Israeli Education Ministry Approves New 'whites-only' Settlement School

[Purveyor]

Several months ago, a religious school in the illegal Israeli settlement of Immanuel was criticized for segregating white Jewish students from non-white Jewish students in classes.

Originally, the school was fined for this policy of racial segregation, because the school was state funded. Now, the Israeli education ministry has agreed with the white parents' request to allow the school to continue with its racial discrimination under private funding.

There is no law preventing racial discrimination by private organizations, even schools, in Israel.

The Israeli court has interpreted these laws to also apply to illegal West bank settlements, like Immanuel, which are located in areas that are supposed to be under Palestinian control. The Palestinian Authority does not allow racial discrimination, but due to the Israeli military occupation of the Palestinian Territories, it has no authority over the area in question.

MORE...

http://www.imemc.org/article/59331

[provis99]

1. welcome to apartheid South Africa.

[aquart]

3. No. Under apartheid you had segregated PUBLIC schools.

This is segregated private schools. Just like in America.

People here really do believe Israel should be a nation of perfect saints or die.

[Violet_Crumble]

9. There are schools in the US segregated by race? I reckon that's a bullshit claim...

Also, what schools in the US are built in illegal settlements like the one in the OP is? None...

And I don't know where 'here' is, but if yr talking about the US, people don't believe anything of the sort.

[Recursion]

10. Yes. My town had one

It was a private school. It was entirely white. If you mean "was there an explicit written policy that none of the black students in the county would be accepted there?", then, no, probably not.

[classysassy]

2. Will our congress hold up funds

until the illegal settlements and school segregation is abolished?If the black congressman and women don't scream to high Heaven they are a disgrace to the black race.

[Ozymanithrax]

5. From scientific point of view, there is no such thing as race.

Therefore, they can not be a disgrace to race.

[Shaktimaan]

8. Who are you to determine such a thing?

So if black elected officials make policy decisions that you disagree with, you feel comfortable with labeling them as traitors to their race?

Personally I find the the whole idea of "disgracing one's race" repugnant to begin with. As though being a certain color means that you should think or act in specific ways.

But here... Obama isn't calling for the US to cut off aid to Israel at all. Do you consider him a disgrace to the black race?

[Poll_Blind]

4. Judaism is in deep, deep trouble. The battle is coming and the guns are big.

And Arabs and goyim in general have nothing to do with this one. Things like racial segregation are only part of it. The symptom.

Because of how the state of Israel was set up, specifically in regards to funding of the ultra-orthodox for Torah studies, a bizarre and unexpected molecule of extremism from the most strict and unforgiving aspects of the Torah and the Talmud (and, importantly, interpretations thereof) was allowed to grow and gain a dangerous foothold, if such a strong influence can be called merely a "foothold", in Israeli culture.

If the ultra-orthodox do get control over determining who is really Jewish, it's going to the fabric of Jewish culture in half. First it was the fixation on genetic testing and that was big for a while- until African and Asians started claiming to be long-lost Jewish refugees. And when the tests started coming back positive, and they were allowed to gain citizenship a la the Law of Return, well, that didn't sit so well with the hardcore in the Ashkenzai community.

There is a lot of criticism that those Africans and Asian refugees aren't really "Jewish". The huge influx of Russian immigrants has also caused a backlash as well, and many of the ultra-orthodox are backing up against a wall, pointing at everyone else and saying "You're not a real Jew!" Now, because of the extreme level of documentation needed to literally prove you are Jewish (to get a married), many Jews (especially from the Diaspora) are being turned down.

Not. Jewish. Enough. Here but especially here.

Imagine it for a moment: You are a part of a group of people who have suffered various forms of persecution for a thousand plus years. Now you're being told by the religious elite in that community that you don't rate, even though you still have to deal with the present-day persecution that still exists.

Yep, that's pretty fucked.

This racial segregation is just the tip of a very ugly iceberg within their society right now and I have no idea how various parties, who have all seemingly painted themselves into various corners, are going to come out of it. This segregation shit is just the tip of that whole damned mess.

PB

[Ozymanithrax]

6. Judaism isn't in trouble. Israel however... n/t

[Donald Ian Rankin]

23. I'm not sure you're right on either count.

I think that Israel is and will remain totally secure and prosperous, thanks to US backing, but that the schism between zionist and non-racist Jews is probably very bad news for the Jewish community.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Crunchy Frog]

7. I would think that no law at all applies when it comes to settlements

that are illegal anyway. Just the law of "might makes right".

[oberliner]

11. This is a news article?

What is the name of the school?

What is the source of the information?

Is there any quote from anyone associated with the school or with the decision?

Which students were not permitted to study at the school and what action, if any, are they taking?

What private organization is providing the funding for the school?

Is there any comment from anyone in the Israeli government on this decision?

What Israeli court decision is being referenced?

Who wrote the article?

[azurnoir]

12. Are you claiming the article is untrue? yes or no? n/t

[oberliner]

13. My claim is that it is not a news article

I provided my reasons for that by listing questions that are neither answered nor addressed.

I have no way of knowing whether any of the information is true or not as there are no details provided that one can attempt to verify.

[azurnoir]

14. the name of the school is Beit Yaakov

here are a few links

http://www.alternativenews.org/english/index.php/topics/news/2827-israels-ministry-of-education-approves-ashkenazi-only-school-in-west-bank-settlement-of-immanuel-

http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=185925

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/august262010/israeli-racism.php

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/ashkenazi-parents-get-okay-for-private-school-in-immanuel-1.310240

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

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[HarveyDarkey]

16. Israeli Education Ministry Approves New 'whites-only' Settlement School

author Thursday August 26, 2010 03:38author by IMEMC Staff Report post

Several months ago, a religious school in the illegal Israeli settlement of Immanuel was criticized for segregating white Jewish students from non-white Jewish students in classes.

Originally, the school was fined for this policy of racial segregation, because the school was state funded. Now, the Israeli education ministry has agreed with the white parents' request to allow the school to continue with its racial discrimination under private funding.

There is no law preventing racial discrimination by private organizations, even schools, in Israel.

The Israeli court has interpreted these laws to also apply to illegal West bank settlements, like Immanuel, which are located in areas that are supposed to be under Palestinian control. The Palestinian Authority does not allow racial discrimination, but due to the Israeli military occupation of the Palestinian Territories, it has no authority over the area in question.

74 white girls who have been studying in a building next to the school will now be allowed to study in whites-only classrooms that are privately funded, as their parents claim they do not want their girls to study in racially-mixed classrooms.

http://www.imemc.org/article/59331

[MrScorpio]

17. I'm wondering if these are recent immigrants or families who are several generations in

It would probably give a clue as to why they would do it

[malaise]

19. All I'll say is

Jimmy Carter was right.

[chimpymustgo]

20. Would either be acceptable? Israel is an apartheid state.

[MrScorpio]

21. Of course, it's not acceptable at all

But that doesn't stop me from wondering who and what is behind this trend

[ladjf]

18. So, in addition to being thugs they are now racists as well. nt

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

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[Cannafield]

25. This post is borderline anti-Semitic and an absolute fabrication

It's nothing to do with race. Here's the deal. For some time now in Israel there's been an ongoing dispute between ashkenaz and Sephardic Jews, mainly Slonimer, a Chassidic sect. This article is so blatantly biased it's disgusting.

If you think this is something that is about race, you are 100% wrong. And here's why. The religious customs between Sephardic and ashkenaz Jews are considerably different in a number of ways. Though generally speaking orthodoxy is orthodoxy, when it comes to women - that's a different thing. Just by looking at that picture I can tell you immediately she is not properly dressed for ashkenaz standards. According to most ashkenaz standards, and virtually all chassidim I know of, it is halachically unacceptable to show your arms above your elbows. That's an immediate thing I can see in the picture. But, the Sephardic standards of tznius(translation for external modesty more or less) are more leniant as a rule of thumb, where as ashkenaz is more stringent. That's why they want to stay seperate.

And Ethiopians, they're technically not Sephardic and definitely not Ashkenaz. But, as a rule of thumb most more orthodox sephardim/ETHIOPIANS follow the Halacha of Ovadia Yosef (chief Sephardic rabbi of Israel, if I spelled his name right). It's a matter of religious respect. Nothing to do with skin color.

Now seriously, it's disgusting of you all to go off saying that this is racism. Really, is this how low you all resort to so you can bash Israel and the Jewish people?

[provis99]

26. the Ethiopian Jews might disagree:

http://mondoweiss.net/2009/08/coming-face-to-face-with-israeli-racism.html
http://alethonews.wordpress.com/2010/05/01/ethiopian-jews-experience-israeli-racism-at-a-very-early-age/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1559361/Israeli-minister-in-Ethiopian-racism-row.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3072260,00.html
http://www.judaismwithoutborders.org/2008/11/14/how-do-you-teach-jews-about-israeli-racism/
http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=180910
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3913394,00.html
http://nazret.com/blog/index.php?c=1&more=1&pb=1&tb=1&title=no_ethiopian_need_apply_ugly_racism_in_i

[Cannafield]

27. Have you ever been to Israel or anoter foreign country? Particular a third or second world country?

Okay, so you collect a plethora of stories in an attempt to refute what I'm saying. Having been in Israel for the past 10 months and met enough Ethiopians (have you ever been to Israel, just curious?), I will say these two things with absolute certainty. The majority of Ethiopians usually to my knowledge work in the service and agricultural industry mainly on the lower ends of the bracket. It is true that they do not have the higher paying jobs as is the case in most countries with immigrants of the first and sometimes second or even third generation. Now whether race and/or culture alone is a factor which weighs in sigmifigantly, it is questionable but I would relate it more to culture than anything else. I mean, consider this, Israel is taking Sudanese refugees(and there are a large number of them in Israel especially in Arad and Tel Aviv) from Darfur and made a daring attempt to rescue them in something like 40,000 people being evacuated from Ethiopia. And actually a good number of them were not even Jewish.

Which raises my next point. There are a considerable ammount of Ethiopians which are Christian and Muslim which were evacuated by the idf and regardless of religious affiliation(practice itself is not the defining factor in a Jew), there is at least with some of them legitimate question, including Sephardim and other mizrachi Jews, as to whether or not they're even of Jewish. Thus what a lot of halachic authorities(authorities in Jewish law) suggested is that the Ethiopians convert just to be safe. It is however my own personal belief that they are, at least the ones who were practicing Judaism prior to their arrival, were largely Jewish. But like I said, there is room for question for a number of sources.

Now as to why they work lower jobs. I'm not sure if you're aware of this or not, but culturally speaking work ethic varies greatly from place to place and this is something I've encountered in every coutry I've been in. Work ethics are extremly relevant to culture. The majority of Ethiopians I've met are honestly lazy workers.  Not to say that Israelis aren't always much better - they do things at their own pace. That's the middle east work ethic in a nut shell. And ethiopians are frankly lazy workers in my experience. I've worked with them and seen how they handle matters in business. It's got nothing to do with race in all honesty. It's cultural. Or at least that is the image which has been depicted, and not by the media. It is nothing similar to Jim Crowe laws in the least.


Now, in the case of migrant workers, particularly African migrant workers, there is considerable reason to have then deported if the intent of Israel is to remain a Jewish state. I'm not saying I necessarily agree with their actions. But, the idea of deportation of certain migrant workers is largely relative to the issue of the state remaining Jewish and a popular right wing stance - which politically speaking, in my opinion is the direction Israel is heading in - for better or worse in terms of foreign relations. At the end of the day, even the secular Jews/traditional Jews(less religious but still mainting certain religious traditions) and especially the orthodox will not interbreed with non Jews. Though some secular Jews will, it's pretty uncommon and I know plenty of atheistic Jews who will not even date a non-Jew. Now, you can call the racist all you want. But a Jew is not a race. So it cannot be a matter which is relative to faith as a Jewish convert of any skin color is accepted whole heartedly(if it is through an orthodox conversion) and it is a mitzvah(commandment) in the Torah to treat converts with extra respect. Furthermore there is another mitzvah of ahavas yisrael(love of a fellow Jew so much to the extent as you love yourself!) It's more of a tribal/religious/cultural thing that generally has little to do with actual genetics - though there are unquestionably certajns genes exclusive to Jews.

However, I do not dispute the validity of racism existing. It does. And I've seen it. Unfortunately, there are some Jews that do outright hate the Arabs and think that there is not a single good one anywhere. It's unfortunate, but contrary to what you may think, this is not the prevalent extent of the problem. You'll find actually there are large Arab Israeli communities where the Arabs(namy Arab-Israelis) do get a long quite well. And it's not uncommon to see Arabs working along side with Israelis any day of the week wherever you go. Particularly in the north if Israel. There is however a particular stigma which will always stay with the Arabs and same with the Jews. And no matter how assimilated they are before the point of interbreeding(which will never happen in large enough numbers to be an issue, as explained above in that Jews don't generally intermix in Israel), will always remain. Because when it comes down to it, it really is a bitter fight and it's sad it has to be this way. But, it's just the way things. No matter how accepted they are, at the end of the day Arab Muslim/Christian function in a Jewish is just that. They're there for themselves as are the Jews. Jews don't want to become integrated with Arabs and Arabs don't want to integrate with Jews. There's a lot of reasons for that, but something a lot of people don't understand is that it's not really racism. We are our own people and so are they. I personally don't object to living side by side with them, as is the case in Haifa, Afula, and many other towns and cities with an Arab/Jewish population within the 1948 lines.

Now, racism does exsist in minute demographics towards Ethiopians as some Jews don't see them as Jews but as blacks. It's the same anywhere. Any where you have numbers of people, you will always have an exception of racism because they see then as different. But the general attitude of Jews is not to hate others based on the fact that they're goyim. It's not so black and white(no pun intended). 

But, this is the main point. Striking another and causing them to bleed, especially another Jew is a very serious Torah prohibition. So if this is an issue at a religious school and the Ethiopians are considered Jewish even by the slonimer, wouldn't it make more sense that since it is a pinnacle mitzvah to love another Jew, the issue is not their skin color but their customs are conflicting with ashkenaz customs? I mean, if for whatever reason they are halachically considered Jewish, especially if they converted, it makes absolutely no sense to hate them because of their skin. It's custom, trust me on this. I can 100% attest to the fact that I have seen black charedim, most likely of the breslov movememnt (another ultra orthodox chassidic group) wearing full out shtreimels and bekashas and black hats with payos living in meah shearim keeping ashkenaz customs and there are absolutely no issues between them and their community. And breslov is just as orthodox as any slonimer, satmar, toldos aharon, or any other charedi movement out there. And you mean to tell me that this is a case of racism?!?

[Cherchez la Femme]

29. So... some Jews are more equal than others?

Hell of a "Democracy" y'all got going there...

You 'don't necessarily agree with' but you seem to do one heck of a lot of defending these things you 'don't necessarily agree with', don't you?

Of the "certajns (sic) genes exclusive to Jews", it seems that Jews showing no Semitic genes but being Khazar descendants are completely assimilated into the Israeli state, including high-paying jobs and perks; while separate races who claim (and are proved by DNA) they are Jewish are argued against.
How strange.

Tell me, can at least Israeli-Arabs drive on the 'Jews only' highways? What of the other rights given solely to Jews which are denied to Palestinians?

"some Jews don't see them as Jews but as blacks. It's the same anywhere."
It IS?! Even if somehow, someway, it is I can tell you it wouldn't be tolerated in a true Democracy governed by The Rule Of Law.

Nor would 'different customs' matter. What of the different customs between Russian Jews, Polish Jews, French Jews, U.S. Jews, etc.? That's OK?!


You may want to not respond to this -- I have a feeling any dialogue between you & I will be unproductive and an astounding waste of time.

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

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[Cherchez la Femme]

31. Stormfront?!

I have never met any more insulting people here on DU --not even homophobes-- than you Israel-is-always-right people.

I am quite conversant in Kosher law -- I worked as a Dietary Supervisor in a Jewish Home for many years when I was getting my degrees. In fact I worked with a Jewish Supervisor who was so lackadaisical about violating said laws and did such things as bringing traife (to feed the residents!) into a Kosher Kitchen and mixing around the different plates, cutlery, etc. used for Dairy & Meat meals (he came from a family who observed Kashrut, strangely enough). I had to keep an especial eye upon him, follow him around and correct his (deliberate, uncaring) mistakes. After one of his weekends working we'd barely have the kitchen utensils to prepare the menu for the day!
I was great friends with the Rabbi and especially one resident, Yetta, who actually liked me very much - she who hated & mistrusted everybody (didn't matter their religion or race) due to her severe emotional scarring from her time in the camps. I was her only friend. When I at long last left, I received a gift from her --she was an inveterate hoarder-- of an almost-full bottle of Aqua Velva -- which I still have & treasure. I often visited her after that, up until she died.

--the only reason I'm telling you that is because I love thinking about her, and how, somehow, she saw a friend in me. Forgive me for reliving that, but it's something I always will love thinking about.

But yeah, I frequent Stormfront. Suure. :sarcasm:
I understand where you're coming from: If one dares to criticize the State of Israel they therefore are antisemitic and absolutely hate all Jewish people!

Just as everybody who criticizes the deeds of the U.S. of A. hates every citizen, right?

Oh well -- if that helps you get through your day...

still, hate to burst the bubble you live in, but know that it's not true. And if Israeli's or indeed Jewish people were on the receiving end of the kind of treatment now doled out to the Palestinians I would be just as vocal against those deeds.

It's not the who but the what that matters. Period. Is that so very difficult to understand?


And BTW, I didn't go through the rest of your post -- what would be the point?-- so don't expect any further comments or questions.


In fact, you and I are done.

[Cannafield]

32. Don't insult me

Yeah and you know shulchan aruch and gemara forbid a goy from supervising a jew in kashrut? Don't insult what you can't understand. Because I actually object to a lot of what israel does. I'm not being vocal. You know in your own mind your right and everything I say is wrong because I'm so pro-Israel. Now don't say sorry to me for venting your own personal experiences with Jews. Go to Israel and decide for yourself because you discredit me even when what I'm saying credible. But it's very anti-Semitic to say that the ashkenaz are not Jews as it is 100% baseless. There is no evidence to verify those claims. That's why I brought storm front into the equation. Criticize Israel all you want. I live in a neighbourhood called Geula 5 minutes away from Meah Shearim. The charedim are the most anti-Zionist people you'll find a lot of them yet I doven with them and study with them and do business with them and am friendly with some of them. Don't spin my words to fit your emotions. You don't know more than me about Israelis or Palestinians. I'm here and witnessing it every single day. I speak from experience. And I am actually ideologically appauled by the formation of the state of israel. I just don't believe in giving land away and have spoken to more people who have been involved with the conflict than you. Don't insult what I've seen because it's real. And everything I've said I told in truth.  

[Cherchez la Femme]

33. I was hired as a D.S. in a large Jewish home

And in fact I did a much better job running a kosher kitchen than... others... there.

Take it up with the management.

[Cherchez la Femme]

35. Um, also

does "shulchan aruch and gemara forbid a goy from supervising a jew in kashrut" mean supervising an actual person or merely supervising the preparation, quality, temperatures, serving, and prescribed diet requirements/restrictions of kosher meals to be served to a Jewish person?

Because no, I never 'supervised' a Jewish person -- I was virtually their servant, running a kosher kitchen to ensure their meals were uh... kosher. If any of the employees who I supervised were Jewish, I was not aware of that fact. The one fellow Supervisor who was Jewish was never under my supervision, even though I, and others, did follow him around to pull for example meat utensils or pans from the dairy side & vice versa.


I said the Ashkenazi were NOT Jews? Where?
If you're talking about DNA, well then that's a very narrow definition of Jewishness IMO. What about converts? Are they not Jewish?


I'm quite aware that some are "actually ideologically appauled (sic) by the formation of the state of israel" (but interesting that such a conviction doesn't stop many from living there). I'm aware it doesn't fit into their interpretation of the Torah (& perhaps Talmud). I have never argued against the State of Israel's existence... just the actions perpetrated on its behalf.

I hope the State of Israel will be here for many millennia to come
I am concerned, however, that the actions of its people may be counterproductive and antithetical to its approval and support in the world,
even its survival.


Excuse me, but me spinning your words to fit my emotions? Seriously?! :rofl:

[polly7]

34. Major flashbacks. Antisemitic, hate Jewish people .......... brings back

memories. Oh ....... and the 'you terrorist-supporters' are all alike, thing. Once you see it a few dozen times though, it sorta loses it's punch. Yet still quite a popular reply to anyone pointing out the fact that Palestinians are human and deserving of the same rights as anyone else in the world.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

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[whosinpower]

36. The state of Israel is now Anti Semitic?!?

Did you even READ the article -

Here is the relevant part - Originally, the school was fined for this policy of racial segregation, because the school was state funded.

So - Cannafield - IT WAS THE STATE OF ISRAEL THAT FOUND THE SCHOOL WAS RACIALLY SEGREGATING STUDENTS. You would propose that the state is Anti-Semitic?!? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Under state funding - this is not allowed. WHY DO YOU THINK THAT WOULD BE? They must be anti-semitic - there is no other possibility.