Polish-Jewish sociologist compares West Bank separation fence to Warsaw Ghetto walls

[Scurrilous]

Sygmunt Bauman says Israel 'terrified of peace' and 'taking advantage of the Holocaust to legitimize unconscionable acts,' in interview with Polish weekly 'Politika.'

<snip>

"Sygmunt Bauman, the Jewish sociologist and one of the greatest philosophers of our time, castigated Israel harshly this week, saying it did not want peace and was afraid of it.

Bauman said Israel was "taking advantage of the Holocaust to legitimize unconscionable acts," and compared the separation fence to the walls surrounding the Warsaw Ghetto, in which hundreds of thousands of Jews perished in the Holocaust.

In a long interview to the important Polish weekly "Politika," Bauman said Israel was not interested in peace. "Israeli politicians are terrified of peace, they tremble with fear from the possibility of peace, because without war and without general mobilization they don't know how to live," he said.

"Israel does not see the missiles falling on communities along the border as a bad thing. On the contrary, they would be worried and even alarmed were it not for this fire," the Polish-British sociologist said."

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/polish-jewish-sociologist-compares-west-bank-separation-fence-to-warsaw-ghetto-walls-1.381828

[izquierdista]

1. Just another anti-Semite....

right? :eyes:

[aranthus]

2. Just another Leftist fool. I don't know about antisemite. n/t

[King_David]

4. Nope ,but here is the reason :

“As Saturen suggests in her letter, international anti-Israel activists place a premium on the participation of Jews in their activities. In this case, the flotilla organizers seemingly scored big – a Jewish participant, and writing in an Israeli media outlet, to boot. Claims of anti-Israelism and anti-Semitism are thus defused.”

http://www.jpost.com/International/Article.aspx?id=233141

[King_David]

3. Not saying it happened here,

But there was an article about anti-Israel activists falsely claiming to be Jewish when making anti Israel statements.

'Why do non-Jews bashing Israel claim to be Jewish?'

http://www.jpost.com/International/Article.aspx?id=233141

[Mosby]

5. this idiot is "of jewish descent"

According to wikipedia. He has never been an observant Jew.

He is a postmodern marxist fool.

[azurnoir]

6. Lol nice try but quite revealing n/t

[King_David]

7. Yes it is very revealing.

Why do people do that?

[azurnoir]

9. why do some imply that Jews who speak out against Israel are not Jews?

but then again I've seen at least one here on DU that cited a GLBT alliance that associated with a NAMBLA (a group that promotes pedophilia) and thereby help to perpetrate one of the most false ugly antigay smears know simply because they also promoted the views on GLBT rights in the OPT that were being promoted by that same poster, so nothing really surprises me anymore

[King_David]

11. I do not understand your post at all,

But it sounds ugly,never the less !

[azurnoir]

12. well it happened on a thread you posted must have gotten past you huh? lol n/t

[King_David]

15. I have no idea WTF you talking about.

And it just sounds ugly , I have not alerted though
but I got an inkling if it were comprehensible it would
be deleted .

[azurnoir]

16. are you threatening me? or are you accusing me of lying?

it certainly sounds as if you are?

[King_David]

17. How could I be threatening you or accuse you of lying

when I have no understanding whatsoever of what yor getting at?

[Violet_Crumble]

19. You managed to tell Az her post sounded ugly...

...while in the same breath telling her you have no understanding of what she's getting at...

[King_David]

20. "sounded ugly" but I wasn't sure

Because I never understood it ;)

[aranthus]

13. Because of deceitful posts like this one.

The idea of some is to post the writings of anti-Israel "Jews" in order to give the anti-Israel kant a legitimacy and credibility that it does not deserve. The nutty writings of this professor for example. The only reason that mention is made of the fact that he's a Jew is to give his ridiculous comparison some credibility. After all, if a Jew says it, it must have something to it. It couldn't possibly be antisemitic, or hateful of Israel, right? Except it's all a bunch of bull, because this professor's ideas don't come from Judaism. So his being Jewish has nothing to do with what he says except to give him false legitimacy. Also notice, that I haven't said that he's not a Jew. Under Jewish law he is. But his ideas don't come from being Jewish. They come from being a Leftist. The fact that his parents were Jewish is completely irrelevant. If people would stop fraudulently parading Leftists of Jewish Parentage as the face of anti-Israelism, then we wouldn't have to point out the fraud, and no one would care if he was Jewish or not, or how Jewish. If he was presented as just another Leftist academic who makes crazy comparisons between Israel and the Nazis, whether he was a practicing Jew or not wouldn't even get mention.

[azurnoir]

14. You seem to believe that Ha'aretz mentions that Buman is Jewish to legitimize his views I believe

it was to create controversy and get the reaction it's getting from you and other posters here, the second paragraph from the article cited here in the OP mentions that he compares the 'separation' wall to the Warsaw Ghetto were hundreds of thousands of Jews died, but it never mentions how that comparison was made or what Bauman said exactly, in fact Ha'aretz only seems to cherry pick the most sensational parts and paraphrase in such a manner as to create outrage IMO, hardly a sign of support, but IMO definitely could be a sign of 'yellow journalism'

[cali]

8. I'm sorry but that's just ridiculous- no matter who says it.

No, I've never heard of him, and he may indeed be one of the greatest philosophers of our time, but anyone with any knowledge of history knows this comparison is without merit. Yes, the separation fence is horrible. So are the ever encroaching settlements, but no they aren't comparable to the Warsaw Ghetto.

The Warsaw Ghetto was the largest of all Jewish Ghettos in Nazi-occupied Europe during World War II. It was established in the Polish capital between October and November 15, 1940, in the territory of General Government of the German-occupied Poland, with over 400,000 Jews from the vicinity crammed into an area of 1.3 square miles (3.4 km2). From there, about 254,000 Ghetto residents were sent to Treblinka extermination camp during the two months of summer 1942. The sheer death-toll among the Jewish inhabitants of the Ghetto during the Großaktion Warschau would have been difficult to compare even with the liquidation of the Ghetto in spring of next year during and after the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising which meant annihilation of additional 50,000 people followed by the actual razing of the ghetto.<1> With the inclusion of the Ghetto falling at least 300,000 Polish Jews lost their lives there.<[br />
<snip>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Ghetto

The comparison is no less sick or obscene for coming from "one of the greatest philosophers of our time".

It's as offensive as the meme that Palestinians are nothing but bloodthirsty terrorists.

I hate this sick shit. And I don't give a flying rat turn who says it.

[Violet_Crumble]

18. I'd like to read a translation of the interview...

Like you, I've never heard of him, but I'd like to see for myself what he actually did say, as there's no quoting from his interview, but just a claim that he compared the separation barrier to the walls around the Warsaw Ghetto...

I think when it comes to offense, comparisons to the Warsaw Ghetto are on a par with comparing boycotting Israeli companies because if Israel's policies towards the Palestinians to the Nazi boycott of Jewish businesses in 1933.

'In March 1933 the Nazis finally achieved a majority in the German parliament and Hitler became Chancellor. Following the victory there was widespread violence and hooliganism directed at Jewish businesses and individuals.<1> Jewish lawyers and judges were physically prevented from reaching the courts. In some cases the SA created improvised concentration camps for prominent Jewish anti-Nazis.<3>

There was widespread international horror at the persecution of the Jews. At the same time, a long-term Jewish boycott of German goods started in March 1933, prompting the UK newspaper Daily Express to go so far as to put as headline "Judea Declares War on Germany".<4>. The Nazis used this to justify a one day national boycott against Jewish Germans.<3> On 1 April 1933, the Nazis carried out their first nationwide, planned action against Jews: a boycott targeting Jewish businesses and professionals.

On the day of the boycott, the SA stood menacingly in front of Jewish-owned department stores and retail establishments, and the offices of professionals such as doctors and lawyers. The Star of David was painted in yellow and black across thousands of doors and windows, with accompanying antisemitic slogans. Signs were posted saying "Don't Buy from Jews", "The Jews Are Our Misfortune." and "Go to Palestine". Throughout Germany, rare acts of violence against individual Jews and Jewish property occurred.
The boycott was ignored by many individual Germans who continued to shop in Jewish-owned stores during the day.<5><6>'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_boycott_of_Jewish_businesses

Comparisons to the Nazis and the Holocaust are generally seen as minimising the horror of what the Nazis did, whether that's the intention of the person doing the comparison or not. I think the reason some people are prone to doing it is because of a mixture of ignorance of what actually did happen back then and being so wrapped up in their cause that all they focus on is trying to get across how horrible they think something happening now is by comparing it to the worst thing they can think of. And then there's obviously some who aren't ignorant of what the Nazis did, but who want to shut up people who disagree with their views, and what better way to do it than comparing those they disagree with to Nazis.

[Swede]

10. A couple of things he got wrong.

Israel does not like missles landing on its territory.

And the Palestinian population is growing,not shrinking by hundreds of thousands.