Punishing the 'Irvine 11,' again

[bemildred]

Last week, the public saw the best and worst of Tony Rackauckas. On Wednesday, the Orange County district attorney concluded a thorough yet timely investigation into the death of a homeless man, which resulted in the unusual decision to file charges against two Fullerton police officers. On Friday, in a case that never should have been filed, a jury delivered guilty verdicts against 10 of the 11 Muslim students who disrupted a UC Irvine speech by the Israeli ambassador to the United States. After one stupid incident, those students will forever have to answer yes if they are asked by, say, potential employers whether they were ever convicted of a crime.

The blame for this does not rest with the jury, whose job is to parse the evidence laid out before it. But criminal charges for unacceptably boorish behavior? Over the top. The whole sad affair has been taken too far when it could have been — and was — handled more appropriately by university officials.

The so-called Irvine 11 attended a speech at the university by Ambassador Michael Oren and, in an orchestrated attempt to disrupt his address, stood up one by one to yell out their objections. As each miscreant was escorted out of the room, another took up the verbal bombardment. Their defense — that they were exercising their own right to free speech — is out-and-out wrong. One's right to free speech, as the courts have long held, does not extend to attempts to erase the free-speech rights of others. There were many valid ways the students could have expressed themselves, such asholding signs, challenging Oren during question-and-answer time or protesting outside the building during his speech.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/opinionla/la-ed-irvine-20110924,0,3702342.story

[vminfla]

1. We are a nation of laws

When you willfully and premeditatively break the law, you must suffer the consequences of your criminal actions.

As it stands, their sentence was light, merely probation and community service. Part of their sentence should have included diversity training and anger management.

[bemildred]

2. Report Details Wide Abuse in Los Angeles Jail System

I didn't even have to go look around for it, right there in LBN.

LOS ANGELES — One inmate said he was forced to walk down a hallway naked after sheriff’s deputies accused him of stealing a piece of mail. They taunted him in Spanish, calling him a derogatory name for homosexuals.

Another former inmate said that after he protested that guards were harassing a mentally ill prisoner, the same deputies took him into another room, slammed his head into a wall and repeatedly punched him in the chest.

And a chaplain said he saw deputies punching an inmate until he collapsed to the ground. They then began kicking the apparently unconscious man’s head and body.

The examples are just a fraction of dozens of detailed allegations of abuse in Los Angeles County’s Men’s Central Jail and Twin Towers, according to a report that the American Civil Liberties Union is expected to file in Federal District Court here on Wednesday. The Los Angeles County jail system, the nation’s largest, is also the nation’s most troubled, according to lawyers, advocates and former law enforcement officials.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/28/us/aclu-suit-details-wide-abuse-in-los-angeles-jail-system.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

[vminfla]

5. Wow! So the Irvine 10 are fortunate

Somebody should do something about that mess in the jail system. Although it has nothing to do with the Irvine 10, they sure are lucky to not have to be in jail.

Or, are you suggesting it is a cautionary tale for them? That they should serve their probation and community service cleanly and keep their noses out of trouble again? I do not know how successful that they are going to be without the anger management classes. These are clearly angry young men. We will probably not see the last of these men, given the high level of recidivism in criminals and their level of rage.

[bemildred]

6. I was addressing your claim that we are a nation of laws. nt

[frylock]

7. we are a nation of selectively enforced laws..

and please do remember that we are a nation of laws the next time you exceed the speed limit.

[azurnoir]

3. Do you know is it common to press criminal charges for such behavior ?

Is there much history of this type of trial in the US?

[bemildred]

4. Like most of our laws, it is selectively enforced according to the whims of cops,

and selectively prosecuted according to the whims of prosecutors.

[Kurska]

8. Not sure where I stand on this.

I want to see and they deserve to be punished for what they did. I also don't think the university went far enough in disciplining this type of action. On the other hand a permanent criminal conviction is a hell of thing to have on your record and I'm not sure this case justifies such an action.

[shira]

9. Agreed, but there are many here who see absolutely nothing wrong with the Irvine 10's act. n/t