and is far as can be from a moral judgement.

It is never wise, Ma'am, to ascribe insanity or simple innate evil to an opponent. Doing so is usually little more than an attempt to avoid facing that there are real reasons for their hostility, and to excuse oneself from the duty of trying to see matters from the opponent's point of view, an exercise essential to success in either war or peace.

[Hippo_Tron]

71. Agreed, just look at Mao Zedong

He believed that China's people were its greatest resource. He told the Americans that if we dropped a nuclear bomb on China and killed thousands of people that he wouldn't care. We often took that to mean that he was irrational. In reality what it meant was that treating people as an expendable resource was a part of his strategy. IMO Hamas likely acts in the same way. The people of Gaza are an expendable resource in their view. The only downside of this strike on Gaza for them is that it may set back their military capabilities for a few months.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

63. What is the source of your info on the will of the people in Gaza?

My sense is, from the people that we know in Gaza, that the Gazans want the CONFLICT to be over once and for all. I don't think the goal is to pick up life, only to be down the same path again in 3 weeks.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

32. No matter how it goes, Israel ends up ahead

[The Magistrate]

35. Time Will Tell, Sir

These things are more political then military....

[tekisui]

6. In an hour and 20 minties, hopefully everyone can have the sense and

decency to take a breath and realize that bombs and bullets don't solve the problems. Nobody wins when innocent people are killed. Hopefully everyone can hold their fire and take (even just) one small step to peace, we can get this thing headed in a better direction.

[The Magistrate]

7. A Hope We Share, Sir

[Captain Needa]

9. Israel wants the situation so fucked up

by the time Obama signs in the office that he won't be able to host another peace conference like Clinton did. Their puppet is history and they know they won't receive another blank check. Yitzchak Rabin was murdered by the very same people whose political career depends on the state of war between Israel and the arabs, that's why now they say that they have fulfilled all their objectives: They haven't crippled Hamas rule in Gaza, neither they have destroyed all those Iranian weapons caches. The soldier held hostage by Hamas was so irrelevant that they even didn't mention him, but they have made sure that Gazans support Hamas for the next 10 years over the PLO. I suspect that promoting a bunch of islamic radicals (Hamas) instead of a classical political organization like the PLO, which could be more easily understood by the Western countries, would make easier for them presenting this carnage as another stage in the War on Terror and we, as the sheep we are supposed to be, would cheer them up all the way through the debris. Wrong. As far as I'm concerned, Israeli leaders have wasted all the credit they had. Some people here can call me whatever they like, but I don't care who is on either side, I despise and condemn actions and in this show Israel is the criminal.

[The Magistrate]

11. Rather Overstated, Captain

They say they have achieved their objectives because that what must be said for domestic political consumption when they stop well short of their announced goals.

The situation is not so bad otherwise as it appears at present, particularly regarding a regional settlement. The attitudes of the governments of Egypt and Saudi Arabia in this have been very promising. How the reconstruction money is handled will be a key element in determining popularity six months from now....

[Captain Needa]

12. Yeah, and when they have their ghetto reconstructed

all of them are gonna be happy and cheerful? Are they gonna be able to rebuild their economy, their lives and their future? Up to what point? To the point they had three weeks ago? What are the Israelis gonna tell'em now: "Ok, fellas, shit happens"?

Sorry sir, but Likud is stating right now that "Mission Accomplished" is sheer bullshit. Of course it has nothing to do with Kadima growing up in polls, I mean, nothing further from my mind than such abhorrent thought.

[oberliner]

72. Likud is not in power in Israel

The Likud party is not part of the current Israeli government.

Likud party representatives have stated that the mission has, in fact, not been accomplished.

[bemildred]

13. Hamas Says It Won't Accept Israeli Military Presence In Gaza

A few other posts to follow.

GAZA CITY (AFP)--The Islamist Hamas movement said late Saturday it will not accept the presence of a single Israeli soldier in the Gaza Strip, as Israel's Prime Minister Ehud Olmert announced a unilateral ceasefire.

"The Zionist enemy must stop all its aggression, completely withdraw from the Gaza Strip, lift the blockade and open the crossings. We will not accept the presence of a single soldier in Gaza," Hamas spokesman Fawzi Barhum said.

"Hamas remains, the resistance is valiant, and the leadership is intact."

Olmert announced a unilateral ceasefire to take effect at 0000 GMT Sunday, but said troops would remain in the battered territory and would return fire if attacked by Palestinian militants.

http://www.nasdaq.com/aspxcontent/NewsStory.aspx?cpath=20090117/ACQDJON200901171747DOWJONESDJONLINE000372.htm

[bemildred]

14. UPDATE 1-US says expects all parties to cease fire in Gaza

WASHINGTON, Jan 17 (Reuters) - The United States welcomed Israel's announcement of a unilateral ceasefire in the Gaza Strip and expects all parties to stop hostile actions immediately, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said on Saturday.

"The goal remains a durable and fully respected ceasefire that will lead to stabilization and normalization in Gaza," she said in a written statement after Israel called off its three-week offensive in the area.

"The United States commends Egypt for its efforts and remains deeply concerned by the suffering of innocent Palestinians," Rice added. "We welcome calls for immediate coordinated international action to increase assistance flows and will contribute to such efforts."

In calling off the offensive on Saturday, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said in a televised address that Israel was responding to an appeal from President Hosni Mubarak of Egypt.

http://af.reuters.com/article/egyptNews/idAFN1731510820090117?feedType=RSS&feedName=egyptNews

[The Magistrate]

16. Let Us Hope, My Friend, This Stills The Guns For At Least a While

[bemildred]

15. Attacks on Be'er Sheva Continue

(IsraelNN.com) Gaza terrorists fired five rockets at the city of Be'er Sheva shortly before midnight on Saturday. The rockets hit open areas outside the city, and no injuries were reported.

Hamas terrorists announced Saturday that they would continue battling Israel despite a unilateral Israeli ceasefire scheduled to go into effect at 2 a.m. Sunday.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/159418

[The Magistrate]

22. Depend Upon It, Sir: Some Fuck Will Pull a Lanyard One Second Short Of the Appointed Hour....

[bemildred]

25. That's what I expect.

Actually, I expect we will see an increase ...

Edit: perhaps a short-lived one.

[The Magistrate]

27. True, Sir: the Next Hour or So Will Be Lit Up Bright

[bemildred]

18. Israel declares unilateral ceasefire in gaza conflict, but if Hamas fires, deal is off

---

"At 2 o'clock in the morning we will stop fire but we will continue to be deployed in Gaza and its surroundings," Olmert said in a speech after a security cabinet vote.

"We have reached all the goals of the war, and beyond," he added.

---

UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon called the strike "outrageous" and said any ceasefire declaration by Israel should include a timetable for withdrawal of ground troops.

Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, which has been trying to broker the truce, also said Israeli troops must withdraw immediately.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/us_world/2009/01/17/2009-01-17_israel_declares_unilateral_ceasefire_in_.html

[Captain Needa]

20. That's the catch

Now that the whole world recognizes them as war criminals, they will try to show themselves as the victims again.

[bemildred]

19. Israelis must pull out troops after ceasefire: Abbas

Ramallah. Israel's decision to call a unilateral ceasefire in Gaza should be followed by a truce agreement and troop withdrawal, a spokesman for Palestinian president Mahmud Abbas said Saturday.
"This Israeli decision to stop the fire is a first step and should be followed by a truce, the end to the closure surrounding Gaza and the withdrawal of troops," Abbas's spokesman Nabil Abu Rudeina told AFP.

http://www.focus-fen.net/?id=n167605

[ProgressiveProfessor]

38. Pretty sensible approach, its all predicated on the rockets stopping

[ProgressiveMuslim]

64. Huh? Isn't that Hamas' demand? LOL!

[Vegasaurus]

68. Hamas demands plenty and offers nothing

but rockets, terrorism and misery to its people.

They should realize that their demanding will simply result in more death and destruction, but that may be their goal anyway.

[bemildred]

21. IDF suggests Gazans delay return to homes

The IDF has recommended that the residents of Gaza, particularly those residing in the north and in areas from which rockets are fired, not return to their homes as of yet for fear that the fighting will be renewed. (Hanan Greenberg)

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3657809,00.html

[The Magistrate]

24. Probably A Sensible Suggestion, Sir....

[bemildred]

26. Seemed like it to me.

One can hope, but I don't think one should assume this is over yet.

[The Magistrate]

28. It Will be Harder For Either party To Keep It Going, Though, Sir

The politics become awful for both sides once the hour is past....

[bemildred]

30. I certainly hope you are right.

But I am in doubt. It's the "unilateral" part that makes me doubt.

[oberliner]

29. It is officially 2 AM in Tel Aviv

Let us hope for the best!

[The Magistrate]

31. Thank You, sir: Let Us Hope It Holds

[ohio2007]

33. Hamas: a small group muslim army defeated israel in 21 days

First Hamas wiped out the Fatah fighters from Gaza in 6 days..Fatah fighters trained by americans. Now Hamas deafeted the IDF/IOF/IAF Elite forces of israel.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a53_1232225995

Can't wait for the celebration parades
:sarcasm:

Saw that comming weeks ago

[GoesTo11]

34. There are times to boast

and there are times to just slink away and disappear after bringing ruin on your people.

[ohio2007]

60. Israel set to swallow defeat in Gaza

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=82729§ionid=351020202
don't expect Hamas to bury the hatchet as it's a known fact, Hamas isn't kind to its vanquished enemies or collaborators

[delad]

36. impossible to make stick

rogue attacks on IDF in Gaza at least, considering the amount of wanton destruction that they're leaving behind. If you killed my wife and children I reckon i would not be able to consider the situation rationally. I'm making a wild guess here that there are some Gazans who may be beyond grief and there's no way Hamas can control everybody, even if they are to be held responsible for their actions

[bemildred]

37. Well, they can stop shooting as long as they choose to.

Personally, I would not want to be in easy range while I was doing it, but I'd wager that is a political decision, like the rest of it.

[DogPoundPup]

39. Israel declares ceasefire as it hails success of bloody Gaza onslaught

18 January 2009 | 03:54 | FOCUS News Agency
London. Israel last night declared a unilateral ceasefire starting early today, ending a fierce 22-day war that has devastated the Gaza Strip and killed more than 1,200 Palestinians, The Sunday Times's online edition writes.
Ehud Olmert, the prime minister, said Israel would halt offensive operations against Hamas, the extremist Islamic organisation that controls Gaza, because “our aims have been fully realised and beyond”.
Addressing the nation on television after a security cabinet meeting, Olmert said the ceasefire would begin at 2am but Israel’s forces would remain in Gaza, withdrawing only at “a timetable reasonable to us”.
He warned Hamas that Israel would retaliate if its militant forces attacked Israeli troops or fired rockets into southern Israel. Hamas responded defiantly, vowing to continue resistance as long as Israeli troops remained.

http://www.focus-fen.net/?id=n167640

[okiru109]

40. a success worthy of satan and his angles

:puke:

[Crunchy Frog]

41. Success = killed lots and lots of people.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

42. Its going to be interesting to see what Hamas does

This is a no lose for Israeli at this point and a no win for Hamas at this point

[DogPoundPup]

43. Maybe for the purpose of the Israeli election, but world opinion says Israelis are c-r-a-z-y

[ProgressiveProfessor]

44. For calling a unilateral ceasefire? Not at all. Even the UN has called on Hamas to stop too

[shira]

45. funny how Israel is even criticized for declaring ceasefire

as if it's really no better than rejecting a ceasefire and continuing their military operations. :eyes:

Can't win or lose with the haters. You can count on them to remain irrational.

[Duckhunter935]

49. can't win nt

[DogPoundPup]

50. ..........

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1117144/Brown-broadside-Shelling-UN-Gaza-indefensible-PM-tells-Israelis.html

[razors edge]

54. Still with the name calling.

It never ends.

[razors edge]

55. They were out of shoes anyway. n/t

[AnOhioan]

62. Israel already lost in the court of world opinion

I am not talking governmental organizations, such as the US Congress. I am talking about ordinary citizens who saw what happened in the past few weeks and did not like the view.

[scarletwoman]

46. Successful? How so? Did they achieve some goal of slaughtering a certain percentage of Palestinians?

The Israeli government is a corrupt bunch of murderous psychopaths, just like bush and the neocons.

sw

[Sanctified]

47. Israel obviously likes to spin their failure...

They probably spent a Billion dollars and dropped an insane amount of firepower in a little region and only killed 1,200 people. In the history of war that is not called success that is called Epic Fail, they need to retrain their soldiers since they are obviously horrible shots considering they can't hit fish in a barrel.

[Duckhunter935]

48. Maybe they were not trying to kill everyone, but that would not

fit the way things are around here.

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bemildred]

51. "Tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow,

Creeps in this petty pace from day to day
To the last syllable of recorded time,
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage
And then is heard no more: it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing."

Macbeth's soliloquy in act 5, scene 5 of William Shakespeare's Macbeth

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sound_and_the_Fury

[ProgressiveMuslim]

65. From the Palestinain Shakespeare

(Mahmoud Darwish... maybe I stretch, but...)

Gentlemen, you have transformed
our country into a graveyard
You have planted bullets in our heads,
and organized massacres
Gentlemen, nothing passes like that
without account
All that you have done
to our people is
registered in notebooks.

[bemildred]

69. The current Harper's has a nice piece on Mr Darwish.

I recommend it. I do wish Mr Said was still around too, I keep thinking about him as all this goes on, he was a difficult writer, but when he was good, he was very good, and I'm sure he would have something to say about all this. I suppose part of that is because I'm struggling through one his books on literary criticism right now. Have been for a while ...

"The way I see it is, if English was good enough for Jesus Christ, then it's good enough for us."

[okiru109]

53. "may pass for good news"

ya think?

[azurnoir]

56. almost 5 hours in and "all quiet on the western front" so far n/t

[The Magistrate]

57. Good To Know, Ma'am: It Will Be Daylight By Now

[Hardrada]

58. Interesting timing. Just as a new government is about to

take the reins here, a government which may not be quite as understanding of Israeli war crimes. If it lets this sort of thing continue, one despairs of humanity.

[ohio2007]

59. Militants fire rockets into Israel after cease-fire

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3695583

Hamas never agreed and IDF responds to the tweeking ;
http://www.presstv.com/detail.aspx?id=82809§ionid=351020202

[Scurrilous]

61. Hamas ceases fire in Gaza, gives Israel week to go

<snip>

"Hamas announced an immediate ceasefire by its fighters and allied groups in the Gaza Strip on Sunday, senior Hamas official Ayman Taha said, adding that the Islamists gave Israel a week to pull out its troops.

"Hamas and the factions announce a ceasefire in Gaza starting immediately and give Israel a week to withdraw," Ayman Taha, a Hamas official in Cairo for talks with Egypt on a truce deal.

Hamas also demanded that Israel open all of the Gaza Strip's border crossings to allow in food and other goods to meet the "basic needs for our people."

Israel said earlier on Sunday that it will not consider a timetable for withdrawing all of its forces from the Gaza Strip until Hamas and other militants cease their fire."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090118/wl_nm/us_palestinians_israel_307

[Vegasaurus]

66. And firing more rockets and contining terrorism=resistance

will help the Palestinian civilians?

Hamas is insane.